Losman's "attitude" turned off teamates

[Dan III]

not so fast - both moulds and adams played better near the end of the season. maybe mularkey got through to them.

550425[/snapback]

or maybe their agents told them players in decline with bad attitudes don't get a big signing bonus..

[Kelly the Dog]

Weve always heard JP is cocky. But how "cocky" does one have to be to have the ENTIRE team turn on him, and publicly to boot?

550433[/snapback]

As far as i can tell, there have been three total players that said publicly that Holcomb is good enough to be an NFL starter. None of the three bashed JP. The question presented to an unknown player or source, from Jerry Sullivan no less, that ended with "Most of them" was "Do you think he is ready to be a starter in this league" or something along those lines. Not is he a punk, does he have a sh------- attitude, etc. There are half the fans on this board that may agree with that, that he is not ready to be a starter. The fans, though, arent answering that question. They're answering the question of, shouldn't he be playing now so you CAN say, later, that he is ready to be a full time starter in this league. Frankly, I have yet to hear any player say anything negative about him.

 

And one report, unsubstantiated, about players want holcomb to be the starter, comes out of another reporter's pen as "the players don't like Losman" like the fukking telephone game in third grade.

[IndyMark]

Most of JP's (lazy, overrated, whiney) teammates haven't won anything in the league either.  I'd love to know why they thought they were in a position to demand anything with regard to the direction the team was taking.  Other than knowing what it takes to come up short, the team as a whole doesn't seem all that informed.

550284[/snapback]

 

 

This is the MVP of this thread. These 'teammates' that are troubled by JP sound more and more like whiny toddlers. Not the NFL players they purport to be.

 

Evidenced by the D's pathetic performance and the record overall, then maybe they are soft. If that is the case, keep JP and cut the rest and start over.

 

Sometimes, the problem is the 'other' people and not the one 'everyone' is talking about.

[MadBuffaloDisease]

Not good news for JP.  If that's his personality then it might just haunt him for his whole career.  I thought he spent every waking moment in the offseason working on becoming a better QB and bonding with his teammates?  Something's weird here.

Actually you're partly right. JP spent all off-season in Buffalo. The problem is, few of his offensive teammates did (Campbell and Euhus were injured so they have an excuse). Evans made it a point to work-out with JP, after finishing some courses at Wisconsin (to get his degree). Moulds never did. So is it any wonder why JP looked so much towards Evans and NOT Moulds? And I still cannot overlook that Dolphins game where he threw 3 TD's in the 1st quarter. That was no fluke.

[Adam]

oh jesus mother of mary. vincent didn't break his leg on purpose. they were playing a little game called football. broken limbs happen all the time. where is this coming from?!?

550396[/snapback]

You dont know what your talking about- it was a scheme to get more money- Vincent wanted to play quarterback!

[The Quebecer]

Imho, JP is victim to the "Rudy syndrome"!

 

All we heard through training camp (and even before that!) is that he was in B-lo, studying and working at getting better. He worked at being a leader by working harder than anyone else!

Imho, some players were frustrated at him for working so hard! Just like Rudy!

Then came the season, 1st half of 1st game, excellent game plan! Wow JP is on fire! 2nd half of 1st game, no adjustments made by MM & co... that's where it all went down...

After that you could see that JP wasn't placed in position to be successful, not enough runs, too much pass, too much thinking...

Is he at fault? Sure enough! Is he the only one at fault, certainly not!

 

Let JP be who he is, a very hard working, self-confident QB!

[MDH]

There have been quite a few players interviewed where they came right out against JP. You never see that.

550442[/snapback]

 

Links please.

[Boatdrinks]

Big difference between being cocky and being a rooster. Troy breaking the kid's leg last year, and Moulds comments this year lead me to believe he is more the second option.

550353[/snapback]

Very good point. I believe windbag Smerlas made this point in his "by a nose" book. Jimbo was as cocky as they come and vets were a bit turned off by him initially. But he won them over with his play on the field, and they jumped on his wagon. JP did not come close to proving anything about being an NFL caliber starter. Just raised more questions IMHO. Remember, Reich was already on the team 1 year prior to Jimbo, and I don't think there was any question who was the better QB from the first training camp practice.There is definitely a question between JP and Holcomb, and that isn't saying much for JP.

[2003Contenders]

I can trace some of this all the way back to last February when Bledsoe was released. Remember that comment that Drew made at the time in reference to being angry about losing his starting job and having to be a backup to "J.P. in particular" without at least having the opportunity to compete for his job?

 

I think the coaches (or TD or whoever it was) did JP a disservice by "handing him the job" without making him earn it. At least Bledsoe was willing to compete for the job -- and the coaches were unwilling to ask JP to do that. Their train of thought seemed to be that JP needed to be the unquestioned starter going in. The flaw to that logic is imagine how much more confidence the kid would have gained -- and the players around him in him -- if he had genuinely won the job in training camp? And even if he didn't, at least he would have been waiting in the wings if/when Drew stumbled.

 

When the team elected to outright release Bledsoe and hand the job to JP, you can imagine how that may have rubbed some of the players the wrong way, especially the contingency that liked Drew. Even taking Drew out of the mix, JP became an easy scapegoat for the 1-3 start -- and cries to start the veteran Holcomb were inevitable.

 

I guess what I am getting at is that the coaching staff likely muddied JP's water before the season ever started in relation to his comradare with his teammates. Now, a good coach would have disspelled some of that by being very hard on JP in training camp -- maybe to the point where his teammates would want to defend him. Instead, the coaches coddled him like a prima dona -- which may have led to this perception that the other players don't like him.

[Kelly the Dog]

There have been quite a few players interviewed where they came right out against JP. You never see that.

550442[/snapback]

Name one. Quote one. Link one. I read every bit of Bills stuff i can get my eyes on and have yet to see one player say anything bad about him. I could quote you all kinds of good things they have said about him. Not to mention that he takes blame himself in the press.

[RkFast]

Name one. Quote one. Link one. I read every bit of Bills stuff i can get my eyes on and have yet to see one player say anything bad about him. I could quote you all kinds of good things they have said about him. Not to mention that he takes blame himself in the press.

550537[/snapback]

 

 

 

http://www.buffalonews.com/editorial/20060...?tbd1062170.asp

 

If they are lobbying FOR Holcomb, they are also lobbying AGAINST Losman. And again, where do you see that.....players openly lobbying to have the backup QB get the nod over a rookie the team KNEW would be starting and would be cutting his teeth during the season? The team, all of them, knew "the plan" before the season began. But by week four, the team came out gainst the kid. And after his comeback, they seemed to have come out against him again (this is my opinion, please dont ask for LINKS). You dont see that in the NFL too often. Something is up in that locker room and it doesnt seem good.

 

Always a !@#$ing fight......or are we reading the same thing differently?

[seq004]

So now it's leaking out that JP Losman "turned-off" his teammates with his attitude.  I guess that gives the defense a free pass for folding like a pack of cards, or for the O-line not to block, or for Willis to mail it in when he didn't feel like playing.

 

The Bears are in the playoffs with a rookie QB that played worse than JP.  The difference is the Bears have a REAL coach, (one TD could have hired, by the way) not one who can't make up his mind without asking his players what they think.

 

At least JP was trying, which is more than the rest of this sorry-a$$ team, that goes double for certain so-called veteran leaders.  Mullarkey has to be fired for creating this cluster***k.

 

PTR

550266[/snapback]

It's becoming very clear to me that Mularkey does a bad job of handling player issues.

[Kelly the Dog]

http://www.buffalonews.com/editorial/20060...?tbd1062170.asp

 

If they are lobbying FOR Holcomb, they are also lobbying AGAINST Losman. And again, where do you see that.....players openly lobbying to have the backup QB get the nod over a rookie the team KNEW would be starting and would be cutting his teeth during the season.

 

Always a !@#$ing fight......or are we reading the same thing differently?

550579[/snapback]

Exactly as I thought. There is nothing anyone ever said remotely bad about Losman.

 

And just because they said that Holcomb is good enough to start in this league does not mean they hate losman or hate his atiitude whatsoever. The players hate to lose more than they want to win. They could easily think that Holcomb gives them a better chance to win THIS WEEK than Losman does. The guys being quoted, Moulds and Campbell and Fletcher, two of the three may not be here next year. They want to win now. So when asked by a reporter in front of their locker, say Kelly Holcomb is a good player and can start in this league. That's simple to understand. Again, that in no way badmouths Losman other than to say that KH is a better QB today than JP is. I don't think many people argue that at all.

 

Most people here, however, were under one of two impressions: either the defense would be great and the special teams great and the offense just needed to be decent to win a bunch of games (which of course didnt happen) OR play the kid now because the defense isnt great and we arent going anywhere even though Holcomb is a better and smarter QB at this point in both of their careers. But we didnt do either of them. And now we don't have the full year of Losman to prepare us for next year.

[LabattBlue]

I don't care if JP is a complete a$$-hole in the locker room as long as he can play. When he starts producing(or for that matter gets a chance to show he can produce), he will shut up all the naysayers.

 

Does anyone believe for a second that there is a team in pro sports where all the players get along like one big happy family? If so, think again.

[Kelly the Dog]

I don't care if JP is a complete a$$-hole in the locker room as long as he can play.  When he starts producing(or for that matter gets a chance to show he can produce), he will shut up all the naysayers.

 

Does anyone believe for a second that there is a team in pro sports where all the players get along like one big happy family?  If so, think again.

550629[/snapback]

Sabres?

 

Even the three goalies like each other.

 

But it goes back to your point, which I agree with. Winning changes everything. When JP starts to play well, and help the team win, they will love him.

[RkFast]

Exactly as I thought. There is nothing anyone ever said remotely bad about Losman.

 

And just because they said that Holcomb is good enough to start in this league does not mean they hate losman or hate his atiitude whatsoever. The players hate to lose more than they want to win. They could easily think that Holcomb gives them a better chance to win THIS WEEK than Losman does. The guys being quoted, Moulds and Campbell and Fletcher, two of the three may not be here next year. They want to win now. So when asked by a reporter in front of their locker, say Kelly Holcomb is a good player and can start in this league. That's simple to understand. Again, that in no way badmouths Losman other than to say that KH is a better QB today than JP is. I don't think many people argue that at all.

 

Most people here, however, were under one of two impressions: either the defense would be great and the special teams great and the offense just needed to be decent to win a bunch of games (which of course didnt happen) OR play the kid now because the defense isnt great and we arent going anywhere even though Holcomb is a better and smarter QB at this point in both of their careers. But we didnt do either of them. And now we don't have the full year of Losman to prepare us for next year.

550616[/snapback]

 

I repeat:

 

If they are lobbying FOR Holcomb, they are also lobbying AGAINST Losman. And again, where do you see that.....players openly lobbying to have the backup QB get the nod over a rookie the team KNEW would be starting and would be cutting his teeth during the season? The team, all of them, knew "the plan" before the season began. But by week four, the team came out gainst the kid. And after his comeback, they seemed to have come out against him again (this is my opinion, please dont ask for LINKS). You dont see that in the NFL too often. Something is up in that locker room and it doesnt seem good.

 

And Kelly...look what I found!

 

http://www.buffalonews.com/editorial/20060...?tbd1062139.asp

 

Losman has started only eight games. He showed progress later in the year, but many of his teammates don't have faith in him. After Sunday's game, one prominent Bill was asked how many players felt Losman wasn't ready.

 

"Try most of them," he said.

 

So we now have Jerry Sullivan and Mark Gaughan making this statement. And despite the geniuses here who think those two are "morons", I think they have a tad more insight into this club and what goes on in the locker room than you or I do. Thank you.

[ajzepp]

I don't care if JP is a complete a$$-hole in the locker room as long as he can play.  When he starts producing(or for that matter gets a chance to show he can produce), he will shut up all the naysayers.

 

Does anyone believe for a second that there is a team in pro sports where all the players get along like one big happy family?  If so, think again.

550629[/snapback]

 

Exactly right.....I'm so sick and tired of listening to all the different ways that these rich, spoiled punks can find to complain. DO YOUR DAMN JOBS! JP has a cocky attitude? GOOD! So frickin what?? Does he negotiate your contract? Do you draw your game check from the 'Bank of JP'? NOOOOOOOOOOO......SO STFU, PLAY YOUR BEST, AND QUIT WHINING!!!!

 

Anyway.....I love the fact that JP is a cocky bastard.

[LabattBlue]

Sabres?

 

Even the three goalies like each other.

