Johnny Hammersticks Posted May 28, 2018 Author Share Posted May 28, 2018 9 minutes ago, ExiledInIllinois said: He knew the kid was lying. Who sends a high schooler... Under 18 on a restricted license to The City from VT on their own to visit sick grandfather. Hope you have good auto insurance. It was a passive agressive jerk move. Sorry for being harsh Hamnetsticks, not a reflection on you. I may have done same... BUT, wouldn't have pulled the trigger? Who knows? Eh, karma’s a b***h man. I never said NYC, and if you know Vermont, NY state is only a 30-40 minute drive from where I live. Kids go there all the time. Was what I did “passive aggressive” as you say? Maybe. But if he were telling the truth then my seemingly innocuous FB comment would have been insignificant. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BarleyNY Posted May 28, 2018 Share Posted May 28, 2018 10 minutes ago, ExiledInIllinois said: He knew the kid was lying. Who sends a high schooler... Under 18 on a restricted license to The City from VT on their own to visit sick grandfather. Hope you have good auto insurance. It was a passive agressive jerk move. Sorry for being harsh Hamnetsticks, not a reflection on you. I may have done same... BUT, wouldn't have pulled the trigger? Who knows? Not his job to try to figure out whether or not the kid was lying. And it sure as hell isn’t his job to try to protect a kid from his own actions even if he suspects dishonesty. The kid said his grandfather was sick and he asked about him. Totally reasonable and, quite frankly, the right thing to do if the kid had been telling the truth. Enabling someone like that will not help them. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Johnny Hammersticks Posted May 28, 2018 Author Share Posted May 28, 2018 1 hour ago, ExiledInIllinois said: I would say trout fishing and bonfires > a crappy lacrosse team. Teach a man to fish... Build a fire... Or follow the group sports think. Yeah... He should have told you straight up, life is more than silly games. But, nobody would understand. It ain't like he will be star Joe Lax. Even if he goes to school. Costs my son a grand a year to play club LAX @ Iowa. Dude had his priorities straight. Not knocking the game. But sports ain't the savior. It's the leech in the room vs. Academics. Unfortunately, this kid is terrible in Academics. Yeah get into sports! No... Learn how to fish, build a bonfire. I will play the counter-point here. ? This makes absolutely no sense to me. If you don’t want to play a sport and you want to go camping or fishing, that’s fine, but don’t sign up to play a varsity sport then. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ExiledInIllinois Posted May 28, 2018 Share Posted May 28, 2018 15 minutes ago, Johnny Hammersticks said: Eh, karma’s a b***h man. I never said NYC, and if you know Vermont, NY state is only a 30-40 minute drive from where I live. Kids go there all the time. Was what I did “passive aggressive” as you say? Maybe. But if he were telling the truth then my seemingly innocuous FB comment would have been insignificant. Oh. Oops, thought he was going to NYC. VT does start license @ 15 like here. My nephew in Burlington area just got his. Right of passage up there. FWIW... Vermonters drive the most distances of any state. Hard to believe, but I remember reading that somewhere... May not still hold true. But, I believe it if there is only one Walmart in state. ? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Johnny Hammersticks Posted May 28, 2018 Author Share Posted May 28, 2018 59 minutes ago, ExiledInIllinois said: Yeah... He should have just been a man and not pull stuff so Hammersticks has to go all passive aggressive... Tell him straight up, he values trout fishing and bonfires more than the LAX. Nothing wrong with that. But judging from his Mama getting on FB... I can see why he can't be straight up. What ever happened to being a man, going to your coach, and saying “coach, lacrosse is just not my priority right now and I just can’t commit to being part of this team, so I’m going to hand in my gear.”?? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ridgewaycynic2013 Posted May 28, 2018 Share Posted May 28, 2018 He who lives by the social media dies by the social media. See if you can also withhold his 'participant ribbon'. 13 hours ago, Johnny Hammersticks said: I know! The balls on that kid! He’s not a very good liar. Balls, yes. Brains, no. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ExiledInIllinois Posted May 28, 2018 Share Posted May 28, 2018 5 minutes ago, Johnny Hammersticks said: This makes absolutely no sense to me. If you don’t want to play a sport and you want to go camping or fishing, that’s fine, but don’t sign up to play a varsity sport then. Yeah... Or just nut up & tell coach to !@#$ off, you're going fishing instead. Quit the team. Everybody has priorities. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Johnny Hammersticks Posted May 28, 2018 Author Share Posted May 28, 2018 1 minute ago, Ridgewaycynic2013 said: He who lives by the social media dies by the social media. See if you can also withhold his 'participant ribbon'. ? Sad thing is there will be a varsity pin waiting for him at our end of year banquet, but I doubt he will show now. I’m not going to confront him unless he decides to come out for the team next year. Now I have some leverage and can institute a zero tolerance policy with him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ExiledInIllinois Posted May 28, 2018 Share Posted May 28, 2018 Just now, Johnny Hammersticks said: ? Sad thing is there will be a varsity pin waiting for him at our end of year banquet, but I doubt he will show now. I’m not going to confront him unless he decides to come out for the team next year. Now I have some leverage and can institute a zero tolerance policy with him. How old is this kid? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Johnny Hammersticks Posted May 28, 2018 Author Share Posted May 28, 2018 1 minute ago, ExiledInIllinois said: Yeah... Or just nut up & tell coach to !@#$ off, you're going fishing instead. Quit the team. Everybody has priorities. I would respect him a great deal more if he were honest. Even if that meant telling me to $&@# off. ? Just now, ExiledInIllinois said: How old is this kid? He’s a sophomore who will likely be a sophomore again next year. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ExiledInIllinois Posted May 28, 2018 Share Posted May 28, 2018 Just now, Johnny Hammersticks said: I would respect him a great deal more if he were honest. Even if that meant telling me to $&@# off. ? !@#$ off! Do you respect me? LoL... 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ridgewaycynic2013 Posted May 28, 2018 Share Posted May 28, 2018 3 minutes ago, Johnny Hammersticks said: He’s a sophomore who will likely be a sophomore again next year. In many schools, athletic participation is coupled with academic achievement. I hope it holds true in your school. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CommonCents Posted May 28, 2018 Share Posted May 28, 2018 Everyone has their own style, what you did was crafty and well deserved. I would have handled it more directly. Challenged his commitment and made him prove it or quit. I’d rather coach kids that want to play and learn than have a kid make a joke of my own effort and his “teammates”. Lots of respect for the coach, the stupid things you guys have to deal with now is insane. I blame the parents, it starts at home. I have a good friend who also coached the girls LAX and field hockey teams. She gave up on LAX because of similar issues with multiple players and the parents would actually would call/email backing up their childs excuses and demand they play in the next game. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Johnny Hammersticks Posted May 28, 2018 Author Share Posted May 28, 2018 4 minutes ago, Ridgewaycynic2013 said: In many schools, athletic participation is coupled with academic achievement. I hope it holds true in your school. It is. That is why he was only eligible for about 5/13 games this season anyway. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ExiledInIllinois Posted May 28, 2018 Share Posted May 28, 2018 10 minutes ago, Johnny Hammersticks said: I would respect him a great deal more if he were honest. Even if that meant telling me to $&@# off. ? He’s a sophomore who will likely be a sophomore again next year. Wow... 16 and driving all around alone. Even Illinois has 15... But not full until 20. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hapless Bills Fan Posted May 28, 2018 Share Posted May 28, 2018 39 minutes ago, Johnny Hammersticks said: I wish I could have confronted him earlier, but I never had any grounds to do so. His lies to get out of practice usually were “coach, I’ve been throwing up all night so I had to stay home from school.” Then I would have his friends/teammates tell me that he was out playing basketball when he was supposed to have school. I had no proof other than heresay, so I never had a solid reason to confront him. His parents didn’t give a crap that he was missing school, and he was probably lying to them too. I couldn’t call his parents to verify. The other one he used often was “coach, I have a dentist appointment at 5:15 (we practice 5-7), and I’m probably going to have some work done so I won’t be able to make it to practice.” Now, I found it interesting that anyone would have a doctor/dentist appointment that late in the day. I went to my AD and ran it by him, and he said that there are some providers in the county that accepted Medicaid and took appointments into the early evening due to the volume of patients they need to see. Again, his “friends” would tell he was lying and skipping practice, but what was I supposed to do? Call his parents and confirm that he actually had a dentist/doctor appointment? I don’t think so. The thing is, I have had several conversations with him about his “commitment to the team” and carefully call into question his frequent absence from practice and the impact on the team. He would always just shrug it off. “Sorry coach, it has been a rough semester and I have been sick a lot.” He actually is a pretty charismatic kid. Probably a budding sociopath. I actually have pretty strict policies about missing practice/games, but this kid always found ways to skirt around them. For example, there are only four acceptable reasons to miss practice; you’re sick and cannot attend school, family emergency, academic obligation (e.g., honor society induction), or significant religious committment (e.g., first communion). Any “no call-no show” regardless of the excuse resulted in loss of playing time. I adhered to that very closely. This kid just always managed to get around the rules in the handbook. So your problem with this kid