Jack Straw Posted May 7, 2012 Share Posted May 7, 2012 In what way is that evaluating talent? Keep digging. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GG Posted May 7, 2012 Share Posted May 7, 2012 In what way is that evaluating talent? To say that coaches do not evaluate talent is laughable, at best. Just because coaches spend time on other things in game preparation doesn't mean that talent evaluation isn't part of the job. It's the same in any other field, industry, etc. Even if the boss is not involved in the day to day sausage making process, doesn't mean that the boss doesn't know how to make the sausage or can't make the sausage better than the workers. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Punch Posted May 7, 2012 Share Posted May 7, 2012 I liked D. Flo and thought he was a great leadership guy. But while I was on the fence about his release, here was a great stat from Peter King: http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/2012/writers/peter_king/05/06/mmqb/3.html It's time for the young guys to play and MCGee to be Yoda. Either way, Drayton was a class act and I wish him the best. It's wholly refreshing that the assumption in the media is now "GM Buddy Nix is too smart to give away cornerbacks who can still cover" rather than second guessing the Bills' front office incompetence--- whether or not this was truly the correct decision remains to be seen, but regardless, it's still refreshing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GG Posted May 7, 2012 Share Posted May 7, 2012 It's wholly refreshing that the assumption in the media is now "GM Buddy Nix is too smart to give away cornerbacks who can still cover" rather than second guessing the Bills' front office incompetence--- whether or not this was truly the correct decision remains to be seen, but regardless, it's still refreshing. ... or the obvious that $5 million is too much to pay for a slot CB? The team still reports to Jeff Littmann. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eball Posted May 7, 2012 Share Posted May 7, 2012 ... or the obvious that $5 million is too much to pay for a slot CB? The team still reports to Jeff Littmann. Absurd that anyone still believes this. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dave mcbride Posted May 7, 2012 Share Posted May 7, 2012 ... or the obvious that $5 million is too much to pay for a slot CB? The team still reports to Jeff Littmann. Gerry: The eyes don't lie: Florence was horrible last year. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DrDawkinstein Posted May 7, 2012 Share Posted May 7, 2012 (edited) ... or the obvious that $5 million is too much to pay for a slot CB? The team still reports to Jeff Littmann. Hope this is a joke. Otherwise, it might be the most ridiculous post in a 16 page thread. Yes, his salary played into the decision, but any thought of a "money hoarding conspiracy" is a bit much. ALL teams ultimately answer to the cap sooner or later. The difference now is that we are answering to the cap because we have so much talent that is worth the money, and we are using all available resources, so it's good to be smart with it. Edited May 7, 2012 by DrDareustein Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GG Posted May 7, 2012 Share Posted May 7, 2012 Gerry: The eyes don't lie: Florence was horrible last year. Oh I agree that he was horrible outside. But he was still better than Rogers covering the slot, and as some argued he could make a decent conversion to safety. But you do not pay that much to a slot CB, let alone a backup safety. DF didn't have the same pull with the front office that Troy Vincent once had. And yes, no matter what people may think, the buck still stops at Jeff Littmann's office. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GG Posted May 7, 2012 Share Posted May 7, 2012 Hope this is a joke. Otherwise, it might be the most ridiculous post in a 16 page thread. Yes, his salary played into the decision, but any thought of a "money hoarding conspiracy" is a bit much. ALL teams ultimately answer to the cap sooner or later. The difference now is that we are answering to the cap because we have so much talent that is worth the money, and we are using all available resources, so it's good to be smart with it. You mean a team not wanting to pay $3.8 million or more in real money to a backup safety is the most ridiculous thing in this thread? I know, it's great to be a fantasy league manager when it's not your checkbook. There's no conspiracy, just a sound look at the team's budget. If it wasn't for DF's salary, he'd still be on the roster because he can still contribute more than some of the guys who are still on the roster. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kelly the Dog Posted May 7, 2012 Share Posted May 7, 2012 (edited) You mean a team not wanting to pay $3.8 million or more in real money to a backup safety is the most ridiculous thing in this thread? I know, it's great to be a fantasy league manager when it's not your checkbook. There's no conspiracy, just a sound look at the team's budget. If it wasn't for DF's salary, he'd still be on the roster because he can still contribute more than some of the guys who are still on the roster. My problem with what you said is that it has a connotation of a bad thing, because it used to be, as well as your history here (along with mine) of criticizing Littman. While I believe that the buck still stops at Jeff Littman, the team has inarguably proven that right now they are not cheap and willing to spend what it takes. A lot of times, cutting a player due to salary is a very wise, prudent thing to do, especially if the team wants to re-sign numerous players, including Fred, Byrd, Levitre, Urbik and Rinehart before next season starts. Florence makes too much money for his production and the wise thing is to not pay that money to him, but to someone else, and there is little reason to believe that they are not going to use it on good players that need to be re-signed. If they lowball and don't retain 3-4 of them, then the criticism should return. But until then, I think we need to give this regime the benefit of the doubt after the Kyle, Fitz, Mario, Anderson and Stevie contracts. To me. getting rid of Florence was almost a no brainer. He cost too much, he wasn't that good, he's getting old, he wasn't that fast, he took too many inopportune penalties, and he was taking time in practice and in games from players who need to be on the field instead of Drayton Florence. Edited May 7, 2012 by Kelly the Dog Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DrDawkinstein Posted May 7, 2012 Share Posted May 7, 2012 (edited) You mean a team not wanting to pay $3.8 million or more in real money to a backup safety is the most ridiculous thing in this thread? I know, it's great to be a fantasy league manager when it's not your checkbook. There's no conspiracy, just a sound look at the team's budget. If it wasn't for DF's salary, he'd still be on the roster because he can still contribute more than some of the guys who are still on the roster. That is not what you implied with your original post. Saying "the team still reports to Littman" implies that nothing has changed in the Front Office, Ralph is cheap, and Buddy, Whaley, etc are not really in charge. Which is incorrect on every level. That was the ridiculous part. It was determined in the first few pages that there were money AND performance reasons behind this, therefore it was a good move. What you posted implied otherwise. Edited May 7, 2012 by DrDareustein Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Malazan Posted May 7, 2012 Share Posted May 7, 2012 There's no conspiracy, just a sound look at the team's budget. If it wasn't for DF's salary, he'd still be on the roster because he can still contribute more than some of the guys who are still on the roster. The problem is you don't seem to know what Jeff Littman actually does. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GG Posted May 7, 2012 Share Posted May 7, 2012 My problem with what you said is that it has a connotation of a bad thing, because it used to be, as well as your history here (along with mine) of criticizing Littman. While I believe that the buck still stops at Jeff Littman, the team has inarguably proven that right now they are not cheap and willing to spend what it takes. A lot of times, cutting a player due to salary is a very wise, prudent thing to do, especially if the team wants to re-sign numerous players, including Fred, Byrd, Levitre, Urbik and Rinehart before next season starts. Florence makes too much money for his production and the wise thing is to not pay that money to him, but to someone else, and there is little reason to believe that they are not going to use it on good players that need to be re-signed. If they lowball and don't retain 3-4 of them, then the criticism should return. But until then, I think we need to give this regime the benefit of the doubt after the Kyle, Fitz, Mario, Anderson and Stevie contracts. To me. getting rid of Florence was almost a no brainer. He cost too much, he wasn't that good, he's getting old, he wasn't that fast, he took too many inopportune penalties, and he was taking time in practice and in games from players who need to be on the field instead of Drayton Florence. Is it really my problem that you guys have a disconnect between inferred vs implied? Check out the evil board for a more proper response. DF's cut was primarily a salary cap move. Jeff Littmann still controls the purse strings. I made no implications other than that. Feel free to add any more commentary to what I may or may not have said. The problem is you don't seem to know what Jeff Littman actually does. I know enough to recognize that Buffalo Bills Inc is likely the only corporation where the Treasurer has more power than the President, and is listed higher on the company's organizational chart. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Malazan Posted May 7, 2012 Share Posted May 7, 2012 (edited) I know enough to recognize that Buffalo Bills Inc is likely the only corporation where the Treasurer has more power than the President, and is listed higher on the company's organizational chart. Ralph Wilson fulfills the role of 'President'. No offense, but I'm not confident in your knowledge of how the organization functions. He may have been behind moves, but to take every move made and attribute it to Littman seems ineffective at discovering the underlying motivations. Edited May 7, 2012 by jeremy2020 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lurker Posted May 7, 2012 Share Posted May 7, 2012 DF's cut was primarily a salary cap move. Jeff Littmann still controls the purse strings. I made no implications other than that. Seems like a pretty big implication to me. Why isn't it more likely that it was a football decision made by Buddy (mediorce performance + high salary + need to re-sign young guys that contribute more = goodbye DF). While tin-foil hats are always in fashion at TSW, it's a big stretch to say Littmann's fingerprints are on this move... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kelly the Dog Posted May 7, 2012 Share Posted May 7, 2012 Is it really my problem that you guys have a disconnect between inferred vs implied? Check out the evil board for a more proper response. DF's cut was primarily a salary cap move. Jeff Littmann still controls the purse strings. I made no implications other than that. Feel free to add any more commentary to what I may or may not have said. Thanks! I will! You do not know it was "primarily" a salary cap move. I would argue that it was equal parts he stunk, younger guys better than him need the reps, and he wasn't worth the money. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GG Posted May 7, 2012 Share Posted May 7, 2012 Ralph Wilson fulfills the role of 'President'. No offense, but I'm not confident in your knowledge of how the organization functions. He may have been behind moves, but to take every move made and attribute it to Littman seems ineffective at discovering the underlying motivations. Oops my mistake looks like Littmann just got promoted to CFO. And yes RW is President. So go ahead and find another company where the president and cfo are listed above the CEO. Thanks! I will! You do not know it was "primarily" a salary cap move. I would argue that it was equal parts he stunk, younger guys better than him need the reps, and he wasn't worth the money. Not all salary cap moves are dumb nor have a conspiracy attached to them. But no matter what we say about Draytons play in '11 he finished the season as the best Bills CB. As aside it's laughable for anyone to claim that corner wasn't a major need heading into the draft. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kelly the Dog Posted May 7, 2012 Share Posted May 7, 2012 Oops my mistake looks like Littmann just got promoted to CFO. And yes RW is President. So go ahead and find another company where the president and cfo are listed above the CEO. Brandon is CEO in name only. He's basically Director of Marketing regardless of title. It's not like he is making a lot of CEO decisions outside of regionalization of the franchise. I do agree that Littman as CFO holds a ton of power and high standing at OBD though, and is second in command. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Senator Posted May 7, 2012 Share Posted May 7, 2012 So I'm sure Drayton Florence is a nice guy and all that, and certainly I wish him well so long as he's not playing against the Bills, but there were several games last season when I would have cut him that afternoon. Out with the old, in with the new...onward and upward, etc., etc.... GO BILLSSS!!!! "I expect to be undefeated...I expect to win every game." - Chan Gailey 19 and 0 baby!!!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
C.Biscuit97 Posted May 7, 2012 Share Posted May 7, 2012 Brandon is CEO in name only. He's basically Director of Marketing regardless of title. It's not like he is making a lot of CEO decisions outside of regionalization of the franchise. I do agree that Littman as CFO holds a ton of power and high standing at OBD though, and is second in command. And Russ Brandon is great for this organization. Local guy who truly has the best interests of the team at heart. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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