Former players convinced me that Rex's D will start clicking

[YoloinOhio]

That's right. We just need to be patient. We've waited 15 years, what's another 1 or 2?

well they didn't want us to get culture shock, so it's a gradual thing

[Over 29 years of fanhood]

I was listening to Jason Taylor on Sirius NFL Radio today and a Bills fan called in and asked about Rex and his D.

 

Taylor said that of all the coaches he ever had, it took him the longest period of time, most work, and most study to figure out what he was supposed to do in Rex's D. It was an enormous adjustment and it is extremely complicated. Eventually he got it but it took some time.

 

This meshes with things other guys have said about Rex's defense: it's complicated, relies on a ton of new terms and communication, as well as a bunch of unique concepts. At first it's very difficult to grasp. But eventually once the players get it things start clicking.

 

I think this is what we are seeing with this D. Rex did not forget how to coach defense. The DL did not forget how to pass rush. It's just going to take some time for this thing to start humming.

 

BTW, that vaunted Schwartz defense got shredded by Brady and couldn't stop the Raiders when it mattered too. Let's not pretend that last year's defense was some sort of iron curtain.

 

I still believe in Rex and I EXPECT to see the defense improve tremendously over the 2nd half of the season.

I believe they are delusional and that there is a mismatch between the personnel and the scheme. the 4 guys up front are great at penetrating and creating havoc, 3 are pro bowlers. Having them read and adjust and drop into coverage and line up on wr's while teams are running no huddle on you is asinine unless you are so talent deficient you have to hocus pocus your way to a win...

 

It looks a lot to me like Baltimore continued to be a dominant d when Rex left after 2008

 

http://m.pfref.com/m?p=XXcoachesXXHarbJo0.htm&t=1

 

and the jets best year defensively, his first year there (which contradicts the thoery it its just hard to learn) was followed by a steady decent to the bottom third in the nfl...

 

http://m.pfref.com/m?p=XXcoachesXXRyanRe0.htm&t=1

 

Maybe we all got duped into this defensive genius mantra, because as always, bills fans have that eternal optimism...

Edited November 5, 2015 by over 20 years of fanhood

[3rdand12]

well they didn't want us to get culture shock, so it's a gradual thing

already happening. first year that everything really did look Roses. so much talent and much more, new day dawning and Playoffs if not SB!

lay the Patriots and all hope is deflated. or worse, a vacuum is created and ever since, fandom has gone all haywire again.

We cant barely handle hope, much less Playoffs.

: )

I believe they are delusional and that there is a mismatch between the personnel and the scheme. the 4 guys up front are great at penetrating and creating havoc, 3 are pro bowlers. Having them read and adjust and drop into coverage and line up on wr's while teams are running no huddle on you is asinine unless you are so talent deficient you have to hocus pocus your way to a win...

 

It looks a lot to me like Baltimore continued to be a dominant d when Rex left after 2008

 

http://m.pfref.com/m?p=XXcoachesXXHarbJo0.htm&t=1

 

and the jets best year defensively, his first year there (which contradicts the thoery it its just hard to learn) was followed by a steady decent to the bottom third in the nfl...

 

http://m.pfref.com/m?p=XXcoachesXXRyanRe0.htm&t=1

 

Maybe we all got duped into this defensive genius mantra, because as always, bills fans have that eternal optimism...

My admission was free. just here to see how it turns out. great storyline so far honestly, lotsa drama and intrigue. a veritable " The Waltons"

Edited November 5, 2015 by 3rdand12

[dayman]

When you have a young, average or even good player you can ask him to do anything.

 

When you have 1/4 billion on the front 4 as a unit...they know what they were paid to do. They were paid to do the specific things they have done while building their career to this point of awesomeness. When you ask them to do bunch of other random **** they have never done at this point in their career/status...it may not work.

 

Rex's scheme will click...but we really weren't built for it. Rex needs a bunch of average/good flexible guys who will run through a wall for him and he'll turn them into probowlers. Not sure Rex knows what to do with our guys.

[Bills Fan of St Augustine]

I'm not buying it. The OL still can't block. We pay huge money for the DL to hold off OL so mediocre LBs can make plays... or not. We take way to many penalties some of which are just stupid like the taunting calls and other unsportsmanlike calls. It's not just learning a new scheme. Discipline is lacking, attitude is poor, professionalism is absent.