is that he provides excuses that are allowed within your rules, but you suspect them of being bogus and have information from other players that suggests they are bogus. I don't know how your school system works. Here, for a kid to miss school or athletic practice, they would need a doctor's or dentist's note verifying the appointment and to miss school due to illness without a doctor's visit, they would need a parent to call the school the morning and/or send a written excuse. Otherwise they are truant and start getting into a whole 'nother set of issues after enough truancies. My kid attended a private school, but a lot of these are Missouri State HS AA rules. Of course, depending upon how seriously the school takes it, would So couple of thoughts: 1) Would your AD/school be willing to support a policy of "you must provide a written note from a doctor or dentist that can be verified" (ie, includes providers name and phone number) - that would cut out those bogus excuses. 2) What is the school's policy about verifying absence due to illness? Do they require a phone call or note from the parent and could you do likewise? 3) Do you know that the parents don't GAS if he misses school ie have talked to them? Or are they just at a loss how to cope and perhaps they would appreciate being looped in? All that sounds like a PITA. On the other hand, I truly do feel it's helpful to kids development to understand adults are wiser to their BS than they think. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ridgewaycynic2013 Posted May 28, 2018 Share Posted May 28, 2018 3 minutes ago, Johnny Hammersticks said: It is. That is why he was only eligible for about 5/13 games this season anyway. Good. See if you can get the mathematics teacher to proportion off 5/13 of the varsity pin, and start sawing. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hapless Bills Fan Posted May 28, 2018 Share Posted May 28, 2018 3 minutes ago, ExiledInIllinois said: Wow... 16 and driving all around alone. Even Illinois has 15... But not full until 20. Missouri Graduated Drivers License allows 16 yr old to drive "alone", just can't have more than one unrelated passenger in the car for the first 6 months I think a lot of states are similar Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ExiledInIllinois Posted May 28, 2018 Share Posted May 28, 2018 3 minutes ago, Hapless Bills Fan said: Missouri Graduated Drivers License allows 16 yr old to drive "alone", just can't have more than one unrelated passenger in the car for the first 6 months I think a lot of states are similar And not after dark. Until 17 here. Anyway... Hammersticks' player is a poor liar, all kids are. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Johnny Hammersticks Posted May 28, 2018 Author Share Posted May 28, 2018 (edited) 12 minutes ago, Hapless Bills Fan said: So your problem with this kid is that he provides excuses that are allowed within your rules, but you suspect them of being bogus and have information from other players that suggests they are bogus. I don't know how your school system works. Here, for a kid to miss school or athletic practice, they would need a doctor's or dentist's note verifying the appointment and to miss school due to illness without a doctor's visit, they would need a parent to call the school the morning and/or send a written excuse. Otherwise they are truant and start getting into a whole 'nother set of issues after enough truancies. My kid attended a private school, but a lot of these are Missouri State HS AA rules. Of course, depending upon how seriously the school takes it, would So couple of thoughts: 1) Would your AD/school be willing to support a policy of "you must provide a written note from a doctor or dentist that can be verified" (ie, includes providers name and phone number) - that would cut out those bogus excuses. 2) What is the school's policy about verifying absence due to illness? Do they require a phone call or note from the parent and could you do likewise? 3) Do you know that the parents don't GAS if he misses school ie have talked to them? Or are they just at a loss how to cope and perhaps they would appreciate being looped in? All that sounds like a PITA. On the other hand, I truly do feel it's helpful to kids development to understand adults are wiser to their BS than they think. This is Vermont, man. No such policies exist, or better I say...are enforced. I am an educator as well, and one of our biggest problems is truancy. Sure, we have policies in place, but ultimately they are never enforced. Even when reported to DCF they don’t do anything. In this case, his parents were allowing him to stay home and would call his absence into school. Again, not the most “skilled” parents in the world, and certainly no importance placed on education, character, or committment in this family. I’m no being judgmental. It just is what it is. Edited May 28, 2018 by Johnny Hammersticks Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hapless Bills Fan Posted May 28, 2018 Share Posted May 28, 2018 11 minutes ago, Johnny Hammersticks said: This is Vermont, man. No such policies exist, or better I say...are enforced. I am an educator as well, and one of our biggest problems is truancy. Sure, we have policies in place, but ultimately they are never enforced. Even when reported to DCF they don’t do anything. In this case, his parents were allowing him to stay home and would call his absence into school. Again, not the most “skilled” parents in the world, and certainly no importance placed on education, character, or committment in this family. I’m no being judgmental. It just is what it is. Got it. Well, if his parents are actually backing him up, and the school doesn't have policies about Dr notes etc - sounds like not much you can do. 17 minutes ago, ExiledInIllinois said: And not after dark. Until 17 here. Really? Missouri only restricts 1 am to 5 am "unless driving to and from a school activity, job, or for an emergency" But they do require a certain number of permit training hours after dark. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gugny Posted May 28, 2018 Share Posted May 28, 2018 Jerk move? Not one bit. I don't know if you would have benefitted from giving yourself 24 hours before reacting. I try to do that when I'm on the fence about doing/saying something based on my current feelings about a situation. I think I would have refrained from engaging in a social media conversation with a student. I would never do anything like that with an employee and that's the only real-life comparison I have. I'm not saying that I think what you did was necessarily wrong; and I absolutely DO NOT think it was a dick move, in the least. I think this is something I may have been more likely to do if I didn't give myself enough time to think it through. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ExiledInIllinois Posted May 28, 2018 Share Posted May 28, 2018 5 minutes ago, Hapless Bills Fan said: Got it. Well, if his parents are actually backing him up, and the school doesn't have policies about Dr notes etc - sounds like not much you can do. Really? Missouri only restricts 1 am to 5 am "unless driving to and from a school activity, job, or for an emergency" I forget now... It may be 11-6... But usually reigned it in w/son as it started to get dark... In summer around 9... Gotta check again, daughter is 16 and still learning. I am passing her off to driving school... /smh, boys so much easier to teach. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Johnny Hammersticks Posted May 28, 2018 Author Share Posted May 28, 2018 34 minutes ago, Gugny said: Jerk move? Not one bit. I don't know if you would have benefitted from giving yourself 24 hours before reacting. I try to do that when I'm on the fence about doing/saying something based on my current feelings about a situation. I think I would have refrained from engaging in a social media conversation with a student. I would never do anything like that with an employee and that's the only real-life comparison I have. I'm not saying that I think what you did was necessarily wrong; and I absolutely DO NOT think it was a dick move, in the least. I think this is something I may have been more likely to do if I didn't give myself enough time to think it through. It’s not my personal FB page, and I do not treat it as such. None of the “friends” of the Schmarnaw Valley Lacrosse Facebook page are family members or friends of mine. I use it to communicate information pertaining to the team (e.g., practice times, cancellations) to players and parents. Every once in a great while I will comment on a player or alums page if they post about a great achievement or something like that. In this case, I was acknowledging his awesome day of fishing. Brook trout season is a huge deal up here ? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ridgewaycynic2013 Posted May 28, 2018 Share Posted May 28, 2018 7 minutes ago, Johnny Hammersticks said: In this case, I was acknowledging his awesome day of fishing. Brook trout season is a huge deal up here ? One would hope personal accountability is a 'huge deal' as well. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ExiledInIllinois Posted May 28, 2018 Share Posted May 28, 2018 6 minutes ago, Johnny Hammersticks said: It’s not my personal FB page, and I do not treat it as such. None of the “friends” of the Schmarnaw Valley Lacrosse Facebook page are family members or friends of mine. I use it to communicate information pertaining to the team (e.g., practice times, cancellations) to players and parents. Every once in a great while I will comment on a player or alums page if they post about a great achievement or something like that. In this case, I was acknowledging his awesome day of fishing. Brook trout season is a huge deal up here ? I can see why the kid was torn. No offense, I'd put the brook before the stick. And in doing so, I would have let it slide. Now, if it was some BS activity... Yeah, call him out. Working a nice fly over LAX is a no brainer. IMO, more important recreation. Same with the bonfire. There is something primal here over a gratuitous game. Don't have to agree... You're the coach. But this is why I would have let it slide. Fishing and fire has more cultural significance. Now... You just !@#$ed with his mind even more... He won't learn. You should have been straight up, private with him... IMO. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Johnny Hammersticks Posted May 28, 2018 Author Share Posted May 28, 2018 3 minutes ago, ExiledInIllinois said: I can see why the kid was torn. No offense, I'd put the brook before the stick. And in doing so, I would have let it slide. Now, if it was some BS activity... Yeah, call him out. Working a nice fly over LAX is a no brainer. IMO, more important recreation. Same with the bonfire. There is something primal here over a gratuitous game. Don't have to agree... You're the coach. But this is why I would have let it slide. Fishing and fire has more cultural significance. Now... You just !