Kelsay

[NaPolian8693]

Seemed like Kelsay had yet another solid game to me. It's a few weeks in a row now.

 

He still looks like a fish out of water when they run strange defenses that get him 20 yards downfield, but he played well off the edge and was applying consistent pressure. It's hard to sack Roethlisberger.

 

Give the man some love!

[Dorkington]

Kelsay potentially lost us the game by missing that sack late.

 

He needs to learn to complete his tackles.

 

But otherwise, yeah he was solid.

[eball]

Kelsay potentially lost us the game by missing that sack late.

 

He needs to learn to complete his tackles.

 

But otherwise, yeah he was solid.

And then he potentially won the game, sacking Ben and causing a fumble inside the one.

 

Like another poster said, Ben R. is a tough sonofabitch to bring down, and I've seen him break seemingly sure tackles by players more accomplished than Kelsay.

 

Dude had another very solid game.

[EasternOHBillsFan]

Johnson ALMOST made a big play.

 

McKelvin ALMOST made a big play.

 

Kelsay ALMOST made several big plays, but yet he didn't MAKE the big plays save one. That's why I was constantly yelling at the TV, especially when he had Roethlisberger clean and didn't fully wrap him up. Bruce Smith or Phil Hansen finished their tackles... ALMOST making plays isn't how you win.

[Spiderweb]

Johnson ALMOST made a big play.

 

McKelvin ALMOST made a big play.

 

Kelsay ALMOST made several big plays, but yet he didn't MAKE the big plays save one. That's why I was constantly yelling at the TV, especially when he had Roethlisberger clean and didn't fully wrap him up. Bruce Smith or Phil Hansen finished their tackles... ALMOST making plays isn't how you win.

 

+1

[cantankerous]

 

 

Bruce Smith or Phil Hansen finished their tackles... ALMOST making plays isn't how you win.

 

LMAO!!! What a horrible comparison.

[EasternOHBillsFan]

LMAO!!! What a horrible comparison.

 

Did you EVER complain about Bruce Smith or Phil Hansen not tackling when they had a good shot at a man??

 

NO, and so when you don't have to worry about it, you don't NOTICE IT.

[Zulu Cthulhu]

Becoming like clockwork at this point : )

 

He played better again lining up in the DE spot, but as others have pointed out, his tackling was lacking. Egregiously so on the big ben sack whiff.

 

I know you reflexively make excuses for kelsay, but "big ben is tough to take down" isn't even a good one. We aren't talking about a 180 lb defensive back getting shedded by ben on a blitz - kelsay's a defensive lineman for god's sake. He shouldn't be bouncing off any qb like a pinball on a 3rd and long play.

 

I give credit to kelsay for just getting in position to make that play, but he failed and ben's scramble set up the late field goal that gave pitt the lead.

 

If people are going to scream at stevie "you gotta make that catch!", then those same people should be telling chris "you gotta make that tackle!"

 

Btich all u want, but be consistent.

Edited November 29, 2010 by Zulu Cthulhu

[stony]

Did you EVER complain about Bruce Smith or Phil Hansen not tackling when they had a good shot at a man??

 

NO, and so when you don't have to worry about it, you don't NOTICE IT.

 

Yeah, Jacksonville vs. Buffalo WC Playoff game. Please forgive me not knowing the year, I think it was 1996. JVille running back caught in the backfield for a would be 3yd loss by Bruce. Instead, breaks his tackle, and rips off huge run for TD. Game over. It happens to everyone, comparing our current roster to HOFers and the guy who lined up opposite of him and saw single blocking schemes because of it, is not a good comparison.

[Acantha]

Johnson ALMOST made a big play.

Johnson had 7 catches for 68 yards and kept us in the game.

 

McKelvin ALMOST made a big play.

McKelvin had a solid game and gave us incredible field position with a 49 yard kickoff return.

 

Kelsay ALMOST made several big plays, but yet he didn't MAKE the big plays save one. That's why I was constantly yelling at the TV, especially when he had Roethlisberger clean and didn't fully wrap him up. Bruce Smith or Phil Hansen finished their tackles... ALMOST making plays isn't how you win.

Kelsay made a huge play that kept us in the game and was getting pressure throughout the day.

 

Believe it or not, there were more than 3 plays yesterday. There's a reason they went late into overtime against a team that was supposed to be far superior.

[Zulu Cthulhu]

It's not fair to compare kelsay to bruce, because kelsay couldn't carry bruce's jock.

 

Which is sort of the point - kelsay's just not very good, and "well, he played well for what he is" isn't a very convincing argument for keeping him on a below average defensive line for the next 3-4 years.

Edited November 29, 2010 by Zulu Cthulhu

[stony]

Johnson had 7 catches for 68 yards and kept us in the game.

 

 

McKelvin had a solid game and gave us incredible field position with a 49 yard kickoff return.

 

 

Kelsay made a huge play that kept us in the game and was getting pressure throughout the day.

 

Believe it or not, there were more than 3 plays yesterday. There's a reason they went late into overtime against a team that was supposed to be far superior.

 

Well said.

[bizell]

Becoming like clockwork at this point : )

 

He played better again lining up in the DE spot, but as others have pointed out, his tackling was lacking. Egregiously so on the big ben sack whiff.

 

I know you reflexively make excuses for kelsay, but "big ben is tough to take down" isn't even a good one. We aren't talking about a 180 lb defensive back getting shedded by ben on a blitz - kelsay's a defensive lineman for god's sake. He shouldn't be bouncing off any qb like a pinball on a 3rd and long play.

 

I give credit to kelsay for just getting in position to make that play, but he failed and ben's scramble set up the late field goal that gave pitt the lead.

 

If people are going to scream at stevie "you gotta make that catch!", then those same people should be telling chris "you gotta make that tackle!"

 

Btich all u want, but be consistent.

 

hahahaha what? Big Ben IS tough to bring down. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3Z5dqelV_8s&feature=related

 

For reference, look at the Baltimore Ravens section of those highlights: He breaks two tackles on sack attempts: Trevor Pryce's and Terrell Suggs. Suggs is 260 and Pryce is 290. Pryce has 91 career sacks and Suggs has 65, so it's not like tackling QBs is anything new to these guys.

Edited November 29, 2010 by bizell

[BuffaloBillsMagic1]

Guy played well piutting pressure on Roth off the edge, desrves credit when credit due.

[Zulu Cthulhu]

Alright biz clearly big ben is impossible to sack. Which is how kelsay was able to get him down later in the game. And carrington was able to as well. Make excuses for him.

 

Fact is that yes, there are more than 3 plays in any game. But some plays are more important than others. Stevie's drop play was a big one. 3rd and 16 in a tie game late in the 4th was another. Kelsay whiffed - he didn't even slow ben down.

 

As waa already said kelsay does get credit for even being in position to make that play he failed to make - obviously he's getting blocked 15 yards downfield less these days.

[bizell]

who said he was impossible to sack? i just said he's very tough to bring down.

[Zulu Cthulhu]

Sure as big as he is he's more difficult to tackle than an average sized QB would be, i suppose.

 

But to highlight that fact in this discussion just stinks of excuse-making, in my opinion. Getting to the quarterback is a big part of kelsay's duties on the field, isn't it? He's proven to be useless as a 34 OLB. End rusher is his game and he's much better at it than he was as a linebacker.

 

So kelsay doesn't make that sack on that down. Maybe big ben is that elusive. But watching that play live yesterday, kelsay didn't even disrupt roethlisberger; he used poor form and spun off him. Bad play, period

[Mr. WEO]

And then he potentially won the game, sacking Ben and causing a fumble inside the one.

 

Like another poster said, Ben R. is a tough sonofabitch to bring down, and I've seen him break seemingly sure tackles by players more accomplished than Kelsay.

 

Dude had another very solid game.

I always thought so too, but then he does seem to be vulnerable to the face slap...

[Ever Since '86]

Sure as big as he is he's more difficult to tackle than an average sized QB would be, i suppose.

 

But to highlight that fact in this discussion just stinks of excuse-making, in my opinion. Getting to the quarterback is a big part of kelsay's duties on the field, isn't it? He's proven to be useless as a 34 OLB. End rusher is his game and he's much better at it than he was as a linebacker.

 

So kelsay doesn't make that sack on that down. Maybe big ben is that elusive. But watching that play live yesterday, kelsay didn't even disrupt roethlisberger; he used poor form and spun off him. Bad play, period

 

size may keep his center balanced a bit more then others but Ben's ability to be Houdini in the pocket is just natural instinct and knowing how to keep the rusher off balanced....

 

just by the way your trying to describe kelsay doing poorly makes it pretty clear you don't know much about "form". Kelsay played the mass majority of downs yesterday... and when the other team posses the ball for an entire half and then some... your technique has to change... the mere fact he was still motoring on the speed rush was proof enough to me ben had to worry about him which no matter way you put it helped keep the score down... let's face it they played Pittsburgh, arguably the most complete team in the NFL and you still want to nit pick a player who might have contributed the most on D(Kyle Williams was a beast all day IMO)...

 

i know i know it's not enough to win blah blah blahhhh... for once I would like to see reality on this board...everyone get's an opinion though right???

[Zulu Cthulhu]

Reality would be nice. Not spinning someone's opinion into oblivion would also be nice. Assuming things that were never said and attributing them to someone else - it would also be nice if we stopped that, right '86? I only said kelsay's form was bad on that particular play. He was out there pretty much all day because he was playing better, i said that already.

 

Your wallbash has been duly noted. But you won't find any reality here. This is where you misread my post and then i reply to your scribblings in kind.

[Ever Since '86]

I unfairly directed most of the kelsay guff at you and apologize for that... your not one of the newbies spinning everything outa control as I may have just done a bit... havn't been paying attention to the poster lately... we both know kelsay is a backup... but he played like a starter yesterday... everyone is so fast to discredit a solid performance on just about anyone and everyone

[Zulu Cthulhu]

Thanks '86 and sorry for responding so snidely.

 

The unabashed kelsay love rubs me (and others on here) the wrong way. I can't "show love" to CK just because he isn't playing so horribly anymore. He transitioned from bad linebacker to mediocre defensive end, that is all. But defenders are right - he did play decent a lot yesterday. But that 3rd and long play was pivotal, and he missed ben.

 

Marcus Stroud has been roundly heckled here week after week too, but he had the same # of tackles and sacks as kelsay had yesterday. I don't see any "show stroud some love" threads yet.

[joejoebills]

Seemed like Kelsay had yet another solid game to me. It's a few weeks in a row now.

 

He still looks like a fish out of water when they run strange defenses that get him 20 yards downfield, but he played well off the edge and was applying consistent pressure. It's hard to sack Roethlisberger.

 

Give the man some love!

 

Its obvious to me that Chris Kelsay's new nickname should be "White Lightning"

 

He's playing GREAT!!!!

 

Go Bills

[Ever Since '86]

Thanks '86 and sorry for responding so snidely.

 

The unabashed kelsay love rubs me (and others on here) the wrong way. I can't "show love" to CK just because he isn't playing so horribly anymore. He transitioned from bad linebacker to mediocre defensive end, that is all. But defenders are right - he did play decent a lot yesterday. But that 3rd and long play was pivotal, and he missed ben.

 

Marcus Stroud has been roundly heckled here week after week too, but he had the same # of tackles and sacks as kelsay had yesterday. I don't see any "show stroud some love" threads yet.

 

agreed... other then filling a gap stroud has been mediocre at best... one solid positive I took from yesterday has been the play of the OLine... and did i hear correctly that Bell hasn't given up a sack this year???

[C.Biscuit97]

If Kelsay could finish half of some of the tackles he whiffs on, he'd be a pro bowler. Say what you want about the guy, but he doesn't seem to get in the backfield or in the right position to make plays. He just struggles to finish.

 

But for the $2 million he will make next year, he is at worst a very solid rotational guy.

[qdawg in philly]

Thanks '86 and sorry for responding so snidely.

 

The unabashed kelsay love rubs me (and others on here) the wrong way. I can't "show love" to CK just because he isn't playing so horribly anymore. He transitioned from bad linebacker to mediocre defensive end, that is all. But defenders are right - he did play decent a lot yesterday. But that 3rd and long play was pivotal, and he missed ben.

 

Marcus Stroud has been roundly heckled here week after week too, but he had the same # of tackles and sacks as kelsay had yesterday. I don't see any "show stroud some love" threads yet.

Did stroud get a new contract worth 24million?!

[C.Biscuit97]

agreed... other then filling a gap stroud has been mediocre at best... one solid positive I took from yesterday has been the play of the OLine... and did i hear correctly that Bell hasn't given up a sack this year???

 

Stroud has been playing with one arm. He isn't the player he was but he is still a very solid one. Plus, he is a big time leader in the locker room. And for a very young team, I think that certainly has a lot of value.

[JPS]

Thanks '86 and sorry for responding so snidely.

 

The unabashed kelsay love rubs me (and others on here) the wrong way. I can't "show love" to CK just because he isn't playing so horribly anymore. He transitioned from bad linebacker to mediocre defensive end, that is all. But defenders are right - he did play decent a lot yesterday. But that 3rd and long play was pivotal, and he missed ben.

 

Marcus Stroud has been roundly heckled here week after week too, but he had the same # of tackles and sacks as kelsay had yesterday. I don't see any "show stroud some love" threads yet.

I have been Stroud's biggest critic, and I have to admit that he, too has been showing up for at least 1/2 of the plays. But let's not get carried away on Stroud OR Kelsay, the Bills still gave up 200 on the ground yesterday. In order to be dominant, both must be replaced.

[Russ 'Em]

In my opinion they have Strouds replacement on the team. He finally got some playing time yesterday and looked pretty good. Can't wait for Carrington to get some more reps even though Dwan edwards had to go down in order to make it happen.

[JPS]

Stroud has been playing with one arm. He isn't the player he was but he is still a very solid one. Plus, he is a big time leader in the locker room. And for a very young team, I think that certainly has a lot of value.

Stroud anchors the worst run defense in the league. Maybe the worst run defense in recent memory. Solid?? There's no such thing as a "leader in the locker room". Without performance on the field, the locker room is hollow. And how would any of US know that he a leader? He's played better, but he still needs to be a backup.

[Ever Since '86]

Stroud has been playing with one arm. He isn't the player he was but he is still a very solid one. Plus, he is a big time leader in the locker room. And for a very young team, I think that certainly has a lot of value.

 

good point... can you put a price on leadership? if so how much does that cost

[Nuncha]

Seemed like Kelsay had yet another solid game to me. It's a few weeks in a row now.

 

He still looks like a fish out of water when they run strange defenses that get him 20 yards downfield, but he played well off the edge and was applying consistent pressure. It's hard to sack Roethlisberger.

 

Give the man some love!

 

Don't know how many times the guy gets close the the QB and MISSES the tackle! He needs to learn how to drive his body into the QB rather than reaching for him. He often gets close but misses which is frustrating to see.

[Zulu Cthulhu]

I have been Stroud's biggest critic, and I have to admit that he, too has been showing up for at least 1/2 of the plays. But let's not get carried away on Stroud OR Kelsay, the Bills still gave up 200 on the ground yesterday. In order to be dominant, both must be replaced.

 

+1 i completely agree with all of this.

 

My comment on stroud wasn't in his defense, i just brought him up as another who was playing out of position earlier in the year and sucking as loudly as kelsay. But why does kelsay get absolved by many here after two weeks of showing up, while stroud's marginal improvement is overlooked?

[Meathead]

for those of you interested in the facts i will be happy to supply them for you. for those who just want to continue to irrationally bash kelsay in an overt attempt to project your feelings of nfl inadequacy onto an undeserving patsy like you did guys like reuben brown, glenn parker, and others then please continue making a fool of yourself

 

lets review the fax, hmmm:

 

- kelsay got paid way too much in his first extension, lets just admit that. even he was surprised by the amount. dont know wth the bills were doing there but its not his fault they gave him too much dough

 

- the containment DE is a valid nfl position. you are not paid cuz you get lots of sacks. you get paid cuz youre a decent end who does everything else they ask of you reasonably well. most fans have absolutely no idea that a de who doesnt pile up sacks can still be quite valuable

 

- kelsay started out slowly, platooning with denny who was a little better than kelsay against the run. kelsay was more of a combo DE who was a little better against the pass. denny also played RDE while kelsay did not, where denny got most of his sacks against weaker tackles

 

- kelsay had his best season at DE last year ('09) and was arguably one of the bills best players. although he didnt see a massive jump in his stats, it was in no uncertain terms his breakout season as an above average starting combo DE

 

- the extension kelsay got recently was CEREMONIAL - if you look at the numbers he got almost NO RAISE just a measely 2mil bonus which is chickenshit for a starting nfl de. frankly im real surprised he accepted it as he could have gone to ANY TEAM and made more. so it appears to me he did the incredible and actually gave some of the previous fkn money back!!

 

- he is now paid like an average starting nfl DE

 

- for whatever reason they didnt want him to go right to playing DE in the 3-4 so he took one for the team and tried his hand at OLB. he sucked. bad. and they abandoned that experiment after seven games

 

- since then he has gone back to exactly the pattern he exhibited last season at DE - except hes getting even MORE consistent pressure on the qb

 

- everybody on the team loves him cuz he is a consummate professional and he has maintained the perfect attitude throughout all the crap he and the team has had to deal with

 

 

so really when somebody says kelsay:

 

- got paid so hes coasting

- was never any good

- has been lucky to start the past few years

- isnt worth the money hes being paid

- isnt a valuable leader

- sucks

 

... the only rational conclusion is

 

YOU HAVE GONE COMPLETELY INSANE!!

and love terrorists

 

so rules judge meathead, so it shall be

[Zulu Cthulhu]

Hilarious rant. Great use of 28 pt. font.

 

Question - since when does the right DE go against weaker tackles? The RDE plays opposite left tackles, usually the stronger OT of the two since they protect righty QBs' blindsides.

 

Please correct me judge meathead with more of your "facts", as i was blown away by your last batch.

[NaPolian8693]

Zulu Cthulhu:

 

Five total hundred posts over four years, yet any time I make a thread about Kelsay you know he's ready to pop off for a good dozen posts. Love it

[Swift Sylvan]

Hilarious rant. Great use of 28 pt. font.

 

Question - since when does the right DE go against weaker tackles? The RDE plays opposite left tackles, usually the stronger OT of the two since they protect righty QBs' blindsides.

 

Please correct me judge meathead with more of your "facts", as i was blown away by your last batch.

 

I would think that it would be easier for a right DE to get sacks than a left DE. Let's say the tackles are even, I would think that as most Qb's are right handed they will be able to see a LDE coming as oppose to a RDE (The blindside).

[wardigital]

Kelsay is occasionally formidable with his hand on the ground, which is where he should be. He is simply not made to be a linebacker and should not be put in that position, ever. He might be the worst athlete standing up right that I've ever seen before. With his hand on the ground and working an edge he is a bit better.

 

And, for weeks I've been saying: If you put Kelsay on the d-line at least he is going to miss his tackle 1 yard downfield instead of 6 yards downfield, potentially saving the team 5 yards every play simply by not screwing up so far down the dang field.

 

I would think that it would be easier for a right DE to get sacks than a left DE. Let's say the tackles are even, I would think that as most Qb's are right handed they will be able to see a LDE coming as oppose to a RDE (The blindside).

 

LT's are generally more athletic blockers, though, and because they are coming from the blind side a QB's step motion to release the ball is away from the RDE and their escapability also caters more often to running away from the RDE than it would the LDE.

 

Each position has its advantages.

[Buffalo Barbarian]

If they use him as a situational passrusher he will be worth the money because he has been getting a lot of pressure and tackles the past two weeks.

[mattsox]

Kelsay is a 4-3 DE not a 3-4 LB. George Edwards should have done a better job evaluating the players and realized the 3-4 is not gonna work with the personal we have. But kudos to him for finally waking up and realizing the 3-4 doesn't work. We are finally getting a halfway decent performance out of our D. Sure hope we draft LBs early and often in next years draft. Not sure who is available via FA either, but This team and be a force next season if they pay out the $$$ to get good.