 

550637[/snapback]

You would like to believe this about the 05-06 Sabres, but it never came out until after he was released, how badly some players wanted Satan off the team at any cost, so you never really know.

[Kelly the Dog]

I repeat:

 

If they are lobbying FOR Holcomb, they are also lobbying AGAINST Losman. And again, where do you see that.....players openly lobbying to have the backup QB get the nod over a rookie the team KNEW would be starting and would be cutting his teeth during the season? The team, all of them, knew "the plan" before the season began. But by week four, the team came out gainst the kid. And after his comeback, they seemed to have come out against him again (this is my opinion, please dont ask for LINKS). You dont see that in the NFL too often. Something is up in that locker room and it doesnt seem good.

550639[/snapback]

That is ridiculous logic. If the Sabres players are lobbying through the press to start Ryan Miller over Marty Biron that in NO WAY means they are lobbying against Marty Biron, hate Marty Biron, or don't like his attitiude. They are only saying that they think Ryan Miller gives them a better chance to win this upcoming game than Marty Biron does. They may also think Marty Biron gives them a good chance to win the game, too, just not as good as Ryan Miller.

 

Reporters stick microphones in players faces and ask them questions, trying to get provocative answers out of them. Moulds wants to win now. Holcomb throws him the ball more. He is GOING to say Holcomb should start. Fletcher praises everyone when you listen to him talk. He's a really positive guy. Sure he knows what he is saying and it will get in the papers but he may legitimately feel like winning one game this week would be better for the team as a whole than giving JP the experience. That's a legitimate POV. That in no way whatsoever suggests he doesn't like Losman. He may love Losman as a guy and teammate and think and say the very same thing (I'm not saying he does, but he easily could). You're taking VERY mild quotes in favor of playing Holcomb and twisting them around to agree with wild speculation that the players don't like Losman. But there has been NOTHING said by anyone anywhere at anytime that we have seen that matches that.

[Kelly the Dog]

 

And Kelly...look what I found!

 

http://www.buffalonews.com/editorial/20060...?tbd1062139.asp

 

Losman has started only eight games. He showed progress later in the year, but many of his teammates don't have faith in him. After Sunday's game, one prominent Bill was asked how many players felt Losman wasn't ready.

 

"Try most of them," he said.

 

So we now have Jerry Sullivan and Mark Gaughan making this statement. And despite the geniuses here who think those two are "morons", I think they have a tad more insight into this club and what goes on in the locker room than you or I do. Thank you.

550639[/snapback]

That quote was what started a lot of this, and I already read it this morning. This is what I was referring to earlier. But again. Read what the players actually said. "He is not ready". That doesn't mean they don't like his attitude one iota. That doesn't mean they hate him. That doesn't mean they have totally lost faith in him. It means nothing more whatsoever than we already knew, and always knew, as soon as we traded for KH, through mini-camp, through pre-season, through the first four games, through the whole season. That Kelly Holcomb is a more accomplished and game ready quarterback than JP Losman is. What is so astounding about that?

[Kelly the Dog]

You would like to believe this about the 05-06 Sabres, but it never came out until after he was released, how badly some players wanted Satan off the team at any cost, so you never really know.

550653[/snapback]

True, but there have been a lot of stories in the news recently about how the current team all seems to like each other legitimately. And that winning makes everything easy.

[34-78-83]

It's emarassing at how this team and these coaches have either directly or indirectly laid the blame of this pitiful season on JP's lap.

550440[/snapback]

 

 

They haven't.

 

It's absolutely amazing to me that a large group of atleast somewhat intelligent people can come together a go on about a such general reach of a statement made by the media when so much evidence (yes, visual evidence that you can see in each game of team comradery) says this is not so. Sure JP might be a cocky guy, but he is surely a good teammate. To boot, this rumor was first heard from the likes of Pro football talk if you trace it back. Not to sound like TD here but it's almost embarrasing to think that all of you would get so involved in what is utter nonsense.

[MadBuffaloDisease]

Players generally want to play with the guy who is "ready" to win, especially veteran players. But when the guy who is allegedly "ready to win" proves to be little better, if better at all, than the guy who ISN'T allegedly "ready," that's when the coach needs to step in and make the decision to go with the "not ready" guy so as to build for the future. Doing the opposite shows a desperate attempt at trying to save a tenuous job situation.

