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No disrespect - but - not really sure how its not part of the conversation? A major concern about Worthy coming out, and still is now, was his small frame holding up to high volume work in the NFL. Pretty doubtful Keon misses time if he had run into Kelce week 1. "Availability is the best ability" is an entrenched mantra in the NFL for a reason. So to act like it has no value, especially during a stretch the Chiefs went 1-2 and are looking up in their division and well behind in the seeding race in the AFC right now seems unreasonable. Not to mention, this was just 1 game he has appeared in, and against the same team Keon had a big game and was a core reason why we won it. Not to mention, Worthy has way more target opportunities in KC right now with the lack of weapons there due to a lesser WR room, lesser OL, lesser RB room and their actual best WR suspended. So no disrespect, but feels like the pro Worthy crowd only seems to be interested in discussing things that provide confirmation bias for preexisting opinions. What is most interesting is how few people seem so shut down to the idea that BOTH teams got the guy that fits best with what they wanted, needed, and the offenses they run. KC wasn't looking for a WR1, they wanted a deep threat and didn't need size either with Kelce and Rice there amongst others. Bills were looking for more a physical and bigger target given we lacked size on our WR room when we drafted Keon and were in the beginning of a full retooling of the group.

First of all, Beane had nothing to do with passing on Mahomes (that was McD/Whaley). But, yes, let's talk about hindsight with Mahomes. Easy to say now the Bills should have drafted Mahomes or not traded K.C. that pick. But, in 2017, we had a first year head coach who didn't even have a good assessment of his own roster yet. We had a lame duck GM, who was about to be fired. At the time, 2017 was not considered a great draft for QBs. Some people felt that K.C. reached for Mahomes at 10 (he was not expected to be as good as he's been, or at least get there as fast as he did by many at the time). And 2018 was already shaping up (again, at the time) to be a generational QB class, as good as 1983. It made all of the sense in the world at the time for McD to wait on his QB. Wait until he knew his roster and organization, wait until he had a GM he trusts and had time to scout all of the QBs, wait for the better QB class, etc. I think you are looking back with hindsight if you think the Bills should have drafted Mahomes. I tried to follow all of the trade deals and subsequent trades of those picks and this was basically what I found as the outcome of the two trades (draft picks in parentheses): Chiefs got: Mahomes (10), Worthy (28), CB Jaden Hicks (133), OC C.J. Hanson (248). Bills got: Tremaine Edmunds (16), Tredavious White (27), Keon Coleman (32), Zay Jones (37), Dion Dawkins (63), DeWayne Carter (95), and OT Travis Clayton (221). The Bills also had to give up two 5th rounders in the process: picks 154 and 156. So, picks 10, 28, 154, and 156 netted us the above 7 players. Sure Zay was a bad pick and Tremaine never quite reached the level of his draft status (though a solid player), but I'd say we did ok. No picks will ever match the value of Mahomes, obviously, but considering we were still able to get Josh the next year, I'd say things worked out for the best. I personally would take Josh 100 times out of 100 times over Mahomes, not because I think Josh is better than Mahomes, but because he just fits Buffalo so perfectly (and I like him/his personality better---though Pat seems like a good guy too). Time to let the whole Mahomes trade go...everything happened they way it was meant to and our day in the Sun will come. Couldn't agree more with everything you've said Generic (even though I didn't quote all of it). But the bold statement is the key that some people just can't get. Both players are good and each team got the guy they wanted. We didn't want Worthy for our offense (otherwise we would have just picked him where we were rather than trading back, and obviously K.C. wanted Worthy over Keon, as they picked Worthy with Keon still on the board). This was a win-win for both teams. And it's not like Worthy is going to be the one player that prevents us from beating K.C. Well, yes, let's talk about the playoffs for a moment. Before garbage time in the Super Bowl (11 quarters of playoff games), Worthy was averaging 53.45 yards and 0.36 TDs per playoff game (and that includes the 29-yard reception in the Bills game that definitely should have been called an INT or an incompletion---but the refs gave it to Worthy). He wasn't killing it all playoffs. Then, with 2:33 minutes left in the third quarter of the Super Bowl, with the Eagles winning 34-0, Worthy hits some big plays. Let me repeat that, the game was 34-0 in favor of the Eagles (34-6 going into the 4th quarter) when Worthy went off. Do you think maybe the Eagles had let up a bit at that point? Do you think Worthy still has that outburst if it's a one-score game at that point? I'm not knocking him for his SB production (it was still impressive and I'd be excited about it as a Chiefs fan as hopefully, things to come), I'm just saying I don't think you can use last year's playoffs as any kind of arbiter for these two players because Keon was in a weird place in our offense after coming back from injury and with Mack playing well in his absence (and Curtis Samuel getting healthy), and because the majority of Worthy's stats came in garbage time of a blowout. To be clear with their career stats thus far: Regular Season: Worthy (19 games): 64 recs on 107 targets for 721 yards and 6 TDs, 11.3 yards/rec, 6.74 yards/target. 142 rushing yards with 3 TDs. Coleman (17 gms): 46 recs on 79 targets for 759 yards and 5 TDs, 16.5 yards/rec, 9.6 yards/target. 8 rushing yards with 0 TDs. Total yards and TDs (reg season): Worthy 863 and 9 TDs; Keon 767 and 5 TDs (Worthy has played two more games than Keon and has 50 more touches). Total yards and TDs (reg season and playoffs): Worthy 1,150 yards and 12 TDs; Keon 789 yards and 5 TDs. (Worthy had 66 more touches than Keon.) Total yards and TDs (reg season and playoffs, minus SB garbage time): Worthy 1,002 yards and 10 TDs; Keon 789 yards and 5 TDs (Worthy with 60 more touches than Keon.) Like I said, it seems like a win/win scenario for both teams, imo. But either way, it will probably take a couple more seasons to make any true assessment, in relation to comparing the two players.

