ChiGoose Posted September 17, 2023 Share Posted September 17, 2023 55 minutes ago, All_Pro_Bills said: NY Post story quoting European Commission report. I should point out anyone could find this Post article and search for the EC's report if they actually wanted to find it https://nypost.com/2023/09/08/despite-bidens-claim-europeans-werent-trying-to-oust-ukraine-prosecutor-targeting-hunters-firm/ Envoys pushed to oust Ukraine prosecutor before Biden “European and US officials pressed Ukraine to sack Viktor Shokin, the country’s former prosecutor-general, months before Joe Biden, the former US vice-president, personally intervened to force his removal, people involved in the talks said. Mr Biden did not act unilaterally nor did he instigate the push against Mr Shokin, despite suggestions to the contrary by supporters of US president Donald Trump, people familiar with the matter said. The circumstances of Mr Shokin’s sacking, which took effect in March 2016, have become a flashpoint in the impeachment saga enveloping US president Donald Trump. *** EU diplomats working on Ukraine at the time have, however, told the FT that they were looking for ways to persuade Kiev to remove Mr Shokin well before Mr Biden entered the picture. The push for Mr Shokin’s removal was part of an international effort to bolster Ukraine’s institutions following Russia’s annexation of Crimea and the armed conflict in the eastern part of the country. “All of us were really pushing [former Ukrainian president Petro] Poroshenko that he needs to do something, because the prosecutor was not following any of the corruption issues. He was really bad news,” said an EU diplomat involved in the discussions. “It was Biden who finally came in [and triggered it]. Biden was the most vocal, as the US usually is. But we were all literally complaining about the prosecutor.” Mr Shokin had been appointed prosecutor-general of Ukraine in February 2015, but the discussions in Washington and EU capitals about pushing for his removal started as early as April after he failed to follow through on a burst of expected early anti-corruption moves, one former US Treasury official said. Mr Biden entered the fray in December 2015, placing Mr Shokin’s removal at the top of his agenda on a visit to Kiev. “I know how the idea to have Shokin fired came up, and it wasn't Biden. His direct involvement came late in the game,” the former US Treasury official said. “” 5 minutes ago, aristocrat said: The new prosecutor must have convicted the owner of burisma right? He surely wouldn’t have dropped all the charges and released all the stolen money back to the criminal so that he could enjoy his life in Monaco right? He has to be in jail right? “We know Chan Gailey wasn’t fired for being a bad coach because Doug Marrone never won the Super Bowl. Gailey must have been fired for another reason.” 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aristocrat Posted September 17, 2023 Share Posted September 17, 2023 4 minutes ago, ChiGoose said: Envoys pushed to oust Ukraine prosecutor before Biden “European and US officials pressed Ukraine to sack Viktor Shokin, the country’s former prosecutor-general, months before Joe Biden, the former US vice-president, personally intervened to force his removal, people involved in the talks said. Mr Biden did not act unilaterally nor did he instigate the push against Mr Shokin, despite suggestions to the contrary by supporters of US president Donald Trump, people familiar with the matter said. The circumstances of Mr Shokin’s sacking, which took effect in March 2016, have become a flashpoint in the impeachment saga enveloping US president Donald Trump. *** EU diplomats working on Ukraine at the time have, however, told the FT that they were looking for ways to persuade Kiev to remove Mr Shokin well before Mr Biden entered the picture. The push for Mr Shokin’s removal was part of an international effort to bolster Ukraine’s institutions following Russia’s annexation of Crimea and the armed conflict in the eastern part of the country. “All of us were really pushing [former Ukrainian president Petro] Poroshenko that he needs to do something, because the prosecutor was not following any of the corruption issues. He was really bad news,” said an EU diplomat involved in the discussions. “It was Biden who finally came in [and triggered it]. Biden was the most vocal, as the US usually is. But we were all literally complaining about the prosecutor.” Mr Shokin had been appointed prosecutor-general of Ukraine in February 2015, but the discussions in Washington and EU capitals about pushing for his removal started as early as April after he failed to follow through on a burst of expected early anti-corruption moves, one former US Treasury official said. Mr Biden entered the fray in December 2015, placing Mr Shokin’s removal at the top of his agenda on a visit to Kiev. “I know how the idea to have Shokin fired came up, and it wasn't Biden. His direct involvement came late in the game,” the former US Treasury official said. “” “We know Chan Gailey wasn’t fired for being a bad coach because Doug Marrone never won the Super Bowl. Gailey must have been fired for another reason.” Hunter to dad…current prosecutor won’t drop charges what do we do? joe-claim the current one is a crook and force him out of office. hunter-done joe comes in and forces them to fire him with the aid package so famously on tape and they claim the new prosecutor is a saint even though he’s bought and paid for and will drop the charges and return the money to burismas owner and the board probably got nice bonuses. That make sense? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChiGoose Posted September 17, 2023 Share Posted September 17, 2023 1 hour ago, aristocrat said: Hunter to dad…current prosecutor won’t drop charges what do we do? joe-claim the current one is a crook and force him out of office. hunter-done joe comes in and forces them to fire him with the aid package so famously on tape and they claim the new prosecutor is a saint even though he’s bought and paid for and will drop the charges and return the money to burismas owner and the board probably got nice bonuses. That make sense? Well that’s certainly a fun fantasy that ignores the facts. Must be fun to be able to just make ***** up because it feels good. Question for you: when did the activities that Shokin was “investigating” occur and when did Hunter join Burisma? 1 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aristocrat Posted September 17, 2023 Share Posted September 17, 2023 Just now, ChiGoose said: Well that’s certainly a fun fantasy that ignores the facts. Must be fun to be able to just make ***** up because it feels good. Question for you: when did the activities that Shokin was “investigating” occur and when did Hunter join Burisma? Obvious before hunter got there. But you know I didn’t mention that. Hunter fixed the problem they had. Got rid of the guy heading the investigation. New investigators come in and charges dropped and tens of millions of public money returned to head of burisma. Guy lives in Monaco now. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChiGoose Posted September 17, 2023 Share Posted September 17, 2023 25 minutes ago, aristocrat said: Obvious before hunter got there. But you know I didn’t mention that. Hunter fixed the problem they had. Got rid of the guy heading the investigation. New investigators come in and charges dropped and tens of millions of public money returned to head of burisma. Guy lives in Monaco now. Remember when Hunter’s business partner testified that he was told that Shokin was “under control” and his firing would be not good for Burisma? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aristocrat Posted September 17, 2023 Share Posted September 17, 2023 1 minute ago, ChiGoose said: Remember when Hunter’s business partner testified that he was told that Shokin was “under control” and his firing would be not good for Burisma? chess baby. Muddy the waters enough. He might be a crack addict but they have the end result which is what they wanted. They got paid. Got their money and the head guy got his money and nice retirement down in Monaco. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BillStime Posted September 17, 2023 Share Posted September 17, 2023 3 hours ago, All_Pro_Bills said: NY Post story quoting European Commission report. I should point out anyone could find this Post article and search for the EC's report if they actually wanted to find it https://nypost.com/2023/09/08/despite-bidens-claim-europeans-werent-trying-to-oust-ukraine-prosecutor-targeting-hunters-firm/ We know facts don't matter when it comes to the cult. On 8/7/2023 at 9:48 PM, BillStime said: Wow, this weird. The EU wanted the same guy gone, too? EU hails sacking of Ukraine’s prosecutor Viktor Shokin – The Irish Times In what appeared to be his last act before dismissal, Mr Shokin sacked his deputy, Davit Sakvarelidze, who had repeatedly called for his boss to be fired. Now why would Shokin's own deputy call for his boss to be fired? *** Whoa, what's this? Stop the appointment of Shokin “The nomination of Shokin is a shock” – shouted the participants of the manifestation in front of the Ukrainian Embassy in Warsaw. Ukrainians, Kazakhs and Warsaw residents gathered in front of the building and protested against the most recent changes in the Prosecutor General’s Office in Ukraine and the nomination of Victor Shokin to head the prosecutor’s office. WAIT A MINUTE "DOC" - BIDEN GOT ALL THESE UKRANIANS TO PROTEST THE NOMINATION OF SHOKIN? *** Envoys pushed to oust Ukraine prosecutor before Biden DOC - OTHERS PUSHED FOR THIS GUY TO BE REMOVED BEFORE BIDEN GOT INVOLVED? *** WAIT - @All_Pro_Bills - OTHERS PUSHED FOR SHOKIN'S REMOVAL BEFORE BIDEN? ARE YOU SERIOUS? On 8/7/2023 at 9:53 PM, BillStime said: WAIT - THERE IS MORE @Doc - lmao KYIV POST: Demonstrators protest Shokin’s firing of anti-corruption prosecutors They protested against Shokin’s decision to fire subordinates of reformist Deputy Prosecutor General Davit Sakvarelidze working on corruption cases against prosecutors. I'm just shocked that BASEMENT BIDEN coordinated all of this!!! On 8/7/2023 at 10:07 PM, BillStime said: IMF warning sparks Ukraine pledge on corruption and reform Lagarde threat to suspend $40bn aid package elicits swift response from Kiev *** Hey @Doc - did Biden collude with the European Council on Foreign Relations, too? No reforms, no aid for Ukraine Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChiGoose Posted September 17, 2023 Share Posted September 17, 2023 27 minutes ago, aristocrat said: chess baby. Muddy the waters enough. He might be a crack addict but they have the end result which is what they wanted. They got paid. Got their money and the head guy got his money and nice retirement down in Monaco. Always more fun to go with the triple Xanatos gambit conspiracy than follow the facts to the simplest, most likely (boring!) conclusion. It’s probably a lot more fun to be with the feelings over facts crowd. 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aristocrat Posted September 17, 2023 Share Posted September 17, 2023 59 minutes ago, ChiGoose said: Always more fun to go with the triple Xanatos gambit conspiracy than follow the facts to the simplest, most likely (boring!) conclusion. It’s probably a lot more fun to be with the feelings over facts crowd. Investigation starts. Hunter is hired. Prosecutor fired with threats from joe. New hire drops charges and money goes to the criminals. Isn’t that the simplest logical conclusion? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aristocrat Posted September 17, 2023 Share Posted September 17, 2023 1 hour ago, ChiGoose said: Always more fun to go with the triple Xanatos gambit conspiracy than follow the facts to the simplest, most likely (boring!) conclusion. It’s probably a lot more fun to be with the feelings over facts crowd. your only argument has been that hunter wasn’t there when the investigation began. He was the fixer. Why do you ignore the end result which was charges dropped and the criminals get the money and ride off into the sunset? Haven’t heard you address that at all. Just parroting t without any actual proof that shokin was corrupt which is all just here say cause they never found proof of it. He gets removed and poof like magic the charges are dropped. Pretty important part of the story and the most important part. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChiGoose Posted September 17, 2023 Share Posted September 17, 2023 (edited) 11 minutes ago, aristocrat said: your only argument has been that hunter wasn’t there when the investigation began. He was the fixer. Why do you ignore the end result which was charges dropped and the criminals get the money and ride off into the sunset? Haven’t heard you address that at all. Just parroting t without any actual proof that shokin was corrupt which is all just here say cause they never found proof of it. He gets removed and poof like magic the charges are dropped. Pretty important part of the story and the most important part. My argument is that the evidence shows that basically the entire West wants Shokin fired, that it is US policy for Shokin to be fired and that Biden was acting with the consent of the President of the United States to get Shokin fired. In addition to that, there is also evidence that Shokin was just sitting on corruption investigations and that his firing would make it more likely that companies like Burisma would face real investigations. In the face of all of that, to say that Biden did this on his own as a favor to his son seems unbelievable. Edited September 17, 2023 by ChiGoose 1 1 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aristocrat Posted September 17, 2023 Share Posted September 17, 2023 1 minute ago, ChiGoose said: My argument is that the evidence shows that basically the entire West wants Shokin fired, that it is US policy for Shokin to be fired and that Biden was acting with the consent of the President of the United States to get Shokin fired. In addition to that, there is also evidence that Shokin was just sitting on corruption investigations and that his firing would make it more likely that companies like Burisma would face real investigations. In the face of all of that, to say that Biden did this on his own as a favor to his son seems unbelievable. except there is an article that was just posted showing that he received praise for his work and then suddenly the Obama administration changed their minds. You ignore that. What changed their minds? And the new prosecutor did a great job returning that sweet cash to the criminals so doesn’t that little guy on your shoulder make you wonder why that happened? Doesn’t pass the smell test at all. You ignore the most important things in the story like a stooge 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doc Posted September 18, 2023 Share Posted September 18, 2023 On 9/16/2023 at 7:16 PM, ChiGoose said: I don’t understand how people still buy this falsehood. It is well documented that basically the entire western world wanted the guy fired. Also, not only was he sitting on the Burisma investigation and not really moving it forward, the period of time in question was *before* Hunter Biden joined the board. So even if he was the anti-corruption crusader that he obviously wasn’t, Hunter wouldn’t be at risk from the investigation. It must be nice to be a right wing grifter because apparently people will believe absolutely anything even if all the evidence goes against it. On 9/16/2023 at 8:41 PM, L Ron Burgundy said: They have no response to this. All on the right will either pretend this is not the case or conveniently forget. You have no answer as to why the State Department said the money should be given because Ukraine was complying with anti-corruption measures. And also why neither Shokin, nor anyone else for that matter, was prosecuted for corruption after he was fired. You'd think that an "anti-corruption policy" and someone alleged corrupt because he wasn't prosecuting corruption...would be prosecuted for corruption. Meanwhile, again, I have seen "the entire western world" fooled into invading a country, ousting its leader and destabilizing the ME over false claims of WMDs. That's a far harder sell than "hey, this prosecutor is corrupt." 13 hours ago, ChiGoose said: Remember when Hunter’s business partner testified that he was told that Shokin was “under control” and his firing would be not good for Burisma? Oh you mean what he was told, likely by Hunter and/or Joke? Yes, real credible. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Joe Ferguson forever Posted September 18, 2023 Share Posted September 18, 2023 7 hours ago, Doc said: You have no answer as to why the State Department said the money should be given because Ukraine was complying with anti-corruption measures. And also why neither Shokin, nor anyone else for that matter, was prosecuted for corruption after he was fired. You'd think that an "anti-corruption policy" and someone alleged corrupt because he wasn't prosecuting corruption...would be prosecuted for corruption. Meanwhile, again, I have seen "the entire western world" fooled into invading a country, ousting its leader and destabilizing the ME over false claims of WMDs. That's a far harder sell than "hey, this prosecutor is corrupt." Oh you mean what he was told, likely by Hunter and/or Joke? Yes, real credible. You seem to suggest that Biden needs to prove his innocence, which would be impossible for you rubes. The morons need tp prove guilty. They can't. It's why they have fools like you carrying water... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doc Posted September 18, 2023 Share Posted September 18, 2023 16 minutes ago, Joe Ferguson forever said: You seem to suggest that Biden needs to prove his innocence, which would be impossible for you rubes. The morons need tp prove guilty. They can't. It's why they have fools like you carrying water... No they don't. The Dems set the standard with that joke of a "phone call" impeachment that only simps like you and your ilk bought, or more precisely, swallowed because you were desperate to get him since "Russian collusion" was a bust. 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BillStime Posted September 18, 2023 Share Posted September 18, 2023 On 9/16/2023 at 7:16 PM, ChiGoose said: I don’t understand how people still buy this falsehood. It is well documented that basically the entire western world wanted the guy fired. Also, not only was he sitting on the Burisma investigation and not really moving it forward, the period of time in question was *before* Hunter Biden joined the board. So even if he was the anti-corruption crusader that he obviously wasn’t, Hunter wouldn’t be at risk from the investigation. It must be nice to be a right wing grifter because apparently people will believe absolutely anything even if all the evidence goes against it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tommy Callahan Posted September 18, 2023 Share Posted September 18, 2023 29 minutes ago, BillStime said: No shoot. a lot had to happen for the euro maiden to work. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
All_Pro_Bills Posted September 18, 2023 Share Posted September 18, 2023 (edited) 2 hours ago, BillStime said: Turns out Barisma was corrupt. They paid the Biden's $5M to get the prosecutor off their backs. But still no evidence. Edited September 18, 2023 by All_Pro_Bills Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BillStime Posted September 18, 2023 Share Posted September 18, 2023 8 minutes ago, All_Pro_Bills said: Turns out Barisma was corrupt. They paid the Biden's $5M to get the prosecutor off their backs. But still no evidence. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John from Riverside Posted September 19, 2023 Share Posted September 19, 2023 On 9/17/2023 at 7:23 AM, aristocrat said: chess baby. Muddy the waters enough. He might be a crack addict but they have the end result which is what they wanted. They got paid. Got their money and the head guy got his money and nice retirement down in Monaco. This sounds like a lot of conspiracy, mental gymnastics 4 hours ago, All_Pro_Bills said: Turns out Barisma was corrupt. They paid the Biden's $5M to get the prosecutor off their backs. But still no evidence. Still nothing leaking into Joe Biden nothing 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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