JaCrispy Posted November 4, 2017 Share Posted November 4, 2017 1 minute ago, PromoTheRobot said: I was getting gas and you know how some pumps have TVs now? They were showing Taylor's escape and TD throw to Holmes vs the Raiders. So now everyone sees that and thinks "wow, that QB is amazing!" Just like how we look at other QBs and wish ours was that amazing. Perspective. This...the good QBs don't look great the whole game....they just have their moments...I'm starting to think that Bills fans underrate Tyrod because they watch his whole games and expect him to be great at on every play- which is just not reasonable. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bangarang Posted November 4, 2017 Share Posted November 4, 2017 4 minutes ago, PromoTheRobot said: I was getting gas and you know how some pumps have TVs now? They were showing Taylor's escape and TD throw to Holmes vs the Raiders. So now everyone sees that and thinks "wow, that QB is amazing!" Just like how we look at other QBs and wish ours was that amazing. Perspective. So you’re saying the people who think he’s amazing because of seeing only the good plays are just as wrong as people here who rave about other QBs for the same reason? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PromoTheRobot Posted November 4, 2017 Share Posted November 4, 2017 2 minutes ago, JaCrispy said: This...the good QBs don't look great the whole game....they just have their moments...I'm starting to think that Bills fans underrate Tyrod because they watch his whole games and expect him to be great at on every play- which is just not reasonable. I've said for years. We watch and analyze every second of Bills games and the warts stick out to us. Then we compare it with the highlights of other games. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JaCrispy Posted November 4, 2017 Share Posted November 4, 2017 (edited) 4 minutes ago, PromoTheRobot said: I've said for years. We watch and analyze every second of Bills games and the warts stick out to us. Then we compare it with the highlights of other games. If we aren't able to make a mega deal for Josh Rosen in the draft, I'm all for building around Tyrod Edited November 4, 2017 by JaCrispy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
boyst Posted November 4, 2017 Share Posted November 4, 2017 15 minutes ago, PromoTheRobot said: I was getting gas and you know how some pumps have TVs now? They were showing Taylor's escape and TD throw to Holmes vs the Raiders. So now everyone sees that and thinks "wow, that QB is amazing!" Just like how we look at other QBs and wish ours was that amazing. Perspective. that's all i heard friday. how jealous the panthers fans were and other coworkers were that we had a qb who was a "gamer" taylor gets a lot of respect outside of bills fans. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PromoTheRobot Posted November 4, 2017 Share Posted November 4, 2017 1 minute ago, JaCrispy said: If we aren't able to make a mega deal for Josh Rosen in the draft, I'm all for building around Tyrod This regime expects players to earn their playing time. So if Tyrod is still starting down the road it's because McDermott thinks he's the best option. I do still think they will draft a QB. I don't think that QB will be handed the starting job. Expect Taylor to start in '18. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
boyst Posted November 4, 2017 Share Posted November 4, 2017 2 minutes ago, JaCrispy said: If we aren't able to make a mega deal for Josh Rosen in the draft, I'm all for building around Tyrod from what i have seen of rosen - very little because i don't have time for college football... we are building for a type of QB for him. i think 50% of the benjamin trade was due to planning after taylor. and i am fairly certain that we are going in to 2018 with Taylor as the starter as I had said prior to the season. i had spoke to a few people at hammers lot and again the next week in carolina that said he was fairly certain to be our 2018 starter unless he **** the bed. i expect we won't have a full time replacement for taylor until 2018 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kirby Jackson Posted November 4, 2017 Share Posted November 4, 2017 (edited) 47 minutes ago, JohnC said: First, Taylor played reasonably well in a game that he was constantly under siege. So let's put that issue aside. Anyone who criticizes his performance in that debacle of a game (from an OL standpoint) is simply being unfair. Given that you bring up a point, maybe unintended, that when you watch other games there is a distinct limitation to his game when compared to more well-rounded qbs. Taylor isn't an inexperienced qb. He has been in the league for seven years, and he has started for three years. When watching his games in comparison to more accomplished qbs it is clearly evident that his passing game is much more simplistic. In the Jets game, Josh McCown, a