GunnerBill

I think they hoped for legit starters. And got that with neither.

It's the same Head Coach. But two different OCs, both of whom parlayed it into HC jobs. I do think Hurts is underrated. #2 is rich for my blood but he is darn good. People talk about the stacked Eagles team in 2024 and that's true. But their 2023 defense was bottom 4 in the NFL and they won 11 games. You don't do that without a really good QB.

Ah I didn't say they should be fired for the picks. Don't misquote me. I thought both were overdrafted by a round or so but they were not fireable picks. I said if they knew they were going to get what they got from those two guys and still spent day 2 picks on them they should be fired. Because running backs who can put up between 600 and 800 yards are not a commodity you want to be spending day two picks on.

My word that Ravens secondary is stacked.

I didn't want any of the guys around or after Moss in that class. That is my point. Singletary is better than those other guys but not in a decisive way. He has had three starting jobs in the NFL now and lost three starting jobs. Sure Harris is out of the league (because of health reasons) and Justice Hill is more of a 3rd down back than a start but the value above replacement of Singletary against those guys is not high. If you are spending a 3rd round pick on such a low value position I would want better.... and even your own link shows there are better guys in the last decade that have been picked in the 3rd, 4th and 5th rounds.

Pleased to say I did not say that on Spencer Brown.

The Moss class was a shallow RB class with some high end guys but not much depth (another problem with spending a high value asset on him). But the Singletary class there are guys after him who have had some production in the league: Damien Harris, Justice Hill, Tony Pollard, Myles Gaskin our own "best 3rd down back in football" Ty Johnson. And then the next two drafts after the Moss draft... Khalil Herbert, Kenneth Gainwell, Chuba Hubbard, Rhamondre Stevenson, Isiah Pacheco, Kyren Williams, Dameon Pierce, Tyler Allgeier etc.... If you are spending a day 2 pick on a guy you better be getting me a guy who is a cut above that company. And Singletary and Moss were not and never had the skillsets to be.

They have both started. And been quickly relegated to the bench. If you are going for such low value positions in the first three rounds I expect actual starting level talents. And neither of those guys were.

If they knew what they were getting with Singletary and Moss and STILL spent day 2 picks on them that is a fireable offence.

I am. I am conflicted on Cook. I am generally in don't pay a back. But I think the things he brings - the vision and fast change of direction are perfect fits for this scheme and not super replaceable by any mid round back. If I thought we had the potential to be explosive in the pass game I wouldn't care at all and I'd say run him 'til he pukes this year then let him try FA. Bur when your passing game so much lacks explosion taking one of the best big play backs in football out of it feels somewhat risky. Hopefully the pass game is more explosive this year and we can happily move on from Cook and take the comp pick. But I can imagine a scenario where I am okay with paying him. Nah at running back their talent evaluation has just sucked aside from Cook. It is not philosophy it is bad talent evaluation. Singletary was never a third round talent. I said it at the time. Moss the same. Davis I had as a 5th they took late 4th I can kind of see the value at least but his ceiling is still a rotational #2.

Yea Cook is a good back. He isn't an elite back but he is a darn good one. I don't think any of the other backs Beane has drafted - and I include Davis in this - are starter level NFL talents. He has spent too many resources on change of pace type guys.

It probably is yes. I agree. But not by Devin freaking Singletary. He is a backup who spent 3 years here masquerading as a starter.

I watched it. No it isn't.

I went for the probably convetional; Pat; Josh; Joe; Lamar. I'd be absolutely delighted with any of the 4 for am entire season. But in the 1 crunch moment that is the order I'd take them

Singletary doesn't have the vision or change of direction of Cook. There is zero chance he makes that play. Zero.

Pats only swept twice in their dynasty. That is a staggering stat to me. I think Bills have done it once (in the Allen era). They would have done it last year too if they needed to, but that applied to the Pats a time or two as well. The finishing with a division game definitely affects how rarely teams sweep. The best team who would be capable of sweeping often doesn't need that last game.

The Bills are not trading him at this point. Save for like a Saquan type guy going down in camp and the Eagles deciding they gotta make a move and overpaying. There was a point where a trade was on the table between the parties as an option but that has passed. And Cook is going to be here and play. Zero point zero point zero per cent chance.

Fair enough. But in that matchup where they have exactly the same team I'd take 2024 Jalen Hurts over 2024 Matt Stafford in a heartbeat. Go back 3 years I'd have taken Stafford above most guys in the league but he isn't that player any more.

I don't think he was consistent at all in 2024. I think his best he still looked like the old Matthew Stafford. His worst he looked a lot like Rodgers did. Those games they won down the stretch they won on defense, with the Bills game a stark exception. Everyone else they were beating 12-6 or score of that nature. Their defense held the Vikings to 9 in the playoff win. I don't think there is any way he is the 5th best Quarterback in the NFL right now. Personally I don't think he is top 10 anymore, he is just outside that.

It's a good point that for a lot of Bills fans who only watch Bills games and the post season they probably saw the best of Stafford and that likely influences opinions.

Yea I think the "eye test" would tell you the past 3 years Stafford has not played as well as any of those guys you have him grouped with. So it is a Championship from 4 years ago that raises him up. I just think that is slightly inconsistent with the way you have ranked those in the elite group.

Yea. 9 = 13. That's just MATH.

I think everyone should list only players they have seen play. Mine was since 2002. I just think highlights, stats and reputation are not great ways to rank guys you have never seen play.

I think there is a fundamental inconsistency @Kirby Jackson and @HappyDays between having Mahomes 3rd or 4th based on "other guys playing better the last two years" and then still having Matt Stafford at #7 and #5 respectively. Over the past two seasons if you look at: - passing yards - completion rate - touchdowns - passer rating - yards per attempt Across ten data points over two seasons Matt Stafford is top 10 in exactly 1 of those ten - yards per attempt in 2023. I love Matt Stafford. He has had a great career and he will be an interesting HoF debate when he comes up in years to come. But over the past three seasons since he won that Superbowl he has been closer to the 15th best Quarterback in football than the 5th. I know he had the elbow injury in 2022 and that might be part of the explanation but I think he is what he is right now. I still have him in my franchise group but while for almost 10 years (even when he was in Detroit) I banged the drum that he was a top 6 Quarterback and at the top of that "best of the rest" category, I think he is towards the backend of that group now.

Hurts is QB5 to me too. He is not the 5th best passer. But that's a different question. When I look at the entire package, the leadership is off the charts, the 600 plus rushing yards every year and the ability in the clutch... I think that puts him at the head of that group after the elite guys.