Alphadawg7

I get that, but as you said, go watch him play actual football and I promise you that you won't come away with the thought he is a "slower player". 4.54 gets mis labeled as slow, but its not that slow and when you put pads on and getting open and beating man involves everything from agility, route running, strength, etc, you will see that a guy can get open with ease at all 3 phases of the field, even at less than elite speed. I encourage you and everyone to watch this...I mean he is separating all over the field and every throw is 40 yards down field. This guy I am telling you all should not be over looked because his "underwear olympics" (as @Beck Watercoined it) 40 times was not as fast as some of the other prospects, but was fast enough. This dude plays fast with aggression, power, and has elite ball skills and hands.

Yes, I think he very much does. Speed on the field comes from a lot of things, not just as you put it “underwear Olympics” forty times. For example, anyone who thinks Worthy is gonna play as fast as Tyreek Hill are puzzling to me. Hill has elite speed in every capacity, not just straight line speed and is strong and physical despite his short height. I mean I would take Polk right now over Coleman for example who by almost all accounts is projected to go ahead of Polk. Coleman does have some separation concerns and he isn’t as good on contested catches as Polk and doesn’t have the level of ball skills Polk has which I think is only second to Odunze in this draft, and a close second. Honestly I would take Polk over Worthy, Legette, Coleman and Pearsall, all guys projected to go ahead of him. Worthy to me lacks the strength and frame to be a true WR1, especially in Buffalo. Legette has maybe a higher ceiling, but also a much lower floor as he is not nearly as polished in many of the areas Polk is. Pearsall I think is better suited as a WR2, although I do think he had potential to be a great WR2. And Coleman as I said has question marks about creating separation at the next level. I’m worried he is Gabe Davis with better hands if he can’t separate in the NFL enough. If we don’t trade up, the top 5 wish list guys for me are currently: Mitchell, McConkey, Franklin, Polk, Legette. I would take Mitchell at 28, but would probably try and trade back if I was going after one of the other guys. If we trade up, then obviously any of the big 4 are excellent options for us. My guess would be that Thomas is the most obtainable or maybe Odunze.

I know this guy isn't a true sleeper, but I think his value is being slept on too much, and that is Ja'lynn Polk, WR, Huskies. He has superior ball skills and strong hands, and 100% fits that theme Beane and McD want of making the catch. What he lacks in 40 time he more than makes up for with route precision, physicality, and ball skills. With a draft this deep, its not a surprise some of these guys are getting almost lost in the shuffle in the draft buzz. But if the Bills exited this draft with just Polk as the addition at WR, I would still be excited. Don't get me wrong, not at all saying he should be our target or who we should take at 28. I am saying, hypothetically Bills go another position at 28 and then wait to pick 60 to draft a WR, if Polk was the guy I would still be very stoked about him. I know the big knock is the 4.54 forty time...but that is faster than Keenan Allen, Larry Fitzgerald, Cooper Kupp, etc who all had over 4.6 to over 4.7 forty times. What people fail to realize about 40 times too often is that straight line speed in shorts and does not automatically translate to on field speed of play. A guy slower in the 40 may play faster or be better at getting separation at the next level than someone who put up a faster time. It is not the end all be all measurement its made out to be. So for me, Polk is not getting enough buzz, but I really think he is going to be a very good player in the NFL. And in Buffalo, where bad weather often helps even the playing field speed wise in those late season and playoff games, having a guy with exceptional ball skills, who runs precise routes and is physical can be a major weapon.

Lets recap: You post a trade scenario for probably the most loved player in Western NY sports history. A player that has averaged 5100 yards and 44 TD's and been a perennial MVP candidate for 4 straight years still in his prime on a discount compared to other top paid QB's in the league. Then you use compensation that is GROSSLY undervaluing him that has NO possibility of ever being considered by anyone within the Bills organization. Then you compound it by telling the doubters here that you "100% guaranteeing" that BOTH the offers have come in and that Beane HAS considered trading him because you know "business". So I am not sure what is worse...your original never gonna happen trade offer or that you thought this would go better around here lol

I would almost argue this has more possibility than the Josh Allen trade proposal in the OP... Before I can answer yes or no...I need to know what kind of bubble gum it is first, that would be the key to this trade for me

