BigBuff423

How can it mean NOTHING?? Luck will be 29 and you say, "10 years minimum", like it's a guarantee....how could you or anyone possibly know that?? You're exchanging one unknown for another....we shall agree to disagree, but I don't like the risk involved for the Luck trade when I have a more measured and controlled risk in Drafting a QB with any of my picks in the first 2 rounds. It's more controlled because I know the information I have on him, I know for sure the shoulder is healthy because I'm not Drafting one in the first 2 rounds has been out for the year, I know he is already 7 to 8 years YOUNGER, and I know that no other organization has gotten what 'could' be the best of him during some really prime years, 25-30. I also know, if I'm Drafting a QB in those first 2 rounds and have done interviews with him, his coaches, and watched interviews of his, he will be hungry and motivated in the way I need him to be coming onto the team as the presumed #1 QB. We disagree, it's cool....but I'm not exchanging damaged goods for a QB who already has seen quite a bit of wear-and-tear on him for a QB who is a terrific prospect and *could* be my solution for the next (by your math) 16-18 years while using my extra Draft picks for other positions, because Luck isn't coming here for anything less than multiple Draft picks AT LEAST one of which would be a 1st and probably it would take two 1sts and maybe more to get it done. In other words: no thanks, i'll trust the process.

First, Brees was 27 for the 2006 season, his first with the Saints, Luck would be 29. Second, how the Colts have handled Luck's shoulder issue is completely different than how Brees handled his as he got surgery right away, meaning the injury didn't linger. Third, due to the two year age gap - which is right in the middle of a QB's prime and that means something when you're giving up your future QB, because that's basically what you're doing exchanging the right now for later - and the fact that the shoulder injury will be going on a two year issue that was not treated properly from the beginning, it would not seem wise IMHO, to trade for Luck, UNLESS you're going to also Draft a QB early this year, ala RGIII and Cousins-esque. The Bills want their QB, but based on what McD and Beane have done thus far, I don't think they want to leverage too much of the future. They gave up a 3rd round pick for a WR who has fully recovered, is on the up-slope of his prime and possesses a skill-set the Bills did not have at the time of the trade without mortgaging their future. You make the trade - I would not - and furthermore, unless the asking price doesn't prevent the Bills from providing too much future capital, I don't think Beane does the trade either.

Come back game....the roller coaster ride of emotions was incredible. I remember yelling so loud when the last TD was scored and again when Christie hit the game winner, I was upstairs in the den watching on tv, and the cat was downstairs, he jumped so far and high he was hanging on the curtains.

You're projecting him to last another 10 years despite the injury concerns he's ALREADY had?? Sorry, I'm not hitching my horse to that wagon, er buffalo as it were... This Draft the Bills FINALLY have 2 1st round picks, 2 2nd round picks, and it makes sense to Draft their guy....get him, train and coach him, and send him in - baptism by fire. Recent research bears out this to be the best approach, as in most cases (I did say most, not all), is to have your QB playing in the Rookie year and have him learn. Sorry, but Andrew will be 29, and absolutely NO guarantee he can play or that his throwing shoulder returns to full health....

As others have said, Gaines missing time is important, then consider missing Poyer and Hyde for one game I believe and Poyer for a few games....additionally, they were doing well against the run until the Jets, so I think the passing game was overcompensating for lacking in the run department, meaning more pass attempts and facing AJ Green, Mike Evans and company, and the Raiders were playing catch up most of the game after the first drive....again, not making excuses, the pass D needs to be better but as noted above injuries and game plan play a part. JMO

To those saying Bills should try to trade for Luck, consider what MMQB said: he missed his three prime years. So, instead of Drafting a QB who could be the franchise solution for the next 12 years or so, with his prime years left, we would trade for a damaged one, with his prime years already behind him and he may still need more medical treatment that could be a problem for NEXT season....?? Count me among the ones that say, "No thanks"....he was certainly a true franchise QB when he came out and was healthy, but now....I think I'd rather roll the dice with what Beane et. al. can do in the Draft.

Unfortunately, I agree.....I think we see a surprise win, but otherwise, based on the above information and the last JETS game, it seems more like 2011 than 1995....

Spent the summer in Poland....my wife is a Polish immigrant, became a citizen this year....you're right, it's an eagle. And that's a cool hat, well done! I'm sure your father will love it.

For real.....charlatan that he is, lol... In thinking more about this topic, and as I've posted several times in this thread already so I've contributed to the notion of getting / keeping players in relation to Cap, the more I realize we always think that the Bills don't have enough Cap room and they sign like, 10 players. Or, the Bills couldn't afford "this" guy, and they get him at market value with a relatively high number and we all say, 'How the hell are they doing this?'....or like the Saints, it seemed every year for 4 or 5 years they were over the Cap, but they kept signing and re-signing players....so, in retrospect, we all "think" we know how the Cap works, but really none of us have any clue.