We played Justin Fields, Tua and Spencer Rattler….

(James Cook tilts his head...)

Vrabel has always preferred this approach. I hope we don't defer if we win the toss. Best way to set the tone in this game is a long scoring drive to start it off & make them play catch-up.

The reason he may have been falling down was trying to cut around White and cut too hard so White's being there caused him to slip. On NFL radio today they were talking about the same thing, that with limited pre-season, the first few weeks are like pre- season use to be and that causes the out of timing issues, penalties, etc. I also think a team like Buffalo with all the established vets likely plays the starters even less than some other team would that is turning over the roster like the Saints.

Expect a steady stream of rushes and ball control offense for BOTH teams.

These guys know their playbooks. They know their assignments. They have millions of dollars on the line. They are prepared.

I agree. His response and his delivery of the response sucked. He’s probably an a-hole. Gregg Williams 2.0? She could’ve asked the question with a not so derogatory tone and facial expression and he took extreme exception to that. When I heard her ask the question the way she did, I cringed in real time. Then cringed even harder with his reaction.

For once. Broken clock is still right twice a day.

It’s really fun to re-litigate this trade every week.

If we had picked him instead of giving up the pick to the Chiefs, we would have him and he wouldn't be on the Chiefs. Look how they struggled without him.

1. Do you have ridiculous game day rituals? - absolutely absurd rituals, like literally call the wagon rituals LOL 2. Do you wear the same clothes on game day? - see above unwashed 3. Do you have rituals during the game, like changing seats if things aren’t going well? - no I stay in the same seat (see above regarding rituals) 4. Do you pace around during commercials? - no I dont move during the game not even to go to the bathroom or get a drink (see above regarding rituals...LOL) 5. Do you read and watch anything and everything that might mention the Bills after a win? And grumble if they are not getting enough recognition? - Yes and no, I read alot after a win, I would prefer to avoid the recognition, I like the under the radar thing... 6. Do you avoid anything or anyone that may mention the Bills after a loss? - dom't you LOL 7. Did you watch every game the season that Kyle Orton was the quarterback? Dude, I watched every game Clod Collins was QB actually, Vince Ferragamo too... and Nathan Peterman, of course Alex Van Pelt.. come to mention it Dennis Shaw... You have made me feel better though with it only being an affliction... I was starting to think I was nuts ...LOL

I have no idea, nor does anyone else, to know if you are right or wrong about how Rossueau is coached. But how's that working out for the Bills? Years and years of this. How's it working out? It's so ridiculously frustrating. It's the same thing, year after year, and it doesn't work in the biggest of games. They need some players that make splash plays. It's pretty damn glorious when Oliver does it from time to time. But damn man, why pay a guy a ton of money to be an edge setter first and foremost. That makes no sense. Unless it's against Lamar. The only thing that baffles me is that McDermott seems to know how to shut down Lamar in the postseason. Maybe it's this disciplined style of play that you speak of that contains Lamar and makes hime throw more. But when you think about it, who doesn't shut down Lamar in the playoffs. But again, my hats off to McD in the postseason against the Ravens. His style of defense seems to be the right thing to slow them down for some reason.

Was listening to NFL radio earlier and they were talking about how the 3-0 Chargers had 14 penalties called on them

They also played a game that was far simpler and had to know far less than in today's NFL. The game is complex in ways that didn't even exist back then let alone having to know all of the things they need to know now. Even looking at playbooks from 20 years ago compared to today's playbooks makes them look like learning 2nd grade math by comparison to calculus.

Awkward how? They use them all. Looking at his contract he will likely have to take a pay cut or get released. Can’t have a 17 million cap hit from Knox. If he wants to stay he will have to take a crappy for him extension.

what?

I keep saying it but, Lamar is still a wait-til-he-is-open thrower. He doesn’t throw with anticipation and his legs have bailed him out. It’s worked for him , but the best teams can beat him. That includes our team

This thread is why anyone who has ever posted on this forum should be banned.

And this is what I was discussing yesterday but in regards to Allen's downfield passing ability. I don't know what it is, but it's not very good. It's really never been great, despite the massive arm, but we're either missing the horses, or the timing is never there. I know the short passing & run game was working, but we SHOULD be able to open up the passing game beyond that. Being so successful running the ball & killing people underneath eventually makes defenses have to play up to stop that, so we need to be able to take advantage of the opportunities that opens up. It's not going to ruin us for now, but I hope they work things out in practice & make those plays a more successful part of their arsenal. If they do, they'll be able to put away teams a lot earlier.