Matt_In_NH Posted March 14, 2021 Share Posted March 14, 2021 38 minutes ago, SCBills said: Ford is going to be given every chance to start. Coming out of college, every analyst had him as a potential pro-bowl caliber Guard. We’ve since experimented with him at RT for one year and then he quickly got hurt before we could see what he can do on the interior. 1) Guards aren’t that expensive in FA, if Beane surprises and we go that route. 2) You can get a high level G prospect in the 2nd Round... sometimes 3rd. I’d rather do any of that, than bring back 4/5ths of the same line that couldn’t run block to save their lives. And given the fact neither of our backs has “get to the edge” speed, that run blocking is very much incumbent on the interior of our OL. Of course Beane could shock us and bring in a speed back, but if he doesn’t, we won’t just magically get better at running the ball with the same personnel. That all sounds reasonable. There are real life cap considerations and there are needs at TE, DE, OT depth, staring OG's....we dont know the current cap number but just the three RFA's and draft class could take all of it. There are more moves they can make but they will have to try and find guys who may not be on our radar in FA to plug in. I get it, the OL could be better than last year...but it also could be worse, they are very good at pass pro which is what the team would prefer. I think we all agree, they need better balance and some more output from the RB position. The strategy the coaching staff took on was pass first and it was very successful so the running game never got the focus. One time in the regular season they needed it against NE they did quite well.....very windy conditions. If they bring back Boettger and Ford, they are not as bad as some thing. Feliciano is an upgrade for those two in my opinion (with the three of them they would have some depth also) but he may not be someone they choose to spend their precious limited resources. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hapless Bills Fan Posted March 14, 2021 Share Posted March 14, 2021 7 hours ago, Thurman#1 said: Unfortunately, it's anything but crazy after re-signing both Milano and Daryl Williams. That cost a lot of money. He said earlier he wants to be here. I think he'll take a discount. But there's now probably a pretty decent chance that won't be enough. People here wondered why the Bills apparently didn't ask John Brown if he was willing to re-negotiate and extend his salary or take a decrease. I think the Bills feel they need a potential upgrade and will seek it in FA/draft, and with limited funds and roster space, you can't seek change while keeping things the same. I think the same may be true for Feliciano. I hope I'm right and it's not that the Bills have decided an OL of Dawkins-Ford-Morse-who dat?-Williams would be fine to go into the season 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SCBills Posted March 14, 2021 Share Posted March 14, 2021 13 minutes ago, Hapless Bills Fan said: People here wondered why the Bills apparently didn't ask John Brown if he was willing to re-negotiate and extend his salary or take a decrease. I think the Bills feel they need a potential upgrade and will seek it in FA/draft, and with limited funds and roster space, you can't seek change while keeping things the same. I think the same may be true for Feliciano. I hope I'm right and it's not that the Bills have decided an OL of Dawkins-Ford-Morse-who dat?-Williams would be fine to go into the season This. I think many of us will be shocked if the Bills don’t get younger and/or cheaper at WR and Guard. That doesn’t mean “worse”. Brown is a older speed guy who was banged up all year. Feliciano is probably the least talented starter on the OL. People can say what they want about Ford, but he’s young, and we’ve barely seen him at G - coming out of Oklahoma, dude was a stud. I could easily see us take a Guard and WR in the first 3 rounds. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JimmyNoodles Posted March 14, 2021 Share Posted March 14, 2021 1 minute ago, SCBills said: This. I think many of us will be shocked if the Bills don’t get younger and/or cheaper at WR and Guard. That doesn’t mean “worse”. Brown is a older speed guy who was banged up all year. Feliciano is probably the least talented starter on the OL. People can say what they want about Ford, but he’s young, and we’ve barely seen him at G - coming out of Oklahoma, dude was a stud. I could easily see us take a Guard and WR in the first 3 rounds. Guard/Center for sure. Might play guard this year and move to center when Morse goes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nihilarian Posted March 14, 2021 Share Posted March 14, 2021 10 minutes ago, SCBills said: This. I think many of us will be shocked if the Bills don’t get younger and/or cheaper at WR and Guard. That