savvy but pedestrian qb at best, exhibited an ability to play a much fuller and sophisticated offense than Taylor could play. That to me is a fatal flaw that he will never overcome. And that is the source of my determination to find a better option at qb. The flip side is that he does things that NO other QB can. That’s why he is so polarizing. He’s extremely unconventional. Here are the 1st round QBs over the last 5 drafts: EJ, Bortles, Manziel, Bridgewater, Jameis, Mariota, Goff, Wentz, Lynch, Trubisky, Watson, and Mahomes. Outside of Wentz and Watson are any of these guys “definitely better?” It looked like Mariota and Jameis were on their way but haven’t been better this year. Goff has improved a lot and may get there. He’s way better than EJ, Bortles, Johnny, Teddy, and Lynch. Mahomes hasn’t had a chance and Trubisky hasn’t looked good. The entire point is that for everyone that thinks it’s so easy to upgrade, it isn’t. It is more likely to be worse than better. That doesn’t mean that they shouldn’t take a shot if the right guy is there. They should. We should just have the appropriate expectations. If this team dumps Tyrod and ends up with Bortles all of this progress is out the window and McDermott and Beane will be shown the door. If you are going to get a guy you can’t be wrong. Edited November 4, 2017 by Kirby Jackson 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lurker Posted November 4, 2017 Share Posted November 4, 2017 46 minutes ago, JohnC said: First, Taylor played reasonably well in a game that he was constantly under siege. So let's put that issue aside. Anyone who criticizes his performance in that debacle of a game (from an OL standpoint) is simply being unfair. Given that you bring up a point, maybe unintended, that when you watch other games there is a distinct limitation to his game when compared to more well-rounded qbs. Taylor isn't an inexperienced qb. He has been in the league for seven years, and he has started for three years. When watching his games in comparison to more accomplished qbs it is clearly evident that his passing game is much more simplistic. In the Jets game, Josh McCown, a savvy but pedestrian qb at best, exhibited an ability to play a much fuller and sophisticated offense than Taylor could play. That to me is a fatal flaw that he will never overcome. And that is the source of my determination to find a better option at qb. I agree with this. But it should be the OCs job to design an offense that allows TT to use HIS unique talents that most other NFL QBs can't touch. More read option, more moving pocket, more designed runs. He's limited in his passing tree but few QBs have his legs and movement skills. I'd love to see what Andy Reid could do with TT... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BringBackOrton Posted November 4, 2017 Share Posted November 4, 2017 (edited) 9 minutes ago, Kirby Jackson said: The flip side is that he does things that NO other QB can. That’s why he is so polarizing. He’s extremely unconventional. Here are the 1st round QBs over the last 5 drafts: EJ, Bortles, Manziel, Bridgewater, Jameis, Mariota, Goff, Wentz, Lynch, Trubisky, Watson, and Mahomes. Outside of Wentz and Watson are any of these guys “definitely better?” It looked like Mariota and Jameis were on their way but haven’t been better this year. Goff has improved a lot and may get there. He’s way better than EJ, Bortles, Johnny, Teddy, and Lynch. Mahomes hasn’t had a chance and Trubisky hasn’t looked good. The entire point is that for everyone that thinks it’s so easy to upgrade, it isn’t. It is more likely to be worse than better. That doesn’t mean that they shouldn’t take a shot if the right guy is there. They should. We should just have the appropriate expectations. If this team dumps Tyrod and ends up with Bortles all of this progress is out the window and McDermott and Beane will be shown the door. If you are going to get a guy you can’t be wrong. Yes. Jameis and Mariota for SURE. Edited November 4, 2017 by jmc12290 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kirby Jackson Posted November 4, 2017 Share Posted November 4, 2017 1 minute ago, jmc12290 said: Yes. Jameis and Mariota for SURE. You sure about that? Mariota has 7 TDs in 6 starts on a talented offense. That includes a whooping 4 Fgs against the Browns!! Two of those other games were against the Raiders and Colts defenses. That’s not good and by most accounts he’s been disappointing. We saw Jameis a week a couple of weeks ago. He is what he is, a lot of plays and a lot of mistakes. His rating, QBR, etc... are all below TT (again). We all agree that decision making is important and Jameis has struggled mightily there despite a loaded offense. I’m not saying that Tyrod is definitely better or worse. That’s what you are saying. Not surprising however from a guy that thinks Siemian is better!