Scott chandler re signs with Bills

[Kirby Jackson]

 

do you realize what they were the year before with Fitz? In the first 4 weeks the Bills lead the NFL in red zone efficiency? guess who the TE was.

 

do you realize what they were one of the last 2 teams to score over 20 ppg on in the the first 4 weeks of the year?

do you realize its a team effort and that also involves coaching / play calling?

 

Like what Dorkington wrote. He's NOT the best, but he's FAR from the worst.

 

your assumption is that I don't want the best TE. You are wrong. The truth of it is ... I'm not delusional enough to expect it.

 

so please read my post again - get over it.

This is not meant to be antagonistic so I apologize if it comes off that way but where do you rank Chandler in terms of tight ends? I have my list above of the 23 guys that I have ahead of him and I am just curious to see where someone that likes him ranks him. I am not a big fan of Scott Chandler's but I tried to approach it objectively. I would trade Chandler 1 for 1 for any guy on that list now. There are others that with the opportunity could be added as well (ie Ed Dickson) & then some that with age could fall off (ie Heath Miller).

[C.Biscuit97]

Kinda torn on this. I like Chandler and think he's solid. But I want more than solid. TE can be a match up nightmare. Chandler isn't. But you could do much worse (we have). I hope this means Mike Evans and maybe they can get a rawer TE with a lot of upside later in the draft.

 

Mike Evans is my first choice but Ebron was very interesting.

[Kirby Jackson]

I give the Bills as much **** as anyone on this board, but how can you be upset at this?

 

Very solid player for us and if anything, he provides depth at the position.

I don't want to speak for everyone and despite Whaley's comments I think that they are now content at TE. If they have a chance to upgrade maybe they will but I would not at all be surprised if the TE group is now set.

 

While Chandler is okay I guess in no way is the football team any better. If Moeaki is healthy The TE group is better but if not it is still one of the weakest position groups on the team. They had chances to upgrade (and I am not talking about Jimmy Graham) but someone like Jermichael Finley could have improved a weak position. That's how I view it anyways.

[Doc]

Sounds promising

Yeah, I'm glad they're at least saying they're not satisfied with the TE position.

[NoSaint]

While Chandler is okay I guess in no way is the football team any better. If Moeaki is healthy The TE group is better but if not it is still one of the weakest position groups on the team. They had chances to upgrade (and I am not talking about Jimmy Graham) but someone like Jermichael Finley could have improved a weak position. That's how I view it anyways.

 

finley couldve been a pretty big boom or bust one would be my only counterpoint - chandler sets a floor that finley might not wherever he ends up, despite the potential (likelihood, even) to be better than chandler.

[Kirby Jackson]

 

 

finley couldve been a pretty big boom or bust one would be my only counterpoint - chandler sets a floor that finley might not wherever he ends up, despite the potential (likelihood, even) to be better than chandler.

I don't disagree at all. I think Moeaki is the same way. He was on the verge of being really good. I remember Peter King writing about him right before he got hurt. I would venture to say that at least 1 of them would be good to go.

[NoSaint]

I don't disagree at all. I think Moeaki is the same way. He was on the verge of being really good. I remember Peter King writing about him right before he got hurt. I would venture to say that at least 1 of them would be good to go.

 

maybe we end up with ASJ in the second, moeaki is the one that ends up coming back strong, and chandler is a role player!

 

 

[KD in CA]

Are you actually yawning or just saying yawn?

 

Perhaps he was dictating.

[1billsfan]

do you realize what they were the year before with Fitz? In the first 4 weeks the Bills lead the NFL in red zone efficiency? guess who the TE was.

 

do you realize what they were one of the last 2 teams to score over 20 ppg on in the the first 4 weeks of the year?

do you realize its a team effort and that also involves coaching / play calling?

 

Like what Dorkington wrote. He's NOT the best, but he's FAR from the worst.

 

your assumption is that I don't want the best TE. You are wrong. The truth of it is ... I'm not delusional enough to expect it.

 

so please read my post again - get over it.

