Game of Thrones Part Deax: The Readers Thread

[FireChan]

 

A lot of leaks are coming out online... including the final images of tonight's episode. Avoid social media if you don't want it spoiled (not that book readers can have it spoiled, we all know what's coming).

So it is FTW. Nice.

[Deranged Rhino]

So it is FTW. Nice.

 

I'm slow today... FTW = For the Win? Or something I'm completely missing GOT related?

[FireChan]

 

I'm slow today... FTW = For the Win? Or something I'm completely missing GOT related?

I was trying to not spoil, just in case. FTW = For the Watch = you know.

[DC Tom]

 

A lot of leaks are coming out online... including the final images of tonight's episode. Avoid social media if you don't want it spoiled (not that book readers can have it spoiled, we all know what's coming).

 

I'll bet no one's anticipating tonight's finale more eagerly than George R.R. Martin himself, who's probably dying to know what happens next in his story...

[LB3]

 

I'll bet no one's anticipating tonight's finale more eagerly than George R.R. Martin himself, who's probably dying to know what happens next in his story...

[Tony P]

Well, although I'm not completely thrilled on how they got there, I'm really happy that the show runners got the main story-line back into alignment with the books. With the strong exception with the Stannis arc.

 

We really don't know a lot about what's going to happen next. I'm among those who believe that Melisandre will bring JS back to life very early next season. I'm also really hoping that GRRM actually does get book six completed by he end of the year.

 

Unfortunately, I also believe that it will primarily a bridge to the final book.

 

Speaking of Stannis, I think that after last week, he had to have everything fall apart this week or the fan masses would have revolted and I loved that Brienne was the one to finish him off.

[Rubes]

Well, although I'm not completely thrilled on how they got there, I'm really happy that the show runners got the main story-line back into alignment with the books. With the strong exception with the Stannis arc.

 

We really don't know a lot about what's going to happen next. I'm among those who believe that Melisandre will bring JS back to life very early next season. I'm also really hoping that GRRM actually does get book six completed by he end of the year.

 

Yeah, I think you said it well. Most of the storylines at least resemble what we know in the books (except for Stannis and Sansa, of course), which is an improvement. Interesting how they merged Sansa and Jeyne Poole there at the end, with the dive into the snow. As for Melisandre, I agree, I think she'll be the one to bring JS back, though there's no foreshadowing of it like there is in the books. If there was some Ghost reference at the end, I would be more confident in that.

[/dev/null]

 

As for Melisandre, I agree, I think she'll be the one to bring JS back, though there's no foreshadowing of it like there is in the books.

 

I thought there was plenty of foreshadowing there. She showed up at Castle Black alone in one scene and then set up Snow's death in the next/final scene

[Tony P]

 

Yeah, I think you said it well. Most of the storylines at least resemble what we know in the books (except for Stannis and Sansa, of course), which is an improvement. Interesting how they merged Sansa and Jeyne Poole there at the end, with the dive into the snow. As for Melisandre, I agree, I think she'll be the one to bring JS back, though there's no foreshadowing of it like there is in the books. If there was some Ghost reference at the end, I would be more confident in that.

 

I read an interview with Kit Harrington (actor who plays JS) after my original post last night and he states emphatically that he will not be back in season six. My wife equates that to killing-off Dr. "McDreamy" in her (not my!!!) Grey's Anatomy. And I do know several female GoT fans that watch the show primarily for Snow. That's got to have them po'd.

 

Anyway, even knowing from book 5 that the Black Brothers were going to off JS "for the Watch", I always thought that GRRM would have a device to bring him back. Now, I'm not so sure. Yes, he could have warged into Ghost and there are other possibilities too but we may have really seen the last of Snow. If so, R+L=J becomes moot.

[BillsFan-4-Ever]

 

I'll bet no one's anticipating tonight's finale more eagerly than George R.R. Martin himself, who's probably dying to know what happens next in his story...

well since they are probably already filming the fall season episodes ...... he may already know

Didn't see the return of Varys! nice

Arya's revenge was SWEET!!!!

 

I will be deeply disappointed if that was the end of Jon. I too think the red witch will save Jon Snow. maybe this is his out of the Brotherhood and he can become part of the Dragon Army foreshadowed by his reclaiming Winterfell and saving Sansa.