[Kelly the Dog]

Players generally want to play with the guy who is "ready" to win, especially veteran players.  But when the guy who is allegedly "ready to win" proves to be little better, if better at all, than the guy who ISN'T allegedly "ready," that's when the coach needs to step in and make the decision to go with the "not ready" guy so as to build for the future.  Doing the opposite shows a desperate attempt at trying to save a tenuous job situation.

550682[/snapback]

That's precisely correct and exactly what is happening, IMO. Which is why MM probably should be fired. He had no business sticking with Holcomb after the #2 or #3 or#4 INT.

[MadBuffaloDisease]

That's precisely correct and exactly what is happening, IMO. Which is why MM probably should be fired. He had no business sticking with Holcomb after the #2 or #3 or#4 INT.

I totally agree with you here. And hearing that JP WANTED to play makes me even further want to see MM gone.

[MDH]

That quote was what started a lot of this, and I already read it this morning. This is what I was referring to earlier. But again. Read what the players actually said. "He is not ready". That doesn't mean they don't like his attitude one iota. That doesn't mean they hate him. That doesn't mean they have totally lost faith in him. It means nothing more whatsoever than we already knew, and always knew, as soon as we traded for KH, through mini-camp, through pre-season, through the first four games, through the whole season. That Kelly Holcomb is a more accomplished and game ready quarterback than JP Losman is. What is so astounding about that?

550664[/snapback]

 

Why are you even bothering?

[Grant]

The fact that we're having this discussion isn't a plus for Losman.

 

And we're not talking about one article or one instance. We've heard some negative rumblings about Losman's attitude before the draft, then after he was drafted from some ex-team mates, and last year with the leg incident and then this year with Moulds' unhappiness and some other anonymous sources citing discontent with Losman.

 

I don't think sports writers are just making this up. I don't think everyone is misunderstanding one another.

 

And I don't think the comments are as innocent as Kelly the Dog is portraying them as. Pro athletes are taught every year not to ever publicly reveal what they're really thinking. You have to read between the lines. I can't believe that when players are saying that "no one thinks Losman is ready" that they mean it in an "aw, shucks" kind of way. Otherwise it would have been phrased different - more positively or optimistically.

 

But really, we can't really know what's going on. Everyone treats the NFL and especially this organization like it's more important than it is. It's a football team. A football team. A football team.

 

I guess we'll find out sooner or later whether or not Losman's "cockiness" is more like Jim Kelly or Jim McMahon, though.

[MadBuffaloDisease]

The fact that we're having this discussion isn't a plus for Losman.

It's not a plus for ANYONE. On one had you have a cocky 24 year old newbie. OTOH you have veterans with sensitive feelings. Grow up, do your job, and win!

[CoachChuckDickerson]

It's not a plus for ANYONE.  On one had you have a cocky 24 year old newbie.  OTOH you have veterans with sensitive feelings.  Grow up, do your job, and win!

550835[/snapback]

 

You can't force team chemistry, you either have it or you don't.

[PromoTheRobot]

I asked Leo Roth about this topic on his WHAM show, and he said he knows of no widespread dislike of J.P. Okay, so who rigt here? Jerry Sullivan or Leo Roth?

 

PTR

[djh]

Veterans cared more about their next $$$ contract than this football team. If you're a team player, rally around the young QB. These veterans that got their egos hurt cause the QB didn't compete for his job are......LOSERS!!!!

[djh]

If Vincent broke his leg on purpose than he should have been suspended by the team.  If MM let him get away with that, then it's no wonder the Bills are they way they are.  This all goes back to Mullarkey.  If JP is being a dork, MM should sit him down and set him straight.  If his teamates are giving him crap, MM should have nipped it in the bud.  Bad coach...very bad coach.

 

PTR

550363[/snapback]

 

FACT.....VINCENT WENT AFTER J.P. ON PURPOSE!!!

I'm sure he didn't mean to break his leg.

 

FACT.....J.P. urged the coaches not to discipline Vincent.

They were rumored to cut Vincent last year.

[Tux of Borg]

Two things that had to happen for us to have a successful 2005 season.

1) The defense had to continue to play at a championship level.

2) Willis McGahee had to carry the offense.

