Peterman was historically bad on Sunday

[boyst]

15 minutes ago, Hapless Bills Fan said:

 

The porous OL against the very strong LAC pass rush and pass D didnt do Peterman any favors (any more than NO did the previous week).

The good news is KC's run D and pass D are down in the bottom third of the league - they're missing a bunch of their best D players - so it's possible our OL might cope.

 

Who saw Peterman (on the Bills) and said he was not worth starting?

 

I was under-impressed in pre-season, but it was possible he improved.

People unspoken with at various points in the early part of the season and about 3 weeks ago who saw him in practices...

[Hapless Bills Fan]

3 minutes ago, Buffalo Bills Fan said:

Justin Houston elite pass rusher might wreck havoc on our O-Line.  I just don't trust this O-Line with any team out there.. Looks very horrible. 

 

Oh, they're not good with Mills and Dawkins and Ducasse in there.  But Bosa's already in double digit sacks and Ingram is headed there on the Chargers.  Can't double everyone.

Houston is good, but Dee Ford (who was their terror last year) has been injured (for the 2nd time this season), missed the last 2 games, and will probably be hampered if he goes.

[JM2009]

2 minutes ago, The Jokeman said:

The reality is Tyrod got benched because apparently I perceived the same thing as our HC did which is Tyrod isn't good enough and won't be a Bill in 2018. 

You don't bench TT when the sixth spot for the playoffs is wide open. He received a lot of flak for it. Players around the league support TT. I think they know more than you.

[boyst]

22 minutes ago, Hapless Bills Fan said:

 

Jeff, can you go into this more?  Why are you so confident of that?

I was told this directly through someone who spoke to Taylor Sunday, if I have that right.   Basically, a trusted person knows someone who is important who spoke to Taylor Sunday and expressed it was 100% Dennison

[Hapless Bills Fan]

1 minute ago, Boyst62 said:

I was told this directly through someone who spoke to Taylor Sunday, if I have that right.   Basically, a trusted person knows someone who is important who spoke to Taylor Sunday and expressed it was 100% Dennison

 

So the initial source of the gouge is Taylor, did I extract that correctly?

[The Jokeman]

3 minutes ago, Boyst62 said:

I was told this directly through someone who spoke to Taylor Sunday, if I have that right.   Basically, a trusted person knows someone who is important who spoke to Taylor Sunday and expressed it was 100% Dennison

Imagine that an OC wanted to bench his QB after he passed for 56 yards and hasn't shown improvements from the preseason when his OC asked him to trust guys to throw it downfield. But I know we can blame someone else besides Tyrod for our 4 losses up to that point of the season.

Edited November 22, 2017 by The Jokeman

[Hapless Bills Fan]

8 minutes ago, The Jokeman said:

Imagine that an OC wanted to bench his QB after he passed for 56 yards and hasn't shown improvements from the preseason when his OC asked him to trust guys to throw it downfield. But I know we can blame someone else besides Tyrod for our 4 losses this season.

 

I've had employees that I would have cheerfully liked to stuff in a box and ship out of town.  But I had to work with them when I couldn't replace them with someone better.  I had to, you know, coach them up, figure out what they did best and focus on that, use them to best advantage to accomplish the needed tasks.  It would have been silly to give their assignments to someone green and incapable, just because they might not be here long-term.

 

Returning the conversation to Taylor, it has to be asked why he passed for just 56 yards.  This breakdown may be of interest in that regard.

Edited November 22, 2017 by Hapless Bills Fan

[boyst]

36 minutes ago, Hapless Bills Fan said:

 

So the initial source of the gouge is Taylor, did I extract that correctly?

Yes

35 minutes ago, The Jokeman said:

Imagine that an OC wanted to bench his QB after he passed for 56 yards and hasn't shown improvements from the preseason when his OC asked him to trust guys to throw it downfield. But I know we can blame someone else besides Tyrod for our 4 losses up to that point of the season.

