Alphadawg7

Hahahahaha you sir win the internet today

Ha, I didn't even see what you posted...yeah I have been beating the drum for Shakir since we drafted him, definitely wasn't me short changing him.

Oh did we get a 5th back...for some reason I thought we just sent the 3rd. Well then maybe your proposal would work. Either way, I would be all for it from our side if the Packers would bite. To be fair though, I don't know his contract numbers look like in a trade, but draft pick comp vs player value is there if we can handle the cap impact.

Ha all good man, just a friendly chat. But I can assure you that Shakir is coveted around the league as I hear from people very much in the league about it. An unselfish WR, who has some of the best hands in football, who is a major RAC threat with the ball in his hands, and also is both a good and willing blocker that does all the dirty work too...he is a rare find in todays NFL and coaches covet guys like him. Not to mention his commitment and dedication to reach his potential he puts into his offseason's.

2 reasons why I don't think the Shakir deal "killed off" any options or plans for them... It is very clear that extending Shakir was a high priority, and I said it would be during the season and I believe you did too. This extension was part of their plan from the get go, so getting it done isn't making them change direction in how they intended on addressing the WR group this offseason. What is really out there in the form of a blockbuster vet WR trade? The most wishful one has been DK, but he isn't even officially available, its just speculation that Seattle would trade him, and even if they did, its more guess work as to what they would want for him. So what else is there if not DK? Hill? Not going to likely be traded IMHO, but even if he was, they are not sending him to Buffalo and we aren't taking on his salary and baggage he brings. Adams? More likely to get cut than traded IMHO. Deebo? Not a fit at all for what we need here. I think the most realistic plan was either using FA to sign a vet, drafting help, or some combo of both. And I think their plan is to look at things like bringing back Cooper or signing a vet in FA like Hollywood, Slayton, or even Adams (if he is cut) if they go the vet route in any capacity. I am not saying they wouldn't have pulled the trigger on a blockbuster WR trade, but I just don't see such a trade out there unless DK is really made available. And dont get me wrong, would be great if they did land someone like DK, just don't think it was ever realistic. So for me, I don't think this extension "killed off" anything and was always part of their plan for the offseason.

They got a 3rd from us for Rasul...Jaire is better than Rasul, not sure that gets it done. But I would do that deal if they the Packers would take it

Actually, Shakir is very highly respected outside of Buffalo and around the league, not just as a "nice" player, but as a very good player. And no one player is going to be the foundation of the best passing duo in the league in Buffalo, not in this style of offense where they run a balanced offense and spread the ball around in a true "everybody eats" fashion that isn't going away regardless of who is on the roster. He is the kind of player coaches covet, dont be fooled by the fact that he may not be the most coveted guy in fantasy football...had Shakir hit the FA market he would have had a lot of suitors and gotten noticeably more money.

Ollie has speed, he is 4.45 guy, but he’s more downhill long speed than short area explosive speed. Once he gets in the open he’s fast and tough to bring down. But I do agree I think they would look at more of home run hitter I think that has that more explosive acceleration and shiftiness at the LOS for more big play potential since we already have Davis.

No disprespect bud...but that is missing a LOT Of context and the bolded is not really a fair statement...The only guys drafted to actually compete at WR were Davis, Shakir, and Coleman, all of which started for this team. The rest were late round fliers for ST purposes or guys who could spend some time on the PS and potentially develop. And that is because they had Diggs and found Davis early and were initially using vets like Brown and Sanders as Davis developed more even though Davis began contributing immediately as a rookie. So really, Beane is 3 for 3 with a 4th TBD in Keon. He sent a first for Diggs who exceeded expectations, turned a 4th rounder in Davis into a significant contributor and starter, and drafted Shakir to be the future of the slot. If Keon hits, then he will be 4 of 4 when using draft capital to find starters for the offense at WR. At no point were McCloud (who has made a nice littler career for himself), Proehl, Stevenson, Hodgins, or Shorter ever considered the future of the position, future starters, etc when they were drafted. And every team has an exact list just like this of late round guys they took for the same reasons that also didn't do anything.

Just to be clear...Keon Coleman played 4 less games than Worthy and started 5 less games. Bills also set an NFL record for most wins by 20+ or more (believe it was 7) to where Allen and the offense took off the 4th quarter and even most the 2nd half of a couple games. Keon plays for a defensive HC. Worthy plays for one of the best offensive minds in history with a QB considered in the GOAT conversations already before he is 30. YET - Worthy only had 82 more yards on the season and 2 more TD's as a reciever. 4 more games...5 more games started...only 82 more receiving yards and 2 more TD's. Keon 19.2 yards per catch. Worthy 10.8 yards per catch. With Keon, Allen had his best season as a pro and won MVP. With Worthy as a season long starter, Mahomes had his worst season as a pro. What you are doing is carefully being sure to add the "postseason" because Worthy got a huge stat boost in the SB down 34-0 with a bunch of garbage time stats that make it look like he did more than he really did. The reality is that Worthy showed who he was, a complimentary piece more suited for as more of a specialty player than a lead target...at least so far. And that is not what the Bills needed during the draft, and even if we redrafted I would bet money our pick still isn't Worthy, nor should it be.

All good, and agree about it being an indictment of this passing offense which this year was more take what the D gives you and spreads the ball around. Shakir is a product of our system in terms of depth of target and stuff because of how dangerous he has shown to be with the ball in his hands. They are using him on this short quick strikes almost as an extension of the run game, much how SF uses Deebo a lot. I think if you put Shakir in a more high volume role with someone like Rams or Lions who know how to really use a guy like him, he would be an automatic 1000+ yard guy and wouldn't surprise me to see him put up several 1200+ yard seasons in a role like that. Im just glad we got him here for the next 4 years on a good deal for him and the Bills because he has been our most trusted and reliable pass catcher who has the trust and great rapport from Allen. I still like Keon despite never quite getting back to where he was before the injury. And I think both him and Shakir will only benefit by adding someone who can be a threat downfield.

I think you missed the part where he was comparing Worthy and Shakir, not Keon.

Just wanted to say congratulations to Shakir and his new deal and this felt like the thread to do it. I said all over this board during the season he was not only going to get extended, but it was going to happen this offseason because Beane would be motivated to lock him up now before FA and Shakir would be motivated to get a new deal now rather than play on a 5th round rookie contract one more season risking injury before FA. Not to mention, the whole organization loves Shakir and he seems to love it here, so the motivation for a fair deal at a home town discount was all there. I couldn't love this deal more...great move Beane and couldn't be happier for Shakir who earned every bit of this life changing deal. LFG! GO BILLS! 2024 Highlights: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tGZ9o0ZaeSs

So you think garbage time stats in the Super Bowl down 34-0 makes his post season great? LMAO...you just want to stick to your original position at all costs.

This is where I get to write: I told you so This is what I have been saying...Bills love him and want him here...he loves it here and wants to be here...he is on a 5th round rookie deal where an injury risk is huge for him this year. They were going to for sure want to extend him now before he gets to FA and he would be motivated to get it done and give a home town discount well below where people like sportrac were saying over $19M. LOVE LOVE LOVE this. Great for him, Great for the Bills. LFG.

I actually really like Ollie, but with Davis here not sure he is the style of back they would target if they did move on from Cook via trade over the contract. Feels like they would look to pair more of a big play threat, home run hitter with Davis. As intriguing as Ollie is, his speed is more down hill style and while he has good long speed, he isn't that explosive in short areas. I think they like how Cook was shifty and explosive in short areas around the LOS and will look to bring someone in who brings more of that if we did move on from him. But I wouldn't hate us drafting Ollie by any means.

So did Diggs to be fair

He has certainly said stuff like this about Elam, he also said it about other rookies too, and from the early going. Guys like Ford for example. I mean both McD and Beane made comments about Kincaid too, who is just a 2nd year player. The difference is, Keon is a much higher profile player than most rookies because of 3 factors, so it gets more attention: He was the first real addition to replace Diggs (and Davis) in the same season and came with high expectations because of it He was our first pick in the draft making him our highest profile rookie, and a controversial pick at that given we traded back before we took him and didn't take some other guys some thought we might take He immediately became a media darling out the gate, so he garners a lot of attention because of his charismatic personality and funny sound bites So when a coach or GM talks about him, its going to get noticed more and even more over analyzed. This

I mean if you listen to the interview and not just read the carefully plucked statements to drive engagement, you will see that the comments aren't nearly the damning comments they are being made out to be. I mean he is just being straight about what Keon's rookie season was. There were some great things we saw, and there were some moments we all know Keon would love to have back. And he obviously didn't get back to where he was after the injury, so McD isn't saying anything that Keon and everyone already doesn't know. End of the day, he was a rookie on a team whose leading receiver had less than 900 yards and he still managed to put up 556 yards, avg 19.2 yards per catch for a guy that everyone here said was too slow to be a big play threat, and this was despite missing 4 games due to injury. There is plenty to still be optimistic of with Keon, he showed more good than bad as a rookie, and like McD said, its on him in terms of how well and fast he continues to develop.

So you’re saying that the #4 offense in nfl history lost because…the opponents defense. Just like the #1, 2, and 3 offenses in NFL history did too in the playoffs. But I bet it won’t stop you from saying we need more offense though

Don’t worry, the we must go all in on WR crowd will still find ways to ignore and spin all the facts to argue not to invest in the defense still. It’s utterly mind boggling.

No problemo bud

Good post and honestly, I don't know how more people don't see it this way either. As much as I would like to see Cook stay, being honest about him, he is a 2 down back that is a liability in pass pro who benefits greatly from a great OL and a QB that defenses need to fear as a runner and as a QB with the best arm in the game. Cook reminds me a bit of guys like Deion Branch, Peerless Price, etc where they excelled in the specific environments they were in, but struggled after they got traded in other situations. Is he really that good or is he really benefitting from being along side Allen and behind this OL to where he is over achieving? I mean Davis had a great game in the one game he started for Cook, and journeyman Ty has been the 3rd down RB over Cook with Allen even calling him the best 3rd down back in the league. I am with you and like the 8 to 10 million range myself, and if that cant get it done (which doesn't seem like it would) I would at least start gauging his trade value/interest around the league, especially heading into a strong draft to be looking for a RB replacement.

I mean we have invested very little draft wise into the position and used low cost FA’s to fill roles. Serviceable is the word to describe almost all of them because that is what you get when you don’t invest into the position.

A good comparison in my mind is Big Ben. He evolved past being a physical runner as his age increased, and that allowed Ben to be a good QB longer than say someone like Cam Newton who really wasn’t a great QB, so when Cam’s physical gifts started to decline so did his career and sharply because he was never a high level passer. Big Ben retired at 39 after 18 seasons and his best season as a passer in his career was when he was 35 or 36 in 2018 when he threw for over 5000 yards. In fact the best 2 year span of his career was his mid 30’s in 2017 and 2018 when he was 35 and 36 years old and threw for over 9,300 yards and had 65 TDs.