 

How many screen shots of Ceirci walk of shame are being posted on the web? The mute Mountain is the brother and not the hound as some have speculated (seen by Breanne and Pod on the island with the walking missionary.

 

Did Breanne off Stannis? and will she also find and rescue Sansa and Reek?

 

Does the prince have an antidote for poison to save Myrcella?

 

I read an interview with Kit Harrington (actor who plays JS) after my original post last night and he states emphatically that he will not be back in season six. My wife equates that to killing-off Dr. "McDreamy" in her (not my!!!) Grey's Anatomy. And I do know several female GoT fans that watch the show primarily for Snow. That's got to have them po'd.

 

Anyway, even knowing from book 5 that the Black Brothers were going to off JS "for the Watch", I always thought that GRRM would have a device to bring him back. Now, I'm not so sure. Yes, he could have warged into Ghost and there are other possibilities too but we may have really seen the last of Snow. If so, R+L=J becomes moot.

The article that I read didn't actually say he would or would not return next season.

 

Do not forget ----- There is power in Kings blood! and we say plenty of it.

[Tony P]

well since they are probably already filming the fall season episodes ...... he may already know

Didn't see the return of Varys! nice

Arya's revenge was SWEET!!!!

 

I will be deeply disappointed if that was the end of Jon. I too think the red witch will save Jon Snow. maybe this is his out of the Brotherhood and he can become part of the Dragon Army foreshadowed by his reclaiming Winterfell and saving Sansa.

 

How many screen shots of Ceirci walk of shame are being posted on the web? The mute Mountain is the brother and not the hound as some have speculated (seen by Breanne and Pod on the island with the walking missionary.

 

Did Breanne off Stannis? and will she also find and rescue Sansa and Reek?

 

Does the prince have an antidote for poison to save Myrcella?

The article that I read didn't actually say he would or would not return next season.

 

Do not forget ----- There is power in Kings blood! and we say plenty of it.

 

Entertainment Weekly: "...So let me ask you: Is Jon really dead?"

Harrington: "This is my understanding of it. I had a sit-down with Dan and David, we did the Tony Soprano walk [letting an actor know they’re being whacked]. And they said, “Look, you’re gone, it’s done.” "...Quite honestly, I have never been told the future of things in this show, but this is the one time I have. They sat me down and said, “This is how it is.” If anything in the future is not like that, then I don’t know about it – it’s only in David and Dan and George’s heads. But I’ve been told I’m dead. I’m dead. I’m not coming back next season. So that’s all I can tell you, really.

 

http://www.ew.com/article/2015/06/14/game-thrones-jon-dies-interview

Edited June 15, 2015 by Tony P

[LB3]

Entertainment Weekly: "...So let me ask you: Is Jon really dead?"

Harrington: "This is my understanding of it. I had a sit-down with Dan and David, we did the Tony Soprano walk [letting an actor know theyre being whacked]. And they said, Look, youre gone, its done.

http://www.ew.com/article/2015/06/14/game-thrones-jon-dies-interview

They're being very specific with their wording it seems. Jon Snow is dead. When he's brought back, he'll no longer be Jon Snow. He'll be himself, but then not. Like how Gandalf the Grey died and came back as Gandalf the White.

[Dorkington]

Non book reader here, thoughts:

 

- It's interesting that they left some ambiguity for Stannis, considering how brutal deaths are on this series. The fact that it happens off screen makes me think she rethought as she swung and just swung it near him or something.

 

- With how long they lingered on Jon Snow, and the fact that Melisandre is skulking around, I could see him coming back... but also kinda curious if the lingering was just to show how much blood is there, and she seems to like her fancy blood, and Snow being questionably important, maybe she just wants his blood for.... stuff.

 

- I was wondering when the Mountain would come back, considering how they teased him surviving a couple times

 

- The ladies of Dorne are brutal... I'm now expecting a Mountain vs Dorne story of some sort after the baby Lannister was poisoned

 

- With dragon glass being lost, and Snow being killed (and there not being much in the way of "Valyrian Steel", seems to me the forgotten Stark kids, and/or the Dragons are the only "hope" against the White Walkers...

 

- Speaking of hope, I assume all hope is lost every episode. To me it seems like a series where only bad things can happen, until maybe the very end. But, even then... I'm kind of expecting the ending of the story to be totally miserable.

 

- Did Sansa and "Reek" commit suicide because they didn't want to be tortured by the Boltons? Or did they jump into a particularly soft snow pile?