If you gave me the option between Taylor and Peterman, I would take Taylor. If you gave me the option of Brian brohm or Peterman, I would take Brohm. If you gave me the option of EJ Manuel or Peterman, I would take manuel. And this is nothing against the kid, this is just what is being said about him he's not going to cut it

[Hapless Bills Fan]

11 minutes ago, Boyst62 said:

Yes

If you gave me the option between Taylor and Peterman, I would take Taylor. If you gave me the option of Brian brohm or Peterman, I would take Brohm. If you gave me the option of EJ Manuel or Peterman, I would take manuel. And this is nothing against the kid, this is just what is being said about him he's not going to cut it

 

"I'd take Brohm" is a bad look.  He's the only QB I found who played ~as poorly as Peterman did (rating 17.9 vs Jets, same as Peterman) and he only threw 3 INTs in 3 Q.

WTF with Dennison wanting to start him then? 

Edited November 22, 2017 by Hapless Bills Fan

[boyst]

1 minute ago, Hapless Bills Fan said:

 

"I'd take Brohm" is a bad look.  He's the only QB I found who played ~as poorly as Peterman did (rating 17.9 vs Jets, same as Peterman) and he only threw 3 INTs in 3 Q.

WTF with Dennison wanting to start him then? 

With brohm you knew and know you're not going to get an NFL starter. With Peterman people actually believe a 5th rounder is going to turn it around for us

[Hapless Bills Fan]

7 minutes ago, Boyst62 said:

With brohm you knew and know you're not going to get an NFL starter. With Peterman people actually believe a 5th rounder is going to turn it around for us

 

By "people" do you mean Dennison?  Dennison believed that, even with (I assume) scout team parts of the practice he can't watch on tape?  Is McWrestler sincere when he's going on about how it won't define his career etc etc, saying he believes in him?

 

WRT Brohm, you knew.  But I can recall loud clamoring from some segments of TBD and in the press, to start Brohm when Fitzpatrick was playing like crap mid-season after cracked ribs - 7 straight losses.  People were all "why doesn't Gailey start Brohm?" "He was a 2nd round draft pick" "See what he's got" "He could give us a spark"  So Gailey started him, and then everyone was "Oh okay.  That's why."  He never played another down in the NFL (he played for the USFL and CFL and is now a coach at Purdue, if anyone wondered).

What boggles my mind is that even after watching that game, people are still "Oh, it's one game, we need to evaluate him, see what he's got, let him play through his mistakes" with Peterman.

Edited November 22, 2017 by Hapless Bills Fan

[boyst]

1 minute ago, Hapless Bills Fan said:

 

By "people" do you mean Dennison?  Dennison believed that, even with (I assume) scout team parts of the practice he can't watch on tape?

 

WRT Brohm, you knew.  But I can recall loud clamoring from some segments of TBD and in the press, to start Brohm when Fitzpatrick was playing like crap mid-season after cracked ribs - 7 straight losses.  People were all "why doesn't Gailey start Brohm?" "He was a 2nd round draft pick" "See what he's got" "He could give us a spark"  So Gailey started him, and then everyone was "Oh okay.  That's why."  He never played another down in the NFL (he played for the USFL and CFL and is now a coach at Purdue, if anyone wondered).

What boggles my mind is that even after watching that game, people are still "Oh, it's one game, we need to evaluate him, see what he's got, let him play through his mistakes" with Peterman.

First, what exactly is boggling the Mind? Daneen bottling the mind? Duh

 

And evidently Dennis and thought enough of Peterman and as little of Taylor to believe as he did. And anyone who thought brohm was a legit starter is a moron

[Nick the Greek]

4 hours ago, The Jokeman said:

So he can only improve right? I know we're all upset at how bad he performed but what do we have to lose now if we start him again? My only concern is about McDermott "losing the locker room". Yet I'm not sure if our current core leaders will be along much longer as I can't see Kyle staying around longer and Lorax looks like age finally caught up with him leaving us a chance to pursue more McDermott guys like Star Lotulelei who's set to be an UFA this offseason. 

It’s always darkest before dawn.

[Hapless Bills Fan]

35 minutes ago, Boyst62 said:

First, what exactly is boggling the Mind? Daneen bottling the mind? Duh

 

And evidently Dennis and thought enough of Peterman and as little of Taylor to believe as he did. And anyone who thought brohm was a legit starter is a moron

 

I think your autocorrect may be running amok.  What is boggling my mind, is the fans still being all "still need to evaluate Peterman and play him".  It's all over TBD.  Poll with 30% of respondents wanting him to start.

 

I have no idea what Daneen bottling the mind should parse to.

 

I get it Dennison thought enough of Peterman, the question is why and what was he seeing? 

And what did McWrestler see that he signed off on it, if your gouge is straight that it was Dennison's call?

 

 

Edited November 22, 2017 by Hapless Bills Fan

[Kelly the Dog]

4 hours ago, Romie said:

Nate Farve all right, it fits.  After all Favre is the all time leader in interceptions.  

What Hyde didn't say was that he was talking about the Favre in the last year of his career. 

[Agent 91]

4 hours ago, BuffaloHokie13 said:

This point simply defies logic. He's going to be a starter for a while. He's easily been in the top 15-20 QBs, or higher depending who you talk to, every year with a less than stellar supporting cast.

 

McDermott can try whatever he wants, but all he did Sunday was demonstrate all the deficiencies on O that Tyrod helps mask.

He may very well be a starter for a while... but it wont be here

[SlimShady'sSpaceForce]

9 hours ago, BuffaloHokie13 said:

He faced the 3rd most average yards to go on 3rd down in the league and was still 9th in conversion rate. People love to see what they want though.

 

And before we get the captain checkdown canned response

 

The message truly is 3rd and long 

 

A possible solution Pass the ball 5 yards or more beyond the LOS on 1st or 2nd.   

8 hours ago, Boyst62 said:

With brohm you knew and know you're not going to get an NFL starter. With Peterman people actually believe a 5th rounder is going to turn it around for us

Noone said Nate would.  Some of us would like to see him succeed just like we wanted TT succeed in becoming a real NFL QB.   

 

Some people are convinced Nate's a failure after 1/2 half of a very bad game where it is documented the OLine never blocked Bosa!

 

We've given TT 2 1/2 years to prove it.   Hypocritical to say give TT a chance and noone else.  (Why do I sound like an EJ homer)

 

 

7 hours ago, Hapless Bills Fan said:

 

I think your autocorrect may be running amok.  What is boggling my mind, is the fans still being all "still need to evaluate Peterman and play him".  It's all over TBD.  Poll with 30% of respondents wanting him to start.

 

I have no idea what Daneen bottling the mind should parse to.

 

I get it Dennison thought enough of Peterman, the question is why and what was he seeing? 

And what did McWrestler see that he signed off on it, if your gouge is straight that it was Dennison's call?

 

 

I'm getting irritated with my auto correct.  I have to  grammar check every freaking post I make. 

 

Edited November 22, 2017 by ShadyBillsFan

[BuffaloHokie13]

7 hours ago, Agent 91 said:

He may very well be a starter for a while... but it wont be here

Not even close to the point I was making, but good attempt!

[boyst]

8 hours ago, Hapless Bills Fan said:

 

I think your autocorrect may be running amok.  What is boggling my mind, is the fans still being all "still need to evaluate Peterman and play him".  It's all over TBD.  Poll with 30% of respondents wanting him to start.

 

I have no idea what Daneen bottling the mind should parse to.

 

I get it Dennison thought enough of Peterman, the question is why and what was he seeing? 

And what did McWrestler see that he signed off on it, if your gouge is straight that it was Dennison's call?