Stop moving the goal post. We are not talking about every player in the NFL, we are talking about one specific player, so stop putting words in my mouth as if I said everyone is untouchable. And that right deal is not a deal anyone would offer to move the needle for Beane is the point because everyone knows Allen is not available for trade and to make him available would cost more than any team is willing to pay. Geezus dude...moving the needle again. You want to speculate that maybe someone inquired in Josh's first 2 years before he became untouchable to the Bills after his year 3 breakout, then sure go ahead and do that. But you know you aren't talking about then, you are talking about NOW (see OP and Poll)...and in recent time since Allen became what Allen is now, which is untouchable to this franchise after averaging 5100 yards and 44 TDS per year for the past 4 seasons. Again...I don't think you understand the difference in ONE side OFFERING and the OTHER side CONSIDERING or not. Just because a team makes an offer does not in any circumstance equate to the other team "considering" it before making a decision. There is absolutely no chance what so ever that someone called Beane and made an offer where Beane actually CONSIDERED it before saying no. It would have been met with an immediate no and probably some laughter. Hate to break it to you, but none of what you are saying is business insight. It's make believe "what if" stuff that will never happen, and has never happened, and literally has nothing to do with business.

You don’t seem to know the difference from someone calling to ask the impossible and Beane actually considering it. There has absolutely under no circumstance been even been one second of thought by Beane considering whether his answer should be yes or no. The fact you delusionaly think you can “guarantee” it’s happened is maybe the most ludicrous thing I’ve seen written on the board this year. Not only that, I highly doubt no team in the NFL has even attempted to approach the Bills about a trade for Josh Allen as everyone in the league already knows that not only is he 100% not available, to even begin to get the Bills to think for even 1 second before saying no, the offer would have to be so ludicrous that they couldn’t make that offer in the first place. To say everyone had a price is such a lazy cop out and a false statement. It takes TWO to make a deal…so it’s not just everyone has a price, there needs to be someone willing to pay that price, and I assure you there are 0 teams that would ever pay the price it would take for Beane to even think about it, let alone say yes. So sorry, but I guarantee you’re categorically wrong about Beane having considered trading Josh Allen.

What makes this trade worse and inherently dumber, is that any future picks from Bears would be late round picks as hey would win too much with Allen. So you’re not even getting good picks back. Anyone who votes yes should have their account suspended until after the draft because the yes vote is that dumb Wrong. 0% chance Beane has considered trading Josh Allen. ZERO.

Hahaha all good and all luv brother! And I don't know that I would say I am gonna die on this hill haha, but I definitely don't want to over compensate either. I think you are very much underestimating the Bills young core right now. Cook is a dual threat, he is more than someone to fill gaps. We have arguably the best TE room in the league right now having both Kincaid and Knox. If all the teams lined up and drafted only TE's across the NFL, I guarantee you Kincaid would be picked top 3 by most GMs...some would take him higher than that. Shakir just led all WR's in catch rate, yards per target, and efficiency. Samuel is in his prime at 27 and finally playing with a real QB for the first time in his career after already being a pretty productive player who had his best year under Brady in Carolina. Now, Kincaid is entering year 2...Shakir year 3 (that fabled year where WR's often take another step forward)...and Cook year 3 now fully entrenched as the lead back and an OC committed to get him the ball on the ground and through the air. That is a pretty exciting young core...I wouldn't refer to them as "gap fillers", this is going to be a spread the ball around offense and all of those guys will play heavy roles this year along with what ever Rookie we take early. Now what rookie is the question...personally I think it seems to be trending towards Troy Franklin right now, but I still am hoping for Brian Thomas. Although I would be stoked about Franklin still, just hoping its Thomas. My real draft crush is Odunze, but I am skeptical Beane will go up that high to get him unless he falls into the mid first range, but I seriously doubt that happens. I think its more likely the big 3 all go top 10.

Marvin Harrison Jr., Ohio State - Cardinals Rome Odunze, Washington - Buffalo Ladd McConkey, Georgia - Carolina Brian Thomas Jr., LSU - Chiefs Xavier Worthy Texas- Cowboys

I don't complain. We have better weapons than people think. We have arguably the best TE room in the NFL with the combo of Kincaid and Knox, a dual threat RB in Cook who broke out last year, a young productive WR in his prime who has never had a real QB in Samuel, and a young WR who just led the NFL in catch rate, Yards per target, and efficiency in Shakir. And I have no doubt we are going to add another high quality WR via the draft, possibly 2. The over exaggeration of how "bad" our weapons have been is comical around here. There are teams who would kill for our roster of weapons last year. For how "bad" our weapons have been, Josh by some miracle has managed for the last 4 years be an MVP finalist, average 5100 yards and 44 TDs, lead the 2nd highest scoring and 2nd highest winning team over those 4 years, and set the NFL record for most TD's in his first 5 seasons and continued that record to now be most TD's in first 6 seasons. Same QB who put up 9 TD's in 2 games to see his defense bounce him in the playoffs against KC. Same QB who has watched his defense crumble all of the last 4 years in the playoffs. So while I agree, we are never going to suck bad enough to get a Chase (unless Allen gets hurt like Burrow did which allowed Cincy to get Chase), Chase and Higgins didn't win a SB either, and now that window is gone most likely with Higgins probably getting traded and cap issues making it hard to pay both now that Burrow is getting paid. Personally, with our current group and whatever Rookie(s) we add, I think Allen is going to have his best season to date.

Keep in mind, I have not once said it’s bad to acquire WR talent…I said it had not paid off to heavily over leverage and invest to where you take away from your team. So people keep bringing up Bengals for example who drafted Higgins and then because Burrow missed his rookie year had Chase fall in their lap. What I’m against is over leveraging assets to WR at a detriment of other potions on the roster by spending important draft capital and cap space. While I don’t think we have to mortgage our future for MHJ, Nabers, or Odunze because this class is so strong, I would still much rather go get one of them and avoid paying a WR $28M for the next 3-4 years.

So Allen, who averages 5100 yards and 44 TDs for the past 4 years isn’t good enough and needs the best receiver group in the league? Then why have lesser QBs won Super Bowls without having a receiver as good as Diggs? Allen has the most TDs in NFL history…but somehow he must have the best WR group in the league to get a SB? We are also 2nd in wins and 2nd in scoring over those 4 years. But we supposedly can’t win a SB without have 2 top WR1 level receivers according to a lot of people here, and that makes no sense. I mean, look at our last 4 playoff exits… 2020 - We lost to KC as we were the lesser overall team. 2021 - We had a WR put up over 200 yards and 4 TDs and lost because our defense gave up 17 points in final couple minutes and OT. 2022 - Cincy dominated us in trenches on both sides of the ball and Brady couldn’t get a run game going in bad weather. 2023 - We lost because we had no LBs, and the ghost of Kelce and Mahomes attacked our LBs all game and we couldn’t get Mahomes dirty. Everyone wants as many great WRs we can get…myself included. But neglecting the roster to go all in on WRs for a team with a huge QB contract and cap issues is a big risk as it leaves you thin elsewhere. So giving up a bunch of picks and paying Aiyuk means we are weaker elsewhere. Not to mention, we are an outdoor bad weather stadium where the first thing impacted is passing game. And this team was already not good enough with Diggs to get there with guys like Tre, Poyer, Hyde, Morse, Davis, etc. who are also all gone. So stick to the draft and get that cap relief and pair Allen with someone for Allen’s prime while they are on a rookie contract. Dont compound the issue and give up valuable picks and then go pay the guy $28m. Because if you do, then you must hit on the majority of your remaining draft picks (very hard to do).

Im not saying it’s not good to have good WR group, I’m saying over weighing your assets into WR rather than balancing the roster has yet to really payoff for anyone. Which is why I doubt Beane is going to both trade draft capital and pay Aiyuk in the high 20’s. Id rather trade up for Odunze and at least get his cheaper contract, and that’s not because I don’t like Aiyuk, because I think he would be great with Allen. But if we tie up all that cap space and lose draft assets it’s going to hold us back at multiple valuable positions on this team through the loss of draft talent or the ability to sign people in free agency, including our own when they come due. And we already came up short having a top 5 WR the last 4 years as it is.

No, I was adding more to further the point. And winning a SB is what matters, so pretty sure not winning that one game is kind of a big deal

Huh? Miami's QB was an MVP candidate and still couldn't win the division with both Hill and Waddle and a 4 game lead last in the season. Eagles had their MVP candidate QB too and didn't get the job done yet with both AJ Brown and Smith. Cincy has Burrow and didn't get the job done with both Chase and Higgins. Dallas has Dak who has been one of the most prolific passers statistically in the NFL who had Cooper and Lamb. So...yeah...your counter point makes no sense considering Dallas, SF, Mia, and Phi all had QB's who have been MVP candidates. Chargers had Allen and Williams with Herbert and can't even make the playoffs.

Ha I am assuming this is either sarcasm directed at the other poster who keeps naming old fogey WR's as better than Aiyuk...or you just replied to me by mistake since I didn't mention Julio lol

Kupp has 2 seasons with over 1000 yards. Two. My wife is a die hard Niners fan, and so I watch every Niners game. You are grossly undervaluing and underestimating Aiyuk. I would take him in a heartbeat over Olave and Kupp...and he is at least as good as DJ Moore. I would say they are pretty close to each other. I don't think we should trade for him, but that doesn't mean you are accurately portraying him either. He is an excellent WR and would go off with a QB like Allen more than he already has. I mean look at what he is doing on a run heavy team with a 2nd year QB that doesn't have a big arm. As much as you are underrating Aiyuk, you are now overrating Keenan for this next season. Is he still a quality player, yes, but he isn't the player he once was and if the over/under on yards was 1000 yards this year I would take the under all day. No disrespect, but you seem to be hung up on names more than being in tune to where some of these guys are right now. Kupp? Allen? No GM in the NFL would choose them over Aiyuk right now.

That wasn't me bud, that was a trade I believe Gunner was doing. I didn't try to make a trade because I already knew the rule. Just saying, I probably would have packaged two 3rds to go get someone like Pearsall, Roman Wilson, or Polk to pair with Odunze with all that extra draft ammo I had after the two tiny trade backs. And I think the Cardinals might have as well...or for someone on the OL too, could see them making that move as well.

Does it though? As I have shown before, teams keep investing tons in WR's and haven't seen the payoff. Look at arguably the best WR in the game in Hill...Miami can't even when their division with him and a 4 game lead late in the season with Waddle, Archane, and Mostert too. Adams didn't do anything for Raiders. Diggs didn't help the Bills do anything other than lose 3 straight years in the 2nd round. Minnesota had both Diggs and Theilen and didn't get over the hump. Dallas had both Cooper and Lamb and won less than we did. Niners didn't get it done with both Aiyuk and Deebo, plus they had Kittle and CMC too. People always say this about WR, but we are not seeing this translate on the field like people assume it does.

With Arizona armed with so many picks (2 first, early 2nd, five 3rd, two 4ths) after my 2 small trade backs, I considered it. But with Odunze already in the fold, there were are a lot of other young WR's to add next to him I would think they would just prefer to go after. In fact, I would have traded up again (still having 3 third round picks, and 2 fourths right now) and grabbed someone like Pearsall or Roman Wilson, but your rules don't allow for us to trade a pick that has already been traded. So only 1 of my remaining thirds could be traded and I thought it would be unrealistic to give away next years 1st or 2nd just to make a trade work here in this deep of a WR draft. But moving 2 of the 3rds I have this year to go get one would have worked draft comp range to go get one, so I would have 100% pulled the trigger to nab another WR mid round 2. Nice pick! And great draft @Virgil, this was a blast as always! We all appreciate the time and work you put into it!

DeVonta Smith got his bag today, and $25m/per is no small number. I would think Aiyuk will command more than this, and I know a lot of people have been thinking Bills could trade for him, make some crazy offer for Jefferson, or even Higgins (no thanks). I have a hard time seeing Beane see this kind of money going out for a WR2 and thinking its a good idea to trade for a WR1 likely to cost more than this. I won't rule it out, Beane has shown to be aggressive when he wants a player, but I would think this pushes Aiyuk contract demands up even more and I am gonna guess Jefferson might end up the first WR over $30M (Hill being the first to hit $30M). We are staring at a historically great WR draft, so is Beane going to focus there (maybe he already was) or would he still pull the trigger knowing he is gonna have to pay one north of $25M per? My gut says draft, we are in a different cap situation then when we traded for Diggs and Allen was on his rookie deal still, so hard to see him want to take on that much cap with a WR draft this strong in front of him. But never know...

Thanks, added that to the OP since Vons expired. And better yet, you got the point of the thread was just that this was funny, not about Von and his track record

The sad part is when Josh is an MVP candidate again, the media and his critics are more likely to say that they were wrong about his weapons being bad when Josh makes Kincaid, Shakir, a rookie, Samuel, etc look great this year. They are more likely to say it’s because Josh is loaded with the best young weapons in the game than they are to give Josh the amount of credit he will deserve. Josh 4 year average is 5100 yards and 44 TDs, and they have done everything in their power to discredit Josh and make others the reason for that like Diggs. Never seen anything like the criticism he gets. It’s like the media and critics have made him a villain because he hasn’t eclipsed Mahomes. It’s insane, especially for a guy a classy, likable, and charitable as Josh.

UPDATE: This is just funny…not about anyone making a prediction. He posted an Instagram story, may not be up much longer as they expire after 24 hours, but it’s hilarious. It’s the AI thing everyone’s doing over the Lil Yachty Walk out clip from a year ago that went viral. For those not familiar with the original clip or viral AI trend, here is another example. Von posted one with Brandon Beane as Lil Yacthy via AI like The Joker is here with the caption “Brandon Beane arriving at the 2024 draft to trade up for a WR” haha