bmur66 Posted January 7, 2017 Share Posted January 7, 2017 Z. Brown played very well in games but terrible in others by my observation. Maybe he was hurt or something I don't know but when he was bad, he was bad. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thebandit27 Posted January 7, 2017 Share Posted January 7, 2017 Z. Brown played very well in games but terrible in others by my observation. Maybe he was hurt or something I don't know but when he was bad, he was bad. He had some bad blown assignments in coverage, but tackling was hardly the issue with him; he finished 2nd in the NFL to Bobby Wagner in total tackles. http://www.nfl.com/stats/categorystats?tabSeq=0&statisticCategory=TACKLES&conference=null&season=2016&seasonType=REG Frankly I don't think he deserved to be an all-pro, but numbers often drive the vote. And if he expects an all-pro salary next year, he's going to have to get it someplace else. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PO16FFS Posted January 7, 2017 Share Posted January 7, 2017 Since day one, a ton of posters on this board have found and and every reason to dislike Gilmore. His reaction to being drafted, injuries, tackling, "heart," allowing one catch, whatever. You're all going to be very disappointed next year when he's gone and Ronald Darby is getting absolutely roasted by opposing #1s Never new Hogan was a #1! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
filthymcnasty08 Posted January 7, 2017 Share Posted January 7, 2017 Bills fans thought process on if a player is good: Does he make big money? Yes. - He is not good No - All-star, blue collar guy, embraces the city of Buffalo. Wish it wasn't the case but....TRUTH Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rant_and_go Posted January 7, 2017 Share Posted January 7, 2017 (edited) I was reliably informed that Stephon Gilmore is crap. How can these stats be? Erik must be lying On a serious note, let me his rattle off his full stats (courtesy of PFF). Also, a comparison to 2015. 2015 (12 games) - 92 targets, 50 receptions (54.3% completion rate), 666 yards (13.3 YPC), 190 YAC, 5 TDs allowed, 3 INT, 6 PD. 2016 (15 games) - 69 targets (nice!), 40 receptions (58% completion rate), 627 yards (15.7 YPC), 188 YAC, 2 TDs allowed, 5 INT, 7 PD. They should start keeping stats of ducking under oncoming ball carriers. Defense really needed leadership. Gilmore could've stepped up. He wilted. He's also been getting burned since day 1. Edited January 7, 2017 by r.harvey Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thebandit27 Posted January 7, 2017 Share Posted January 7, 2017 They should start keeping stats of ducking under oncoming ball carriers. Defense really needed leadership. Gilmore could've stepped up. He wilted. He's also been getting burned since day 1. 2 TDs allowed and a 67.7 passer rating against #facts Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
reddogblitz Posted January 7, 2017 Share Posted January 7, 2017 So you want a DC that prefers corners that can tackle to corners that can cover? Not no, but HELL NO. I want corner backs that can cover AND tackle. If you play defense you HAVE TO tackle. It's not rocket surgery. Somebody like Nate Clements for example. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John from Riverside Posted January 7, 2017 Share Posted January 7, 2017 Z. Brown played very well in games but terrible in others by my observation. Maybe he was hurt or something I don't know but when he was bad, he was bad. Or maybe the damn defense started playing bad.....the rumors about RR letting his brother handle everything and screwing it up are very concerning Not no, but HELL NO. I want corner backs that can cover AND tackle. If you play defense you HAVE TO tackle. It's not rocket surgery. Somebody like Nate Clements for example. Or Antoine WInfield Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thebandit27 Posted January 7, 2017 Share Posted January 7, 2017 Not no, but HELL NO. I want corner backs that can cover AND tackle. If you play defense you HAVE TO tackle. It's not rocket surgery. Somebody like Nate Clements for example. That's like saying that you want an edge rusher to play well in coverage--it's not his primary (or even secondary) role. CBs need to cover first--tackling comes at a distant second. Clements was an okay tackler, not great, and he wasn't in Gilmore's league in terms of man coverage. He had half of a very good season. And so again I'll ask: of the corners that are in Gilmore's echelon of coverage ability, which are the good tacklers? Bottom line: NFL CBs get paid to change cover; tackling ability is a bonus. If you only want to pay guys that are elite in both areas, then be prepared to watch every corner walk out the door. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bill from NYC Posted January 7, 2017 Share Posted January 7, 2017 The Bills will certainly miss him if he moves on.They sure will! If Gilmore leaves (perish the thought) the Bills might not finish at .500!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
3rdand12 Posted January 7, 2017 Share Posted January 7, 2017 Zach Brown won't be here next year and he can't tackle either yes. those statements should be sent right to Overdorf. so we can bring him back! oops he made all pro. looks like he is better them we hoped he was He had some bad blown assignments in coverage, but tackling was hardly the issue with him; he finished 2nd in the NFL to Bobby Wagner in total tackles. http://www.nfl.com/stats/categorystats?tabSeq=0&statisticCategory=TACKLES&conference=null&season=2016&seasonType=REG Frankly I don't think he deserved to be an all-pro, but numbers often drive the vote. And if he expects an all-pro salary next year, he's going to have to get it someplace else. why closing doors before they need to be? That's like saying that you want an edge rusher to play well in coverage--it's not his primary (or even secondary) role. CBs need to cover first--tackling comes at a distant second. Clements was an okay tackler, not great, and he wasn't in Gilmore's league in terms of man coverage. He had half of a very good season. And so again I'll ask: of the corners that are in Gilmore's echelon of coverage ability, which are the good tacklers? Bottom line: NFL CBs get paid to change cover; tackling ability is a bonus. If you only want to pay guys that are elite in both areas, then be prepared to watch every corner walk out the door. thats absurd if true Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
reddogblitz Posted January 7, 2017 Share Posted January 7, 2017 (edited) And so again I'll ask: of the corners that are in Gilmore's echelon of coverage ability, which are the good tacklers? I'm not exactly sure what "echelon" Gilmore is in (high "echelon" guys don't get torched by Marshall and Fitz), but I'll humor you're insinuation it is high. I got 2 for ya. Revis and Sherman. Edited January 7, 2017 by reddogblitz Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boatdrinks Posted January 7, 2017 Share Posted January 7, 2017 So you want a DC that prefers corners that can tackle to corners that can cover? Hey, idea of the year: let's play Zach Brown at corner, since tackling is what we REALLY need on the boundary! Let's hope our next HC doesn't think that way. No, I want coaches that like guys that are good. That means you cover when asked, make a good form tackle when you need to , and generally hate to give up a yard . You know, actually play defense and don't think you are only there to do one thing, or that the play stops before the whistle blows. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GoBills808 Posted January 7, 2017 Share Posted January 7, 2017 Not sure what the Gilmore pariah club is seeing TBH, he's a very solid player. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thebandit27 Posted January 7, 2017 Share Posted January 7, 2017 (edited) I'm not exactly sure what "echelon" Gilmore is in (high "echelon" guys don't get torched by Marshall and Fitz), but I'll humor you're insinuation it is high. I got 2 for ya. Revis and Sherman. Okay then: who had the most solo tackles of the 3 this year? Who had the most INTs? Oh, and in regards to top corners not getting beat by certain receivers... Sherman sucks--Woods abused him on national TV. Revis sucks--Goodwin torched him on national TV. Even average corners have no business getting beaten by those 2 bums See how easy it is? No, I want coaches that like guys that are good. That means you cover when asked, make a good form tackle when you need to , and generally hate to give up a yard . You know, actually play defense and don't think you are only there to do one thing, or that the play stops before the whistle blows. Ah, so a coach only qualifies if he thinks Gilmore is not good? Well, I'm exceptionally glad that you aren't leading the coaching search! Not sure what the Gilmore pariah club is seeing TBH, he's a very solid player. It's simple: they want a corner that never allows a completion and never misses a tackle. Not a bum like Sherman who can't even cover Robert Woods. Edited January 7, 2017 by thebandit27 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NoSaint Posted January 7, 2017 Share Posted January 7, 2017 (edited) Okay then: who had the most solo tackles of the 3 this year? Who had the most INTs? Oh, and in regards to top corners not getting beat by certain receivers... Sherman sucks--Woods abused him on national TV. Revis sucks--Goodwin torched him on national TV. Even average corners have no business getting beaten by those 2 bums See how easy it is? We've had this chat a dozen times if not more but... Corner is one of those rare positions we have been so spoiled with here. I think a lot of fans forget what the base line for what average talent is out there. And that shut down corners don't exist either. Also I don't think I know another position where the expectation is revis. Like, does anyone demand that you get Brady or ray Lewis or ed reed in order to have a good player at their respective positions? It's always straight to revis with corner discussion Edited January 7, 2017 by NoSaint Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VABills Posted January 7, 2017 Share Posted January 7, 2017 I was reliably informed that Stephon Gilmore is crap. How can these stats be? Erik must be lying On a serious note, let me his rattle off his full stats (courtesy of PFF). Also, a comparison to 2015. 2015 (12 games) - 92 targets, 50 receptions (54.3% completion rate), 666 yards (13.3 YPC), 190 YAC, 5 TDs allowed, 3 INT, 6 PD. 2016 (15 games) - 69 targets (nice!), 40 receptions (58% completion rate), 627 yards (15.7 YPC), 188 YAC, 2 TDs allowed, 5 INT, 7 PD. Terrible. Robert James had a season where he gave up no TDs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thebandit27 Posted January 7, 2017 Share Posted January 7, 2017 The "great tackling" Richard Sherman ladies and gentlemen: http://m.imgur.com/gallery/TzDcw8H Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
reddogblitz Posted January 7, 2017 Share Posted January 7, 2017 It's simple: they want a corner that never allows a completion and never misses a tackle. Exaggerate much? I just want a CB that when he has the opportunity to STOP a drive and get the D off the field actually makes a tackle. Not either run away or dives at thier feet. I saw Gilmore keep the D on the field like this several times this year. Can you name any other CBs in Gilmore's echelon that are worse tacklers? His coverage skills are decent, but if he gives up 1st downs, TDs, and big gainers because he's afraid to tackle, it takes away from the benefits we get from his coverage ability. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boatdrinks Posted January 7, 2017 Share Posted January 7, 2017 Okay then: who had the most solo tackles of the 3 this year? Who had the most INTs? Oh, and in regards to top corners not getting beat by certain receivers... Sherman sucks--Woods abused him on national TV. Revis sucks--Goodwin torched him on national TV. Even average corners have no business getting beaten by those 2 bums See how easy it is? Ah, so a coach only qualifies if he thinks Gilmore is not good? Well, I'm exceptionally glad that you aren't leading the coaching search! It's simple: they want a corner that never allows a completion and never misses a tackle. Not a bum like Sherman who can't even cover Robert Woods. One game does not a player make. If you think Gilmore plays with a fraction of the fire and heart of Sherman, well the Stephon colored glasses are permanently affixed. Not sure of the reason for the Gilmore love affair, but whatever floats yer boat Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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