 

 

I wasdrained. But mind bottling is a TBDism. 

[Shaw66]

22 hours ago, LA Grant said:

 

• No quarterback had thrown three picks in the first quarter since Geno Smith did it in 2014.

 

 

 

 

I'm not going to go back to figure out who else threw three picks in the first quarter, but I know Trent Edwards did it against the Browns in Buffalo.   

Edited November 22, 2017 by Shaw66

[Kelly the Dog]

Go back and look at game logs. Tyrod has a lot of third and longs because of a lot of negative runs on first as well as a lot of 2-20s and 3-20s after penalties. Plus a fair amount of sacks on early downs some of which were his fault and some when he was immediately swarmed. 

[DaBillsFanSince1973]

Mike Rodak ESPN Staff Writer 

Bills rookie Nathan Peterman said Buccaneers and former Bills quarterback Ryan Fitzpatrick reached out to him after Peterman's poor debut Sunday against the Chargers. "[Fitzpatrick] told me about his rookie year and stuff. That was helpful to see," Peterman said Wednesday.

Mike Rodak

Edited November 22, 2017 by DaBillsFanSince1973

[OldTimeAFLGuy]

13 minutes ago, DaBillsFanSince1973 said:

Mike Rodak ESPN Staff Writer 

Bills rookie Nathan Peterman said Buccaneers and former Bills quarterback Ryan Fitzpatrick reached out to him after Peterman's poor debut Sunday against the Chargers. "[Fitzpatrick] told me about his rookie year and stuff. That was helpful to see," Peterman said Wednesday.

Mike Rodak

 

 

...if Dennison drove this decision because he does not like working with Taylor (first smell test for me is his inconsistencies in game plans that do not capitalize on TT's mobility as in three step drops in the pocket with a porous OL), we have BIGGER problems......if egos or personality clashes take precedent over "W's", we are in deep fertilizer...........

[LA Grant]

Look at the bright side -- Peterman had a higher passer rating on Sunday if you considered him a Chargers QB.

 

http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2017/11/22/nathan-peterman-had-a-higher-passer-rating-as-a-chargers-quarterback/

 

What a ridiculous disaster. Destroy the relationship with Tyrod and ruin Peterman's confidence. Killing two birds with one stone? Now that's what I call process.

[OldTimeAFLGuy]

9 minutes ago, LA Grant said:

Look at the bright side -- Peterman had a higher passer rating on Sunday if you considered him a Chargers QB.

 

http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2017/11/22/nathan-peterman-had-a-higher-passer-rating-as-a-chargers-quarterback/

 

What a ridiculous disaster. Destroy the relationship with Tyrod and ruin Peterman's confidence. Killing two birds with one stone? Now that's what I call process.

 

...STILL going back to my redundant assertion that something ain't passing the smell test here......TT benching and Peterman premature start on the road albeit West Coast is a Dennison personal thing....if McD lets that happen, he is a weak link...........

[Hapless Bills Fan]

39 minutes ago, DaBillsFanSince1973 said:

Mike Rodak ESPN Staff Writer 

Bills rookie Nathan Peterman said Buccaneers and former Bills quarterback Ryan Fitzpatrick reached out to him after Peterman's poor debut Sunday against the Chargers. "[Fitzpatrick] told me about his rookie year and stuff. That was helpful to see," Peterman said Wednesday.

Mike Rodak

 

That doesn't surprise me a bit to hear.  Whatever you think of him as a QB, Fitz is a good guy.  He certainly had an up-and-down rookie year, and yeah, he both set a record for yards thrown by a rookie/comeback win in his first game AND he threw a 5-INT game.

[DaBillsFanSince1973]

7 minutes ago, Hapless Bills Fan said:

 

That doesn't surprise me a bit to hear.  Whatever you think of him as a QB, Fitz is a good guy.  He certainly had an up-and-down rookie year, and yeah, he both set a record for yards thrown by a rookie/comeback win in his first game AND he threw a 5-INT game.

 

fitz has always had class.

 

 I agree, he's a good guy..

Edited November 22, 2017 by DaBillsFanSince1973

[Buffalo Bills Fan]

7 minutes ago, Hapless Bills Fan said:

 

That doesn't surprise me a bit to hear.  Whatever you think of him as a QB, Fitz is a good guy.  He certainly had an up-and-down rookie year, and yeah, he both set a record for yards thrown by a rookie/comeback win in his first game AND he threw a 5-INT game.

 

Ya lol I would love to have a beer or two with Fitz lol. Very nice guy.

Edited November 22, 2017 by Buffalo Bills Fan

[OldTimeAFLGuy]

1 minute ago, DaBillsFanSince1973 said:

 

fitz has always had class.

 

 I agree, he's a good guy..

 

 

....Brandon did offer him backup money to stay after his ridiculous $$ extension, but he declined saying, " I know I can get starter money elsewhere".....thus, his NFL global trot....

[DaBillsFanSince1973]

Just now, OldTimeAFLGuy said:

 

 

....Brandon did offer him backup money to stay after his ridiculous $$ extension, but he declined saying, " I know I can get starter money elsewhere".....thus, his NFL global trot....

 

he's holding a job, getting paid. I have no issue with that.

[dulles]

49 minutes ago, OldTimeAFLGuy said:

 

 

...if Dennison drove this decision because he does not like working with Taylor (first smell test for me is his inconsistencies in game plans that do not capitalize on TT's mobility as in three step drops in the pocket with a porous OL), we have BIGGER problems......if egos or personality clashes take precedent over "W's", we are in deep fertilizer...........

If that is true, I'd be surprised.  I think that McD might go after that in the offseason  if it is true.  

[OldTimeAFLGuy]

8 minutes ago, dulles said:

If that is true, I'd be surprised.  I think that McD might go after that in the offseason  if it is true.  

 

...PURE speculation on my part bud....but something just does not seem right.....perhaps I have another gas bubble..............

[Pine Barrens Mafia]

48 minutes ago, LA Grant said:

Look at the bright side -- Peterman had a higher passer rating on Sunday if you considered him a Chargers QB.

 

http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2017/11/22/nathan-peterman-had-a-higher-passer-rating-as-a-chargers-quarterback/

 

What a ridiculous disaster. Destroy the relationship with Tyrod and ruin Peterman's confidence. Killing two birds with one stone? Now that's what I call process.

 

What relationship with tyrod?

 

 

[Hapless Bills Fan]

13 minutes ago, OldTimeAFLGuy said:

....Brandon did offer him backup money to stay after his ridiculous $$ extension, but he declined saying, " I know I can get starter money elsewhere".....thus, his NFL global trot....

 

Really, now.  What was this offer, and what were the other terms?

The devil is always in the details.
 

36 minutes ago, OldTimeAFLGuy said:

 

...STILL going back to my redundant assertion that something ain't passing the smell test here......TT benching and Peterman premature start on the road albeit West Coast is a Dennison personal thing....if McD lets that happen, he is a weak link...........

 

I am with you here though.  If it was Dennison's call, how did McWrestler vet it?  And how did Dennison vet it?  It's not a good look for them.

There is one guy here claiming that some people positioned to know, told him just a week or two back that Peterson did not look good, not at all ready.

2 minutes ago, joesixpack said:

What relationship with tyrod?

 

And here, perhaps you have identified a source of this season's offensive woes

[Pine Barrens Mafia]

1 minute ago, Hapless Bills Fan said:

 

And here, perhaps you have identified a source of this season's offensive woes

Put yourself in McBeane's shoes.

 

Do you try and build an offense around a guy whose ceiling is "average?" Or do you see if he can perform as a normal NFL QB...and if he can't let him go?

 

[DaBillsFanSince1973]

1 minute ago, joesixpack said:

Put yourself in McBeane's shoes.

 

Do you try and build an offense around a guy whose ceiling is "average?" Or do you see if he can perform as a normal NFL QB...and if he can't let him go?

 

 

 

pretty cut and dry.

[Hapless Bills Fan]

11 minutes ago, joesixpack said:

Put yourself in McBeane's shoes.

Do you try and build an offense around a guy whose ceiling is "average?" Or do you see if he can perform as a normal NFL QB...and if he can't let him go?

 

I vote for "neither of the above". 

 

Tyrod is a guy with a unique skill set, who had at that time 2 years of tape saying he could do some things expected of a traditional NFL QB well, other things poorly, and has in addition some unique abilities pretty much no one else has.

 

If I'm unwilling to work with him as he is, I tell my bosses to get me the best traditional-type pocket passer on the FA market and let Taylor go - LAST SPRING.

 

if I want to keep Taylor or if they simply can't sign the traditional guy I want, I select from my 5 2-inch thick notebooks a subset of plays that focus on his strengths, design a few that exploit his unique skillset, and only a few that stretch him and ask him to develop. 

 

That's how you win.  You don't win by keeping players who don't fit the roles you want them to fill and trying to hammer that square peg into roundness and @#%! it just Won't.  Become.  Round.

 

People talk about McDaniel's offense on the Pats** as though it's a static thing, but the truth is, it changes quite a bit from year to year depending upon the personnel he has to work with.  Dennison/Kubiak are the guys that tried to make "Shotgun Sheriff Manning" into a pocket passer who rolled out in his last season.  Nuff said.

Edited November 22, 2017 by Hapless Bills Fan

[Buffalo Bills Fan]

1 minute ago, Hapless Bills Fan said:

 

I vote for "neither of the above". 

 

Tyrod is a guy with a unique skill set, who had at that time 2 years of tape saying he could do some things expected of a traditional NFL QB well, other things poorly, and has in addition some unique abilities pretty much no one else has.

 

If I'm unwilling to work with him as he is, I tell my bosses to get me the best traditional-type pocket passer on the FA market and let Taylor go.

 

if I want to keep Taylor or if they simply can't sign the traditional guy I want, I select from my 5 2-inch thick notebooks a subset of plays that focus on his strengths, design a few that exploit his unique skillset, and only a few that stretch him and ask him to develop. 

 

That's how you win.  You don't win by keeping players who don't fit the roles you want them to fill and trying to hammer that square peg into roundness and @#%! it just Won't.  Become.  Round.

 

People talk about McDaniel's offense on the Pats** as though it's a static thing, but the truth is, it changes quite a bit from year to year depending upon the personnel he has to work with.  Dennison/Kubiak are the guys that tried to make "Shotgun Sheriff Manning" into a pocket passer who rolled out in his last season.  Nuff said.

 

Wow great post with this. Agree.

[OldTimeAFLGuy]

4 minutes ago, joesixpack said:

Put yourself in McBeane's shoes.

 

Do you try and build an offense around a guy whose ceiling is "average?" Or do you see if he can perform as a normal NFL QB...and if he can't let him go?

 

...probably another stupid question that follows my litany and repertoire, but how much building does one expect Beane to do coming in on May 9, 2017 POST DRAFT?.....what exactly are his choices other than UFA's, cuts/releases, etc?.......cream of the crop...or CRAP?....

[Pine Barrens Mafia]

2 minutes ago, OldTimeAFLGuy said:

...probably another stupid question that follows my litany and repertoire, but how much building does one expect Beane to do coming in on May 9, 2017 POST DRAFT?.....what exactly are his choices other than UFA's, cuts/releases, etc?.......cream of the crop...or CRAP?....

 

Yep neither of these guys have been here for a full year. Yet the tyrod fanatics want them run out. Boggles the mind