Alphadawg7

I mean there is a good chance in the real draft they trade down with the Vikings and don't pick again until 11 where there is no assurances either of the big 3 WR's are on the board. But they would also have 3 first round picks at min at that point and could take say Odunze or Thomas...or go and get a stud CB or DL prospect, 2 other biggest needs and then go get Thomas after and still have pick 27 to add yet another player. This is why I have found it puzzling a lot of people have AZ locked in on MHJ at 4 because moving back does a lot more for their team who isn't a WR away from competing and they still get an elite WR prospect in each of the likely trade back scenarios.

The Cardinals are not a MHJ away from contending as the roster is a bottom tier roster, they can safely make this trade back and still get an elite WR prospect, and TBH, they don't even need to go WR at this pick, they have 2 first round picks and now 2 3rds, and 2 4ths later too for them to double down on a WR. And, if they made this trade and Giants didn't go QB and went MHJ, they is nothing saying they still wouldn't trade back with say Vikings and get another first (giving them 3 total) if Chargers take Nabers/Odunze. Cardinals could still take someone like Thomas and have 2 more first rounders to go with their 3rd and 4th round picks they just stacked. But I know Kirby hates McCarthy, so Vikings won't be trading up in this draft with Chargers or AZ lol. In the real draft though, both Chargers and AZ picks would be prime spots for Vikings to go get a QB (unless they also don't like McCarthy lol).

I never thought to ask you who you were gonna take at 4, just assumed it was McCarthy. So this one was a fun surprise. I do think that the two most likely teams to make a trade with the Cardinals are the Giants and Vikings come the real draft. But I would assume the Giants would do it to get a QB, but maybe you are on to something, they are in need of playmakers in the worst way.

OFFICIAL TRADE: Cardinals and Giants are swapping picks and @BuffaloBillyG and the New York Giants are now on the clock. Details of the trade below. Cardinals send: #4, #138, #162 (1863.6 value points) Giants send: #6, #70, and #107 (1920 value points)

TRADE ALERT: Arizona Cardinals have submitted a trade for approval. Twitter is swirling with Rumors that it is the Bills and includes Josh Allen and multiple first round picks headed to AZ. Rumors started flying that someone associated with the Bills named @KDIGGZhas been pushing for this after tiring of Josh Allens lack of offseason workouts. Its all rumors right now, but thats what people thought about Diggs and look what happened...stay tuned to find out the mystery team.

He has also wowed guys like Jordan Palmer and Kyle Allen when they have seen him train or trained with him.

You do know this is maybe the best WR draft in NFL history right and there isn't a place anywhere in the first round where a team can't get a true high quality WR1 prospect. So the Cardinals are currently weighing all options on a team utterly devoid of talent

And honestly that’s what I think is going to happen on draft day. Or maybe even Giants to beat Vikes to a QB if they make the decision to get a QB.

Well the object is make the best moves for the team, not make the most picks for fun. But I get it too. Now shut your **** blocking mouth, you’re putting salt in my game 😂🤣😂

One more pick away just like a deep booger. Cardinals number 4 pick is still open for bids for those looking for that elusive QB. Don’t wait and miss out on a QB like a loser

Making it known now…Arizona Cardinals will listen to offers for the #4 pick. So if you’re looking for a QB hit me on my Motorola pager with the code 80085

I’ll take the Ravens as a 2nd team if you need it

Thanks for sharing. One key difference is Shakir is built quite a bit different than those other ones. I think he can be the outlier, I really do in terms of overall career. I don’t think he should be a primary boundary WR though or even there 50%. I said he can move around but will still eat primarily from the slot. I just think he can do more from the slot than a typical “slot” only guy and be a dangerous weapon there.

Polk McConkey Thomas Jr Mitchell Yes this draft is loaded which is why I don’t like the idea of an expensive move up.

Came here to say this. He has great ball skills and knows how to go up and get the ball, something of great value that isn't on our roster right now.

