Canadian Bills Fan Posted August 24, 2012 Share Posted August 24, 2012 http://www.cbc.ca/sports/cycling/story/2012/08/23/sp-cycling-lance-armstrong-doping-appeal-charges.html?cmp=rss What does everyone think? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Poojer Posted August 24, 2012 Share Posted August 24, 2012 has he failed any tests? i know they are saying they have samples indicating doping signs, but has any of that been formally released??? this is very bizarre Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Canadian Bills Fan Posted August 24, 2012 Author Share Posted August 24, 2012 They say they have two of his former teammates who would testify in court that he was doping. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Beerball Posted August 24, 2012 Share Posted August 24, 2012 has he failed any tests? i know they are saying they have samples indicating doping signs, but has any of that been formally released??? this is very bizarre Common man, he's dirty & has always been dirty (always meaning for each of his Tour wins). They say they have two of his former teammates who would testify in court that he was doping. Minor clarification...from what I heard if Armstrong wanted to contest this it would be done in front of an independent arbitrator. (apologies if that's bad info) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Canadian Bills Fan Posted August 24, 2012 Author Share Posted August 24, 2012 I'm shocked and torn...half of me really blieves Lance but then there is always doubt. I can't see Lance as the type of person who would cheat. He has had haters ever since he owned the Tour de France Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
truth on hold Posted August 24, 2012 Share Posted August 24, 2012 (edited) Innocent or guilty I think he's doing the right thing at this point. This is like quadruple jeopardy. His statement is a little fishy sounding but again i agree with the conclusion : http://lancearmstrong.com/news-events/lance-armstongs-statement-of-august-23-2012 Edited August 24, 2012 by Joe_the_6_pack Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KD in CA Posted August 24, 2012 Share Posted August 24, 2012 I think the US government spending millions of dollars on a witch hunt of a retired athlete because he may or may not have doped up for a bike race that was run in another country ten years ago is about the stupidest thing I have ever heard outside of PPP. And by the way, how exactly does the US strip anyone of a title in France's race? p.s. if the guy never failed a drug test, that makes it even more of an abomination. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Poojer Posted August 24, 2012 Share Posted August 24, 2012 based on what? speculation? association...if so, I guess i have been wrong about jeter and that asshat is right.... Common man, he's dirty & has always been dirty (always meaning for each of his Tour wins). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dpberr Posted August 24, 2012 Share Posted August 24, 2012 If you are innocent of doing something, you don't get tired defending yourself no matter how long it takes or how arduous the task becomes. You beat that drum until you physically can't. Not only have you put doubt into the minds of the general public, but also your kids minds. At best, dad looks like a quitter. At worst, he's a quitter *and* a cheater. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RkFast Posted August 24, 2012 Share Posted August 24, 2012 (edited) Whats damning for LA is the fact that there are a ton of former teammates, racers, soigners (assistants on the team) who have, from what Im reading, are ready to testify against LA. Still, its odd to me that the USADA has the jurisdiction to strip him of his titles, especially without an admision or a failed test from that specific event. This isnt the NFL with one governing body. Theres the USADA, WADA, CAS, UCI and the race organizers, ASO who all have a say. Confused yet? Yeah, me too. As far as testing goes, be careful. The "never had a failed test" thing is a weak argument. Its bloody EASY to foil a test, especially back in the day when Lance raced. All he needed to do was carefully keep his doping "doses", if you will, below the testing threshold, which wasnt hard and would still provide an advantage to him. I was a HUGE LA fanboy. And I watch the entrie pro cycling calendar from the Tour Down Under in Jan, right through the Tour de Faso in late Fall. I think there have been few riders with the talent, natural ability and mental edge that LA has. Think Bruce Smith's physical talent with Jim Kelly's brashness, leadership and "head for the game." He is that good. So its not like some punch and judy competitor "stole" anything. Doping or not, he was still one of the best ever. Even back when he was a kid, he would show up at local races and ride the whole field off his wheel like they were standing still. But with that said...he also did stuff that would be borderline impossible to do WITHOUT doping. He and the others racing in the early 2000s were going so damned fast it was insane. I can watch this year's tour, go back and watch a clip of the 1999 tour and see the difference in the flat out speed clear as day. NO WAY they werent all doping. And the fact that virtually every rider LA raced against has been dinged for doping confirms that. And there is a mountain of damning evidence and stories that is just too much to ignore. Its a huge list. Here is is.... http://www.cyclingne...