Puff Piece

[H2o]

Whitner needs to be one of the guys shipped off of this team come the offseason. He is highly over rated and wasn't worth the #8 pick when drafted. Another screw up by Marv.

If this is the case, and I say if, we all should be very worried. Reason being, Taylor Mays will be sitting at the top of alot of people's draft boards come April and he could be "the best player available" when the Bills hit the clock. Another 1st Round pick on a DB, and a SS at that, you say? Don't be completely shocked if it happens. The guy is a freak of an athlete, the size of a LB with the speed of a CB, and would surely be an upgrade over Wilson or Scott. I'm just saying that we should all be careful what we wish for.

[sharper802]

Can Marv be voted out of the hall of fame for his completely inept run as GM? I thought he was a borderline candidate for the hall in the first place. He should give his spot up for Reed.

[Leonidas]

"There will be times when the Bills use only two safeties. It's hard to image Whitner might not being one of them, but he's prepared to do what is asked of him." Well said, Al. You write for living??

[dave mcbride]

"There will be times when the Bills use only two safeties. It's hard to image Whitner might not being one of them, but he's prepared to do what is asked of him." Well said, Al. You write for living??

People who write for a living make grammatical mistakes like that all of the time (I know I do, and essentially write for a living). That's why newspapers have copyeditors to catch those mistakes. They didn't catch this one. In fact, I saw a similar mistake in the NY Times a couple of days ago deep into a story. It happens.

[Nanker]

I dunno. Whitner might be just another NFL player that had his career ruined by Soft Dick Jauron's weak coaching. Fewell's undeniably sending messages to the squad that they're simply not tough enough by any NFL standard. It's a bad message - but a good one to give... if you get my drift.

[spartacus]

That and also also allowing our draft picks a couple of seasons before declaring them a bust or a wasted pick. It is easy to sit back in retrospect and bash our draft picks but if Whitner had turned into a Polamalu or a Bob Sanders, I doubt if anybody would be gloating on their own right-ness about the pick. Make no mistake, I do agree that our top picks would have been better spent on the lines first but to bash the FO for not attempting to pick a franchise safety is not right.

This situation is likely to play itself out again with this years first choice, a front line pick. At the time the pick was made, I was quite happy because coming out of last season we were woefully lacking at the DE position. The FO or the coaches had no way of knowing that Kelsay would suddenly start playing well. As of now, Maybin's lack of impact plays is worrisome, but it is too early to tell if he will eventually be an Erik Flowers or a Mario Williams. Again, when the pick was made, we needed a DE.

 

we did not need a DE to start immediately

 

we did need palymaking LBs to start immediately (like Cushing) or a starting LT

 

absolutely stupid to waste the #11 pick on an undersized, situational pass rusher - who has proven he can't even do that

 

when the team has glaring holes elsewhere

[Nanker]

we did not need a DE to start immediately

 

we did need palymaking LBs to start immediately (like Cushing) or a starting LT

 

absolutely stupid to waste the #11 pick on an undersized, situational pass rusher - who has proven he can't even do that

 

when the team has glaring holes elsewhere

 

I began calling him Error Maybe. I think I'll change that to Error Mamula. He just does not belong on this roster. Most of the rest of this year's picks were pretty solid, but the FO was myopic on that one.

[I'm Spartacus]

we did not need a DE to start immediately

 

we did need palymaking LBs to start immediately (like Cushing) or a starting LT

 

absolutely stupid to waste the #11 pick on an undersized, situational pass rusher - who has proven he can't even do that

 

when the team has glaring holes elsewhere

I'm Spartacus!

[VADC Bills]

we did not need a DE to start immediately

 

we did need palymaking LBs to start immediately (like Cushing) or a starting LT

 

absolutely stupid to waste the #11 pick on an undersized, situational pass rusher - who has proven he can't even do that

 

when the team has glaring holes elsewhere

At the time I don't think any one disagreed with our need for a DE. It seemed as though we had a lot of Orakpo supporters...myself being one of them. Orakpo clearly was not starting material as a DE so they moved him to OLB where he has 6.5 sacks this year. The Redskins coaches wanted to get him on the field because they felt he would learn better by playing instead of watching...I wish the Bills would adopt this attitude. I think Maybin's future will be at OLB we should start playing him there now.

Cushing and Oher have been outstanding. but would having Oher give TE the balls to throw the 20 - 30 pass and not play scared checking down all the time. Would having Cushing increase Poz's instincts to run toward the play instead of away from it and not allow the defenses to exploit the middle via run or pass???

As you pointed out we need better personel, it would have been great to have started the process last year instead of next year.

[thewildrabbit]

Donte Whitner was the 53rd rated player on the board, but the Bills were clearly desperate for a safety as they had just dumped Lawyer Milloy.

 

The Raiders took Michael Huff with the pick right before Buffalo and so far he hasn't played as well as Whitner. Is Whitner a great safety, in a word no. But then who knows how good he could be if he played in a different system, see Jim Leonhard. Personally I hate the Tampa 2 and will be happy to see that defense dead and gone from the NFL or at least from Buffalo. Mostly because most DC's simply can't get it to work very well, irregardless of talent on the field.

 

Why does everyone blame Levy for the Whitner pick when he stated he only suggests who to pick, and Jauron had the power draft who he wanted. If anything It is Jauron who has scrood the pooch every year with his draft choices IMO.

[NorCal Aaron]

Donte Whitner was the 53rd rated player on the board, but the Bills were clearly desperate for a safety as they had just dumped Lawyer Milloy.

 

The Raiders took Michael Huff with the pick right before Buffalo and so far he hasn't played as well as Whitner. Is Whitner a great safety, in a word no. But then who knows how good he could be if he played in a different system, see Jim Leonhard. Personally I hate the Tampa 2 and will be happy to see that defense dead and gone from the NFL or at least from Buffalo. Mostly because most DC's simply can't get it to work very well, irregardless of talent on the field.

 

Why does everyone blame Levy for the Whitner pick when he stated he only suggests who to pick, and Jauron had the power draft who he wanted. If anything It is Jauron who has scrood the pooch every year with his draft choices IMO.

 

Huff has played well this year, and I would say has been more noticeable this year for his good play than Donte ever has.

[BillsVet]

That and also also allowing our draft picks a couple of seasons before declaring them a bust or a wasted pick. It is easy to sit back in retrospect and bash our draft picks but if Whitner had turned into a Polamalu or a Bob Sanders, I doubt if anybody would be gloating on their own right-ness about the pick. Make no mistake, I do agree that our top picks would have been better spent on the lines first but to bash the FO for not attempting to pick a franchise safety is not right.

 

 

There is no such thing as a franchise safety because they depend so heavily on the people in front of them. You do not take 2 safeties and a CB with your first four picks in a draft which should have formed the foundation of the team. ALL of those picks are busts or near-busts: Whitner, McCargo, Youboty, and Simpson.

 

Sure it's hindsight, but there were a lot of people on draft day 06 doubting Marv's strategy of building the secondary first without having the pass rushers, interior DL, and OL. Their doubts were ultimately confirmed.

 

The Buffalo Bills have spent each 1st-3rd round pick since 2006 drafting for sheer need, which is more evidence they've not improved one iota. You could say each 1st-3rd round pick save Edwards was a need pick: Whitner, McCargo, Youboty, Lynch, Posluszny, McKelvin, Hardy, and Ellis.

 

At the end of the day, the talent on the roster to close 2009 isn't much better than what was present to conclude 2005. It's not a bash-Marv thing, it's reality.

[Beerball]

we did not need a DE to start immediately

 

we did need palymaking LBs to start immediately (like Cushing) or a starting LT

 

absolutely stupid to waste the #11 pick on an undersized, situational pass rusher - who has proven he can't even do that

 

when the team has glaring holes elsewhere

yeah

[Beerball]

At the time I don't think any one disagreed with our need for a DE. It seemed as though we had a lot of Orakpo supporters...myself being one of them. Orakpo clearly was not starting material as a DE so they moved him to OLB where he has 6.5 sacks this year. The Redskins coaches wanted to get him on the field because they felt he would learn better by playing instead of watching...I wish the Bills would adopt this attitude. I think Maybin's future will be at OLB we should start playing him there now.

Cushing and Oher have been outstanding. but would having Oher give TE the balls to throw the 20 - 30 pass and not play scared checking down all the time. Would having Cushing increase Poz's instincts to run toward the play instead of away from it and not allow the defenses to exploit the middle via run or pass???

As you pointed out we need better personel, it would have been great to have started the process last year instead of next year.

I would have taken Oher, Cushing or Matthews just off the top of my head. Really disliked our pick at the time. So far he's done nothing to make me change my mind.

[spartacus]

Donte Whitner was the 53rd rated player on the board, but the Bills were clearly desperate for a safety as they had just dumped Lawyer Milloy.

 

The story of the Bills clown show.

 

They did not have to "dump" Milloy - when they did

 

If they had been smart, they would have held him until after the draft to see how it played out -

instead of forcing themselves into a box and having to draft a safety capable of starting immediately.

 

The self-created need was further screwed up by blowing the evaluation of Whitner and concluding that a small, slow safety could be an impact player - better than a stud DT. The decision making is further flawed in trying to make a small safety the cornerstone of their defense instead of stud DT

 

Again - multiple stupid decisions compounding themselves into really bad results.

[Dawgg]

The story of the Bills clown show.

 

They did not have to "dump" Milloy - when they did

 

If they had been smart, they would have held him until after the draft to see how it played out -

instead of forcing themselves into a box and having to draft a safety capable of starting immediately.

 

The self-created need was further screwed up by blowing the evaluation of Whitner and concluding that a small, slow safety could be an impact player - better than a stud DT. The decision making is further flawed in trying to make a small safety the cornerstone of their defense instead of stud DT

 

Again - multiple stupid decisions compounding themselves into really bad results.

It's one thing if they targeted Whitner in that draft (which they clearly did). It's quite another to reach and take him at #8 overall when they could have traded down, acquired more picks and still taken the small, underachieving, loud-mouthed, second string safety that he has now become.

[sharper802]

It's one thing if they targeted Whitner in that draft (which they clearly did). It's quite another to reach and take him at #8 overall when they could have traded down, acquired more picks and still taken the small, underachieving, loud-mouthed, second string safety that he has now become.

Wisest post so far. That is what good franchises do. NE has a rather poor draft history lately but they make up for it with quantity by moving down. Marv did the exact opposite. He targetted players and moved up wasting good draft picks to get McCargo and Poz. Those two third rounders could have been the missing OLB and Tackle this team needs.

[Fan in Chicago]

There is no such thing as a franchise safety because they depend so heavily on the people in front of them. You do not take 2 safeties and a CB with your first four picks in a draft which should have formed the foundation of the team. ALL of those picks are busts or near-busts: Whitner, McCargo, Youboty, and Simpson.

 

Sure it's hindsight, but there were a lot of people on draft day 06 doubting Marv's strategy of building the secondary first without having the pass rushers, interior DL, and OL. Their doubts were ultimately confirmed.

 

I think in a way we are saying something similar but with a slightly different slant. My point was that the decision to take a DB was not wise. As I said, it would have been better to go OL or DL. But, once the decision to take a DB was done, the fact that it was Whitner was not necessarily wrong. There is little indication to know if he would become an impact safety or a average player.

To add to your other argument, I think the biggest error in the recent past was the selection of McGahee. He was not a position of need and could not play the first year anyway. That choice started the catch-up we have been playing ever since.

[Dawgg]

I think in a way we are saying something similar but with a slightly different slant. My point was that the decision to take a DB was not wise. As I said, it would have been better to go OL or DL. But, once the decision to take a DB was done, the fact that it was Whitner was not necessarily wrong. There is little indication to know if he would become an impact safety or a average player.

To add to your other argument, I think the biggest error in the recent past was the selection of McGahee. He was not a position of need and could not play the first year anyway. That choice started the catch-up we have been playing ever since.

It was fairly obvious that he, coming out of college, was not in the class of a Polomalu or Sanders. The thought was that he was a notch below... even if he turned out to be an average to above-average safety, it doesn't change the fact that it was a botched pick. Any respected NFL personnel man will tell you that you don't devote a high pick to a safety unless he is a game changing player. Whitner was not considered that by any stretch of the imagination.

[Sisyphean Bills]

The Bills needed to build their team around a franchise QB or, if that wasn't there, start building in the trenches. It's not a complete coincidence that the dysfunctional teams that have stayed on the losing side picked two undersized S and a midget LB, while the teams immediately after that were actually making a push towards returning as playoff teams and they dared to take two QBs and a Pro Bowl DL. Dick Jauron was, of course, burned to a blackened crisp in his first gig when he selected Cade McNown, and it's hard to say to what degree that may have influenced the room against Tom Modrak, who supposedly lobbied hard for Cutler. (Which should make you really wonder who it was that really wanted JP Losman, not that the answer isn't obvious.)

 

The 06 draft is not living up to its pre-draft hype, and the Bills are not alone in getting minimal value. That's not exactly anything to celebrate, but the Bills compounded this misfortune by jettisoning their veterans, the locker room leadership, and signing a bunch of "under 30" free agents that they felt were "up and coming" but which turned out to be nothing but bad players one and all.