Hughes gives nearly as many yards as he takes with his ratio of sacks to 15 yard penalties, and that is not the type of undisciplined football McD wants to play, so given his Cap hit, I would be (and probably will be) more surprised if they bring him back at the same pay. And yes, pass rush struggles are real, but the Draft and FA can go a long way in helping that, and not sacrifice penalty yards. Again, what good does it do to sack a QB for -7 yards but two plays later give up the automatic 1st down plus 15 more?? As for Tyrod, he was / is the best option they had. But for $18 million in Cap money, they can do a lot of things to bring in good, quality players and Draft their own QB at a significant fraction of the cost plus he doesn't really do what they want a QB to do: stay in pocket, be accurate, do quick hits in a WC style Offense and be tall enough to see the field clearly. But, we shall see.... As for Shady...he's been dynamic when blocking is there, and he's been a truly good character for the team. But, and it's a huge a*s but, he is hitting the magical wall of 30 and at a pretty hefty price....so, I think Beane and McD identify an early round RB to be their bell-cow, say late 1st to late 2nd round, and go with him at a reduced cost. Again, that same RB money can be used for Offensive line help and LB help, which they will desperately need. I can see them signing Preston Brown and EJ Gaines because of their relative age to productivity to cost ratio. Not that it matters, but I did say Sammy would be traded, I did say I didn't see Dareus back next year via trade or release (and got laughed at for it), I did say Gilmore wasn't coming back, I did say I didn't think Gillisilee would be a priority for them, and that there is a "type" of player at each position McD and Beane want....look closely enough, you'll see Tyrod doesn't fit the mold and neither does Shady. They're the best they have / had when they arrived. But given their contract status and now with multiple Draft picks and good amount of money to be free, i don't think they can justify bringing either one back. Also, not sure about Clay. Him, I think they ask to re-structure to save Cap money but keep him since Dennison's Offense is TE friendly.

Not to totally pee all over your parade, but Rob Quinn did a nice write-up and explanation of Cap situation. They are in a very good position with a fair amount of money and that's WITH Tyrod coming back at $18, Shady at his cap hit and Hughes at his Cap hit...none of which I think come back.

Does that surprise you considering the moves thus far? Honestly, I think if they had better options, they wouldn’t have been here this year - except Kyle, and him I think it’s his decision. Shady and Tyrod’s contract make them expendable. Shady is great, but at 30 and that cap hit, based on what we’ve seen this season - I don’t see it for next year. As for Tyrod, no I don’t think he’ll be the QB for the Bills next year considering the Draft capital they have and that they can take that $18 mil hit and reinvest in other areas while they Draft their guy. Sorry Edit: as for Hughes, again I just don’t think his character and type of penalties will sit well with McD when they have an off season to have all those penalties sink in, and evaluate his cap hit compared to the negatives that also come with his pressures. It’s just a hunch and I might be wrong about Hughes, but....we’ll see.

I understand the question and reason for it, but honestly it’s hard to answer until we know how Beane and McD will approach FA. So, I’ll say this about position needs IMO, that need to be addressed via FA or Draft in some way: 1. QB (I don’t think Tyrod is back) 2. DT (Kyle isn’t coming back) 3. Offensive line: Guard - RT (if not Dawkins) 4. LB 5. Corner 6. DE (Hughes cut / traded) 7. WR 8. RB (no more Shady next year) 9. Everything else for depth

Fair enough, point taken.

In the moment - I totally understand. Its not like they were in much of a position to do any significant changes. But now, with a full year with him and a full season of their own scouts and leadjng into the FA period and Draft, no reason - zero, none - to not get their signal caller for the next phase of team development.

Milano was playing extremely well, you dont pull that kind of production off the field, especially in a Rookie. You let him play and learn. The only time you do that for a Rookie is if the game appears too big for him. Let him mature a bit, but when hes playing like he was, you let him grow through the process and get better and stronger and smarter.

No...nope....no....hell no! Its sad that a franchise who has been so devoid of true franchise QB since basically Kelly, results in accepting anything that doesnt appear to be completely putrid. Ive beaten this horse into raw meat, so....Ill just leave. But God help us if Beane and McD thinks he is anything more than a one year rental.

No....Tyrod throws the ball as soon as he comes out, Thomas runs into the endzone easily. As for what Thomas was supposed to do, if you say so....but the NFL isn't always (in fact rarely) perfectly scripted, making decisions on the fly is part of the QB position. He does it when he runs, but he can't do it when he throws? Then he's not an NFL QB.

Honestly, the failing Logan Thomas pass that DIDN'T result in a TD is the epitome of this argument. I think it was the Denver game, but I can't recall, when Tyrod had Logan Thomas in the flat wide-fricken-open as soon as he rolled out on the play-action with the LB between Tyrod and Logan. If Tyrod released the ball as soon as he's out of the play-action, really, really good chance it's a TD. Instead, he holds the ball too long, the LB catches up, gets between them and as they all run right, Tyrod and Thomas run out of real estate and while Tyrod placed the ball where only Logan "could" get it, no one got it...it was thrown out of bounds. This, is Tyrod's decision making in a nutshell...hold too long, doubt the window, and cause the play to be "broken".

As the Tyrod debate wages on....I keep going back to my original opinion after halfway through his first season with the Bills and this article essentially sums it up but coming to a very different conclusion. Tyrod is a phenomenal athlete, he is a rare specimen of ability with his strong arm, gifted elusiveness and outright speed at the QB position. He is a good character type guy, a decent leader and someone who very obviously loves the game of football. But.... and it is that huge a*s that stands in the way of things, the "but".... He struggles to consistently stay in clean pockets (although he has gotten better this year), he just doesn't have the height to see over Offensive and Defensive linemen, he is not a tremendously accurate passer, doesn't anticipate a receiver open well (if at all), and doesn't make audible changes at the line often (again, if at all) that result in positive yardage or plays. In short, he doesn't have the prototypical size / height desired, lacks the elite accuracy I think is truly necessary for long-term viability, doesn't have the chess-match part of the game piece in his mind to adjust at the line, and lacks the pocket presence I think a true "franchise" QB needs to be a great QB over the course of time. What he DOES do well, is great for a team like Denver or what used to be the Seahawks, or Dallas with a tremendous running game and elite Offensive line...but he won't be that Favre, Brees, Manning type QB - and yes, I know those are greats, including HOFers, but isn't that what we should WANT as a fan base instead of settling for slightly above average in most categories??? Is it ok for this year because they're winning with Defense and the last two games by running the ball effectively?? OF COURSE, but he is not the long-term answer... Draft a QB, doesn't need to be in the 1st round - see Dak, Cousins, Russ, et. al - but that QB does need to have the smell of franchise QB on him and then let that QB develop - and based on recent articles, that's not on the bench, it's in the trenches facing live fire.....

I seriously LOL'd....

I just don't think that's the direction Beane and McD want to go....the reason why Kelvin is here is because he's prime age, big bodied and they have him for another year before they really have to "worry" about the contract. Additionally, Kelvin is a rare talent regarding his size and experience. Newton doesn't do the things I think McD and Beane truly want...I think they want a guy who is a good teammate, low drama, accurate, strong enough arm in the Buffalo weather, pocket passer, can anticipate the receiver open, make good reads on Defenses pre-snap....Cam is obviously strong enough for Buffalo weather, arguably strongest arm behind Stafford, but everything else doesn't really fit his player DNA.... So, I think Buffalo Drafts their guy or gets a FA ironically ala Tyrod and let's Peterman and FA fight it out and then let the chips fall where they may....but if I had to bet, I'd bet on them taking their guy in the 1st round somehow in 2018. Not really out of the question: 3 1st round picks....ours, KCs and trading back into the 1st for the QB of the future.

I actually hope he's Inactive for Thursday's game. I would think McD wants to get him into the locker room to meet with the team, get to know the playbook, get settled in a bit and then look to prepare for the Saints. Honestly, except for the Bye week, the trade couldn't come at a better time as the whole team and now Benjamin will have 10+ days to prepare for the Saints. If he goes out to play, they have to make another player Inactive and at this point, it seems to risky as they do have some injuries to some key positions like Safety and LB. Also, I don't want his trade to get into his head and feel he has to "save" the team or WR group....if the Bills win against the Jets, and that's a huge IF, then he can relax a bit and feel like he's just one member of the larger group while learning and acclimating.... as opposed to feeling like he has to immediately be the #1 go-to guy.

You know what they say, "Timing is everything"....and I'm pleased with how this team has fared this year thus far, and I'm encouraged by what I see from the FO to the coaching staff to what counts most, the on-field product. However, it is with cautious optimism and I think many if not all of us are in that boat.... That said, McD and Beane seemed to be a perfect match from the moment GM search was underway and McD really did rise to the top and the Pegulas took the advice of the league and used their services to locate the top HC prospects and then made their decision from there. So, they used the tools the league gave them and trusted their own "process"...also, and it sounds so cliche and tired...but sometimes, I think pieces of a puzzle just fall into place and the McD hire felt like that from the beginning and then when Beane started assembling his FO staff, it showed real promise based on the resumes of those hired. Glad to have them on board, glad to see the return on the investment thus far, and glad to have a hope for the Bills for this season and for the next two to three seasons based on promise and prospects.

It's threads like these that make this message board both the absolute best and the absolute worst....the same thread.....but for very different reasons. Regardless of trade yesterday, to think Beane is the "worst GM in Bills history" brings to light the microwave mentality by the fans in today's NFL....how we forget the Marv Levy as GM days and Russ Brandon calling the football shots and we gave out huge contracts at FA to Derrick Dockery and Langston Walker, traded Jason Peters, let Winfield go, Drafted lil' Donte BEFORE Ngata, traded UP for J.P. Losman, and so much, much more....they are building a TEAM, say it with me OP, T-E-A-M...meaning, talent be damned, if you don't get in the process and buy-in, you're not with the TEAM....think Beane is stupid, go talk to Belichick when he traded FOR Wes Welker and made him a star, traded away Seymour and Willie or kept bringing in replacement RBs year after year..... It's amusing if it weren't for being so infuriating because posts like this make the fan base look bad as a whole....