 

- Arya's turn was pretty cool, but I'm kinda disappointed she was punished for it. Even so, her story is interesting.

 

- Uh what else... on the mother of dragons... I've basically lost interest in her. Cool, she has a dragon and all, but basically no personality, and always makes really dumb decisions, it seems.

[BillsFan-4-Ever]

Beric Dondarian died - 5 times?

Momma Stark died and became Lady Stone Heart

Both by the Red God.

 

Melisandre didn't trod back into Castle Black for the fine weather.

[Dorkington]

Beric Dondarian died - 5 times?

Momma Stark died and became Lady Stone Heart

Both by the Red God.

 

Melisandre didn't trod back into Castle Black for the fine weather.

No she didn't, but it was also significantly safer for her than the battlefield after she saw the losses Stannis took on.

[BillsFan-4-Ever]

Non book reader here, thoughts:

 

- It's interesting that they left some ambiguity for Stannis, considering how brutal deaths are on this series. The fact that it happens off screen makes me think she rethought as she swung and just swung it near him or something.

 

- With how long they lingered on Jon Snow, and the fact that Melisandre is skulking around, I could see him coming back... but also kinda curious if the lingering was just to show how much blood is there, and she seems to like her fancy blood, and Snow being questionably important, maybe she just wants his blood for.... stuff.

 

- I was wondering when the Mountain would come back, considering how they teased him surviving a couple times

 

- The ladies of Dorne are brutal... I'm now expecting a Mountain vs Dorne story of some sort after the baby Lannister was poisoned

 

- With dragon glass being lost, and Snow being killed (and there not being much in the way of "Valyrian Steel", seems to me the forgotten Stark kids, and/or the Dragons are the only "hope" against the White Walkers...

 

- Speaking of hope, I assume all hope is lost every episode. To me it seems like a series where only bad things can happen, until maybe the very end. But, even then... I'm kind of expecting the ending of the story to be totally miserable.

 

- Did Sansa and "Reek" commit suicide because they didn't want to be tortured by the Boltons? Or did they jump into a particularly soft snow pile?

 

- Arya's turn was pretty cool, but I'm kinda disappointed she was punished for it. Even so, her story is interesting.

 

- Uh what else... on the mother of dragons... I've basically lost interest in her. Cool, she has a dragon and all, but basically no personality, and always makes really dumb decisions, it seems.

any book reader can fill you in on Sansa / Jayne Pool "jump" with reek and Arya's blindness but lets leave it as is for now.

 

Yeah Dani's story grew boring when she stopped in Meereen both on TV and in the books.

 

What happened to the young queen Margaery? no mention of her in 2 or 3 episodes.

No she didn't, but it was also significantly safer for her than the battlefield after she saw the losses Stannis took on.

IIRC Melisandre bailed as soon as they heard that half the army deserted and before Stannis's wife was discovered hanging about.

 

I was actually expecting her to return to save Stannis.

I am pretty sure that most of the show is caught up to the book. There are one to three minor storylines yet untold in the show WRT Sam, Arya and Reek and the escaping "wife"

 

one would cover a page or 2, the other chapters.

[Rubes]

 

Entertainment Weekly: "...So let me ask you: Is Jon really dead?"

Harrington: "This is my understanding of it. I had a sit-down with Dan and David, we did the Tony Soprano walk [letting an actor know they’re being whacked]. And they said, “Look, you’re gone, it’s done.” "...Quite honestly, I have never been told the future of things in this show, but this is the one time I have. They sat me down and said, “This is how it is.” If anything in the future is not like that, then I don’t know about it – it’s only in David and Dan and George’s heads. But I’ve been told I’m dead. I’m dead. I’m not coming back next season. So that’s all I can tell you, really.

 

http://www.ew.com/article/2015/06/14/game-thrones-jon-dies-interview

 

That sounds pretty convincing, but I have absolutely no doubt that D&D and GRRM would purposefully keep the fate of Jon Snow secret to everybody, including Kit, just to make sure it doesn't get out. It's one of the biggest uncertainties of the books as they currently stand, and I'm sure nobody wants that little nugget to be leaked. I'm sure they knew *everybody* would be interviewing Kit this offseason wondering if he'll be back, and this would be the way to ensure nobody finds out.