 

Neither happened.

 

As for Bledsoe, he can have the starting QB job back when he can beat Pittsburgh's 3rd string.

[RkFast]

Why are you even bothering?

550711[/snapback]

 

Because its called a debate and discussion of different ideas and expression of opinions. Ya know...the whole reason why we have these discussion boards in the first place?

[RkFast]

The fact that we're having this discussion isn't a plus for Losman.

 

And we're not talking about one article or one instance. We've heard some negative rumblings about Losman's attitude before the draft, then after he was drafted from some ex-team mates, and last year with the leg incident and then this year with Moulds' unhappiness and some other anonymous sources citing discontent with Losman.

 

I don't think sports writers are just making this up. I don't think everyone is misunderstanding one another.

 

And I don't think the comments are as innocent as Kelly the Dog is portraying them as. Pro athletes are taught every year not to ever publicly reveal what they're really thinking. You have to read between the lines. I can't believe that when players are saying that "no one thinks Losman is ready" that they mean it in an "aw, shucks" kind of way. Otherwise it would have been phrased different - more positively or optimistically.

 

But really, we can't really know what's going on. Everyone treats the NFL and especially this organization like it's more important than it is. It's a football team. A football team. A football team.

 

I guess we'll find out sooner or later whether or not Losman's "cockiness" is more like Jim Kelly or Jim McMahon, though.

550821[/snapback]

 

THANK YOU, Amazing Grant! This is my point, exactly.

 

I give you the NY Giants of last year as an example. They brought Manning in, started him mid-year rather abruptly, pretty much changing the teams mode from attempting to contend with Kurt Warner to rebuilding with Manning. Not a word was said by anyone on the team about the move, at pleast not publicly. It was accepted that the team was heading in a different direction to rebuild now and win later and everyone was on board with that. Even when Manning's play was less than good, those first few games of his, they were all on board with the team's goals.

 

Youre not seeing that with the Bills. There is talk.."rumblings"....that everyone is NOT on board with "the plan". Whatever the reason for that, the fact that the entire team isnt working towards the same goal is very, very troubling.

[stevewin]

The fact that we're having this discussion isn't a plus for Losman.

 

And we're not talking about one article or one instance. We've heard some negative rumblings about Losman's attitude before the draft, then after he was drafted from some ex-team mates, and last year with the leg incident and then this year with Moulds' unhappiness and some other anonymous sources citing discontent with Losman.

 

I don't think sports writers are just making this up. I don't think everyone is misunderstanding one another.

 

And I don't think the comments are as innocent as Kelly the Dog is portraying them as. Pro athletes are taught every year not to ever publicly reveal what they're really thinking. You have to read between the lines. I can't believe that when players are saying that "no one thinks Losman is ready" that they mean it in an "aw, shucks" kind of way. Otherwise it would have been phrased different - more positively or optimistically.

 

But really, we can't really know what's going on. Everyone treats the NFL and especially this organization like it's more important than it is. It's a football team. A football team. A football team.

 

I guess we'll find out sooner or later whether or not Losman's "cockiness" is more like Jim Kelly or Jim McMahon, though.

550821[/snapback]

I also agree with most of this - players hardly ever trash teammates publicly, when they do it becomes a circus (see TO). Beat writers won't write off the record comments, and also don't want to bite the hands that feed them (quotes) and jeapordize their access to information. Usually these things are kept "in the family" - the fact that it has come up at all publicly actually leads me to believe that it is worse than it appears, not better. I also think it is a bit ridiculous to write off every journalist who writes something negative about JP as a worthless hack, and every player who implies anything negative about him as a worthless whiny jerk.

 

The other thing that bothers me is the difference between being "cocky" and just not mature and/or lacking character. Everybody wants to talk about reports of how hard JP worked in the offseason - what about the year before that? If preparation/character is such an ingrained part of his charcter then why did MM throw him in the NE game to "send him a message", why (allegedly) did TV give him a shot in practice to "send him a message", why the disparaging "especially JP" comment from Drew (who IMO overall was very classy when he left and tried very hard to not say anything inflammatory). Why are there quotes from veterans once the season started talking about the "night and day" difference between what he knew at the start of the season even from THIS Spring's mini-camp(!). WTF was he doing for the last YEAR before all the warm fuzzy reports of him finally digging in and watching lots of film this summer? It's great if he's had a change of heart and is now taking things more seriously now - but don't tell me that any report of him not preparing himself properly (in say a draft report) are lies and complete BS just because he finally watched some film this summer (with possibly a proverbial gun (held by Wyche) held to his head).

 

I wonder if all the comments from people who say "who cares if he's an a-hole" have ever played on a team sport. Has anyone ever played a sport where a teammate in a leadership position is an unrespected a-hole? There's no way you can tell me that has no affect on a team ("professional" or not). It's about respect - not cockiness. (Jim) Kelly had it - I don't think JP does right now.

[Kelly the Dog]

The fact that we're having this discussion isn't a plus for Losman.

 

And we're not talking about one article or one instance. We've heard some negative rumblings about Losman's attitude before the draft, then after he was drafted from some ex-team mates, and last year with the leg incident and then this year with Moulds' unhappiness and some other anonymous sources citing discontent with Losman.

 

I don't think sports writers are just making this up. I don't think everyone is misunderstanding one another.

 

And I don't think the comments are as innocent as Kelly the Dog is portraying them as. Pro athletes are taught every year not to ever publicly reveal what they're really thinking. You have to read between the lines. I can't believe that when players are saying that "no one thinks Losman is ready" that they mean it in an "aw, shucks" kind of way. Otherwise it would have been phrased different - more positively or optimistically.

 

But really, we can't really know what's going on. Everyone treats the NFL and especially this organization like it's more important than it is. It's a football team. A football team. A football team.

 

I guess we'll find out sooner or later whether or not Losman's "cockiness" is more like Jim Kelly or Jim McMahon, though.

550821[/snapback]

A lot of players loved McMahon, and he won a Super Bowl.

 

Furthermore, I agree with you that players know what they're saying, and you must read between the lines. But what you can't do, is what you and other fans are doing, put lines in their mouths, or evel kneival from one statement to another. Players weren't saying "no one thinks Losman is ready". That's an entirely different concept, to me anyway (who works as a writer, btw) than Jerry Sullivan reporting that one inside source, when asked how many players think Losman isn't ready, said try most of them. If there was one quoted player as saying "No one in this locker room think Losman is ready" I would be worried. But even further, seriously, where do you make the jump from not thinking he is ready, especially when they're comparing him to Kelly Holcomb, to "the players don't like him." That's what this was all about. I am one of the only ones that think he's ready (and I only think that because I think the alternative is already done, so he's ready to be the Bills starter not he's ready to be a star in this league.

 

If you asked the question of "Do you think Losman is ready?" to this entire board, you would likely get the answer of "no" from most of them. Which is what Jerry Sullivan was allegedly reporting of the Bills players. And you wouldn't know one thing about whether this board liked Losman or not. Thought he was a bust or not. Thought he was a punk or not.

 

ALL of these reports from the Bills were about KH being better prepared than Losman. Even Moulds, Losman's biggest detractor, says he likes Losman. Every actual quote about his relationship with Losman that I have seen Moulds has been favorable, he just doesn't like the fact that Losman is too green, throws to Evans more, and that KH is better prepared, and wants Holcomb as the QB because he wants to win. When Moulds threw his little shitfit it was about the play-calling, not because Losman was a jerk or a punk or even threw the ball to Evams more.

[Johnny]

I totally agree with you here.  And hearing that JP WANTED to play makes me even further want to see MM gone.

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now you see

[Agua]

I don't think sports writers are just making this up.

Why? Maybe your WNY beat writers have higher standards than the ones following the Phins, but the S.Fla. guys make crap up all the time, then base subsequent stories on previous garbage made up in other rags.

[Kelly the Dog]

I will add that do I think Losman is beloved by all his teammates? Of course not. Do I think he's cocky? Of course, and I sure hope so. Do I think it's impossible that a lot of the team doesn't like him? Sure, it's possible, although there have been no real signs of it. What I also think is that he is a tough, brass, confident, cocky, half-Latino kid from the barrio in a really tough neighborhood that sometimes may brush people the wrong way. But as soon as he starts playing well, everyone will love playing with him.

 

And precisely none of this talk has much if anything to do with liking or disliking Losman. This has to do with losing football games.