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BringBackOrton Posted November 4, 2017 Share Posted November 4, 2017 Just now, Kirby Jackson said: You sure about that? Mariota has 7 TDs in 6 starts on a talented offense. That includes a whooping 4 Fgs against the Browns!! Two of those other games were against the Raiders and Colts defenses. That’s not good and by most accounts he’s been disappointing. We saw Jameis a week a couple of weeks ago. He is what he is, a lot of plays and a lot of mistakes. His rating, QBR, etc... are all below TT (again). We all agree that decision making is important and Jameis has struggled mightily there despite a loaded offense. I’m not saying that Tyrod is definitely better or worse. That’s what you are saying. Not surprising however from a guy that thinks Siemian is better!! Yes. Indubitably. If you polled 32 GMs, I am very confident 32/32 would take Jameis/Mariota over TT tomorrow. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kirby Jackson Posted November 4, 2017 Share Posted November 4, 2017 Just now, jmc12290 said: Yes. Indubitably. If you polled 32 GMs, I am very confident 32/32 would take Jameis/Mariota over TT tomorrow. They probably would. Those guys were picked in the top 2 and have shown flashes. They have high ceilings and favorable contracts. That doesn’t mean that they’ve played better. Most GMs would take Trubisky too at this point. Please make an argument that he is a better player now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JaCrispy Posted November 4, 2017 Share Posted November 4, 2017 19 minutes ago, Boyst62 said: from what i have seen of rosen - very little because i don't have time for college football... we are building for a type of QB for him. i think 50% of the benjamin trade was due to planning after taylor. and i am fairly certain that we are going in to 2018 with Taylor as the starter as I had said prior to the season. i had spoke to a few people at hammers lot and again the next week in carolina that said he was fairly certain to be our 2018 starter unless he **** the bed. i expect we won't have a full time replacement for taylor until 2018 Certainly will be interesting come draft time...while I'm leaning towards Tyrod being back, I also think this FO has shown they are capable of anything. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BringBackOrton Posted November 4, 2017 Share Posted November 4, 2017 1 minute ago, Kirby Jackson said: They probably would. Those guys were picked in the top 2 and have shown flashes. They have high ceilings and favorable contracts. That doesn’t mean that they’ve played better. Most GMs would take Trubisky too at this point. Please make an argument that he is a better player now. Here I thought I was discussing Mariota and Winston? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
boyst Posted November 4, 2017 Share Posted November 4, 2017 Just now, JaCrispy said: Certainly will be interesting come draft time...while I'm leaning towards Tyrod being back, I also think this FO has shown they are capable of anything. what upgrades this team for the better more tomorrow and long term - this is where i am on the fence. an offensive lineman - a wide receiver - a qb i'm thinking if we just upgraded right guard and right tackle we'd be head and shoulders better. i don't understand why 2016 was so much better blocking and it isn't the blocking scheme. i think part of it is taylor is being coached not to move up in the pocket and run like he used to. he rolls to the outside instead of stepping up in the pocket like he used to and that isn't even with a linebacker spying him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kirby Jackson Posted November 4, 2017 Share Posted November 4, 2017 1 minute ago, jmc12290 said: Here I thought I was discussing Mariota and Winston? You said if you polled 32 GMs they would take those guys. Do you disagree that most GMs would take Trubisky today? I think that they would. That doesn’t mean that he is playing better. It’s the same situation. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BringBackOrton Posted November 4, 2017 Share Posted November 4, 2017 2 minutes ago, Kirby Jackson said: You said if you polled 32 GMs they would take those guys. Do you disagree that most GMs would take Trubisky today? I think that they would. That doesn’t mean that he is playing better. It’s the same situation. I think some would take Trubisky. Not all. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kirby Jackson Posted November 4, 2017 Share Posted November 4, 2017 Just now, jmc12290 said: I think some would take Trubisky. Not all. Would you not agree with most? How many is some over/under half? It’s definitely over. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PromoTheRobot Posted November 4, 2017 Share Posted November 4, 2017 They're better because of the media tongue bath they got before the draft. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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