 

 

I just went back in your Scott Chandler time machine and saw that he had 4 TDs in those first four games of 2012. Bravo for finding that…

 

…however, over the last 30 games Scott Chandler has played for the Bills he has had exactly 4 TDs. I repeat, Scott Chandler has had FOUR TDs in the last THIRTY games.

 

You seriously need to get over Eric Ebron becoming a Buffalo Bill...LOL

[Cash]

Overall, I'm mildly happy about this signing, assuming the $$ was comparable to his last deal. I get Kirby's point about upgrading the position and all that, but 1.) I'm not as low on Chandler as he is, and 2.) I firmly believe that you upgrade positions by keeping your decent+ players and adding to them, not by changing names at the top and leaving the garbage below untouched. In other words, to get better at TE, we should be looking to get rid of Lee Smith and/or Chris Gragg, not Scott Chandler.

 

Now, having listened to Doug Whaley's interview on WGR, here's my very subjective take: First off, when they asked if he was set with TEs currently on the roster, he did technically say 'no', but immediately spun that into the 2 classic clichés of "we're always looking to upgrade at every position" and "it creates competition". Later in the interview, he spoke lovingly of all 4 TEs currently on the roster, saying they have different strengths:

 

Smith - Blocking (Toad)

Gragg - Speed (Princess)

Chandler - Size (Luigi)

Moeaki - Combo of all. (Mario)

 

Q: "Are you planning on [Moeaki] being a *big* factor on this team?"

Whaley: "That's the plan." (Then went right into more cliché about competition.)

 

So my (again, highly subjective) takeaway from all this is that there's zero chance they sign another FA TE, and Ebron at #9 is very unlikely. Wouldn't 100% rule out Ebron, especially in a trade down, but given that Ebron is a pass-catcher with questions about his blocking, he doesn't seem like a great fit next to Chandler. I think Plan A is Chandler & Moeaki compete for the starting job, and the loser probably still plays in 2-TE sets, with Moeaki being more of the blocking TE in those sets whether he starts or not. I think Plan B is Moeaki flames out, and we run back the TEs we had last year. I think the Bills will be open to drafting a TE in round 2 or later, but would only do it if they really do value a guy above where they're drafting. I want Troy Niklas, but I have difficulty thinking they'd take him in round 2 over whatever of WR/OT they didn't take at #9. (FWIW, Whaley did mention how deep the OT class was, for those of you who want or expect the Bills to pass on OT at #9.) If Niklas or AS-J was there in the 3rd, I think the Bills might pull the trigger.

[BillsFan-4-Ever]

This is not meant to be antagonistic so I apologize if it comes off that way but where do you rank Chandler in terms of tight ends? I have my list above of the 23 guys that I have ahead of him and I am just curious to see where someone that likes him ranks him. I am not a big fan of Scott Chandler's but I tried to approach it objectively. I would trade Chandler 1 for 1 for any guy on that list now. There are others that with the opportunity could be added as well (ie Ed Dickson) & then some that with age could fall off (ie Heath Miller).

Whats wrong with (hoping to) having a great TE found in FA and a good TE already on the team?

seriously guys

 

http://sportsillustr...0386/index.html

from the (AP) - Scott Chandler is returning to Buffalo, where he spent the past three seasons establishing himself as the Bills' top pass-catching tight end.

Chandler is coming off a year in which he set career highs with 53 catches and 655 yards.

 

12th in the NFL in yards (which to some sucks) - w/ lets say 20 teams worse off.

http://sports.yahoo.com/nfl/stats/byposition?pos=TE&conference=NFL&year=season_2013&timeframe=All&sort=28&old_category=TE

 

----------

Hoping to find a great TE in the draft on day 1 is IMO a reach. The draft is a crapshoot, sometimes you strike it rich

Edited March 14, 2014 by BillsFan-4-Ever

[Kirby Jackson]

 

Whats wrong with (hoping to) having a great TE found in FA and a good TE already on the team?

seriously guys

 

http://sportsillustr...0386/index.html

from the (AP) - Scott Chandler is returning to Buffalo, where he spent the past three seasons establishing himself as the Bills' top pass-catching tight end.