doesn’t mean “worse”. Brown is a older speed guy who was banged up all year. Feliciano is probably the least talented starter on the OL. People can say what they want about Ford, but he’s young, and we’ve barely seen him at G - coming out of Oklahoma, dude was a stud. I could easily see us take a Guard and WR in the first 3 rounds. I can't! A TE perhaps or a center to groom for replacing Morse. The thing with John Brown is, as much as I like the guy. We all saw he couldn't get any separation in the Chiefs games or in that Ravens game this year and last year. That first Chiefs game in 2020, 4 targets 0 catches. Brown had the same targets and receptions as Diggs in the 2020 Ravens playoff game. The difference was Diggs 11 targets, 8 receptions for 106 yards, 1 TD. Brown 11 targets, 8 receptions for 62 yards. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hapless Bills Fan Posted March 14, 2021 Share Posted March 14, 2021 36 minutes ago, SCBills said: I could easily see us take a Guard and WR in the first 3 rounds. WR would surprise me greatly. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SCBills Posted March 14, 2021 Share Posted March 14, 2021 (edited) 13 minutes ago, Hapless Bills Fan said: WR would surprise me greatly. If we sign someone like Hunter Henry, I suppose I could see us going with Diggs-Beasley-Davis and co., but if we don’t dramatically increase the proven talent level of our TE or RB room, running with Gabe Davis as our outside #2, with not much behind him in proven talent is risky. Edited March 14, 2021 by SCBills Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hapless Bills Fan Posted March 14, 2021 Share Posted March 14, 2021 15 minutes ago, Nihilarian said: I can't! A TE perhaps or a center to groom for replacing Morse. The thing with John Brown is, as much as I like the guy. We all saw he couldn't get any separation in the Chiefs games or in that Ravens game this year and last year. That first Chiefs game in 2020, 4 targets 0 catches. Brown had the same targets and receptions as Diggs in the 2020 Ravens playoff game. The difference was Diggs 11 targets, 8 receptions for 106 yards, 1 TD. Brown 11 targets, 8 receptions for 62 yards. I'm puzzled as to your point on the last part. Brown had an excellent game against the Ravens. He made some crucial, tough, sideline shoestring catches. But part of it was how the Ravens played our WR. The Colts played to take Brown and Diggs away, as a result of which Diggs had 6 receptions on 9 targets for 128 yds and Brown had 0 receptions on 4 targets while Davis and Beasley caught everything thrown near them for 85 and 57 yards, respectively. Beasley in particular moved the chains when we needed to. Partly as a result, the Ravens decided Brown was nothing to worry about but in addition to Diggs, Beasley and Davis were dangerous guys who had to be limited. As a result Beasley and Davis got skunked but Brown had his chances. And the extra motivation of sticking it to a team that dumped him may have given Brown some juice. With Davis hobbled, KC succeeded in limiting everyone, including Diggs. Anyway the point that Brown couldn't gain separation against the Colts or Chiefs would make more sense to me than against the Ravens this year; he did get separation there. Last year not so much, but the Ravens had fewer receivers to worry about. We clearly need a different path, in any event, whether that's a better TE or a better pass-catching RB or a more physical speed guy. Just now, SCBills said: If we sign someone like Hunter Henry, I suppose I could see us going with Diggs-Beasley-Davis and co., but if we don’t dramatically increase the proven talent level of our TE or RB room, running with Gabe Davis as our outside #2, with not much behind him in proven talent is risky - especially if McKenzie doesn’t get re-signed. I agree. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ed_Formerly_of_Roch Posted March 14, 2021 Share Posted March 14, 2021 14 hours ago, SCBills said: What is the reasoning for those who hope we re-sign him? He’s an ok player with positional flexibility. He and Ford would be the weak links on our OL currently. Ford is only a weak link due to being unproven... he was projected to be a stud G out of college - we’ve since played him at RT Year 1 and then he got hurt early playing Guard in Year 2. Feliciano is a weak link because he’s not that good. He’s not bad... but he’s not good either. If we want to have a running game this year, I’d assume Beane wants to upgrade the G positions - especially since LT, RT, C are the same guys. Ford could upgrade one spot... I’m hoping we also try to upgrade the other. I think much of the reasoning was the assumption that Williams was gone, so didn't want to lose two starting lineman. Wouldn't shock me if Beane was negotiating with both Williams and Mongo and basically told them whomever signs first gets the contract, loser is heading to FA. Having an opening at guard is maybe better than a tackle as can sign an interior lineman for less than a tackle. My expectation is they will draft an interior lineman fairly high, maybe Ike B is still resigned, he starts in the beginning of the season, but by November or so the rookie is starting. Likely they also sign a cheap mid level FA tackle as a backup. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BillsFanForever19 Posted March 14, 2021 Share Posted March 14, 2021 (edited) 5 hours ago, Big Turk said: We didn't run out of money. Beane can easily make room if he felt it was a necessity by restructuring a contract like Dawkins to free up $10 million. Likely we will do that if he finds a guard in FA he wants. The issue is with the cap held down and all the guards on the market, there are 5 or 6 guards better than Mongo who will all be getting around the same contract as Mongo. Why do anything until we see if we can get one of those guards first? Yes, we aren't completely broke. But at 7.65 under, draft picks, and RFA's like Wallace, Bojorquez, and Boettger to sign - you're probably not fitting Feliciano in unless, like you said, he does more restructures. Which I'm not counting on until it happens. Just because something makes sense to us doesn't mean it's going to happen. See: Trent Murphy last season Edited March 14, 2021 by BillsFanForever19 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
3rdand12 Posted March 14, 2021 Share Posted March 14, 2021 16 hours ago, Freddie's Dead said: Resign and re-sign are not synonyms. This is news to me. But thanks for the pro tip jk 5 hours ago, Hapless Bills Fan said: People here wondered why the Bills apparently didn't ask John Brown if he was willing to re-negotiate and extend his salary or take a decrease. I think the Bills feel they need a potential upgrade and will seek it in FA/draft, and with limited funds and roster space, you can't seek change while keeping things the same. I think the same may be true for Feliciano. I hope I'm right and it's not that the Bills have decided an OL of Dawkins-Ford-Morse-who dat?-Williams would be fine to go into the season Does Boettger or Ford take RG. seems maybe Ford should play RG and Ike LG and winters fades away. I want Feliciano on the Bills. tweets be damned 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
whatdrought Posted March 14, 2021 Share Posted March 14, 2021 False, Blackbears. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
3rdand12 Posted March 14, 2021 Share Posted March 14, 2021 1 hour ago, Ed_Formerly_of_Roch said: I think much of the reasoning was the assumption that Williams was gone, so didn't want to lose two starting lineman. Wouldn't shock me if Beane was negotiating with both Williams and Mongo and basically told them whomever signs first gets the contract, loser is heading to FA. Having an opening at guard is maybe better than a tackle as can sign an interior lineman for less than a tackle. My expectation is they will draft an interior lineman fairly high, maybe Ike B is still resigned, he starts in the beginning of the season, but by November or so the rookie is starting. Likely they also sign a cheap mid level FA tackle as a backup. Re-signed gracious me. I thought we covered this already today 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hapless Bills Fan Posted March 14, 2021 Share Posted March 14, 2021 3 minutes ago, 3rdand12 said: Does Boettger or Ford take RG. seems maybe Ford should play RG and Ike LG and winters fades away. I could be mistaken but I thought Ford had success at LG in college. So maybe he's more comfortable there? Has Boettger ever played RG? I think they need to draft/bring in more at OL Winters is a FA and I doubt he's resigned. 3 minutes ago, 3rdand12 said: I want Feliciano on the Bills. tweets be damned I love Mongo. I loved Smoke, too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LyndonvilleBill Posted March 14, 2021 Share Posted March 14, 2021 Guess he was just Re-Signed... time to move on...LOL... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hapless Bills Fan Posted March 14, 2021 Share Posted March 14, 2021 1 hour ago, Ed_Formerly_of_Roch said: Wouldn't shock me if Beane was negotiating with both Williams and Mongo and basically told them whomever signs first gets the contract, loser is heading to FA. It would shock me completely Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KingBoots8 Posted March 14, 2021 Share Posted March 14, 2021 Well, guess we can close this one down now lol Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hapless Bills Fan Posted March 14, 2021 Share Posted March 14, 2021 1 minute ago, KingBoots8 said: Well, guess we can close this one down now lol You're a Prophet!!!!! 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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