@#$ed with his mind even more... He won't learn. You should have been straight up, private with him... IMO. You’re ridiculous. You can’t skip a varsity sport game...the last game of our season...our senior game!!! To go fishing and have a bonfire!!! Are you freaking kidding me with this absurdity?? You are banned from this thread. Go open a lock or something... 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ExiledInIllinois Posted May 28, 2018 Share Posted May 28, 2018 6 minutes ago, Johnny Hammersticks said: You’re ridiculous. You can’t skip a varsity sport game...the last game of our season...our senior game!!! To go fishing and have a bonfire!!! Are you freaking kidding me with this absurdity?? You are banned from this thread. Go open a lock or something... LoL... I said I would take the counter point. And yes you can in trout country! Culturally significant. Do they have Varsity fishing. Last weekend I just locked the bass team from Mokena, Illinois. They have a team. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Johnny Hammersticks Posted May 28, 2018 Author Share Posted May 28, 2018 45 minutes ago, ExiledInIllinois said: LoL... I said I would take the counter point. And yes you can in trout country! Culturally significant. Do they have Varsity fishing. Last weekend I just locked the bass team from Mokena, Illinois. They have a team. I hope you’re just busting balls at this point, EIL ?? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ExiledInIllinois Posted May 28, 2018 Share Posted May 28, 2018 (edited) 40 minutes ago, Johnny Hammersticks said: I hope you’re just busting balls at this point, EIL ?? A little. But I scored high on empathy... Almost in the "paralyzed zone" where nothing gets accomplished. ? But, no... We have HS fishing teams... I would think they can letter... LoL... Two kids won a tourney last year... Caught the biggest smallies in lock... All the old guys cried foul since it is technicality a no fishing zone. But what makes LAX or classic team games better, higher priority. Kids are pulled in all directions today... Glad he was doing a traditional activity. He probably didn't want you to get mad. Must be getting old being the best player on a not so good team. Edited May 28, 2018 by ExiledInIllinois Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ridgewaycynic2013 Posted May 28, 2018 Share Posted May 28, 2018 2 hours ago, Hapless Bills Fan said: Got it. Well, if his parents are actually backing him up, and the school doesn't have policies about Dr notes etc - sounds like not much you can do. Depending on how rewarding working with the rest of the team is, there is something JH can do. Hand in his resignation at the end of the season, with a letter outlining lack of commitment from some players, and lack of support from school administrators. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ExiledInIllinois Posted May 28, 2018 Share Posted May 28, 2018 5 minutes ago, Ridgewaycynic2013 said: Depending on how rewarding working with the rest of the team is, there is something JH can do. Hand in his resignation at the end of the season, with a letter outlining lack of commitment from some players, and lack of support from school administrators. Yeah. But... Sounds like this kid is a cancer. Should have nipped it in bud. But, if he is only good one on team... Everybody whores for the kid. Betcha his mother laughed it off. Did his parents put some heat on him? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dante Posted May 28, 2018 Share Posted May 28, 2018 I feel he pulls jerk moves on you all the time. This was probably way overdue. Likely no one ever calls him out on his shite. Someone has to. May as well be a coach Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fadingpain Posted May 28, 2018 Share Posted May 28, 2018 Nah, not a jerk move. But further proof that intelligence and the frequency of use of social media are often inversely proportionate. Kids. Don't know how you have the patience to deal with that crap. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Johnny Hammersticks Posted May 29, 2018 Author Share Posted May 29, 2018 Much to my surprise. I received an email from my AD today, and despite our forfeit, we actually made state playoffs as the 12th seed (out of 13). We play up north (about 10 miles from the Canadian border) on Wednesday against the reigning state champs in my division. Going to be a slaughter, but it’s cool to get invited to the dance. Last year, we won our first playoff game in program history. I’m happy for my players...there are some really good kids on my team. Pseudonymn Paul has played his last game this season. I will have a heart to heart with him tomorrow at practice....provided he shows. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BringBackFergy Posted May 29, 2018 Share Posted May 29, 2018 Johnny. You done good. Exiled? Well.....I guess we all know why his name is Exiled. (Check my post time...he will respond in 12 minutes) 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Teddy KGB Posted May 29, 2018 Share Posted May 29, 2018 Hide the kids from exill and his terrible advice 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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