Chandler is coming off a year in which he set career highs with 53 catches and 655 yards.

 

12th in the NFL in yards (which to some sucks) - w/ lets say 20 teams worse off.

http://sports.yahoo.com/nfl/stats/byposition?pos=TE&conference=NFL&year=season_2013&timeframe=All&sort=28&old_category=TE

 

----------

Hoping to find a great TE in the draft on day 1 is IMO a reach. The draft is a crapshoot, sometimes you strike it rich

I don't disagree that it is unlikely in the 1st. My question was where would you rank Chandler as an NFL TE? You seem to like him more than some. I have him at 24.

[BillsFan-4-Ever]

I don't disagree that it is unlikely in the 1st. My question was where would you rank Chandler as an NFL TE? You seem to like him more than some. I have him at 24.

as the stats I posted indicated - above average - 12th in the league

[NoSaint]

 

as the stats I posted indicated - above average - 12th in the league

 

are there 12 on kirbys earlier posted list that you dont think are better? genuinely curious if you are going just on gut or looking at the names

[Kirby Jackson]

 

 

are there 12 on kirbys earlier posted list that you dont think are better? genuinely curious if you are going just on gut or looking at the names

That's what I was getting at. I really tried to be objective. There may be a few that you could argue Chandler over but you'd have to be wearing your Bills goggles to get anywhere close to 12. Edited March 14, 2014 by Kirby Jackson

[1billsfan]

That's what I was getting at.

 

He's trying to make a case that the Bills are all set with Chandler as their starting TE and he failed. Notice that when I pointed out Chandler has scored a measly 4 TDs in the last 30 games he stopped responding to my posts?

 

Any Bills fan who is accepting of that kind of production from for our TE position is plain and simply delusional. Chandler is a bottom of the barrel NFL starter. The Bills and specifically their 1st rd QB pick EJ Manuel deserve to get the best TE they can this offseason. It's not Scott Chandler, hopefully they draft Eric Ebron who will become one of the best TEs in the NFL.

Edited March 14, 2014 by 1billsfan

[FLFan]

I don't disagree that it is unlikely in the 1st. My question was where would you rank Chandler as an NFL TE? You seem to like him more than some. I have him at 24.

The only problem with that is Chandler has outperformed many of the TE's you have rated higher over the past few years. I am not sure I understand your criteria.

 

Chandler is certainly not elite. He is average to above average. He lacks speed certainly. I would love for the Bills to have an elite TE, but compared to the other FA options this year once Graham and Pitta were locked up, I am fine with Chandler. Finley could be the exception, but he may or may not be healthy, and who knows if wanted to even leave GB. I would rather the Bills focus the draft on a potential #1 WR, OT, OG in that order, and resigning Chandler allows them to do that.

 

As to TD production, do you think the QB position may have a bit to do with that?

Edited March 14, 2014 by MDFan

[Kirby Jackson]

He's trying to make a case that the Bills are all set with Chandler as their starting TE and he failed. Notice that when I pointed out Chandler has scored a measly 4 TDs in the last 30 games he stopped responding to my posts?

 

Any Bills fan who is accepting of that kind of production from for our TE position is plain and simply delusional. Chandler is a bottom of the barrel NFL starter. The Bills and specifically their 1st rd QB pick EJ Manuel deserve to get the best TE they can this offseason. It's not Scott Chandler, hopefully they draft Eric Ebron who will become one of the best TEs in the NFL.

I am really not trying to be antagonistic. I admittedly am not a big fan of Chandler so I want to know if I am being overly harsh on him. I just couldn't justify putting him ahead of any of those other 23 and then there are guys like DIckson, Zach Miller and Pettigrew that could all be considered ahead of him.

 

The only problem with that is Chandler has outperformed many of the TE's you have rated higher over the past few years. I am not sure I understand your criteria.