-over-the-years Bottom line, its a sad day, but one the pro cycling world and the regular riding Spandex Mafia (proud member!) have been waiting on for a long time. There are some tears and a bit of anger, but mostly relief and feelings of justification. Edited August 24, 2012 by RkFast Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jim in Anchorage Posted August 24, 2012 Share Posted August 24, 2012 Whats damning for LA is the fact that there are a ton of former teammates, racers, soigners (assistants on the team) who have, from what Im reading, are ready to testify against LA. Still, its odd to me that the USADA has the jurisdiction to strip him of his titles, especially without an admision or a failed test from that specific event. This isnt the NFL with one governing body. Theres the USADA, WADA, CAS, UCI and the race organizers, ASO who all have a say. Confused yet? Yeah, me too. As far as testing goes, be careful. The "never had a failed test" thing is a weak argument. Its bloody EASY to foil a test, especially back in the day when Lance raced. All he needed to do was carefully keep his doping "doses", if you will, below the testing threshold, which wasnt hard and would still provide an advantage to him. I was a HUGE LA fanboy. And I watch the entrie pro cycling calendar from the Tour Down Under in Jan, right through the Tour de Faso in late Fall. I think there have been few riders with the talent, natural ability and mental edge that LA has. Think Bruce Smith's physical talent with Jim Kelly's leadership and "head for the game." He is that good. SO its not like some punch and judy competitor "stole" anything. Doping or not, he was still one of the best ever. But...he also did stuff that would be borderline impossible to do WITHOUT doping. He and the others racing in the early 2000s were going so damned fast it was insane. NO WAY they werent all doping. And the fact that virtually every rider LA raced against has been dinged for doping confirms that. And there is a mountain of damning evidence and stories that is just too much to ignore. Its a huge list. Here is is.... http://www.cyclingne...-over-the-years I think your post fits the legal definition of hearsay. Which is all anyone has on him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RkFast Posted August 24, 2012 Share Posted August 24, 2012 (edited) I think your post fits the legal definition of hearsay. Which is all anyone has on him. Seriously? THIS is your response to what I posted? I gave you a !@#$ing list of the allegations against him since 99. Did you even bother to click? And whats "hearsay?" You DO realize there are sworn, sealed testimonies made by former teammates that would have come out if it went to arbitration, right? You do realize LA made a $450,000 payoff through a swiss bank account to Michele Ferrari, considered the "Dr. Feelgood" of Pro Cycling two yesars after Ferrari was banned from the sport and LA swore off ever working with him again? Of course you do! Edited August 24, 2012 by RkFast Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Poojer Posted August 24, 2012 Share Posted August 24, 2012 i agree with that for most people...but lance armstrong 'beat' cancer a couple of times, maybe that changed his perspective on what is and what isn't important in terms of a fight.... If you are innocent of doing something, you don't get tired defending yourself no matter how long it takes or how arduous the task becomes. You beat that drum until you physically can't. Not only have you put doubt into the minds of the general public, but also your kids minds. At best, dad looks like a quitter. At worst, he's a quitter *and* a cheater. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NoSaint Posted August 24, 2012 Share Posted August 24, 2012 (edited) If you are innocent of doing something, you don't get tired defending yourself no matter how long it takes or how arduous the task becomes. You beat that drum until you physically can't. Not only have you put doubt into the minds of the general public, but also your kids minds. At best, dad looks like a quitter. At worst, he's a quitter *and* a cheater. obviously as an outsider its easy to say this. but maybe hes generally happy in life right now, has an identity beyond those accomplishments, and would prefer to enjoy his day rather than fight until he is physically exhausted. just because its your priority, doesnt mean you can 100% project it on to him and say because hes not doing what you would do that he is obviously guilty. it certainly doesnt look good, but hes been fighting allegations like this for years. maybe hes just tired of it now? or maybe he did it. i agree with that for most people...but lance armstrong 'beat' cancer a couple of times, maybe that changed his perspective on what is and what isn't important in terms of a fight.... didnt get this far before my first post, but exactly what i was getting at. maybe he appreciates not sitting in a court room, having articles speculating about what he did, being a topic on first take daily for the next 6 months etc.... more than he does the titles that he is losing. having his days be as enjoyable as possible might be far more important to the guy at this point than is proving something to the world, that in the end doesnt much matter. or maybe he did it. Edited August 24, 2012 by NoSaint Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jim in Anchorage Posted August 24, 2012 Share Posted August 24, 2012 Seriously? THIS is your response to what I posted? I gave you a !