MattM Posted January 25, 2015 Share Posted January 25, 2015 Could be as simple as luck, like Rogers, liking them as firm as possible. We know very little still. But they still tested within the range at halftime it sounds like. In addition, that would mean a decrease of less than 1 psi at most vs the 2 psi or more the Pats* decreased by Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KD in CA Posted January 25, 2015 Share Posted January 25, 2015 So the atmosphere effected the Patriots' footballs, but not the Colts. Got it. And it only affected the Pats footballs in the first half but not in the (presumably colder) second half. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Georgia Bill Posted January 25, 2015 Share Posted January 25, 2015 You guys just won't let it go. At the end of all this I think there's going to be a lot of embarassed people in the public eye who called them out as cheaters and liars, without any facts. Frankly, what Belichick said made sense. It made sense that he would insist on walking through the process so he could understand what happened, given the hoopla. In a nutshell he said the preparation process (vigorous rubbing) raises the PSI by about a pound. They are then provided to the officials who are asked to inflate to 12.5 PSI. All that done at room temp. Once out in game temps (colder), you lose not only the initial one pound due to prep, but also another half. So you can be down about one and a half pounds (to 11 PSI or so). I suspect this will be proven to be possible - depending on the ball prep process, and it is by far the most probable explanation. Why weren't the Colts balls low too? I have to say that's a stupid question. Maybe they don't heat up the ball temp as much when they prep the balls, if at all. Maybe they ask for their balls to be set at the high side (13.5 PSI). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
What a Tuel Posted January 25, 2015 Share Posted January 25, 2015 (edited) You guys just won't let it go. At the end of all this I think there's going to be a lot of embarassed people in the public eye who called them out as cheaters and liars, without any facts. Frankly, what Belichick said made sense. It made sense that he would insist on walking through the process so he could understand what happened, given the hoopla. In a nutshell he said the preparation process (vigorous rubbing) raises the PSI by about a pound. They are then provided to the officials who are asked to inflate to 12.5 PSI. All that done at room temp. Once out in game temps (colder), you lose not only the initial one pound due to prep, but also another half. So you can be down about one and a half pounds (to 11 PSI or so). I suspect this will be proven to be possible - depending on the ball prep process, and it is by far the most probable explanation. Why weren't the Colts balls low too? I have to say that's a stupid question. Maybe they don't heat up the ball temp as much when they prep the balls, if at all. Maybe they ask for their balls to be set at the high side (13.5 PSI). If the Patriots didn't have a history of skirting the rules, or blatently ignoring them then I would be all for "just letting it go". However they skirted the rules and did something questionable just the week before this game too. Their leeway or good will has been spent, and it is about time people start questioning their tactics. Edited January 25, 2015 by What a Tuel Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DC Tom Posted January 25, 2015 Share Posted January 25, 2015 You guys just won't let it go. At the end of all this I think there's going to be a lot of embarassed people in the public eye who called them out as cheaters and liars, without any facts. Frankly, what Belichick said made sense. It made sense that he would insist on walking through the process so he could understand what happened, given the hoopla. In a nutshell he said the preparation process (vigorous rubbing) raises the PSI by about a pound. They are then provided to the officials who are asked to inflate to 12.5 PSI. All that done at room temp. Once out in game temps (colder), you lose not only the initial one pound due to prep, but also another half. So you can be down about one and a half pounds (to 11 PSI or so). I suspect this will be proven to be possible - depending on the ball prep process, and it is by far the most probable explanation. Why weren't the Colts balls low too? I have to say that's a stupid question. Maybe they don't heat up the ball temp as much when they prep the balls, if at all. Maybe they ask for their balls to be set at the high side (13.5 PSI). The problem with the story is that even if the prep raises the pressure by 1 psi, it makes no difference because that occurs before the officials get the balls. If they ask the officials to set the balls at 12.5 psi, they're 12.5 psi, regardless of what happens before that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nihilist25 Posted January 25, 2015 Share Posted January 25, 2015 (edited) Per BB, Patriot's recreation found: 1. Pre-cert Patriot ball rubbing raised ball PSI by 1 PSI. I have no idea how rubbing could cause PSI to rise. Do they put the footballs in a clothes dryer? 2. Balls filled to 12.5 and moved outside lost 1.0-1.5 PSI due to atmosphere. Per the NFL's story the, balls were filled to 12.5 PSI during cert. Also, see King video. BB didn't put 2+2 together for us. I think he wants us to believe that the balls had an additional excited PSI when handed to the refs. The refs filled the balls to 12.5. He wants us to allow that the balls could have settled at 11.5 after cert regardless of atmosphere. Additionally, lower outside temperature caused 1.0-1.5 loss of PSI. That's a loss of 2.0-2.5 PSI total. Also,he wants us to think that this is all the NFL's fault (or at least out of the Patriots hands) for not considering atmosphere and settling. He's worried about pre-SB sanctions and wanted to get his shot in before the NFL does and without giving the media, the NFL, and other parties much time to prepare. That's why he had the conference today with one hour notice. Edited January 25, 2015 by Nihilist25 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
reddogblitz Posted January 25, 2015 Share Posted January 25, 2015 Reminds me of another famous press conference: I did not have sexual relation with that deflated football, Miss Lewinsky ..." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Georgia Bill Posted January 25, 2015 Share Posted January 25, 2015 The problem with the story is that even if the prep raises the pressure by 1 psi, it makes no difference because that occurs before the officials get the balls. If they ask the officials to set the balls at 12.5 psi, they're 12.5 psi, regardless of what happens before that.Yes they would be at 12.5 PSI right when they are filled - no one was debating that. The prep process heats the ball up(and air inside it). It's the same as using "heated air" as some suggested they were doing if cheating deliberately. If they are given right after that prep (heating) process to the officials, and they set them at 12.5 PSI, once the ball cools down to room temp (due to the heat from rubbing the ball dissipating)they drop to 11.5 PSI. Then another half when out in 50 degrees. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pneumonic Posted January 25, 2015 Share Posted January 25, 2015 People are assuming the refs measured and altered the PSI (to Pats requested 12.5 PSI) after being handed the balls by the Pats. That part is yet unknown and was actually referenced by BB in this presser when he said "You will have to ask the league as to what they did or DID NOT DO" in response to a question about if the officials measured the pressure with accurate gauges before signing off. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nihilist25 Posted January 25, 2015 Share Posted January 25, 2015 Per BB, Patriot's recreation found: 1. Pre-cert Patriot ball rubbing raised ball PSI by 1 PSI. I have no idea how rubbing could cause PSI to rise. Do they put the footballs in a clothes dryer? 2. Balls filled to 12.5 and moved outside lost 1.0-1.5 PSI due to atmosphere. Per the NFL's story the, balls were filled to 12.5 PSI during cert. Also, see King video. BB didn't put 2+2 together for us. I think he wants us to believe that the balls had an additional excited PSI when handed to the refs. The refs filled the balls to 12.5. He wants us to allow that the balls could have settled at 11.5 after cert regardless of atmosphere. Additionally, lower outside temperature caused 1.0-1.5 loss of PSI. That's a loss of 2.0-2.5 PSI total. Also,he wants us to think that this is all the NFL's fault (or at least out of the Patriots hands) for not considering atmosphere and settling. He's worried about pre-SB sanctions and wanted to get his shot in before the NFL does and without giving the media, the NFL, and other parties much time to prepare. That's why he had the conference today with one hour notice. If true about PSI loss due to rubbing and atmosphere, the Patriots knew or should have known that their footballs would have low PSI during play. They should have determined what would happen to PSI due to their proprietary rubbing process. They knew or should have known the refs cert process as there was at least a video on it dated as recently as 2013. Additionally, the Patriots acknowledged they requested the refs inflate to 12.5 PSI. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sodbuster Posted January 25, 2015 Share Posted January 25, 2015 This whole rubbing thing is just bogus. Brady said himself that he picks the balls and then they go. They don't mess with the surface after he picks them. There is no way that the balks would hold onto heat for the entire time that he picks them, and then they go to get checked. That would have to be a really quickly executed process. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MattM Posted January 25, 2015 Share Posted January 25, 2015 Yes they would be at 12.5 PSI right when they are filled - no one was debating that. The prep process heats the ball up(and air inside it). It's the same as using "heated air" as some suggested they were doing if cheating deliberately. If they are given right after that prep (heating) process to the officials, and they set them at 12.5 PSI, once the ball cools down to room temp (due to the heat from rubbing the ball dissipating)they drop to 11.5 PSI. Then another half when out in 50 degrees. Then why weren 't the Colts' balls below the required range? If you can't answer that, you really have no answer here. Common, basic sense. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PolishDave Posted January 25, 2015 Share Posted January 25, 2015 (edited) If the Patriots supposedly want the balls inflated to 12.5lbs wouldn't they deliver them to the ref that way already so that the ref didn't have to do anything to the balls at all. Wouldn't that make it more likely that the balls would end up with the inflation that the Pats actually wanted? Asking the refs to inflate the balls to 12.5 lbs implies that the balls are underinflated when delivered to the ref in the first place, which I would consider cheating right there. Hopefully going forward from here, teams are never allowed to choose the balls and bring their own balls anymore. What a ridiculous system anyway....the balls should be delivered game day and selected by the ref right then. Edited January 25, 2015 by PolishDave Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Roger Goodell Posted January 25, 2015 Share Posted January 25, 2015 The NFL appreciates Coach Belichick taking the time to clarify the facts and put to rest any remaining speculation regarding the footballs used during last week's AFC Championship game. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Georgia Bill Posted January 25, 2015 Share Posted January 25, 2015 This whole rubbing thing is just bogus. Brady said himself that he picks the balls and then they go. They don't mess with the surface after he picks them. There is no way that the balks would hold onto heat for the entire time that he picks them, and then they go to get checked. That would have to be a really quickly executed process.Bogus or not they just put the NFL into the position of having to disprove that it is possible. That will have to be part of their investigation, and the science of all the half pound changes due to this or that is going to bore people to tears. It will also reveal that the NFL does not have rules in effect to make absolutely sure that balls are within 12.5 to 13.5 at game time, and they are going to have to change their process. Then why weren 't the Colts' balls below the required range? If you can't answer that, you really have no answer here. Common, basic sense.Common basic sense? How about maybe the Colts don't do their ball rubs just before giving them to the refs. Or perhaps they ask the refs to inflate them to 13.5 PSI, not 12.5 PSI. This isn't an investigation into the Colts ball handling practices. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pneumonic Posted January 25, 2015 Share Posted January 25, 2015 If true about PSI loss due to rubbing and atmosphere, the Patriots knew or should have known that their footballs would have low PSI during play. They should have determined what would happen to PSI due to their proprietary rubbing process. They knew or should have known the refs cert process as there was at least a video on it dated as recently as 2013. Additionally, the Patriots acknowledged they requested the refs inflate to 12.5 PSI. Ummmm, the game happened BEFORE Belichick did the tests he just explained today. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nihilist25 Posted January 25, 2015 Share Posted January 25, 2015 People are assuming the refs measured and altered the PSI (to Pats requested 12.5 PSI) after being handed the balls by the Pats. That part is yet unknown and was actually referenced by BB in this presser when he said "You will have to ask the league as to what they did or DID NOT DO" in response to a question about if the officials measured the pressure with accurate gauges before signing off. That's what I was wondering yesterday. Then the NFL released a statement indicating that before this game the balls were inflated to 12.5-13.5. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kelly the Dog Posted January 25, 2015 Share Posted January 25, 2015 No one seems to remember that The Devil Wears Hoodie said that something else happens that adds half a pound in his scenario. So the 1.5 is actually 1.0 and they were twice that amount under. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pneumonic Posted January 25, 2015 Share Posted January 25, 2015 That's what I was wondering yesterday. Then the NFL released a statement indicating that before this game the balls were inflated to 12.5-13.5. I may have missed it when I read it but I recall the league being very vague on the particulars of the PSI component of the official's part in OK'ing the balls. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DC Tom Posted January 25, 2015 Share Posted January 25, 2015 I may have missed it when I read it but I recall the league being very vague on the particulars of the PSI component of the official's part in OK'ing the balls. I never heard that...but that would just figure. The league specifies something specific, and is vague about enforcing it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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