 

Chandler is certainly not elite. He is average to above average. He lacks speed certainly. I would love for the Bills to have an elite TE, but compared to the other FA options this year once Graham and Pitta were locked up, I am fine with Chandler. Finley could be the exception, but he may or may not be healthy, and who knows if wanted to even leave GB. I would rather the Bills focus the draft on a potential #1 WR, OT, OG in that order, and resigning Chandler allows them to do that.

 

As to TD production, do you think the QB position may have a bit to do with that?

The criteria is would you trade Chandler straight up for that guy? If you could get Jermaine Gresham for Chandler would you (for example)? Not factoring in salary cap or anything else to get messy. Simply would you rather Chandler or ___

[Cash]

I think that he has had a lot of opportunities as well. Here is my list of TE that I would rather have (in no particular order): J. Graham, G. Graham, Gronk, Gates, Gresham, Gonzalez (maybe we need a TE that's last name starts with a "G"), Pitta, Witten, Daniels, Rudolph, Eiffert, Cameron, Thomas, Charles Clay, Greg Olsen, Reed, Miller, Ertz, Bennett, Finley, Fleener, Cook, and Davis. That's 23 by my count (including Gonzalez but not the rookies) that I would trade Chandler straight up for.

are there 12 on kirbys earlier posted list that you dont think are better? genuinely curious if you are going just on gut or looking at the names

 

I know no one's asking me, but I'll take a stab anyway. I don't like a straight linear ranking, though -- how big a difference is there between the 16th and 17th best guy? So I'll go more tier-based:

 

Tier 1

Jimmy Graham

Gronkowski (significantly lower, but only due to health concerns)

 

Tier 2

Witten

Vernon Davis

Julius Thomas

Jordan Cameron

 

Tier 3

Gates

Olsen

Jordan Reed If He Stays Healthy

Charles Clay

Heath Miller (only b/c he's a very good blocker. As a pure receiver, he'd be a tier or two lower.)

 

Tier 4

Martellus Bennett (borderline Tier 3)

Dennis Pitta (borderline Tier 3 if healthy)

Ladarius Green (I think he'll be Tier 3 or 2 if anything happens to Gates)

Brent Celek

Pettigrew

Delanie Walker

Chandler

Fleener

Ertz

Kyle Rudolph

Jared Cook

Garrett Graham

Gresham

 

Tier 5

Zach Miller

Brandon Myers

Owen Daniels

Ed Dickson

Jermichael Finley (always been overrated, and now has major medical concerns)

Tony Gonzalez (dude, Gonzo retired. You can't count retired players. That bumps Chandler up to 23rd in your ranks.)

 

So I'd put 11 TEs clearly ahead of Chandler, to the point where they'd be very significant upgrades. I'd probably rather have some of the Tier 4 guys than Chandler, but at what cost? We haven't seen the details of Chandler's new contract yet, but the old one was for peanuts. I definitely think Pitta or Bennett would be an upgrade over Chandler, but either one (esp. Pitta) might be making double what Chandler is making. I don't think either one is $2-3 million/year better than Chandler. Pettigrew is fairly close, but based on blocking alone, he might be an upgrade over Chandler even though he's a Robert Royal-esque receiver. I'd definitely rather have Chandler at (guessing here) 2 years, $6mil than Pettigrew at 4 years, $16mil. Pettigrew is not so much better than Chandler that he's worth 50% more per year.

 

Now, if we're paying Chandler something like 2 years, $10+ million, I will absolutely change my tune. For now, I'll assume he's making significantly less. If the money was equal amongst all Tier 4 guys, I'd probably put Chandler something like 18th overall, but again, without much difference between #14 and #24.

[Kirby Jackson]

Cash, I counted Gonzalez instead of the rookies. I guess that I would put ASJ & Ebron (maybe Amaro) on otherwise and take Gonzo off. I was trying to give Chandler the benefit of the doubt. I just think that some of those other guys have more ability and less opportunity. There are some (like Fleener) that I would trade Chandler for without blinking and then others (Pettigrew or Daniels) that you could go either way on.

 

He is what he is. Chandler is a mediocre TE with limited athletic ability and a big frame. You could do worse (the Bills have) but you could easily do better. Great post though!!

Edited March 14, 2014 by Kirby Jackson