@#$ing list of the allegations against him since 99. Did you even bother to click? And whats "hearsay?" You DO realize there are sworn, sealed testimonies made by former teammates that would have come out if it went to arbitration, right? You do realize LA made a $450,000 payoff through a swiss bank account to Michele Ferrari, considered the "Dr. Feelgood" of Pro Cycling two yesars after Ferrari was banned from the sport and LA swore off ever working with him again? Of course you do! Point me to a positive blood test. Not he's too good to be real stuff, or a [jealous] team mate saying yeah LA was a dopper. Hard, scientific proof. And please there where no good dope tests in 2000? The guys been under a microscope for years, always came up clean. I don't blame him for saying the hell with it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DC Tom Posted August 24, 2012 Share Posted August 24, 2012 Seriously? THIS is your response to what I posted? I gave you a !@#$ing list of the allegations against him since 99. Did you even bother to click? And whats "hearsay?" You DO realize there are sworn, sealed testimonies made by former teammates that would have come out if it went to arbitration, right? You do realize LA made a $450,000 payoff through a swiss bank account to Michele Ferrari, considered the "Dr. Feelgood" of Pro Cycling two yesars after Ferrari was banned from the sport and LA swore off ever working with him again? Of course you do! Actually your list is very thin on evidence and very long on hearsay. And a payoff? Really? How come I can't find a single reference to that anywhere? How'd that even get around Swiss banking practices to get found out? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RkFast Posted August 24, 2012 Share Posted August 24, 2012 (edited) Point me to a positive blood test. Not he's too good to be real stuff, or a [jealous] team mate saying yeah LA was a dopper. Hard, scientific proof. And please there where no good dope tests in 2000? The guys been under a microscope for years, always came up clean. I don't blame him for saying the hell with it. You had absolutely zero idea what youre talking about. None. Go do some research. I have. Im telling you I follow this sport closely, have read a lot about it and have follwed LA's career closely. Not his apperances on The Tonight Show. His actual racing career. But you just dismiss my opinion like I have no clue? So OK......go do some research on your own and get back to me. Google is your friend. Actually your list is very thin on evidence and very long on hearsay. Tom, there is sworn testimony made against LA. And a payoff? Really? How come I can't find a single reference to that anywhere? How'd that even get around Swiss banking practices to get found out? http://www.cyclingne...ferrari-in-2006 Edited August 24, 2012 by RkFast Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mike in Syracuse Posted August 24, 2012 Share Posted August 24, 2012 I simply can't envision a scenario where a multiple time Tour winner would just "give up" his titles if there wasn't something there. If he truly didn't dope wouldn't he be screaming from the mountaintops? I think he's guilty as hell... Point me to a positive blood test. Not he's too good to be real stuff, or a [jealous] team mate saying yeah LA was a dopper. Hard, scientific proof. And please there where no good dope tests in 2000? The guys been under a microscope for years, always came up clean. I don't blame him for saying the hell with it. Really, so you'd just give up your titles and quit? bull ****, you'd be screaming till the day you died that you didn't do anything and that they need to !@#$ing prove it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RkFast Posted August 24, 2012 Share Posted August 24, 2012 if you want a good rundown, this is it. Some of the info is outdated. For example, it says George Hincapie has been supoenead (I cant friggin spell). As of today, he ehas testified. http://www.bicycling.com/news/pro-cycling/you-jury Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shrader Posted August 24, 2012 Share Posted August 24, 2012 If you are innocent of doing something, you don't get tired defending yourself no matter how long it takes or how arduous the task becomes. You beat that drum until you physically can't. Not only have you put doubt into the minds of the general public, but also your kids minds. At best, dad looks like a quitter. At worst, he's a quitter *and* a cheater. It's not exactly a life or death fight though that would keep him out of jail or anything serious like that. The only thing he loses if he's ever proven to be guilty of doping is some endorsements, but is he even getting much in endorsements anymore? He made a ton of money over the years thanks to those races and they're not going to take it away at this point. They may has well be accusing him of peeing in a pool when he was 10. It has very little impact on him moving forward in life. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts