Marty McFly Posted October 9, 2017 Share Posted October 9, 2017 Star players make star plays. If we have AJ Green and they have Zay Jones, we win. Gotta agree with that. I pointed that out earlier Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kelly the Dog Posted October 9, 2017 Share Posted October 9, 2017 Nelson and Jones played over their heads that year, though imo... and if we had 2011 Stevie right now, he would have gone over 100 today. Nobody could get open after Clay went down, and the D keyed on Shady. It's brutal how much we need WR help.Derek Hagen is better than anyone we have now. Zay will end up better. But Hagen was decent player. Nelson was far better. Then he got hurt. Hagen played 10 seasons. Just never was a regular. But pretty decent player Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dave mcbride Posted October 9, 2017 Share Posted October 9, 2017 As I said......."the bottom line is that he'd still be playing well if they hadn't mismanaged their WR corps". Perhaps I should have used the word "producing" instead of the term "playing well". We are in agreement on him needing yards before contact to be a high number and without the threat of the deep ball that isn't going to happen. Clearly, the most out of touch this staff was on a group was the WR corps..........why they thought bringing in 3 slot receivers (Jones, Boldin, Matthews) and no legit vertical threat........EVEN IF THEY HAD KEPT SAMMY.........is difficult to comprehend because nothing in Tyrod's past should have suggested he would excel with a bunch of posession receivers. He's actually been remarkably adaptive, IMO. Never thought he'd be completing 17 passes in a game to TE's and RB's. Agreed. The craziest thing about this season? Glass Goodwin is producing at a light years-better rate than any Bills receiver (243 yards and a 17.4 ypc), and with a worse QB. Zay Jones's most amazing stat: he has been targeted 23 times and has 5-count-'em-5 receptions. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BADOLBILZ Posted October 9, 2017 Author Share Posted October 9, 2017 Derek Hagen is better than anyone we have now. Zay will end up better. But Hagen was decent player. Nelson was far better. Then he got hurt. Hagen played 10 seasons. Just never was a regular. But pretty decent player Part of the problem with losing so much is that people just remember the bad things. I can't mention Jauron Ball without getting attacked like I am comparing them to the 2008 Lions. This WR group is REALLY BAD........I knew the stats would start coming out on it.........but when statisticians are having to go back decades of league stats to find comparable ineptitude by one teams WR position.......that's heinous. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
reginald Posted October 9, 2017 Share Posted October 9, 2017 He's "not been stellar' in the same way that Colin Brown was "not stellar" in place of Levitre at OG...............and Jordan Mills was "not stellar" at RT last year. The chasm between stellar and awful is a canyon that you are trying to write off as a mere subtlety. Who cares. Forget all this useless analysis crap. Start posting some winners. You like the points at home tonite? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BADOLBILZ Posted October 9, 2017 Author Share Posted October 9, 2017 Agreed. The craziest thing about this season? Glass Goodwin is producing at a light years-better rate than any Bills receiver (243 yards and a 17.4 ypc), and with a worse QB. Zay Jones's most amazing stat: he has been targeted 23 times and has 5-count-'em-5 receptions. I've compared him to Josh Reed. Reed looked like a Hines Ward clone as a rookie serving as a 4th option in the passing game behind Moulds, Price and Centers. They bumped him up to #2 WR........he dropped what should have been an EASY long TD from Bledsoe in the Jags game and never recovered. Went on to produce almost the same amount of yards and catches on TWICE as many targets in his second year. And that awful season makes him look like a world beater compared to what Jones is doing. He's been atrocious (aka "less than stellar" ). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wayne Cubed Posted October 9, 2017 Share Posted October 9, 2017 Not according to people that track these. And track all the teams the same, which gives a good comparison on what QBs are hurt by their WRs dropping numerous Balls. No one officially tracks drops, hence it's not an official stat. If you think the Bills have only had 4 drops previously I've got some swamp land to sell you. I know the dislike for Tyrod is strong in you but it CAN be both the WRs aren't talent and this is a very bad group AND Tyrod played poorly this week. I'm not sure why anyone would defend this WR group. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dave mcbride Posted October 9, 2017 Share Posted October 9, 2017 No one officially tracks drops, hence it's not an official stat. If you think the Bills have only had 4 drops previously I've got some swamp land to sell you. I know the dislike for Tyrod is strong in you but it CAN be both the WRs aren't talent and this is a very bad group AND Tyrod played poorly this week. I'm not sure why anyone would defend this WR group. both things can be true and are! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brianmoorman4jesus Posted October 9, 2017 Share Posted October 9, 2017 This team did the same thing last year after Sammy got hurt. There is no urgency whatsoever about the WR position. We will just trot out backup trash and lose these games to anyone that can stop the run. Its the same thing every year Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wayne Cubed Posted October 9, 2017 Share Posted October 9, 2017 both things can be true and are! I know, crazy isn't it! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SoTier Posted October 9, 2017 Share Posted October 9, 2017 The ONLY reason that I wouldn't call it the worse WR corps ever is because I'm not sure that the 1973 Buffalo Bills even had a real WR corps. That was the year that OJ Simpson ran for 2003 yards in a 14 game season. The Bills played OT Paul Costa at TE, so they obviously valued run blocking. I suppose those WRs were kind of afterthoughts, much like the WRs on the 2005 Chicago Bears when they were bulldozing their way to 11-5 and the NFCN title. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kelly the Dog Posted October 9, 2017 Share Posted October 9, 2017 The ONLY reason that I wouldn't call it the worse WR corps ever is because I'm not sure that the 1973 Buffalo Bills even had a real WR corps. That was the year that OJ Simpson ran for 2003 yards in a 14 game season. The Bills played OT Paul Costa at TE, so they obviously valued run blocking. I suppose those WRs were kind of afterthoughts, much like the WRs on the 2005 Chicago Bears when they were bulldozing their way to 11-5 and the NFCN title.73 Bills had Bob Chandler and JD Hill. Both very good. Ferguson was rookie so they never threw. Plus oj couldnt be stopped. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SoTier Posted October 9, 2017 Share Posted October 9, 2017 This team did the same thing last year after Sammy got hurt. There is no urgency whatsoever about the WR position. We will just trot out backup trash and lose these games to anyone that can stop the run. Its the same thing every year Exactly this. Last season, Watkins, Woods, and Goodwin constituted the best talent that the Bills have had a WR (you can add Clay in there as a good pass catching TE) since 2002 when Drew Bledsoe set team passing records for the season as well as for individual stats. Oh, and in the 2003 off season, the Bills dismantled that receiving corps via FA and trades just like they dismantled the 2016 receiving corps. Deja vue all over again. 73 Bills had Bob Chandler and JD Hill. Both very good. Ferguson was rookie so they never threw. Plus oj couldnt be stopped. I said wasn't sure. What everybody who remembers 1973 remembers is the runnng game. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Buffalo716 Posted October 9, 2017 Share Posted October 9, 2017 When Matthews is healthy it is NOT AS BAD as when we fielded Stevie, Donald Jones as our #2 and David Nelson as our #3... Neither of those guys could stick 5+ years in there league lol we just cut philly brown who has more yards than Jones in his career. Same with Andre Holmes. The hyperbole is crazy. It's bad but not HISTORICALLY BAD... Brandon Tate had more receiving yards than Jones Hyperbole is real Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dave mcbride Posted October 9, 2017 Share Posted October 9, 2017 (edited) 73 Bills had Bob Chandler and JD Hill. Both very good. Ferguson was rookie so they never threw. Plus oj couldnt be stopped. That same pair led a WR corps that helped Bills QBs throw for 28 TD passes in 14 games (2 per game) in 1975, which is the most in team history save for 1991. Chandler and Hill combined for 13 TD catches in 14 games that season, and OJ had over 1800 yards. The Bills were #1 in both points scored and yards that season. What happened after that season was a very Bills-y story ... When Matthews is healthy it is NOT AS BAD as when we fielded Stevie, Donald Jones as our #2 and David Nelson as our #3... Neither of those guys could stick 5+ years in there league lol we just cut philly brown who has more yards than Jones in his career. Same with Andre Holmes. The hyperbole is crazy. It's bad but not HISTORICALLY BAD... Brandon Tate had more receiving yards than Jones Hyperbole is real David Nelson was actually OK - he made some plays and was a reliable third down target. The guys the Bills are running out there now are FAR worse than Nelson was. Edited October 9, 2017 by dave mcbride Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kelly the Dog Posted October 9, 2017 Share Posted October 9, 2017 That same pair led a WR corps that helped Bills QBs throw for 28 TD passes in 14 games (2 per game) in 1975, which is the most in team history save for 1991. Chandler and Hill combined for 13 TD catches in 14 games that season, and OJ had over 1800 yards. The Bills were #1 in both points scored and yards that season. What happened after that season was a very Bills-y story ... David Nelson was actually OK - he made some plays and was a reliable third down target. The guys the Bills are running out there now are FAR worse than Nelson was. Nelson was quite good. Then he tore his acl in his knee and never recovered. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Buffalo716 Posted October 9, 2017 Share Posted October 9, 2017 (edited) That same pair led a WR corps that helped Bills QBs throw for 28 TD passes in 14 games (2 per game) in 1975, which is the most in team history save for 1991. Chandler and Hill combined for 13 TD catches in 14 games that season, and OJ had over 1800 yards. The Bills were #1 in both points scored and yards that season. What happened after that season was a very Bills-y story ... David Nelson was actually OK - he made some plays and was a reliable third down target. The guys the Bills are running out there now are FAR worse than Nelson was. I agree he was reliable. Much better than Donald Jones...But he was still an UDFA who couldn't stick in the league for over 5 years... Zay Jones SHOULD BE much better Hopefully he figures it out soon... if Zay is catching balls and Matthews is healthy it wouldn't be as big of an issue Edited October 9, 2017 by Buffalo716 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HuSeYiN_NYC Posted October 9, 2017 Share Posted October 9, 2017 Good receivers get open. There were several plays today where Tyrod had plenty of time to throw in the pocket but our WRs couldn't get any separation and the play fell apart. The take on TT is that he waits for the receiver to be WIDE open. Did you see Dalton throw to Green on the sidelines where the ball hit Green on the back shoulder? He was covered tight but if Green looked back for the ball a half second sooner, he would of caught it in very good coverage. THAT'S trusting your receiver. Not waiting for him to have a 5 yard separation. In the NFL, if the receiver is ahead of the defender (even by just a step), that's considered open n the QB should find a way to get the ball in front of that receiver. But unfortunately, TT either throws too high, throws behind, throws too low or just plain old doesn't see the receiver cuz the Oline collapsed. Every now and then he makes an amazing throw. But it's rare. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LABILLBACKER Posted October 9, 2017 Share Posted October 9, 2017 When Sammy and Woods were both out last season vs Dolphins and we played Hunter off the street, Powell, and Goodwin, I was convinced that was a low point in talent. Boy was i wrong. This group is an all-time low. ....the Bills can't find durable wr's to save their lives... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kelly the Dog Posted October 9, 2017 Share Posted October 9, 2017 I agree he was reliable. Much better than Donald Jones...But he was still an UDFA who couldn't stick in the league for over 5 years... Zay Jones SHOULD BE much better Hopefully he figures it out soon... if Zay is catching balls and Matthews is healthy it wouldn't be as big of an issue He couldn't run after he badly tore his ACL. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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