KellyToughII Posted September 5, 2017 Share Posted September 5, 2017 (edited) Peterman, to me, is the logical guy to start. This is a 5-7 win team, let the guy who will be your backup and maybe your future get you those wins if he can. Worst case Scenario is he develops into our 10+ year backup. Pat Kirwin yesterday on moving the chains said the same thing. 7 win team tops, BUT he feels under McBeane we will finally progress. He wants to see Peterman play to see what we have there. Edited September 5, 2017 by KellyToughII Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thebandit27 Posted September 5, 2017 Share Posted September 5, 2017 Very nicely said and is why many are in full suport of Peterman as the starter. You don't need to evaluate Peterman this year, since you know for a fact that you're drafting a QB next season regardless. Also, you have Peterman under contract for 3 more seasons after this; there's no hurry. What this team needs to do is evaluate everything else. The QB that is capable of making the most plays on Sundays is the guy that will give the FO the best chance to evaluate the other pieces/parts of the offense. Right now, they must believe that's Taylor, or else they'd be starting Peterman. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
grb Posted September 5, 2017 Share Posted September 5, 2017 (edited) Didn't answer the question. What is better for the long term future of the Bills. Playing a QB that is not in your future to get to 6-7 wins (ala Kyle Orton) or playing your Promising (though flawed) Rookie QB to get a full year of evaluation prior to a draft you are loaded with picks and still get to those 6-7 wins? Unless you're trying to lose, it seems to me you start the better player. I think that's what's expected in the locker room, whether the position is right tackle, middle linebacker, or quarterback. Speaking of fudging, I see you don't hold that starting the better player should be automatic, yet assume the same wins regardless. Your position would be clearer if you didn't use such a convenient dodge. Edited September 5, 2017 by grb Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thebandit27 Posted September 5, 2017 Share Posted September 5, 2017 Peterman, to me, is the logical guy to start. This is a 5-7 win team, let the guy who will be your backup and maybe your future get you those wins if he can. Worst case Scenario is he develops into our 10+ year backup. Pat Kirwin yesterday on moving the chains said the same thing. 7 win team tops, BUT he feels under McBeane we will finally progress. He wants to see Peterman play to see what we have there. How anyone can say this based on the sample space we've seen is beyond me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MAJBobby Posted September 5, 2017 Share Posted September 5, 2017 (edited) Unless you're trying to lose, it seems to me you start the better player, I think that's what's expected in the locker room, whether the position is right tackle, middle linebacker, or quarterback. Speaking of fudging, I see you don't hold that starting the better player should be automatic, yet assume the same wins regardless. Your position would be clearer if you didn't use such a convenient dodge. I don't dodge anything, With TT and Peterman I see 6-7 wins from this team at best.. Why Because they are depended on the Run and playing Defense, they can do that with BOTH QBs, now what you lose in TT running you gain in Peterman's better passing ability. See it is a wash. So again what is better for the Long term of the Franchise (which you have still yet to answer, so who is dodging). Start the guy that is not part of the long term answer? Or start the Rookie that could be? Edited September 5, 2017 by MAJBobby Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bill_with_it Posted September 5, 2017 Share Posted September 5, 2017 You don't need to evaluate Peterman this year, since you know for a fact that you're drafting a QB next season regardless. Also, you have Peterman under contract for 3 more seasons after this; there's no hurry. What this team needs to do is evaluate everything else. The QB that is capable of making the most plays on Sundays is the guy that will give the FO the best chance to evaluate the other pieces/parts of the offense. Right now, they must believe that's Taylor, or else they'd be starting Peterman. Bandit I rarely agree with you, but this is 100% on point. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BobChalmers Posted September 5, 2017 Share Posted September 5, 2017 (edited) to me it depends on whether they currently evaluate NP as a potential future franchise QB or not. Many scouting reports indicated his ceiling was a good NFL backup. They may feel that way too and if they do, they should play the QB that gives them the better chance to win now (I personally don't think they are trying to lose). If they do evaluate him as having high ceiling NFL starter potential, then it does make more sense to play him now to see what they have and accelerate his development. It also depends on their evaluation of TT. Are they done evaluating him as a future franchise QB for this team, or do they want more time to see him in this system? I think there are assumptions out there but nothing confirmed on that front. Yeah - that's pretty much the analysis. If players were robots this would be undeniable. The mitigating factor being playing to win now for the sake of the culture of the overall team. The secondary factor is if Tyrod looks as terrible operating the new offense in the regular season as he did in the preseason, how long do you wait to pull the plug? At some point TT might really not be the option that wins the most games now. Edited September 5, 2017 by BobChalmers Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
xRUSHx Posted September 5, 2017 Share Posted September 5, 2017 (edited) You don't need to evaluate Peterman this year, since you know for a fact that you're drafting a QB next season regardless. Also, you have Peterman under contract for 3 more seasons after this; there's no hurry. What this team needs to do is evaluate everything else. The QB that is capable of making the most plays on Sundays is the guy that will give the FO the best chance to evaluate the other pieces/parts of the offense. Right now, they must believe that's Taylor, or else they'd be starting Peterman. I don't understand the evaluating of other positions in how it has to do with our starting QB this season, after watching preseason it looked more like a working offense when Peterman was running it. We all feel Tyrod is done next season so are they not wasting time and energy trying to force a round peg in a square hole while taking away valuable experience time Peterman could be getting? What worries myself and others is the fact they might be still stuck in the must win now mode and think Tyrod is the saviour like the team did in the Fitz era only to fall flat on it's face and the staff fired. The best way to fix the problem is to first admit the problem is one. With keeping Tyrod are they going to aTaylor made offense again and hold our other players back from learning a new offense just so Tyrod can move the offense down the field? Peterman would gain more experience playing in my opinion so if we all know it's not a playoff season let's stop wasting time on a QB who will be gone and give that experience to a QB that will be here longer. Unless you're trying to lose, it seems to me you start the better player. I think that's what's expected in the locker room, whether the position is right tackle, middle linebacker, or quarterback. Speaking of fudging, I see you don't hold that starting the better player should be automatic, yet assume the same wins regardless. Your position would be clearer if you didn't use such a convenient dodge. Watching the preseason Peterman was the better player, going off years of starting experience Tyrod wins by defalt but going off what this staff has watched in live action this season Peterman should be on top. He deserves the start in my opinion. Edited September 5, 2017 by xRUSHx Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thebandit27 Posted September 5, 2017 Share Posted September 5, 2017 I don't understand the evaluating of other positions in how it has to do with our starting QB this season, after watching preseason it looked more like a working offense when Peterman was running it. Peterman was working against 2's and 3's...there's no comparison. We also don't know what the offensive game plan is going to look like with Taylor, the starting OL, and the starting WRs in the lineup, since we haven't seen that yet. We all feel Tyrod is done next season so are they not wasting time and energy trying to force a round peg in a square hole while taking away valuable experience time Peterman could be getting? It's not a square-peg-round-hole situation unless Tyrod looks wholly incapable when the games start to count. Surely you have to admit that the coaching staff has a better feel for who's more capable today based on what they've seen day-in/day-out in practice than we do based on preseason. What worries myself and others is the fact they might be still stuck in the must win now mode and think Tyrod is the saviour like the team did in the Fitz era only to fall flat on it's face and the staff fired. The best way to fix the problem is to first admit the problem is one. Watching the preseason Peterman was the better player, going off years of starting experience Tyrod wins but going off what this staff has watched in live action this season Peterman should be on top. He deserves the start in my opinion. We have no reason to suspect that they're stuck in win-now mode. Also, if we're only going on what happened this preseason, then Jonathan Williams should be the starting RB over McCoy. He's not...because experience, track record, and regular-season body of work matter. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Big Gun Posted September 5, 2017 Share Posted September 5, 2017 Peterman was working against 2's and 3's...there's no comparison. We also don't know what the offensive game plan is going to look like with Taylor, the starting OL, and the starting WRs in the lineup, since we haven't seen that yet. Except for when he wasn't. See game 3 against Baltimore. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
xRUSHx Posted September 5, 2017 Share Posted September 5, 2017 (edited) Peterman was working against 2's and 3's...there's no comparison. We also don't know what the offensive game plan is going to look like with Taylor, the starting OL, and the starting WRs in the lineup, since we haven't seen that yet. It's not a square-peg-round-hole situation unless Tyrod looks wholly incapable when the games start to count. Surely you have to admit that the coaching staff has a better feel for who's more capable today based on what they've seen day-in/day-out in practice than we do based on preseason. We have no reason to suspect that they're stuck in win-now mode. Also, if we're only going on what happened this preseason, then Jonathan Williams should be the starting RB over McCoy. He's not...because experience, track record, and regular-season body of work matter. Do you think this offensive scheme should be what we expect and that is what we seen in the preseason or do you think it will be more Lynn like in Taylor made? Putting into perspective they either have the entire offense learn the new scheme now and only have to teach a new QB next season this scheme or do they wait and teach the new scheme next season to all the players and the new QB? I would think they would want to find out if the current players can play in this new scheme not see them replay last seasons scheme in Lynns that worked for Tyrod. If they are continuing with Lynn's scheme why didn't they just stay with Lynn and hire a new DC? Seams to me they need to run the new scheme and whomever can't hack it needs to go. Did you just try to say that replacing a sure fire HOF RB that has been the best the league has to offer with a rookie is the same as replacing a 2 year starting QB that has never been good enough with a rookie? Wow Edited September 5, 2017 by xRUSHx Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SlimShady'sSpaceForce Posted September 5, 2017 Share Posted September 5, 2017 (edited) I like them but no more than Kelce and Tyreek Hill. That's one of the group's considered low near us. The Jets are bad. The Bills pass catchers are right near the bottom of the league. It would be tough to debate otherwise. I've asked for opinions and got "I don't know." We don't need hindsight to evaluate it. All I or we can do is hope for the best, no matter what position the player is for the Bills. I'm talking about this. You twisted my words then got defensive calling someone mrs taylor when they corrected you . I have never stated your view on tyrod just clarifying my post since you didn't understand it the first time did you not see my post where I said I was incorrect? let it go. Edited September 5, 2017 by ShadyBillsFan Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mikemac2001 Posted September 5, 2017 Share Posted September 5, 2017 All I or we can do is hope for the best, no matter what position the player is for the Bills. did you not see my posy where I said I was incorrect? let it go. u kept arguing about something different which I wasn't even arguing about. That's what I was trying to tell you Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Figster Posted September 5, 2017 Share Posted September 5, 2017 (edited) You don't need to evaluate Peterman this year, since you know for a fact that you're drafting a QB next season regardless. Also, you have Peterman under contract for 3 more seasons after this; there's no hurry. What this team needs to do is evaluate everything else. The QB that is capable of making the most plays on Sundays is the guy that will give the FO the best chance to evaluate the other pieces/parts of the offense. Right now, they must believe that's Taylor, or else they'd be starting Peterman. To me its almost like instant replay, do we see enough to overturn the decision. In my opinion we do and perhaps Dennison and McD feel the same way, but it makes no sense telegraphing that line of thinking to the opposition not just for this Sunday, next Sunday as well in my humble opinion bandit. Edited September 5, 2017 by Figster Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SlimShady'sSpaceForce Posted September 5, 2017 Share Posted September 5, 2017 to me it depends on whether they currently evaluate NP as a potential future franchise QB or not. Many scouting reports indicated his ceiling was a good NFL backup. They may feel that way too and if they do, they should play the QB that gives them the better chance to win now (I personally don't think they are trying to lose). If they do evaluate him as having high ceiling NFL starter potential, then it does make more sense to play him now to see what they have and accelerate his development. It also depends on their evaluation of TT. Are they done evaluating him as a future franchise QB for this team, or do they want more time to see him in this system? I think there are assumptions out there but nothing confirmed on that front. Even if its for 2 seasons does he have to be a franchise guy? Going with a QB drafted in 2018 - He could be the bridge QB until the 18 pick is ready. Maybe I'm just bored of the run and don't pass mentality left over from Rex and Roman. If the Ginger Hammer is correct and all positions are being evaluated. That would include regular season games and not just camp bodies. You don't need to evaluate Peterman this year, since you know for a fact that you're drafting a QB next season regardless. Also, you have Peterman under contract for 3 more seasons after this; there's no hurry. What this team needs to do is evaluate everything else. The QB that is capable of making the most plays on Sundays is the guy that will give the FO the best chance to evaluate the other pieces/parts of the offense. Right now, they must believe that's Taylor, or else they'd be starting Peterman. I'd link to see hard evidence of that bandit. FWIW - The only hurry I have is ending the drought. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DCBongo Posted September 5, 2017 Share Posted September 5, 2017 I'm old school, this is TT's team and if he can play, he starts. If he cannot, then Peterman should get the nod and if it turns into Brady/Bledsoe then so be it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BillsfanAZ Posted September 5, 2017 Share Posted September 5, 2017 I think the Bills go with Tyrod if he is healthy. Peterman looked good in preseason but the regular season is a different level. The only way Peterman plays this season is because of injury or later in the season if the Bills are out of playoff contention. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
billsfan60 Posted September 5, 2017 Share Posted September 5, 2017 to me it depends on whether they currently evaluate NP as a potential future franchise QB or not. Many scouting reports indicated his ceiling was a good NFL backup. They may feel that way too and if they do, they should play the QB that gives them the better chance to win now (I personally don't think they are trying to lose). If they do evaluate him as having high ceiling NFL starter potential, then it does make more sense to play him now to see what they have and accelerate his development. It also depends on their evaluation of TT. Are they done evaluating him as a future franchise QB for this team, or do they want more time to see him in this system? I think there are assumptions out there but nothing confirmed on that front. Don't even try to be this reasonable. It'll trash a perfectly good circular argument. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
grb Posted September 5, 2017 Share Posted September 5, 2017 (edited) ......what you lose in TT running you gain in Peterman's better passing ability. See it is a wash. Three points : The "better passing ability" you saw in Peterman's up&down preseason (and training camp) must involve a hefty amount of wishful thinking. I also note this "better passing ability" somehow doesn't make Peterman the out&out starter and barely compensates for Taylor's rushing yards - which TT's detractors have always insisted were irrelevant anyway. You'd think "better passing ability" would count for more, particularly given the NFL is a passing league (as we're reminded so many times). My opinion? Peterman's best chance at being a long-term starter is to sit awhile - just like Taylor did. Indeed, the two are very similar : Both likeable and very easy to root for, both trying to prove the draft-day naysayers wrong, both wanting to show there are intangibles to playing QB beyond all those scouting reports and cliches. If you put Peterman out there now (with this team) I think it's likely he'll implode, and his career will effectively be over before it barely gets started. Which brings me to my third point : After ten minutes of Peterman starting, a sizable percentage of Bills' fans will write him off with stone-cold contempt, moving on to fantasies of their '18 draft dreamboat. Why not stick with TT? You're already used to despising him. Edited September 5, 2017 by grb Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Figster Posted September 5, 2017 Share Posted September 5, 2017 (edited) Don't even try to be this reasonable. It'll trash a perfectly good circular argument. Peterman has played the way you would expect a veteran starting NFL QB to play while learning a new system/players in my humble opinion. Edited September 5, 2017 by Figster Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts