BillsFanForever19 Posted January 6, 2006 Share Posted January 6, 2006 Am I the only one who was watching the Rose Bowl angry at our playmaker McGee? Had we just lost the Bengals game like we should have, our QB situation could have been answered by Vince Young or Matt Leinart with our #3 overall pick. Yes, either one of them could be "busts". But so could anyone else we pick. But since we won that meaningless game, we'll pick 8th and draft someone on the OL or DL that probably won't make much of an impact right away. Tired of the sexy pick? I'm sure you are. But with Losman and Holcomb, it's actually needed for once. After the Rose Bowl, i'd do almost anything for Vince Young to be wearing a Bills uni next year. Flame me if you want, but I stand by it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Tomcat Posted January 6, 2006 Share Posted January 6, 2006 Change your avatar.... FLAME ON! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nick in* england Posted January 6, 2006 Share Posted January 6, 2006 I really don't think Vince Young is an NFL QB and I really don't think the team or the fans would swallow picking another round 1 QB... The priority is the trenches wherever we pick.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RVJ Posted January 6, 2006 Share Posted January 6, 2006 Don't fret. If Vince Young stays in school. There is a good possibility that the Bills will have the number one pick overall next year. And Im serious. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BillsFanForever19 Posted January 6, 2006 Author Share Posted January 6, 2006 I really don't think Vince Young is an NFL QB and I really don't think the team or the fans would swallow picking another round 1 QB... The priority is the trenches wherever we pick.... 557084[/snapback] I agree with you whole-heartidly. Our priority is with the trenches. But I feel that should be addressed in free agency and in the 2nd and 3rd rounds. There are a lot of DT's that will be there in Round 2 who will be quality. As well as Max-Jean Gilles perhaps on the OL. OL and DT at #8 is a stretch for anyone besides D'Brickashaw Ferguson. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
buffalo mike2 Posted January 6, 2006 Share Posted January 6, 2006 Don't fret. If Vince Young stays in school. There is a good possibility that the Billswill have the number one pick overall next year. And Im serious. 557086[/snapback] Youv'e already mailed in 2006!! Holy Crap man. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BuckeyeBill Posted January 6, 2006 Share Posted January 6, 2006 Number 8 is a GREAT drafting order. Considering players like Reggie Bush, Leinart, and Young we wouldn't take even if we were #1. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BillsGuyInMalta Posted January 6, 2006 Share Posted January 6, 2006 Being at #8, we'll still get a shot at some damn good players. Honestly the best thing that could happen for the Bills is if Vince Young enters the draft...talent gets pushed further down to us. IN FACT, I read some mock drafts this morning over on NFLDraftCountdown.com and with Young entering the draft, some have D'Brickshaw falling to us. Now I doubt that happens because some team will trade up to get him, but still...definitely would help us. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IDBillzFan Posted January 6, 2006 Share Posted January 6, 2006 Yes, either one of them could be "busts". But so could anyone else we pick.557080[/snapback] Yes, either of them can be a bust. Apparently just like JP, who you have decided is a bust after playing in eight games. One can only assume that you'll allow the same amount of extensive development time for Leinart or Young. So when they suck after eight games, which quarterback will you want to draft next to replace them? Jesus !@#$ing H. Christ. Doesn't anyone think before they post anymore? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alaska Darin Posted January 6, 2006 Share Posted January 6, 2006 Yeah, let's draft ANOTHER QB. That'll fix our line problems. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hot Pockets Posted January 6, 2006 Share Posted January 6, 2006 Yes, either of them can be a bust. Apparently just like JP, who you have decided is a bust after playing in eight games. One can only assume that you'll allow the same amount of extensive development time for Leinart or Young. So when they suck after eight games, which quarterback will you want to draft next to replace them? Jesus !@#$ing H. Christ. Doesn't anyone think before they post anymore? 557097[/snapback] Draft Leinart ! DING ! Meatball pockets rule ! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Crap Throwing Monkey Posted January 6, 2006 Share Posted January 6, 2006 Had we just lost the Bengals game like we should have, our QB situation could have been answered by Vince Young or Matt Leinart with our #3 overall pick. Yes, either one of them could be "busts". But so could anyone else we pick. But since we won that meaningless game, we'll pick 8th and draft someone on the OL or DL that probably won't make much of an impact right away. 557080[/snapback] Let's see...we can keep the same porous line and put a top-ranked QB behind it to get killed. Or we can draft a top-ranked offensive lineman six picks later, and improve the line so that the QBs we have don't get killed. And you think a QB is going to make a greater impact than a lineman? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tux of Borg Posted January 6, 2006 Share Posted January 6, 2006 Young and Leinart will both be NFL busts. Now watch a team with no O-line like the Texans draft Bush. We'll see how good he is when there are 3 guys to meet him in the backfield. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BuffaloinAtlanta Posted January 6, 2006 Share Posted January 6, 2006 You mad at a guy for playing hard? Man, change your allegiane to the Houston Texans and leave Bills nation... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MadMark Posted January 6, 2006 Share Posted January 6, 2006 The priority is the trenches wherever we pick.... 557084[/snapback] Amen Brother! The Bills need to bolster or rebuild their offensive and defensive lines before they worry about anything else. GO BILLS 2006!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CoachChuckDickerson Posted January 6, 2006 Share Posted January 6, 2006 Change your avatar.... FLAME ON! 557081[/snapback] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Risin Posted January 6, 2006 Share Posted January 6, 2006 I can't see how anyone is giving up on JP yet. Did anyone see Alex Smith play this year? JP already looks like 10 times the QB he is, and he was a #1 overall pick. Christ, Bills fans make me sick sometimes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gmanbfan Posted January 6, 2006 Share Posted January 6, 2006 And another first round QB will help us right away! But since we won that meaningless game, we'll pick 8th and draft someone on the OL or DL that probably won't make much of an impact right away. 557080[/snapback] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BillsFanForever19 Posted January 6, 2006 Author Share Posted January 6, 2006 Yes, either of them can be a bust. Apparently just like JP, who you have decided is a bust after playing in eight games. One can only assume that you'll allow the same amount of extensive development time for Leinart or Young. So when they suck after eight games, which quarterback will you want to draft next to replace them? Jesus !@#$ing H. Christ. Doesn't anyone think before they post anymore? 557097[/snapback] Do I think J.P. Losman is a bust? No, it's too early to tell. But here's what I do think; I think Mularkey has no faith in him. I think the entire team has no faith in him. I also think that Losman has played significantly worse than most "young QB's" that just need a little experience. Talk around the media and the league is that the kid just doesn't have it mechanically. He plays great when everything's going well, but so do most NFL QB's. He just doesn't make things happen and he's no leader. Might he be a good QB someday? Maybe. But do I think Vince Young would be an upgrade? Most definitely. Right now, we don't know if we have a starting QB on this team. So why not? Again, Ngata is not a good choice and their isn't an OL or DT worth taking at 8. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
inkman Posted January 6, 2006 Share Posted January 6, 2006 IF the right player is selected, and they are used correctly, they can have an impact. J. Ogden didn't suck too much his first year. Neither did R. Seymour. Picking 8th sounds okay to me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
R. Rich Posted January 6, 2006 Share Posted January 6, 2006 Yeah, let's draft ANOTHER QB. That'll fix our line problems. 557110[/snapback] I "thought" so too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BRH Posted January 6, 2006 Share Posted January 6, 2006 Jesus !@#$ing H. Christ. Doesn't anyone think before they post anymore? 557097[/snapback] What's with the "anymore"? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
R. Rich Posted January 6, 2006 Share Posted January 6, 2006 What's with the "anymore"? 557191[/snapback] Now that's just wrong. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alaska Darin Posted January 6, 2006 Share Posted January 6, 2006 I also think that Losman has played significantly worse than most "young QB's" that just need a little experience. 557180[/snapback] Mostly because you've actually seen him play. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
apuszczalowski Posted January 6, 2006 Share Posted January 6, 2006 8th is a good spot to get an impact player and we don't have to ppay huge contracts (like our favorite early draft pick MW) No matter who we get, the player will probably not have an immediate impact, but hopefully he will in the very near future (although it is possible at 8 that we could draft the next rookie of the year) As for JP, what makes you think another top draft QB is going to be much better, With 8 games experience and no o-line infront of him, how can we say we have seen what he can do. And the media is going to say he's a bust cause he is in Buffalo and he is not a manning. JP's stats looked alot better than some of the other 1st round picks at QB in their first season. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IDBillzFan Posted January 6, 2006 Share Posted January 6, 2006 What's with the "anymore"? 557191[/snapback] I mistype that all the time. It's good to get called out on it because I like to call people out on their typos as well. Talk around the media and the league is that the kid just doesn't have it mechanically. He plays great when everything's going well, but so do most NFL QB's. He just doesn't make things happen and he's no leader. Thank god the media is here to tell us what to think. Frankly, I saw JP get better with each game. As long as he's improving, there's no telling how good he can be with a full season under his belt. We need to address the line. If you don't address the line, it won't matter who the hell is back there, leader or not. You can not win football games consistently if you don't have a good OL. It's just that simple, and bringing in yet another quarterback is not going to change that fact. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BillsFanForever19 Posted January 6, 2006 Author Share Posted January 6, 2006 I mistype that all the time. It's good to get called out on it because I like to call people out on their typos as well. Thank god the media is here to tell us what to think. Frankly, I saw JP get better with each game. As long as he's improving, there's no telling how good he can be with a full season under his belt. We need to address the line. If you don't address the line, it won't matter who the hell is back there, leader or not. You can not win football games consistently if you don't have a good OL. It's just that simple, and bringing in yet another quarterback is not going to change that fact. 557201[/snapback] Yes, we need to address the line. But I don't think that's going to happen with the #8 pick. I think that's going to happen with FA. Guys like LeCharles Brantley and/or Steve Hutchinson. I think it will happen with our 2nd pick (or picks depending on Clements and how many 3rd's we have and whether or not we want to trade up) with someone like Max-Jean Gilles, Davin Joseph, Daryn Colledge, Jeremy Trueblood, or maybe even Jonathan Scott (as Ferguson, Justice, Winston, and McNeill all will go before he does). And J.P. got better with every game? Did you see him in the Chiefs game and then the Carolina game after that? He has the potential to have a good game, then he get's cocky and falls on his face. Even he has admitted that. It's something that just hasn't been able to be fixed his entire life. That was his problem coming out of Tulane. He was never spectacular in college. He was journeyman and expected to be a 2nd round pick. But then GB got a hard-on for him and we had to jump in front of them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IDBillzFan Posted January 6, 2006 Share Posted January 6, 2006 Yes, we need to address the line. But I don't think that's going to happen with the #8 pick.557215[/snapback] And it's not going to happen by using your #8 pick to grab a quarterback. We have a quarterback until proven otherwise. And you can't prove it otherwise until you address the line. If you're suggesting we just grab someone like Young if he's still there, I believe that's a terrible idea. Manipulate your picks, focus on the line, then start focusing on the D. Nothing great is going to happen next year anyway. So start building this year, and if the right decisions are made during the next two drafts, we should be in contention for the playoffs by 2007. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BEAST MODE BABY! Posted January 6, 2006 Share Posted January 6, 2006 I really don't think Vince Young is an NFL QB and I really don't think the team or the fans would swallow picking another round 1 QB... The priority is the trenches wherever we pick.... 557084[/snapback] Here are my thoughts on the whole Vince Young thing. Plain and simple, the guy makes athletic people look unathletic. People are saying quarterbacks like Young and Vick can't make it in the NFL. I disagree. Lots of people may say that, but it will take a coach/oc who will throwout old ideas and try new ones. People used to say it was impossible to go faster than the speed of the sound. Just because something hasn't been done before, doesn't mean it can't. Maybe it won't be with Vick or Young. But someday, a running quarterback who has an arm will dominate in the NFL. Mark my words. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
R. Rich Posted January 6, 2006 Share Posted January 6, 2006 Yes, we need to address the line. But I don't think that's going to happen with the #8 pick. I think that's going to happen with FA. Guys like LeCharles Brantley and/or Steve Hutchinson. I think it will happen with our 2nd pick (or picks depending on Clements and how many 3rd's we have and whether or not we want to trade up) with someone like Max-Jean Gilles, Davin Joseph, Daryn Colledge, Jeremy Trueblood, or maybe even Jonathan Scott (as Ferguson, Justice, Winston, and McNeill all will go before he does). 557215[/snapback] That's kinda what I'm hoping for. If we can land a couple very good free agent OL and one good DT, then we can upgrade our pass rush w/ Mario Williams or Mathias Kiwanuka. I certainly do hope Marcus McNeill and Winston Justice go before the Bills have to decide on them. McNeill had a subpar year and appeared disinterested @ times while Justice is just plain overrated. Of all the big time talent on display Wednesday night in Pasadena, he was by far the most disappointing. If we're going to look @ OL help around here, I sure would love to see Jonathan Scott of Texas (not a HUGE tackle as they had before in Big Mike or Leonard Davis, and a good athlete also). I wouldn't even mind seeing us go after a guy like G Will Allen of Texas later on. He looked very good in the Rose Bowl, and could be a possibility for Buffalo in this draft. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bluv Posted January 6, 2006 Share Posted January 6, 2006 I wish we had the #3 pick ONLY if we trade down and get multiple picks in strong draft; especially one strong in OL,DE and DE, our greatest needs. While we could do better at skill positions than Losman, McGahee, Evans,etc they have all shown some flashes of brilliances and until proven won't break the bank so they are more than adequate. A high draft pick is a boom or bust; take MW for example. If we can get a quality LT or DT who in this draft may be a #8 pick versus a top 5 pick in previous drafts then we will win out as there won't be as much of a financial obligation if the guy doesn't pan out but he will be a top talent and victim of a strong draft. You don't have to have the best QB,RB, WR's to win in this league; but if they are all better than average and play well together combine with a good OL then you can compete to win it all. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LabattBlue Posted January 6, 2006 Share Posted January 6, 2006 Am I the only one who was watching the Rose Bowl angry at our playmaker McGee? Had we just lost the Bengals game like we should have, our QB situation could have been answered by Vince Young or Matt Leinart with our #3 overall pick. Yes, either one of them could be "busts". But so could anyone else we pick. But since we won that meaningless game, we'll pick 8th and draft someone on the OL or DL that probably won't make much of an impact right away. Tired of the sexy pick? I'm sure you are. But with Losman and Holcomb, it's actually needed for once. After the Rose Bowl, i'd do almost anything for Vince Young to be wearing a Bills uni next year. Flame me if you want, but I stand by it. 557080[/snapback] Are you related to JP-era? Wasn't he the poster who always wanted to trade up and grab the big name skill player? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Buckeye Eric Posted January 6, 2006 Share Posted January 6, 2006 Had we just lost the Bengals game like we should have, our QB situation could have been answered by Vince Young or Matt Leinart with our #3 overall pick. Yes, either one of them could be "busts". But so could anyone else we pick. 557080[/snapback] History indicates that Heisman trophy winning QBs do not win SBs. Additionally: - There have been 26 different starting SB QBs since 1985 - 11 1st round draft choices have started a SB. - 10 QBs were drafted in the 4th round or later (including UDFA) have started a SB. - 33% of the past 21 SB (7) were won by 1st rd choices - 48% (10) were won by QBs drafted 4th round or later (incl UDFA). - 7 of the 1st rd choices started the SB for the team that drafted them. Aikman is the only one to win. - Aikman, Elway, and Dilfer are the only 1st rounders to win. - More QBs (4) drafted in the 4th Rd have won the SB for the team that drafted them than those 1st Rd. (Brady, Warner, Rypien, Montana) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stussy109 Posted January 6, 2006 Share Posted January 6, 2006 JP has an arm, mobility, and the willingness to go long. Give him a chance behind some guys that can block. Our O-line was a work in prgress all yr. I think we need 2 solid signing 1 via draft, 1 via free agency, and we should have a solid O line. I want some athletes on theline, guys that can pull. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
1billsfan Posted January 6, 2006 Share Posted January 6, 2006 Do I think J.P. Losman is a bust? No, it's too early to tell. But here's what I do think; I think Mularkey has no faith in him. I think the entire team has no faith in him. I also think that Losman has played significantly worse than most "young QB's" that just need a little experience. Talk around the media and the league is that the kid just doesn't have it mechanically. He plays great when everything's going well, but so do most NFL QB's. He just doesn't make things happen and he's no leader. Might he be a good QB someday? Maybe. But do I think Vince Young would be an upgrade? Most definitely. Right now, we don't know if we have a starting QB on this team. So why not? Again, Ngata is not a good choice and their isn't an OL or DT worth taking at 8. 557180[/snapback] It's hard to make things happen when your not given a full 60 minutes of playing time. You forget that JP was yanked by Malarkey for Holcomb twice during his first four starts. We'll never know if JP could have pulled these games out a la what Eli Manning has done previously for the Giants. Malarkey pushed the panic button and lost his chance of having Losman gain confidence in himself and having the team gain confidence in him by Losman pulling out a come from behind win. Maybe this year Malarkey won't be so noncommital in his support for our QB of the future, maybe he can grow a pair and let the guy at least finish what he starts. We can only hope. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SouthernMan Posted January 6, 2006 Share Posted January 6, 2006 Am I the only one who was watching the Rose Bowl angry at our playmaker McGee? Had we just lost the Bengals game like we should have, our QB situation could have been answered by Vince Young or Matt Leinart with our #3 overall pick. Yes, either one of them could be "busts". But so could anyone else we pick. But since we won that meaningless game, we'll pick 8th and draft someone on the OL or DL that probably won't make much of an impact right away. Tired of the sexy pick? I'm sure you are. But with Losman and Holcomb, it's actually needed for once. After the Rose Bowl, i'd do almost anything for Vince Young to be wearing a Bills uni next year. Flame me if you want, but I stand by it. 557080[/snapback] Donahoe just got the axe because he didn't have sense enough to build from the trenches outward. Name me ONE superbowl champion that had subpar offensive or defensive line. It all comes down to these simple question and answers: Q: Can a team succeed with an average QB behind an outstanding O-line? A: YES. Q: Can an outstanding QB succeed behind a below average line? A: No, not likely Look no further than our own HOF QB Jim Kelly to confirm this. In the few instances where Kent Hull was out, his game suffered tremendously. The 1996 season, when Jimbo played behind a crappy line (still wayyy better than the 2005 version), he was far from being the Jim Kelly of years prior. When the line is superior, you can manage the game with power running, sprinkled with occasional passes when the situation dictates. If you control the clock, your defense gets rested, making them more effective as well. With an O- line as porous and undisciplined as the Bills, even the best QB is going to have only sporadic successes behind center. The run game is undependable and the passing game is less than stellar with the defense in the backfield immediately after the snap of the ball. Last thing to consider....there has been an enormous amount of "can't miss" QBs who've been a total bust. The QB position, more than any other, depends greatly on bringing them along at the right pace and maintaining their fragile young psyches so they don't beome mental casualties. Brett Favre was expendable after being drafted by the Falcons. Not saying that Losman will be the next Brett Favre, but I'd sure like to see how well he progresses behind an actual NFL offensive line. And if Losman doesn't work out, just think how attractive it would be to a FA QB to come to a team with a line that will protect him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Realist Posted January 6, 2006 Share Posted January 6, 2006 History indicates that Heisman trophy winning QBs do not win SBs. Additionally: - There have been 26 different starting SB QBs since 1985 - 11 1st round draft choices have started a SB. - 10 QBs were drafted in the 4th round or later (including UDFA) have started a SB. - 33% of the past 21 SB (7) were won by 1st rd choices - 48% (10) were won by QBs drafted 4th round or later (incl UDFA). - 7 of the 1st rd choices started the SB for the team that drafted them. Aikman is the only one to win. - Aikman, Elway, and Dilfer are the only 1st rounders to win. - More QBs (4) drafted in the 4th Rd have won the SB for the team that drafted them than those 1st Rd. (Brady, Warner, Rypien, Montana) 557265[/snapback] You really can't make comparisons like this because there are a very limited number of 1st round QBs. But there are dozens and dozens of QBS from the "4th round and beyond". So of course there will be more QB's from the latter part of the drafts and UDFA to make the SB than 1st rounders. What % of 1st round QB's become starters? What % of late round and UDFA QB's even make the NFL let alone become starters? There are a multitue of reasons why your argument really doesn't fly. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CoachChuckDickerson Posted January 6, 2006 Share Posted January 6, 2006 I can't see how anyone is giving up on JP yet. Did anyone see Alex Smith play this year? JP already looks like 10 times the QB he is, and he was a #1 overall pick. Christ, Bills fans make me sick sometimes. 557151[/snapback] I would hope so considering Smith is a rookie. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Joe Fergy Posted January 6, 2006 Share Posted January 6, 2006 Here are my thoughts on the whole Vince Young thing. Plain and simple, the guy makes athletic people look unathletic. People are saying quarterbacks like Young and Vick can't make it in the NFL. I disagree. Lots of people may say that, but it will take a coach/oc who will throwout old ideas and try new ones. People used to say it was impossible to go faster than the speed of the sound. Just because something hasn't been done before, doesn't mean it can't. Maybe it won't be with Vick or Young. But someday, a running quarterback who has an arm will dominate in the NFL. Mark my words. 557233[/snapback] You mean like Steve Young, and Fran Tarkenton Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
R. Rich Posted January 6, 2006 Share Posted January 6, 2006 You mean like Steve Young, and Fran Tarkenton 557393[/snapback] Nah. They sucked. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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