Who else is worried about the pass rush

[Thoner7]

I know OL and QB have gotten a lot of attention this off season as weak spots, mainly because they were horrid last season and we didn't address them in the draft. But what about the pass rush? This preseason we basically had none when it was 1st v 1sts

 

IMO we dont have the talent to go out and create pressure. Kelsay/Maybin/Ellis/Torbor sure aren't scaring anyone. Dwan Edwards seemed to be our best pass rusher this preseason which is not a good sign. Now I was thinking about it and I think the 34 scheme will help, as we can use the scheme to create pressure and not have to rely solely on our players beating their players like last season.

 

But at the same time when we go to the nickle in passing situations we go back to a 4 man front, and we are back to relying on Maybin/Ellis to beat LTs etc. I think that this is really our Achilles heal. With our secondary, we should be shutting down teams, but with no pass rush their talent is neutralized somewhat because they cant cover for 8 seconds. Hopefully we can figure out a way to dial up the pressure.

 

After the preseason and seeing Trent and the O improve the pass rush is whats worrying me most, Luckily Long is out so we can beat the Phish

[Mr. WEO]

I know OL and QB have gotten a lot of attention this off season as weak spots, mainly because they were horrid last season and we didn't address them in the draft. But what about the pass rush? This preseason we basically had none when it was 1st v 1sts

 

IMO we dont have the talent to go out and create pressure. Kelsay/Maybin/Ellis/Torbor sure aren't scaring anyone. Dwan Edwards seemed to be our best pass rusher this preseason which is not a good sign. Now I was thinking about it and I think the 34 scheme will help, as we can use the scheme to create pressure and not have to rely solely on our players beating their players like last season.

 

But at the same time when we go to the nickle in passing situations we go back to a 4 man front, and we are back to relying on Maybin/Ellis to beat LTs etc. I think that this is really our Achilles heal. With our secondary, we should be shutting down teams, but with no pass rush their talent is neutralized somewhat because they cant cover for 8 seconds. Hopefully we can figure out a way to dial up the pressure.

 

After the preseason and seeing Trent and the O improve the pass rush is whats worrying me most, Luckily Long is out so we can beat the Phish

More worried about the opposing pass rush.

[The Big Cat]

I'm waiting to see them run a blitz package or two before I get my panties in a bunch!

[stony]

I know OL and QB have gotten a lot of attention this off season as weak spots, mainly because they were horrid last season and we didn't address them in the draft. But what about the pass rush? This preseason we basically had none when it was 1st v 1sts

 

IMO we dont have the talent to go out and create pressure. Kelsay/Maybin/Ellis/Torbor sure aren't scaring anyone. Dwan Edwards seemed to be our best pass rusher this preseason which is not a good sign. Now I was thinking about it and I think the 34 scheme will help, as we can use the scheme to create pressure and not have to rely solely on our players beating their players like last season.

 

But at the same time when we go to the nickle in passing situations we go back to a 4 man front, and we are back to relying on Maybin/Ellis to beat LTs etc. I think that this is really our Achilles heal. With our secondary, we should be shutting down teams, but with no pass rush their talent is neutralized somewhat because they cant cover for 8 seconds. Hopefully we can figure out a way to dial up the pressure.

 

After the preseason and seeing Trent and the O improve the pass rush is whats worrying me most, Luckily Long is out so we can beat the Phish

 

You make some good points. I'm hoping that Gailey isn't bluffing when he says the Def. hasn't shown much of anything in the blitz department. Also, is that definite regarding Long? I heard he was fine.

[BillsVet]

Blitzing to manufacture a pass rush is not a long term solution. Torbor was cut from Miami, where he played ILB. Maybin is unproven and is a second stringer, Kelsay is a converted DE as is Ellis who has little experience regardless of defense. IMO, the coaching staff knows they don't have the horses to play strictly 3-4 and will attempt to mitigate this by frequently moving from a 43 to a 34.

 

Over time, the lack of a good pass rush exposes a defense. For all the talk about the secondary, they'll be left out to dry without someone stepping up who can get to the QB. Good coaching cannot replace bad players ill-suited to scheme.

[Dr. K]

I know OL and QB have gotten a lot of attention this off season as weak spots, mainly because they were horrid last season and we didn't address them in the draft. But what about the pass rush? This preseason we basically had none when it was 1st v 1sts

 

IMO we dont have the talent to go out and create pressure. Kelsay/Maybin/Ellis/Torbor sure aren't scaring anyone. Dwan Edwards seemed to be our best pass rusher this preseason which is not a good sign. Now I was thinking about it and I think the 34 scheme will help, as we can use the scheme to create pressure and not have to rely solely on our players beating their players like last season.

 

But at the same time when we go to the nickle in passing situations we go back to a 4 man front, and we are back to relying on Maybin/Ellis to beat LTs etc. I think that this is really our Achilles heal. With our secondary, we should be shutting down teams, but with no pass rush their talent is neutralized somewhat because they cant cover for 8 seconds. Hopefully we can figure out a way to dial up the pressure.

 

After the preseason and seeing Trent and the O improve the pass rush is whats worrying me most, Luckily Long is out so we can beat the Phish

 

 

I'm worried about the defense in general. It was bad in all phases (except interceptions) in pre-season. Bad run defense, no real pass rush, and gave up tons of pass yardage. Seemed to me that the linebackers were getting torched in pass coverage.

 

I'm hoping it's just because it's a work in progress, and we'll see them get steadily better (barring injuries) in the regular season.

[RI Bills Fan]

I know OL and QB have gotten a lot of attention this off season as weak spots, mainly because they were horrid last season and we didn't address them in the draft. But what about the pass rush? This preseason we basically had none when it was 1st v 1sts

 

IMO we dont have the talent to go out and create pressure. Kelsay/Maybin/Ellis/Torbor sure aren't scaring anyone. Dwan Edwards seemed to be our best pass rusher this preseason which is not a good sign. Now I was thinking about it and I think the 34 scheme will help, as we can use the scheme to create pressure and not have to rely solely on our players beating their players like last season.

 

But at the same time when we go to the nickle in passing situations we go back to a 4 man front, and we are back to relying on Maybin/Ellis to beat LTs etc. I think that this is really our Achilles heal. With our secondary, we should be shutting down teams, but with no pass rush their talent is neutralized somewhat because they cant cover for 8 seconds. Hopefully we can figure out a way to dial up the pressure.

 

After the preseason and seeing Trent and the O improve the pass rush is whats worrying me most, Luckily Long is out so we can beat the Phish

 

I believe that Gailey and Edwards made a decision to play nothing but base defenses in the preseason in order to evaluate players and keep the blitz packages under wraps. It's the same thing most teams do.

 

On Sunday you'll see a defense that looks quite different from what you saw in the preseason. I don't know if it will look and perform better but I gaurantee you'll see things you didn't see when the games didn't count.

 

Now in three or four weeks if we're still moaning about a lack of pass rush, then it will be time to start getting concerned. But right now we haven't seen the real defensive scheme on the field yet.

[Doc]

More worried about the opposing pass rush.

Fear not this weekend, at least. Miami's pass rush looked even worse than the Bills' did in pre-season.

[DaBills51]

The lack of pass rush has concerned me some this preseason, but like BigCat said, I hope it was due to the lack of blitz packages.

 

I agree with you Billsvet that blitzing isn't the long term solution to generating a pass rush, but hopefully the Bills will do a better job during the regular season of disguising where that 4th man will be coming from. If anything, I'm more concerned about our run defense, because if we can't stop the run again this year then our pass rush really doesn't mean much. Majority of sacks come in long down and distance situations, and if our team is getting gashed on the ground were not going to see many of them.

 

Here's a link to a pretty good article from Pat Kirwan on the blitz tendencies of teams from last season. It also discusses how more and more teams are spreading their offense out to counter blitzes.

 

http://www.nfl.com/news/story/09000d5d818e0966/printable/spread-offense-has-ability-to-help-teams-in-pass-protection-

[sharper802]

Blitzing to manufacture a pass rush is not a long term solution. Torbor was cut from Miami, where he played ILB. Maybin is unproven and is a second stringer, Kelsay is a converted DE as is Ellis who has little experience regardless of defense. IMO, the coaching staff knows they don't have the horses to play strictly 3-4 and will attempt to mitigate this by frequently moving from a 43 to a 34.

 

Over time, the lack of a good pass rush exposes a defense. For all the talk about the secondary, they'll be left out to dry without someone stepping up who can get to the QB. Good coaching cannot replace bad players ill-suited to scheme.

Except one of the reasons to switch to a 3-4 is to disguise b litz packages. No one rushes just 3 from the base defense. In nickel and dime it is still rare to just rush 4 downlineman. Corners and safeties are usually added to the rush packages.

[Kelly the Dog]

I don't think there is anyone in the world who has a really good idea about how well the Bills defense will be this Sunday. They kept it super vanilla throughout pre-season. What the Dolphins will see they will see for the first time. Blitzes will come from all over. That is NOT to say we will be good, or stop anyone. Only to say what you saw in pre-season is not going to be how we will play. We could even play worse, who knows?

 

Pass rush is a certain key to any defense, but pass rush is really meant to stop the other team from killing you through the air, and the fact our pass rush sucked last year but we had a ton of turnovers and the second ranked pass defense greatly lessens the need for sacks. We need pressures as much or more than sacks. Teams ran all over us, obviously, so the pass D stats could be misleading, but the turnovers are not. No one has any idea whether that will continue to this year.

 

To me, the most important players on defense on Sunday will be Bryan Scott, who doesn't even start, and Poz. If we get killed through the air, it's highly likely to be from backs and TEs coming out of the backfield on our LBs. The Dolphins TEs are fair at best (another reason it was a surprise to most everyone they cut Martin). Brown and Rickey are decent coming out of the backfield but neither is a great receiver or burners, which helps the Bills.

 

The Dolphins are not very good on offense. They can run, but Henne is still a work in progress and I for one still think he stinks. Their line is weak. Marshall is an enigma and you can't count on him (although I think he will make a spectacular catch or two). The injury to Long, although I think he will play, could cripple them. The Ralph will have a lot of noise and energy. Another thing that should help the Bills, perhaps a lot, is George Edwards practicing against the Miami wildcat for two full years while they were implementing it.

 

In fact, it's just a prediction, but I think our defense does pretty well on Sunday, everyone gets excited about them for the season, and then we get murdered by Aaron Rogers and Ryan Grant and company the following week in Green Bay which is an entirely different story.

[Deadstroke]

I believe that Gailey and Edwards made a decision to play nothing but base defenses in the preseason in order to evaluate players and keep the blitz packages under wraps. It's the same thing most teams do.

 

On Sunday you'll see a defense that looks quite different from what you saw in the preseason. I don't know if it will look and perform better but I gaurantee you'll see things you didn't see when the games didn't count.

 

Now in three or four weeks if we're still moaning about a lack of pass rush, then it will be time to start getting concerned. But right now we haven't seen the real defensive scheme on the field yet.

 

 

That's what is being said and obviously that's what we're hoping, RI.

 

You know that in just trying to evaluate our players, I see the DL guys are at least avg, maybe a shade better; the DB's are way better than avg, maybe even top 5 or so, and that leaves the LB's.

 

When you think about it, Poz & Davis in the middle are more than adequate. Davis is good and the only knock against Poz has been a marginal one concerning MAYBE he lacks good speed for a MLB, but that knock is now negated by going to the 3-4.

 

To me the only concern is the 2 OLB's. Hopefully with the talent that we have there if they are used properly at the right time, situation, etc, the lack of top line talent there won't hurt too much. They're not that darned awful!

[mpl6876]

I have looked up and down our roster and I cannot find a legit pass rusher. You bet it is a major concern.

[EastRochBillsfan]

I'm waiting to see them run a blitz package or two before I get my panties in a bunch!

I agree with this statement. And,........you wear panties???

[Dorkington]

The defensive front seven is my biggest worry.

 

I think our offense will be fine, actually, as long as the OL stays healthy. Our DB's are solid... its just the front seven that... are kinda scaring me. If they come out and get some plays... I think our team will be fine.

[Brainiac72]

The defensive front seven is my biggest worry.

 

I think our offense will be fine, actually, as long as the OL stays healthy. Our DB's are solid... its just the front seven that... are kinda scaring me. If they come out and get some plays... I think our team will be fine.

 

Dwan Edwards is no sack artist, but he looks stellar to me so far... seen an OTA practice, Training camp, and preseason games and he stood out each time to me. the the DE's will be solid.

 

the LB's may not be star quality, but there is some talent there. OLB's make their bones on scheme as much as talent. look at that pittsburgh guy, james harrison. he was cut by teams before finding his niche in dick lebeau's defense. we may not have reggie white or jason tuck here, but if our DC does his job, we don't have to. so i won't be worried unless we look bad sunday.

[HARCO186]

I believe that Gailey and Edwards made a decision to play nothing but base defenses in the preseason in order to evaluate players and keep the blitz packages under wraps. It's the same thing most teams do.

 

On Sunday you'll see a defense that looks quite different from what you saw in the preseason. I don't know if it will look and perform better but I gaurantee you'll see things you didn't see when the games didn't count.

 

Now in three or four weeks if we're still moaning about a lack of pass rush, then it will be time to start getting concerned. But right now we haven't seen the real defensive scheme on the field yet.

I agree. I feel that the pass rush will be a hybrid with more blitzes from the inside creating a bullrush effect to draw the qb out of the pocket and throw on the fly. This creates a fooled pass rush when a team has no pass rush. This is why Chan likes a 3-4 vice a 4-3. They can hide the formation better. I'm not YET concerned but feel it needs attention next year when we draft a stud on defense..

[Wagon Circler]

I think anytime anAaron Maybin is your best pass rusher you have to be concerned. Edwards will probably have to get creative with the blitzing. Since cornerback is our strength, play press and send five.

Of course run defense is another worry...

[Mr. WEO]

 

 

but if our DC does his job, we don't have to. so i won't be worried unless we look bad sunday.

Who is that again?

[Brainiac72]

Who is that again?

 

i know, i know... NOT dick lebeau. it's an unknown, that's for sure.