[Beef Jerky]

I believe they are delusional and that there is a mismatch between the personnel and the scheme. the 4 guys up front are great at penetrating and creating havoc, 3 are pro bowlers. Having them read and adjust and drop into coverage and line up on wr's while teams are running no huddle on you is asinine unless you are so talent deficient you have to hocus pocus your way to a win...

It looks a lot to me like Baltimore continued to be a dominant d when Rex left after 2008 http://m.pfref.com/m?p=XXcoachesXXHarbJo0.htm&t=1

and the jets best year defensively, his first year there (which contradicts the thoery it its just hard to learn) was followed by a steady decent to the bottom third in the nfl... http://m.pfref.com/m?p=XXcoachesXXRyanRe0.htm&t=1

Maybe we all got duped into this defensive genius mantra, because as always, bills fans have that eternal optimism...

 

It isn't scheme b.c the Bills have run every different scheme in the past years, never a consistent 3-4, 4-3... Always something different. Just going to take some time, thing is the Bills don't have time.

[Webster Guy]

The thing that baffles me is that we're getting stellar play from gilmore and darby, which I understood in preseason to be the only possible reason this defense would not be tops in the league.

 

Instead our challenges have become our penalties, front seven, special teams (except punting), and an exceptionally injury prone offense at the skill positions.

[dayman]

The thing that baffles me is that we're getting stellar play from gilmore and darby, which I understood in preseason to be the only possible reason this defense would not be tops in the league.

 

Instead our challenges have become our penalties, front seven, special teams (except punting), and an exceptionally injury prone offense at the skill positions.

 

None of us have any choice but to hope time will cause this to work. Rex isn't going anywhere and neither is the bulk of our front 7.

 

Offense has been a dumpster fire we need to sign some more durable guys that can be expected to ball consistently. I actually like Sammy, Goodwin, and Percy all individually...but as 3 of the top 4 WRs on a team it looks like it can't work that way right now.

[Over 29 years of fanhood]

It isn't scheme b.c the Bills have run every different scheme in the past years, never a consistent 3-4, 4-3... Always something different. Just going to take some time, thing is the Bills don't have time.

If defenses were all as simple as how many dudes play LB and how many put their hand in the dirt, they'd make a magic 8 ball the d coordinator.

 

The high level premise I've come to understand, is Rex's defense has a read and react component with numerous dependencies, while the schwarz d simply lines guys up to create and attack gaps... add in all the disguise of who is rushing vs dropping.. Dareus is warren sapp but he's playing the role of bj raji...

 

The scheme is marginalizing a front 4 and secondary that did last year to Aaron Rodgers what Denver just did.

 

So let's stop pretending this defense, who did in fact shut down two canton bound qbs last year, now couldn't sack Andy Dalton, got torched on a game wining drive by Blake Bortles,hasn't changed for the worse in just about every way with the same cast. Let's also allow deductive reasoning to help us understand, since the core cast is identical the obvious difference causing the deterioration must be COACHING and/or SCHEME

Edited November 5, 2015 by over 20 years of fanhood

[Chandler#81]

This is pretty much how I feel about it as well

 

My only fear is that it took too long for this year and we end up coming like 1 game short

We're all wearing doom under our hat regarding the Jag game. It will be the one game we all back at if we miss the Playoffs by one AFC loss. We just can't give a game like that away. But, we did..

[Nuncha]

It takes time for players to learn Rex D? What a joke. How much time is it going to take?

Schwartz came here and in one season had this defense playing outstanding. If Rex is a defensive "guru", he should be able to do the same with all the talent on this roster.

 

 

 

[Nanker]

A 12 - 4 record should get them into the Playoffs.

The Bills still control their own destiny.

 

Just win. Just win.

[Nihilarian]

That's fine. But it is widely believed that Rex is a brilliant defensive coach and that the Bills have tremendous talent on defense. So, why can't Rex simplify the scheme to take advantage of our great players on a weekly basis and build upon that simplified scheme over time?

Puking everything at the players and blaming them for not grasping the concepts seems ill advised and misguided.

Same thing happened with Ryan in NY, and cried about not having the players needed to run his defense. So, in order to Run Ryan's scheme the Bills will need to dump all four all pro D linemen, and draft or bring in top free agent LBers to run his scheme.

 

Many threads open about the defense. Below taken from a different thread.

 

For the life of me I can't figure out why you continue to want to defend a defense that isn't even coming close to utilizing its players like it should.

 

This year the Bills are 29th in sacks, and 27 in sack percentage when this team basically lead the league the last two years. Its been like this in just about every game this year, and a big reason as to why the stats for sacks, hits, pressures for the Bills defense is so bad this year. Conversely, Denver leads the NFL in sacks, hits pressures and a big why their defense is currently ranked #1.

 

"As far as Dareus is concerned, simpler is better. He has felt that since training camp, when he complained publicly about not seeing eye-to-eye with how he was being coached."

 

"Ryan employs a base 3-4 defense. Hughes and Mario Williams, who led the Bills with 14.5 sacks last season, are not positioned anywhere near as wide as they were by Schwartz. There isn’t as much of an attack-up-the-field philosophy with the linemen. It’s more about doing things that allow linebackers to be a greater part of the play-making than before."

 

"In another significant change, Kyle Williams often finds himself lining up outside, in a standing position, rather than inside and in a three-point stance as he was last year. He also will move laterally, in an effort to draw blockers from other defenders."

 

http://bills.buffalonews.com/2015/10/07/bills-d-line-experiencing-disconnect-with-scheme/

 

 

I mean WTF! What complete horsecrap this coaching staff is doing with the Bills front four this year. This is why these men are complaining publicly about what they are being asked to do this year.

Click the link, and read the article please!

Edited November 5, 2015 by Nihilarian

[ricojes]

It takes time for players to learn Rex D? What a joke. How much time is it going to take?

 

Schwartz came here and in one season had this defense playing outstanding. If Rex is a defensive "guru", he should be able to do the same with all the talent on this roster.

 

 

 

2 quotes from this article definitely back up the notion the players are still learning Rex's D.

 

http://sports.yahoo.com/news/mixed-messages-ryan-bills-players-seem-odds-defense-220005992--nfl.html

 

Preston Brown said he was pleased to learn the defensive scheme had been simplified during the team's bye week off.

''I think this week we're just going to take a whole bunch (of plays) out and just play fast. That's what we want to do,'' Brown said. ''We don't have to be as complicated as we've been in the past.''

 

''We've got to figure out things we can do better,'' safety Corey Graham said. ''And we talked about it and we've figured it out. Now we've just got to go out there and do what we're supposed to on the field.''

 

This is the 8th game and we're still hearing the same things from week 2 and 3. It's a lot more complicated than JS's D, plain and simple. I am not saying I agree with implementing a complicated D when there is this much talent on D, just that I do agree with the OP....

[Best Player Available]

It takes time for players to learn Rex D? What a joke. How much time is it going to take?

Schwartz came here and in one season had this defense playing outstanding. If Rex is a defensive "guru", he should be able to do the same with all the talent on this roster.

 

The Jets are un-learning Ryan's D pretty fast.

[vincec]

The Jets are un-learning Ryan's D pretty fast.

This is the thing that concerns me. The Jets had defenses ranked in button third of the league his last two seasons there and now the are top ten. I know they added a couple of players but that's pretty big jump. Meanwhile, Rex comes to Buffalo and their previously top 10 defense is now bottom half.

 

What's going on?

[Best Player Available]

This is the thing that concerns me. The Jets had defenses ranked in button third of the league his last two seasons there and now the are top ten. I know they added a couple of players but that's pretty big jump. Meanwhile, Rex comes to Buffalo and their previously top 10 defense is now bottom half.

What's going on?

Why Fix something that was not broken?

[YoloinOhio]

This is the thing that concerns me. The Jets had defenses ranked in button third of the league his last two seasons there and now the are top ten. I know they added a couple of players but that's pretty big jump. Meanwhile, Rex comes to Buffalo and their previously top 10 defense is now bottom half.

 

What's going on?

the Jets were ranked 6th in total D in 2014 and 11th in 2013 per NFL.com Edited November 5, 2015 by YoloinOhio

[Beef Jerky]

This is the thing that concerns me. The Jets had defenses ranked in button third of the league his last two seasons there and now the are top ten. I know they added a couple of players but that's pretty big jump. Meanwhile, Rex comes to Buffalo and their previously top 10 defense is now bottom half.

What's going on?

Well always been said you can't know how good the defense or offense really was till all the games are played. By the end of the season the Jets defense will drop and the Bills will be at the top. Already started to happen last week against the Raiders.

[vincec]

the Jets were ranked 6th in total D in 2014 and 11th in 2013 per NFL.com

Interesting. I was looking at points per game, which has them at #24 in 2014 and #19 in 2013. Not sure which measuring stick is more accurate, although it's bizarre that you could be # 6 in yards per game but #24 in points per game in the same season.