Nice work...and I think it only further shows that there is just no proven history that going all in to get a WR is the recipe. Granted, there were a couple near misses like Julio Jones who absolutely should have won...although the irony is not lost on me that the REASON they lost was because they kept THROWING the ball haha. Oh Kyle Shannahan what were you thinking. And when you go down this list, what stands out the most is that very few teams had an elite WR1, most had someone ranging from pretty good to pretty meh. Just further showing that maybe this board puts too much emphasis on getting that absolutely elite WR. And to be honest, it gets back to the original point by the OP...that maybe the best recipe is not that elite WR who commands a lot of targets and there is an effort to always get them the ball. History seems to show that maybe not having to force feed someone plays out better on the field where the QB spreads the ball around multiple guys and takes what the defense is giving them. Ha, well thanks for the time to read it, I am glad you at least didn't feel like it was a waste of your time

I get where you are coming from, but Owens and Moss don't qualify for what I am saying. Eagles didn't trade a bounty for TO, nor did the Patriots to get Moss who only spent a 4th round pick. And of course, they never won a Super Bowl either. So not that your points aren't valid, I think maybe you misunderstood the basis of my point of when teams give up a ton of draft capital to go get a WR that then diminishes their ability to continue to build the rest of the team. For example, anytime someone can go get a "Randy Moss" player for a 4th round pick and has the cap room to make it work, its a no brainer. But how often does a trade up to draft Julio Jones or big trade for a Tyreek Hill result in a Super Bowl? Answer is quite frankly never has. The reason I bring this up is we have to weigh the cost vs the return. Is it really necessary to go get a top 15 WR in the draft and give up 2-4 premium picks to do so? Well, only one team in the last 20 years even had a top 15 drafted WR1 in Mike Evans despite there being some great WR drafts over that span with some great WR's to come out of them early in those drafts. Consider the year we got Diggs. That draft, everyone here wanted us to use trade the farm to move up to get one of Ruggs, Jeudy, or Lamb because everyone knew none would make it to us, including Beane. Well...lets see how that worked out: Bills - we sent a pretty big trade package to Minny to get Diggs and then paid him a lot of money while Allen was on a rookie deal. Diggs emereged as a top 5, arguably top 3 WR during at least 2 of those years, and we only made it out of the 2nd round once in 4 years. What if we had instead traded up for one of the big 3: Ruggs and Jeudy - Ruggs is in Jail and Jeudy sucks compared to his hype and has been a mediocre WR. Lamb - Was being questioned if he was truly a WR1 until finally this year, his 4th season. Dallas has won even less than we have and they had multiple seasons with Cooper and Lamb. Best WR's in the draft ended up being people on the board at our original pick in Jefferson and Higgins. Lamb finally entered the debate now with Higgins on who is better, but up until this season it was Jefferson and Higgins. Trading up in that draft would have been a huge mistake and not returned the value of Diggs. Trading for Diggs worked out to help us win more games, but ultimately it delivered 4 disappointing playoff exits, none of which was because of our WR group. We lost in 2020 because we were the worse team 2021 we lost because of our defense 2022 we lost in the trenches and not being able to run the ball in bad weather 2023 we lost because he had no linebackers and couldn't even get Mahomes jersey dirty. The most correct thing to do was not trade for Diggs and stay put and take Jefferson. Doesn't mean the Diggs trade was bad or wrong, but not giving up draft capital and taking Jefferson on a rookie contract was more correct. But, again, Diggs trade makes more sense as no one knows how those rookies will turn out until they hit the field. Look around at other big moves to get a WR...Even a lesser cost of Hopkins to AZ when he was arguably the best WR in the NFL and at least top 3, did very little for them although they only gave a 2nd. Clevelands big trade for OBJ didn't do much either, neither did Antonio Brown to the Raiders, or Amari Cooper also in Cle. I mean the examples can keep going on, I am just trying to name more of the most recent ones. To be 100% clear, I want a WR early in this draft too, we all do. I would love to get one of MHJ, Nabers, Odunze, or Thomas...I just don't believe we should gut a lot of premium draft capital to do so because this team needs more than just one of them to get over the hump, its proven that already the last 4 years. And when you factor in how great this draft is, historically great, maybe the best of all time in talent and depth...it gets even more illogical to gut our draft capital on a team who needs to keep restocking young talent given for cap management. IMHO next years first should be really near our max, and only because we have two 2nd's next year now, so moving the first hurts less. But even so...imagine in 2025 having our first and then probably an early 2nd (Vikings) and of course our 2nd all next year for this roster, we could really load some talent up on this team. That could be what puts us over the top even. And we still would have added some exciting WR(s) in this draft too. For the record...if on draft day I see we make some big expensive move to get someone like Nabers, I won't be mad, adding Nabers would be incredibly exciting. I will however be concerned that the cost may outweigh the reward because we will need to keep building through the draft to find playmakers and elite talent elsewhere on the roster because we won't have cap room to sign them in FA.

Arizona, Eagles, Patriots

I do think its possible they could draft 2 WR's, all I was saying to the other poster was that we are not trading up in the first for a WR then again trading up in the 2nd for another WR. I would cap our trade up at next years first and only for one of the top 4 guys. And the only reason I would say we can include next years first is because of the extra 2nd we got from the Diggs trade making that more palatable. This draft is too good and rich to over pay to go too far up for a WR. Lets say we did go WR with both our first 2 picks...scenario one we take McConkey at 28 or on a small trade back, I wouldn't mind seeing them then go get someone like Legette or Polk after. If we took someone like Mitchell at 28, then I wouldn't mind seeing them go get someone like McConkey, Pearsall, etc after. Personally, I think we will nab one WR in either round 1 or 2 depending on the draft falls then probably not take another one until day 3, if we even take another one (Beane may still want to add another vet to the room instead).

We had a better WR group the past 4 seasons than many super bowl winning teams have had in the past 20 to 30 years. We had a top 5 WR (arguably top 3 a couple seasons) where only a few teams in the NFL can ever make that claim. We had Davis who by WR2 standards put up WR2 numbers despite his limitations. We had one of the best slot WR's in the NFL for part of that in Cole Beasley. Last year we had a rookie TE set team records, a 2nd year WR lead the NFL in catch rate, efficiency, and yards per target. We still had Diggs and Davis too along with a breakout star in Cook. People talk about the receiving group Allen has had like its been bad or bottom of the league and its just remotely close to reality. What really gets me, is this notion that we didn't advance because we didn't sign Hopkins like no one actually remembers the KC playoff game. We lost because we started a journeyman LB who had just been on his couch a few weeks earlier and the KC defense just literally attacked our LB's all game long. We lost because Chris Jones blew up Dawkins into Josh Allens foot a half second before Josh got a sure TD strike off to Shakir causing him to come up short. We lost because we lost key players on defense and couldn't make a play when we needed to stop KC. We lost because we couldn't get Mahomes jersey dirty and didn't win in the trenches. None of our losses was because of WR's unless you want to point the finger to our top end WR1 who dropped a pass 70 yards downfield. But even then, we had other chances to win that game and the team failed in other ares. 2020 - This team was not on the level to compete with KC yet and we lost bad on both sides of the ball to the Chiefs. 2021 - Allen had 9 TD's in 2 games...we were eliminated because our defense gave up 17 points in a matter of the final minutes of the game and OT. 2022 - We lost because Bengals dominated the trenches on both sides of the ball in a bad weather game where Dorsey was grossly outcoached and had no idea how to run the ball in bad elements. 2023 - We lost because (see recap above) I get it...we ALL want Allen to have as many weapons as possible. But this notion we havent won a Super Bowl because Beane ignored weapons for Josh is just not accurate IMHO and greatly exaggerated around here.

Here is the reality no one wants to see... Never in NFL history has a large investment to acquire a WR via trade, FA, or the draft has ever translated into a Super Bowl win. No team has given up multiple premium picks to trade for a proven top end WR and paid them big money and gone on to win a SB (which is what some want us to do to get Auiyuk, Higgins, etc). No team has ever signed a FA WR to top of the league money and then turned that into a SB win. No team has ever made a big trade up in the first round using multiple premium picks and won a SB (which many want to send multiple firsts and multiple 2nds to get up into the top 12). There is no example of a major investment like that in a WR ever leading to a SB trophy. There are however countless examples where teams have won the Super Bowl without having a top 5 WR. In the past 20 Super Bowls only 1 team had a WR1 drafted in the top 15 of the draft (Mike Evans). I want to find a WR1 for Josh too out of this draft, but people need to cool their jets on how much they are willing to give up to go get one. WR has never in NFL history, including the passing era, ever proven to be the "missing piece" for any championship team. And lets be real...Bills have had a top 5 WR the better part of the past 4 seasons, some would say top 3 WR for at least 2 of those seasons, and we only made it past the 2nd round once and never reached a Super Bowl. Going back to last year, we were 5-5 and firmly on the outside looking in regarding the playoffs when we treated Diggs like a high volume WR1. Once we went away from that we rallied to win the division and the 2 seed. Allen also had an INT% over 4% targeting Diggs and Davis while around 2% targeting everyone else. There are a number of reasons for that, but a big part of that is Allen taking what the defense gives him with everyone else rather than forcing it into Diggs or Davis. Allen is him. He doesn't need an elite WR to be an elite QB, in fact, Josh is at his best when he just goes out and makes plays without having to consider who he is getting the ball too. Yes...go draft a WR early in this draft in round 1 or 2. Yes, if there is a chance to make a small trade up to get Brian Thomas you can still pull that trigger. NO you DONT reach at 28 for just the sake of taking a WR if there is a better player at another position on the board. Yes, you can still get your WR in the 2nd, even make a less costly trade up to do so or even a trade back from 28 if that makes more sense to Beane and get back a 3rd or something. Bottom line is we do not need to mortgage our future for a WR, this has worked 0 times for a success rate of 0% and a fail rate of 100% in NFL history. ESPECIALLY in a draft this rich at WR where stud WR's will be coming out of it likely on day 1, day 2, and day 3.

Who was old and in decline last year just to still win the SB again.

I would rather keep Elam. He has shown more than Burks has at this point and with Tre gone and Bedford coming back from injury, Elam also has more value to the team right now and has a chance to compete to start. Burks would be competing at bottom of WR depth chart here to be a WR 4/5 right now with Hollis after we draft a WR. And if we draft 2 WRs he could end up 5th or 6th on the depth chart. Hollis also brings blocking and ST value over Burks too.

Agree…And to be clear, I’m not saying we would never trade up twice. I was just saying we aren’t trading up twice in first 2 rounds to take 2 WRs.

With the 100th pick in the 2024 NFL Draft, the Washington Commanders select: Cade Stover, TE, Ohio State Recruited as a LB who also played DE, Cade has shown adaptability and promise despite only playing TE full time 2 seasons. He brings a nice blend of toughness and explosiveness making him an exciting player both as a receiver and blocker despite his relative inexperience and we believe he can continue to grow as a TE and come in and compete to start. With that pick, the Commanders 3 round is complete and we couldn’t be more excited about the new look offense and exciting new defensive pieces for our new coaching staff to get to work with and carry this franchise into a new era. Draft Recap: 2 - Drake Maye, QB North Carolina 36 - Ladd McConkey, WR, Georgia 40 - Cooper Beebee, OL, Kansas State 67 - Austin Cooper, DE, Kansas 78 - Jeremiah Trotter Jr, LB, Clemson 100 - Cade Stover, TE, Ohio State Obviously with me having the final pick, you saved the best for last. Thank you @Virgil for another great draft, and you’re welcome for me once again carrying this draft and now anchoring it here at the end and putting a ribbon on it per uge. I know, I know…it’s really cool of me to participate without compensation, no need to keep thanking me because I’m so humble and just happy to give back. The charitable tax write off I get is thanks enough. If anyone is still reading this post and come this far then you may need to evaluate your life and schedule more outside time. 😂