jjmac Posted January 19, 2012 Share Posted January 19, 2012 Can he play both guard and center positions? Without a doubt. How do you know this for certain? I like taking solid players, with proven, consistent performance from winning programs when drafting in the first round. Whitney Mercilus is not that player. May I ask why from a winning program is important? John Elway did not have a winning record at Stanford. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Big Cat Posted January 19, 2012 Share Posted January 19, 2012 How do you know this for certain? May I ask why from a winning program is important? John Elway did not have a winning record at Stanford. John Elway was drafted 29 years ago. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dpberr Posted January 19, 2012 Share Posted January 19, 2012 How do you know this for certain? May I ask why from a winning program is important? John Elway did not have a winning record at Stanford. I think it's important, especially on defense. Looking at the college pipeline into the NFL, winning programs contribute the greatest number of NFL players. When you think of the teams that have historically contributed the most NFL players... USC, Miami, Pittsburgh, Florida State, Penn State, Ohio State, etc. you can readily establish years or decades of winning programs and NFL talent. You want that top ten pick to be as safe and as sure a bet as possible. You want to eliminate that bust potential as much as possible. You want your player to have faced the tough competition and performed well against it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RyanC883 Posted January 19, 2012 Share Posted January 19, 2012 I hope they draft him. Putting up the numbers he did against Big 10 offensive lines is impressive. Upshaw is "good" all around, but does not strike me as "spectacular" in any one area. We need a specultacular pass rusher. But, I wouldn't be upset with Upshaw at all. I love drafting Alabama players. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
#34fan Posted January 19, 2012 Share Posted January 19, 2012 I think it's important, especially on defense. Looking at the college pipeline into the NFL, winning programs contribute the greatest number of NFL players. When you think of the teams that have historically contributed the most NFL players... USC, Miami, Pittsburgh, Florida State, Penn State, Ohio State, etc. you can readily establish years or decades of winning programs and NFL talent. You want that top ten pick to be as safe and as sure a bet as possible. You want to eliminate that bust potential as much as possible. You want your player to have faced the tough competition and performed well against it. For defensive players, I don't think it's that big of an issue. Brian Urlacher and James Harrison came out of 4-7 and 6-5 programs, respectively. Urlacher came out of New Mexico, and Harrison from Kent State. Neither school is known as a football power-house. Illinois' year started off good, but got bogged down in the meat of their schedule. (Ohio State, Michigan, Penn State, Wisconsin) None of whom blew Illinois out. The Fighting Illini were in every last one of those games, mostly due to their defense. The problem I have with your line of thinking is that it tends to overlook natural GEMS. I love picking from the SEC, but there are other good conferences out there. With a player like Mercilus, you can't just look at wins. You must consider strongly the following: Attitude, Competition level, Productivity, and Work-ethic. I think pedigree is important, but high-profile Alma-maters, don't always produce winners IMO. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
playman Posted January 19, 2012 Share Posted January 19, 2012 getting his sacks on a losing team is even more impressive. because the opposing teams werent in catch-up mode but rather consuming clock. so more sacks in less pass attempts Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
syrcuse315 Posted January 20, 2012 Share Posted January 20, 2012 (edited) getting his sacks on a losing team is even more impressive. because the opposing teams werent in catch-up mode but rather consuming clock. so more sacks in less pass attempts Illinois also blitzed over 50% of the time on defense this year causing tons of 1v1's and free rushers to the quarterback. Whether it was one extra rusher or multiple, Illinois confused offenses by sending so many guys so often at the quarterback. When I watched them vs Penn State and their bowl game I was amazed. At one point during the Penn State game I think Illinois blitzed like 8 consecutive defensive plays, stopped for one or two plays and then did it again. All I'm saying is that when you bring that many blitzers people are bound to get free easier and have a chance for more sacks. I think due to this his stats are slightly inflated but he is still a great player from what I've seen. At pick 10? I'd lean toward no but things can always change. Edited January 20, 2012 by syrcuse315 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JOE IN HAMPTON ROADS Posted January 20, 2012 Share Posted January 20, 2012 How confusing for the the announcers would it be to have both Marcell Dareus and Mercilus playing DE? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OldTimer1960 Posted January 20, 2012 Share Posted January 20, 2012 I hope they draft him. Putting up the numbers he did against Big 10 offensive lines is impressive. Upshaw is "good" all around, but does not strike me as "spectacular" in any one area. We need a specultacular pass rusher. But, I wouldn't be upset with Upshaw at all. I love drafting Alabama players. The Big 10 is known for big strong OL, not necessarily elite athletic LTs. Yes, I know Jake Long was from the Big 10. Remember, Aaron Maybin put up a lot of sacks in one season of Big 10 play. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BillsCelticsAngelsBama Posted January 21, 2012 Share Posted January 21, 2012 (edited) isnt Whitney Mercilus another one year wonder? He caused turnovers... but look at him when he lines up... almost a replica of a DE/OLB from the same conference that we drafted a few years ago (Maybin). Please JUST SAY NO !! You think we're going to draft Dave DeCastro with our first pick? Man oh man, TSW would be a mess if that happened. Very good player, but not @ 10 And the Bills would be a mess if they draft Whitney at #10. Some players take time to mature and develop, lots of players have had only 1 great yr at the CFB level and go on to have a great career in the pro`s. Al Smith and JPP are to of the more recent players to be labeled with the 1yr wonders. Look what these 2 players have been able to do with there current teams, Whitney Mericulus is a Beast, 6-4 268 long arms very strong at the POA, has an array of moves from the bullrush to speed rush the man is an all round talent. I would love to see this guy line up next to Dareus and Williams and if Merriman can get healthy. Who knows we might end up in the top 10 in sacks next season... LET`s go Bills. Make it happen BUDDY!!! Can I borrow your old Maybin jersey ? Edited January 21, 2012 by MOVALLEYRANDY Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mob16151 Posted January 21, 2012 Share Posted January 21, 2012 He caused turnovers... but look at him when he lines up... almost a replica of a DE/OLB from the same conference that we drafted a few years ago (Maybin). Please JUST SAY NO !! And the Bills would be a mess if they draft Whitney at #10. Can I borrow your old Maybin jersey ? Other than playing in the Big 10 Maybin and Mercilus have very little else in common. Mercilus is significantly larger,and stronger than Maybin. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Buffalo Barbarian Posted January 21, 2012 Author Share Posted January 21, 2012 Other than playing in the Big 10 Maybin and Mercilus have very little else in common. Mercilus is significantly larger,and stronger than Maybin. This Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Coach Tuesday Posted January 21, 2012 Share Posted January 21, 2012 They don't have to be from winning programs, but Nix and Co. like team captains and 3- or 4- year starters with few injuries during their college career. I don't know if Mercilus fits those categories or not. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CBD Posted January 21, 2012 Share Posted January 21, 2012 They don't have to be from winning programs, but Nix and Co. like team captains and 3- or 4- year starters with few injuries during their college career. I don't know if Mercilus fits those categories or not. Definately doesn't fit the 3 or 4 year starter. Mercilus entered this past season with just two career sacks, but he had a break out performance in 2011 as a first-year starter, leading the Big Ten in several categories and ranking among the tops in all of college football. He has adequate size and build, but lacks the frame to get much stronger and add bulk ? has long arms and big hands to create problems for blockers. Mercilus is still developing and is more of an athlete than polished pass rusher at this point, but he is a high effort player with a nonstop motor and simply finds ways to get to the backfield. He looks like a poor man?s Aldon Smith and will be best used by a creative defensive coordinator who moves him around the defensive front ? a one-year performer, but has the make-up to be a top-40 pick in April. http://www.cbssports.com/nfl/draft/players/1689559/whitney-mercilus Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bobobonators Posted January 21, 2012 Share Posted January 21, 2012 I think taking Mercilus at #10 is a bit of a stretch. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KGUN34 Posted January 21, 2012 Share Posted January 21, 2012 Whitney Mercilus is tearing it up tonight. DE Whitney Mercilus might be playing his final game for the Illini. As a finalist for the Nagurski Award as the nation's best defensive player, the junior has the resume to make himself available for the NFL draft. Mercilus lead the nation in sacks (14.5) and sacks per game (1.21). He also broke the Big Ten record with nine forced fumbles, one short of the NCAA record of 10. Mercilus leads the conference with 19.5 tackles for loss. http://www.nfldraftscout.com/ratings/dsprofile.php?pyid=83709&draftyear=2013&genpos=DE http://draftbreakdown.com/whitney-mercilus-vs-asu-2011 Is it me or is this guy a bit sluggish off the line?Is this the best DE available because he is no number 78!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
