PromoTheRobot Posted July 22, 2014 Share Posted July 22, 2014 (edited) Let's give in to the idea for a moment that EJ isn't the guy. Did the Bills miss an opportunity with another QB? Listening to Schopp pretty much throw EJ (and Marrone for that matter) under the bus today, I started thinking about what other options there were in 2013 and 2014. Nassib? Bridgewater? Geno Smith? Would you be any more optimistic with these QBs on the Bills right now instead of EJ? To me EJ was the best from an apparently weak class. But also keep in mind that 80% of Bills fans wanted a QB taken in 2013. So the Bills got EJ and the feeling was that at least the Bills are taking a shot. We even got EJ plus Kiko by trading down. But a year later and good feelings are gone. What if we waited till 2014? No Sammy but Manziel at 9? Bortles? Would we be any more guaranteed success with those guys? My point is the Bills really didn't have much choice but take EJ and go all in with him. There was no other QB that was a consensus franchise player in either the 2013 or 2014 draft. Would you have stuck with Fitz for two more years? Sign a free agent? If so, who? Vick? Freeman? Sanchez? How about any QB from this list of 2013 free agents? Again, not only was there no sure bets at QB in either draft, there was no quality free agent QBs to sign in 2013 or 2014 either. So it was going to EJ any way you slice it. PTR Edited July 22, 2014 by PromoTheRobot Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Over 29 years of fanhood Posted July 22, 2014 Share Posted July 22, 2014 Let's give in to the idea for a moment that EJ isn't the guy. Did the Bills miss an opportunity with another QB? Listening to Schopp pretty much throw EJ (and Marrone for that matter) under the bus today, I started thinking about what other options there were in 2013 and 2014. Nassib? Bridgewater? Geno Smith? Would you be any more optimistic with these QBs on the Bills right now instead of EJ? To me EJ was the best from an apparently weak class. But also keep in mind that 80% of Bills fans wanted a QB taken in 2013. So the Bills got EJ and the feeling was that at least the Bills are taking a shot. We even got EJ plus Kiko by trading down. But a year later and good feelings are gone. What if we waited till 2014? No Sammy but Manziel at 9? Bortles? Would we be any more guaranteed success with those guys? My point is the Bills really didn't have much choice but take EJ and go all in with him. There was no other QB that was a consensus franchise player in either the 2013 or 2014 draft. Would you have stuck with Fitz for two more years? Sign a free agent? If so, who? Vick? Freeman? Sanchez? How about any QB from this list of 2013 free agents? Again, not only was there no sure bets at QB in either draft, there was no quality free agent QBs to sign in 2013 or 2014 either. So it was going to EJ any way you slice it. PTR Can't argue. The QB cabinet was barren. The free agents slim. They tried Leinart, Kolb, Young... They had no success with any of these guys. Had to take a shot at building their own. The only other recent rookies I'd rather have at this point than EJ are the easy calls: Luck (no chance) Rg3 (a minuscule chance) Russell (sort of lucky pick) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BuffaloBill Posted July 22, 2014 Share Posted July 22, 2014 They made their bets and have gone all in. You want to see who is next if EJ faulters look at class of 2016 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
machine gun kelly Posted July 22, 2014 Share Posted July 22, 2014 Let's give in to the idea for a moment that EJ isn't the guy. Did the Bills miss an opportunity with another QB? Listening to Schopp pretty much throw EJ (and Marrone for that matter) under the bus today, I started thinking about what other options there were in 2013 and 2014. Nassib? Bridgewater? Geno Smith? Would you be any more optimistic with these QBs on the Bills right now instead of EJ? To me EJ was the best from an apparently weak class. But also keep in mind that 80% of Bills fans wanted a QB taken in 2013. So the Bills got EJ and the feeling was that at least the Bills are taking a shot. We even got EJ plus Kiko by trading down. But a year later and good feelings are gone. What if we waited till 2014? No Sammy but Manziel at 9? Bortles? Would we be any more guaranteed success with those guys? My point is the Bills really didn't have much choice but take EJ and go all in with him. There was no other QB that was a consensus franchise player in either the 2013 or 2014 draft. Would you have stuck with Fitz for two more years? Sign a free agent? If so, who? Vick? Freeman? Sanchez? How about any QB from this list of 2013 free agents? Again, not only was there no sure bets at QB in either draft, there was no quality free agent QBs to sign in 2013 or 2014 either. So it was going to EJ any way you slice it. PTR Amen. Everyone has these hindsight ideas, but there was no one. If you go back farther you can bring up Russel Wilson and Andy Dalton. That's it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
yungmack Posted July 22, 2014 Share Posted July 22, 2014 There is a certain type of fan who seems to believe there is an orchard which has a Quarterback Tree, and when you need one, why you just go pick one off the limb. And this certain type of fan then feels free to excoriate management, coaches, anyone and everyone if that fresh-picked QB isn't "The One." Your assessment is exactly correct, the Bills needed a QB and EJ was the best of the available bunch. And the Bills FO was very upfront about how he projected, clearly stating that he had a ton of talent but needed a ton of work. There was no intent to start him until the middle of the season at the very earliest, and probably not for a season or two. You know, the way it used to be done in the NFL. So, a still-not-quite-ready QB was forced into action, with predictable results. What I'd ask the nay-sayers to do is to stop viewing EJ as a completed project who hasn't lived up to expectations and should thus be jettisoned. Instead think of him as a work in progress who, because of Kolb's injuries, is actually ahead of the projected learning curve. And for the upcoming season, look for a good bit of progress but still with much room for improvement. And if he regresses, the Bills can always go out to the orchard and pick another QB off the tree. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dayman Posted July 22, 2014 Share Posted July 22, 2014 (edited) Hate to be that guy, but it's all Wilson. He was an obvious pick, not a lucky pick. When you know you have no QB (which we did at the time), and you know you haven't had a qb in forever, and you know you are building a team from crap, you take Wilson when he's there for you. He was no mystery, we took TJ Graham instead. But moving off that, I have to say I would rather have Mike Vick start the season for us than EJ. I would take Vick and Freeman/Sanchez as backup and go from there. Be aggressive when a shot opens for QB. That's just me though. Assuming EJ is not the guy (which I do even without the topic prompting me to). EDIT: Oh ya, I would much rather have Johnny Football as well. Edited July 22, 2014 by MoreOffense Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tyrod's Tailor Posted July 22, 2014 Share Posted July 22, 2014 They made their bets and have gone all in. You want to see who is next if EJ faulters look at class of 2016 There might be some decent veteran options this coming offseason. I could see Eli Manning possibly being available, to give one example. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KDIGGZ Posted July 22, 2014 Share Posted July 22, 2014 Buddy Nix backed himself into a corner where he HAD to take a QB when there wasn't one they necessarily wanted to take so high. It's their fault for ignoring the position for so long and thinking Fitz was ever going to be a franchise QB. They had opportunities to get other guys in the past (one of them just won a Super Bowl) but they dropped the ball so to speak. Sure, EJ was the best available...out of a bad class and they had to reach for him because they were desperate at that point. If it was me I would have gone for someone like Alex Smith in free agency and then also grab EJ in the draft. Maybe in 2-3 yrs EJ would end up being something. But in the meantime you need someone who can win games. Our team is good enough to make the playoffs. We can't be held back by a sub par QB. If EJ is mediocre we could really win some games. Like 16th best QB out of 32 mediocre and we might even win a playoff game or two Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Augie Posted July 22, 2014 Share Posted July 22, 2014 (edited) They made their bets and have gone all in. You want to see who is next if EJ faulters look at class of 2016 Yep, and at least in the '16 we'll have a first round pick. (I view Kiko as our '15 first rounder - it helps my digestion.) But it's never high enough. Mediocre is almost worse than being terrible. Look and the Colts and their luck with Luck. Playoffs, suck, playoffs. You have to stink at the perfect moment, and we seem to have bad timing or too much talent to stink quite as much as needed. If we get freaky lucky we get an established QB like Brees or P. Manning who sees a lot of talent and a chance to win (with a declining Brady) in the near future. But my first choice is EJ for Super Bowl MVP. Edited July 23, 2014 by Augie Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Over 29 years of fanhood Posted July 23, 2014 Share Posted July 23, 2014 Hate to be that guy, but it's all Wilson. He was an obvious pick, not a lucky pick. Right.... So obvious that Cleveland took Weedon and Miami took Tanehill.... Obvious Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dayman Posted July 23, 2014 Share Posted July 23, 2014 If EJ is mediocre we could really win some games. Like 16th best QB out of 32 mediocre and we might even win a playoff game or two Haha, if EJ is the 16th best quarterback this team will not win 2 playoff games. We're better than we have been, but don't be ridiculous. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PromoTheRobot Posted July 23, 2014 Author Share Posted July 23, 2014 Hate to be that guy, but it's all Wilson. He was an obvious pick, not a lucky pick. When you know you have no QB (which we did at the time), and you know you haven't had a qb in forever, and you know you are building a team from crap, you take Wilson when he's there for you. He was no mystery, we took TJ Graham instead. But moving off that, I have to say I would rather have Mike Vick start the season for us than EJ. I would take Vick and Freeman/Sanchez as backup and go from there. Be aggressive when a shot opens for QB. That's just me though. Assuming EJ is not the guy (which I do even without the topic prompting me to). EDIT: Oh ya, I would much rather have Johnny Football as well. I would say Russell Wilson going in the 3rd round means he was nowhere near an obvious pick. If he were obvious he'd have gone in the first round. But if you want to play the "who got picked next" game then yeah TJ instead of Wilson hurts, as does Troup instead of Gronk. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dayman Posted July 23, 2014 Share Posted July 23, 2014 (edited) Right.... So obvious that Cleveland took Weedon and Miami took Tanehill.... Obvious As in, it was obvious our team needed him in the 3rd when he was there. It was not mystery the kid was real good and an interesting pick...that is the pick you make in the 3rd as the Bills in that draft. That is what I mean by obvious. i'm no genius, but I still remember screaming at the tv in that moment. Edited July 23, 2014 by MoreOffense Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BetterNextYearRight? Posted July 23, 2014 Share Posted July 23, 2014 I rode the Glennon and Bridgewater bandwagons myself, but it is a very good point and also brings up the fact that minus 3 QBs, rookie QB's still struggle to adjust to the league and it takes time. EJ might have had a lot to gain from sitting for a year or two, but with how negative most of the fanbase is bringing in a veteran not named Drew Brees would still have us kicking and screaming. The only other option I think the Bills might have had a chance at would have been pushing to acquire Kirk Cousins. Alex Smith is still middle of the pack and might have led to a playoff berth but not much else. To draft a QB in 2014 would have been a mistake and would throw even more pressure on the pick to make it happen this year. 3 years is typically what a young QB gets to prove it unless he absolutely bombs out (google Jamarcus Russell). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Augie Posted July 23, 2014 Share Posted July 23, 2014 Hate to be that guy, but it's all Wilson. He was an obvious pick, not a lucky pick. Apparently it was not all that obvious to 32 NFL teams for several rounds. It was " a shot". We took our shot. I'm concerned about basic accuracy issues mostly (I love the work ethic and composure), but at least we took a shot AND got Kiko. Well played in my book. You could consider Kiko the first round pick and EJ the second if it helps you sleep. That would be a deal in my opinion. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bangarang Posted July 23, 2014 Share Posted July 23, 2014 I wouldn't mind having Teddy Bridgewater on this team. I wouldn't have wanted us to take him in the first round but if he fell to our 2nd pick then I would have wanted us to take him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ohiostyle Posted July 23, 2014 Share Posted July 23, 2014 Wow its helpful to have it put in that context. At this point there isn't anyone from that class that I'd rather have. We definitely had to draft a guy, and in my opinion he's the only one. Nassib is obviously an unknown, but even if he turns out great, the comparison of his path of sitting behind a solid vet, vs a qb hungry team isn't fair. All that said please let EJ work out for this team. People still talk about what was given up to get Sammy, but starting over on the qb lottery sets franchises back way further than losing a first. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dayman Posted July 23, 2014 Share Posted July 23, 2014 Apparently it was not all that obvious to 32 NFL teams for several rounds. It was " a shot". We took our shot. I'm concerned about basic accuracy issues mostly (I love the work ethic and composure), but at least we took a shot AND got Kiko. Well played in my book. You could consider Kiko the first round pick and EJ the second if it helps you sleep. That would be a deal in my opinion. Basic accuracy is a big deal, impossible to play QB with true confidence without it. Work ethic and composure is not a problem for the vast majority of QBs...the fact that EJ is good there means nothing to me. Anyway, as I said above...the "obvious pick" was us to grab him the third...not for Wilson to have gone in the first. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Augie Posted July 23, 2014 Share Posted July 23, 2014 (edited) "Obvious pick" seems to be in question. Basic accuracy is a big deal, impossible to play QB with true confidence without it. Work ethic and composure is not a problem for the vast majority of QBs...the fact that EJ is good there means nothing to me. Anyway, as I said above...the "obvious pick" was us to grab him the third...not for Wilson to have gone in the first. Hindsight is definitely on your side. That would be hard to argue. I still like a big, strong pocket QB, but hey, I'd love my QB to have a ring! Edited July 23, 2014 by Augie Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rockinon Posted July 23, 2014 Share Posted July 23, 2014 There is a certain type of fan who seems to believe there is an orchard which has a Quarterback Tree, and when you need one, why you just go pick one off the limb. And this certain type of fan then feels free to excoriate management, coaches, anyone and everyone if that fresh-picked QB isn't "The One." Your assessment is exactly correct, the Bills needed a QB and EJ was the best of the available bunch. And the Bills FO was very upfront about how he projected, clearly stating that he had a ton of talent but needed a ton of work. There was no intent to start him until the middle of the season at the very earliest, and probably not for a season or two. You know, the way it used to be done in the NFL. So, a still-not-quite-ready QB was forced into action, with predictable results. What I'd ask the nay-sayers to do is to stop viewing EJ as a completed project who hasn't lived up to expectations and should thus be jettisoned. Instead think of him as a work in progress who, because of Kolb's injuries, is actually ahead of the projected learning curve. And for the upcoming season, look for a good bit of progress but still with much room for improvement. And if he regresses, the Bills can always go out to the orchard and pick another QB off the tree. Excoriate......LOL. I had to look that up. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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