GunnerBill Posted December 29, 2015 Share Posted December 29, 2015 Agree completely. I think it is where most sensible fans are. There are some to the left shouting "pay the man" some to right shouting "he sucks" and a lot of sensible folk in the middle saying "so far so good - can he take the next step? Let's wait and see." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BuffaloMatt Posted December 29, 2015 Share Posted December 29, 2015 Yawn. 13 pages. Wins. Only stat that matters. Think about it. Wait For It. . . . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Agent 91 Posted December 29, 2015 Share Posted December 29, 2015 (edited) Holcomb is just an example of how you can both be a bum and produce a 300 yard day. There is a litany of such QBs.How many did orton have? The other 4: Gil Brandt @Gil_Brandt 23s23 seconds ago Gil Brandt Retweeted Joe D'Agostino Steve Young (3x) Russell Wilson (3x) Mike Vick (1x) RG3 (1x) Long story short. Mixed bag lol Edited December 29, 2015 by Agent 91 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
3rdand12 Posted December 30, 2015 Share Posted December 30, 2015 First was responding to PTR... Second I want TT to succeed and hope he does. I blame a lot on Rman. The point was there was not a single comeback this year and the Bills blew the KC game, should have beaten both NE & Philly too. The issues these games is Roman has a game plan (my opinion) that is predicated on the team always being ahead and no way of coming back. And way too many 3 and outs. Or the team really isnt that good at executing yet. But agreed the 3 an outs are what affects the w/l I agree with this. But not being able to throw with a shortened field has, in my opinion, hurt us on numerous occasions. we are better than last year in the redzone aren't we ? Agree completely. The middle of the field reads and throws are going to be on the O line and moving the pocket . That is something that could come this offseason under Roman and Kromer working TT and the fat kids it can be done. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
moshermw Posted December 30, 2015 Share Posted December 30, 2015 TT did not win a game in the 4ht qtr except the Titans. True. And disappointing cuz there were definitely shots. He also did not choke/int away any leads in the 4th .. macrocosm of the game manager/less than 30 throw concept. So how was it that the Bills weren't ahead in the 4th so often .... ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dibs Posted December 30, 2015 Share Posted December 30, 2015 ......And before you scoff at TT being young, he is the 3rd youngest NFL QB with 3 or more starts. This is not correct. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Billsfan1972 Posted December 30, 2015 Share Posted December 30, 2015 TT did not win a game in the 4ht qtr except the Titans. True. And disappointing cuz there were definitely shots. He also did not choke/int away any leads in the 4th .. macrocosm of the game manager/less than 30 throw concept. So how was it that the Bills weren't ahead in the 4th so often .... ? They were ahead and comfortably in 6 of their wins. Outside the first NE game and vs. Jax they scored very few fourth quarter points. And yes I do remember the Houston game (was there) and the winning td. They were never beiind the entire game and a blown coverage led to the winning TD (over the middle and YAC too). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maury Ballstein Posted December 30, 2015 Share Posted December 30, 2015 Tyrod beat the Titans by scoring 14 whole points. Can we stop citing that game as the good one for Tyrod ? Talleywacker and the fins dropped 40 on the Titans following week. Qb purgatory, might still be there. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Billsfan1972 Posted December 30, 2015 Share Posted December 30, 2015 The 300 yard argument is really very simple. The Bills will end the season .500 at best. They have lost 8 games and let's forget the defense for now as we are talking TT. He was the QB for 6 of those losses. 300 yards means first downs and the ball moving. The Bills lost those games being behind the entire second half (tied vs. Phil) in all the games and never took the lead (EJ & Jax notwithstanding). Think about that.... Behind and never ahead vs. NE x 2, Washington, NYG, Phil, KC and still no big throwing #'s. When someone posts about Russel Wilson as a comparative, and their run oriented offense, they forget that Seattle has won 11-13 games/yr not 6-9 and seldom came from behind.... I will repeat for now I blame Roman not TT. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GunnerBill Posted December 30, 2015 Share Posted December 30, 2015 When someone posts about Russel Wilson as a comparative, and their run oriented offense, they forget that Seattle has won 11-13 games/yr not 6-9 and seldom came from behind.... I will repeat for now I blame Roman not TT. But the difference is Seattle were behind less - so see the defense is relevant to the conversation. And I am not total sold on Tyrod by the way... but Tyrod could have been the QB who took us to the playoffs this year if the defense had held up its end of the bargain. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Billsfan1972 Posted December 30, 2015 Share Posted December 30, 2015 But the difference is Seattle were behind less - so see the defense is relevant to the conversation. And I am not total sold on Tyrod by the way... but Tyrod could have been the QB who took us to the playoffs this year if the defense had held up its end of the bargain. And I'm saying the same thing. However Russel has led Seatte back multiple times and the team wins. We know about the D issues. The point I made is and I blame Roman is that the offense looks the same whether ahead or behind. The only time it looked different as when it was up 30 points and went to run mode vs. Miami x 2 & Indy. Heck down 21-0 to Washington and there was urgency. Oh and throw the ball to Watkins!!!!!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thebandit27 Posted December 30, 2015 Share Posted December 30, 2015 Tyrod beat the Titans by scoring 14 whole points. Can we stop citing that game as the good one for Tyrod ? Talleywacker and the fins dropped 40 on the Titans following week. Qb purgatory, might still be there. Nobody said it was his good game; many said it was an example of his ability to take the team on his back and win in the 4th, and it was. The purgatory comment STILL references draft position, not player talent Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GunnerBill Posted December 30, 2015 Share Posted December 30, 2015 And I'm saying the same thing. However Russel has led Seatte back multiple times and the team wins. We know about the D issues. The point I made is and I blame Roman is that the offense looks the same whether ahead or behind. The only time it looked different as when it was up 30 points and went to run mode vs. Miami x 2 & Indy. Heck down 21-0 to Washington and there was urgency. Oh and throw the ball to Watkins!!!!!!! Wilson wasn't leading them to loads of 4th quarter come backs in year one. There was one maybe 2... Tyrod has one. The offense is built this way (right down to their choice of a guards renowned for their run blocking more than their pass blocking) because they expected the defense to be better. Hard to suddenly realise after 4 games you D sucks and now you have got to install a load more passing routes than those you installed in pre-season. If it is on anyone you are right to blame the coaches... but I am sure when Rex sat down with Roman and told him what sort of offense he wanted it was pretty similar to the one Roman has provided him QB'd by TT. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Billsfan1972 Posted December 30, 2015 Share Posted December 30, 2015 Nobody said it was his good game; many said it was an example of his ability to take the team on his back and win in the 4th, and it was. The purgatory comment STILL references draft position, not player talent The best game of the year for the D????? Oh yea and Roman opening up the playbook and 17 passes for Tyrod and 109 yards passing (yes he was good on the ground) against a bad defense. Let me repeat I blame Roman...... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thebandit27 Posted December 30, 2015 Share Posted December 30, 2015 The best game of the year for the D????? Oh yea and Roman opening up the playbook and 17 passes for Tyrod and 109 yards passing (yes he was good on the ground) against a bad defense. Let me repeat I blame Roman...... I don't see what point you're attempting to refute Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Santana Posted December 30, 2015 Share Posted December 30, 2015 I don't have a problem with anyone not liking Tyrod Taylor, you're entitled to your opinion and I respect that. The problem I have is that some people aren't being fair in respect to his actual playing time. This is his first year as a QB in the NFL. Here's a look at some of the other successful QB stats from their early playing days just to compare to. Tyrod Taylor's First 13 games Year Team G Comp Att % Yds Y/G Y/A 300+ TD Int Rush Yds Y/G Avg TD 100+ Lost 2015 BUF 13 224 352 63.6 2853 219.5 8.1 0 20 6 94 517 39.8 5.5 3 0 1 Tom Brady's First 16 games Year Team G Comp Att % Yds Y/G Y/A 300+ TD Int Rush Yds Y/G Avg TD 100+ Lost 2000 NE 1 1 3 33.3 6 6.0 2.0 0 0 0 0 0 .0 .0 0 0 0 2001 NE 15 264 413 63.9 2843 189.5 6.9 1 18 12 36 43 2.9 1.2 0 0 3 Aaron Rodgers first 23 games Year Team G Comp Att % Yds Y/G Y/A 300+ TD Int Rush Yds Y/G Avg TD 100+ Lost 2005 GB 3 9 16 56.3 65 21.7 4.1 0 0 1 2 7 2.3 3.5 0 0 2 2006 GB 2 6 15 40.0 46 23.0 3.1 0 0 0 2 11 5.5 5.5 0 0 1 2007 GB 2 20 28 71.4 218 109.0 7.8 0 1 0 7 29 14.5 4.1 0 0 0 2008 GB 16 341 536 63.6 4038 252.4 7.5 4 28 13 56 207 12.9 3.7 4 0 3 Ben Roethlisberger's first 2 seasons Year Team G Comp Att % Yds Y/G Y/A 300+ TD Int Rush Yds Y/G Avg TD 100+ Lost 2004 PIT 14 196 295 66.4 2621 187.2 8.9 1 17 11 56 144 10.3 2.6 1 0 2 2005 PIT 13 168 268 62.7 2385 183.5 8.9 1 17 9 31 69 5.3 2.2 3 0 1 Peyton Manning's first 2 seasons Year Team G Comp Att % Yds Y/G Y/A 300+ TD Int Rush Yds Y/G Avg TD 100+ Lost 1999 IND 16 332 534 62.2 4141 258.8 7.8 2 26 15 35 73 4.6 2.1 2 0 3 2000 IND 16 357 571 62.5 4413 275.8 7.7 5 33 15 37 116 7.3 3.1 1 0 2 I just think it's fair to say that as Bills fans we shouldn't be that upset with the production we are getting out of Tyrod. I mean we've had some terrible QB play since Drew Bledsoe left just be patient. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PromoTheRobot Posted December 30, 2015 Author Share Posted December 30, 2015 (edited) But the bills had the balland in the 4th and never accomplished anything.That is a meaningless blanket statement. You have to break down every play in the 4th to determine how each game was lost. Did TT not make plays or did other factors play into it? Edited December 30, 2015 by PromoTheRobot Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Billsfan1972 Posted December 30, 2015 Share Posted December 30, 2015 (edited) Wilson wasn't leading them to loads of 4th quarter come backs in year one. There was one maybe 2... Tyrod has one. The offense is built this way (right down to their choice of a guards renowned for their run blocking more than their pass blocking) because they expected the defense to be better. Hard to suddenly realise after 4 games you D sucks and now you have got to install a load more passing routes than those you installed in pre-season. If it is on anyone you are right to blame the coaches... but I am sure when Rex sat down with Roman and told him what sort of offense he wanted it was pretty similar to the one Roman has provided him QB'd by TT. Sure about that????? I only count 4 in year one and both playoff games (going ahead with :28 left vs. Atlanta, I'll call a comeback)...... I'd say that was impressive for a True Rookie..... In tear 2, 3 games they came back in the fourth and also beat SF in the playoffs. That is a meaningless blanket statement. You have to break down every play in the 4th to determine how each game was lost. Did TT not make plays or did other factors play into it? Why don't you??? Pretty obvious that the Bills did nothing in the 4th quarters of close games his year. And then let's not forget the 2 minute offense that was putrid. This as said I'm laying at the feet of Roman, but these are facts. Edited December 30, 2015 by Billsfan1972 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Big Gun Posted December 30, 2015 Share Posted December 30, 2015 (edited) The 300 yard argument is really very simple. The Bills will end the season .500 at best. They have lost 8 games and let's forget the defense for now as we are talking TT. He was the QB for 6 of those losses. 300 yards means first downs and the ball moving. The Bills lost those games being behind the entire second half (tied vs. Phil) in all the games and never took the lead (EJ & Jax notwithstanding). Think about that.... Behind and never ahead vs. NE x 2, Washington, NYG, Phil, KC and still no big throwing #'s. When someone posts about Russel Wilson as a comparative, and their run oriented offense, they forget that Seattle has won 11-13 games/yr not 6-9 and seldom came from behind.... I will repeat for now I blame Roman not TT. The bolded is very telling. Whether it is Roman or Tyrod or both, that needs to be worked on. Roman only draws up he plays, it's up to TT to execute them. I have to believe there are guys running routes every single play, it's up to TT to get the ball to them. If the rest of the league is going for 300 yards and a couple TDs a bunch of times every single week and everyone is playing each other yet our guy can't do it against the same competition, it's on him. Can't keep blaming our guys as being covered, or our OC stinks, or our defense stinks, or injuries etc. Backup scrubs are doing it weekly, our guy needs to be better, especially being behind late in games. Any QB would be racking up stats, not TT though. It's a throwing league and that isn't going to change anytime soon. Edited December 30, 2015 by old school Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hapless Bills Fan Posted December 30, 2015 Share Posted December 30, 2015 Roman only draws up he plays, it's up to TT to execute them. I have to believe there are guys running routes every single play, it's up to TT to get the ball to them. There are guys running routes every single play, and usually at least one of them is open. Some of the play calling is puzzling, especially on third down. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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