atlbillsfan1975 Posted January 21, 2012 Share Posted January 21, 2012 I think it's important, especially on defense. Looking at the college pipeline into the NFL, winning programs contribute the greatest number of NFL players. When you think of the teams that have historically contributed the most NFL players... USC, Miami, Pittsburgh, Florida State, Penn State, Ohio State, etc. you can readily establish years or decades of winning programs and NFL talent. You want that top ten pick to be as safe and as sure a bet as possible. You want to eliminate that bust potential as much as possible. You want your player to have faced the tough competition and performed well against it. I think you are right but would say this, maybe take a solid performer from a great confrence...ie the SEC. You have to look no further then Stevie Johnson. He was a one year wonder at Kentucky. But he put up great numbers in his final season. He played against the best college talent every week. He slipped to the seventh round, but when he was drafted i remember looking at his stats and thinking this kid could be a player. Heck i even went on here and said as much. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dpberr Posted January 21, 2012 Share Posted January 21, 2012 For defensive players, I don't think it's that big of an issue. Brian Urlacher and James Harrison came out of 4-7 and 6-5 programs, respectively. Urlacher came out of New Mexico, and Harrison from Kent State. Neither school is known as a football power-house. Illinois' year started off good, but got bogged down in the meat of their schedule. (Ohio State, Michigan, Penn State, Wisconsin) None of whom blew Illinois out. The Fighting Illini were in every last one of those games, mostly due to their defense. The problem I have with your line of thinking is that it tends to overlook natural GEMS. I love picking from the SEC, but there are other good conferences out there. With a player like Mercilus, you can't just look at wins. You must consider strongly the following: Attitude, Competition level, Productivity, and Work-ethic. I think pedigree is important, but high-profile Alma-maters, don't always produce winners IMO. Agreed that both your stated examples are good players. However, in my original post, I stated that I preferred players with established performance from winning programs. Harrison was undrafted only after two years at Kent State and took a while to develop and was a one year wonder at Kent State. Urlacher had an established record of performance. The man was a college legend. I think when you combine the OYW and a losing program, you're taking on a lot of risk for a top ten pick. That's all I'm saying. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RyanC883 Posted January 21, 2012 Share Posted January 21, 2012 Illinois also blitzed over 50% of the time on defense this year causing tons of 1v1's and free rushers to the quarterback. Whether it was one extra rusher or multiple, Illinois confused offenses by sending so many guys so often at the quarterback. When I watched them vs Penn State and their bowl game I was amazed. At one point during the Penn State game I think Illinois blitzed like 8 consecutive defensive plays, stopped for one or two plays and then did it again. All I'm saying is that when you bring that many blitzers people are bound to get free easier and have a chance for more sacks. I think due to this his stats are slightly inflated but he is still a great player from what I've seen. At pick 10? I'd lean toward no but things can always change. Lets draft him and the Illinois D-coordinator to be our new LB coach! Agreed that both your stated examples are good players. However, in my original post, I stated that I preferred players with established performance from winning programs. Harrison was undrafted only after two years at Kent State and took a while to develop and was a one year wonder at Kent State. Urlacher had an established record of performance. The man was a college legend. I think when you combine the OYW and a losing program, you're taking on a lot of risk for a top ten pick. That's all I'm saying. A valid point. No doubt it's a risk. But it's a risk I like better than Maybin. It seems that this draft is lacking the Von Miller/Derus combo last year of instant impact top defensive talent in terms of front 7. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Webster Guy Posted January 21, 2012 Share Posted January 21, 2012 getting his sacks on a losing team is even more impressive. because the opposing teams werent in catch-up mode but rather consuming clock. so more sacks in less pass attempts Good point. They should have a factor built into sacks that takes this into account. Sacks in obvious passing situations vs normal 4 man rush type or something like that. Look at how bad Indy's defense was without Peyton getting them ahead most of the time.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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