 

Of course, it's possible that he doesn't come back next season, but the season after that...?

 

There's too much foreshadowing of Jon Snow's importance for him to just be gone for good. Perhaps, as others have suggested, he may return in a different form...

 

- Did Sansa and "Reek" commit suicide because they didn't want to be tortured by the Boltons? Or did they jump into a particularly soft snow pile?

 

That jump was basically an adaptation of a similar scene from the books, involving Reek and a different character.

 

No she didn't, but it was also significantly safer for her than the battlefield after she saw the losses Stannis took on.

 

My sense is that they were trying to show her realizing that her interpretations of the visions from the fire were all wrong...and that she may now realize they were about Jon Snow, not Stannis...

[Brandon]

- Uh what else... on the mother of dragons... I've basically lost interest in her. Cool, she has a dragon and all, but basically no personality, and always makes really dumb decisions, it seems.

 

If you think show-Dany is stupid and annoying, you should try reading her book arc. By the time I finished book 5, I was hoping one of the dragons would eat her.

 

Otherwise, I thought it was a good episode that brings us more or less to the same point as the end of the last book, although they definitely rushed the final scene. All that time wasted on Olly this season could've been put to better use, but whatever. In any event, I'm not in the slightest bit convinced that Jon is permanently dead in either the books or the show, regardless of how many times they send Kit Harrington out for interviews saying otherwise.

 

I don't think Stannis is dead, either, but on that, I'm less certain. It seemed to me that Brienne was unsure at the end, having built Stannis up as one thing in her own mind and instead being confronted with a pathetic, broken man in the end. I think she spared him, and at this point, for Stannis, that may well be worse than death. If he didn't realize at the start of the episode that Melisandre had led him down a dark path on a fool's errand, he clearly did by the last time we saw him.

[Rubes]

I don't think Stannis is dead, either, but on that, I'm less certain. It seemed to me that Brienne was unsure at the end, having built Stannis up as one thing in her own mind and instead being confronted with a pathetic, broken man in the end. I think she spared him, and at this point, for Stannis, that may well be worse than death. If he didn't realize at the start of the episode that Melisandre had led him down a dark path on a fool's errand, he clearly did by the last time we saw him.

 

The funny thing is, you know after reading the books that nobody is dead unless it is absolutely clear that they are dead. And even then, some of them can still come back to life, like Catelyn and Dondarrion.

 

But yeah, the show specifically did not show Stannis dying, or for that matter the Hound. Although I think Stannis is dead, we didn't actually see his head get chopped off, so I suppose it's possible that he's not...

[Deranged Rhino]

 

As for Melisandre, I agree, I think she'll be the one to bring JS back, though there's no foreshadowing of it like there is in the books. If there was some Ghost reference at the end, I would be more confident in that.

 

 

 

I thought there was plenty of foreshadowing there. She showed up at Castle Black alone in one scene and then set up Snow's death in the next/final scene

 

There was even more foreshadowing of Melisandre (possibly) being the one to save Snow in the show than in the book. In season 3 (?) she meets Thoros of Myr and examines Dondarrion after Arya witnesses him being resurrected and asks Thoros "how many times has the Lord brought him back?"

 

These three never meet in the books, and I thought it was strange at the time that she met them in the show -- but it makes sense if she is the one who brings Jon back.

 

 

Entertainment Weekly: "...So let me ask you: Is Jon really dead?"

Harrington: "This is my understanding of it. I had a sit-down with Dan and David, we did the Tony Soprano walk [letting an actor know they’re being whacked]. And they said, “Look, you’re gone, it’s done.” "...Quite honestly, I have never been told the future of things in this show, but this is the one time I have. They sat me down and said, “This is how it is.” If anything in the future is not like that, then I don’t know about it – it’s only in David and Dan and George’s heads. But I’ve been told I’m dead. I’m dead. I’m not coming back next season. So that’s all I can tell you, really.

 

http://www.ew.com/article/2015/06/14/game-thrones-jon-dies-interview

 

 

They're being very specific with their wording it seems. Jon Snow is dead. When he's brought back, he'll no longer be Jon Snow. He'll be himself, but then not. Like how Gandalf the Grey died and came back as Gandalf the White.

 

100%, LB.

 

Kit has a deal for two more seasons, he signed it in October of '14. He's also on the shooting schedule for season 6. Despite what EW says, he's not gone from the show.