Richard Noggin

You make a great counterpoint here, in that comparing this particular highly-rated, short-armed COLLEGE/DRAFT cornerback prospect to other short-armed PROFESSIONAL NFL cornerbacks doesn't consider amateur context/pedigree, which allows for further consideration of McDuffie's unhandicapped ability. This limited trait of his might reasonably damage his draft value, however. Right or wrong.

Ummm...so this must be a disguised Edmunds-should-be-moved-to-EDGE post, then? Because that's where Ojabo plays. OBVIOUSLY.

I don't think the OP is a troll, strictly. I think he's young and/or hopeful/eager. No cynicism detected. This thread isn't trolling. It's obliviousness. I'm as cruel and unforgiving of ill intentioned discourse as anyone. Sometimes you just have to nod and smile and go on with your life without punching down.

I don't think the percentage strata (or rings) are indicative of YOE, exactly. Otherwise, a merely average RB would be gaining roughly 80% MORE yards than expected on given types of plays, which sounds to me like a VERY above average player. So I think, like RAS, this spider chart is simply offering comparative percentile rankings for RB performance on various categories of situational plays, with 100% being the highest score.

I'm not sure what you're looking at specifically to derive that kind of almost 200% YOE... Looks like the spider chart simply suggests an almost 20% above average YOE on outside runs in 2021. If you're diving in elsewhere, I'm happy to take a look.

And then there's also Gabriel Davis, and Micah Hyde isn't getting any younger, and RB and CB and OG...it never ends. Hitting on a QB is SO essential, but then that just sets in motion a perpetual wheel of good problems to have.

I'd hope the following consideration has been addressed in the impressive 57-page span of this topic, but...scheme fit? I'm not an advocate for 1st round RBs, but...it seems to me that Hall is a nice prospect for the outside zone run scheme the Bills are looking to feature. His strengths line up with what the Bills org wants to do offensively (all the OL coach candidates this time around were outside zone guys, which is what McD wanted to implement early on with effing Rick Dennison...and all those unforgettable, DYNAMIC outside runs with Mike Tolbert), including pass catching acumen. This spider chart highlights Hall's strength as an outside runner (although it also identifies a lot of deficiencies elsewhere, which can be due to factors above his pay grade, of course).

To be fair...he's closer than most TEs to being an actual WR.

I'm definitely no troll (and yes I can see that label was unleashed while quoting someone else, but you did pluralize it). I AM someone who tries to question hyperbole and fallacy. Jordan Poyer is NOT currently holding out. And while it's not unreasonable to argue that a holdout could be on the horizon, that isn't what you did in your post that kicked off this particular sidebar. You are allowed to make fallacious arguments, and I am allowed to call them out. Don't get defensive. I've probably/definitely put forth some poorly supported claims myself.

It's a bit of a journey, but it lands nonetheless.

Karlos Williams says what

I'm sorry...what?

In this thread you've posited that an Achilles tear somehow has a...shorter NFL recovery timetable than an ACL (which is bonkers at least in terms of functional high-end athleticism; that injury means a FULL year before someone is right again, if they ever get it all back). ACLs have become rote. So obviously you're hyper-concerned about the CB depth chart (or want the Bills to draft a different position) and the injury is exacerbating things for you (which is at least a little understandable). But here, in the quoted post, you write that "(FOR WHATEVER REASON) [Tre] waited over two weeks before doing the surgery" (all emphases mine). So now there is something else going on. Now, suddenly, you're ignoring myriad reasonable contexts surrounding significant injuries (such as inflammation (most common complication), infection, conflicting medical opinions, etc.) to, I guess, introduce further doubt about Tre, or the team, or both? Or just to reinforce your own fears (or conflicting draft desires). I don't know. But two weeks between significant injury/trauma and high-stakes surgery is NOT noteworthy.

The football answer to your question depends on the simple answer to THIS question: which ACTUAL player are we talking about? Until we know that, then this discussion is just a way of reshaping old narratives.

I disagree that off-ball LBs still need to be differentiated between ILB and OLB. I know there have historically been differences between their responsibilities, but at this point it really feels like your MLB is just the stouter of your two or three best LBs. The roles/specific LB positions are determined by the traits or talents of the personnel on a given roster. Possibly unrelated: Remember the playoff game against Jacksonville back in 2017/18? Remember Lorenzo effing Alexander essentially playing MLB in that game? At least as a subpackage in short yardage and goal-line. He was a beast at it. He made a handful of old school MLB plays. From OL to IDL and EDGE and eventually SLB...no idea where I'm going with this. I guess he was our best LB by far at that point, and we needed him most in the middle that game, against that offense.

And the part of the defense that was actually working on those pressure plays was the secondary, ironically, in that coverage forced Mahomes to hold onto the ball at least long enough for the pass rushers to beat their blocks and have the opportunity to then throw up all over themselves.

The bolded is easily forgotten based on how the playoff game ended, but for the first three quarters, at least, Mahomes evaded and eluded and really kind of embarrassed Bills pass rushers. So many squandered opportunities to finish plays and drives. The Bills were in such a hole in part because the D-line could NOT close the deal.

He is NOT "tiny." 5'11" 185 is nowhere close to tiny. Even if he's slightly smaller than advertised, he's got enough size to be a legitimate NFL prospect. Especially with the shiftiness and surprising contact balance I see in this highlights package. Did he maybe run slow or test poorly at the combine? Is that part of why he's such a Day 2 or Day 3 guy in the eyes of draft prognosticators? Edit: upon further review, it appears Robinson is much shorter than advertised, which DOES help to explain his later round value projections (along with only one year of tape as a starter).

He's a millennial, but that's hilarious nonetheless

I think you're both overstating the potential rise of "zone CB1" draft value AND misrepresenting Sauce Gardner as a "zone CB1" prospect whose value is on par with a Tre White prospect. Gardner is a top 5-10 pick with measurables, tape, and man/zone scheme flex. Tre White was a borderline 1st/2nd guy with decent measurables, tape, and less scheme flex. Overall, you probably have a point about the obvious rise of zone coverage schemes, but I don't agree that this trend devalues CBs who can also flourish in man coverage. It might even reinforce their value as scheme diverse players who allow coordinators more creativity to mix up their game plans. But it definitely does NOT place a Tre White draft prospect on par with a Sauce Gardner.

Haden, Tre, Dane, EJ Gaines, Josh Normaaane...

Is that true?! That's wild, in the context of McCreary and even McDuffie a little. I KNOW Google could help me answer this quickly. But I like leaning on the perspective of fellow posters.

The poll is unofficially over already, of course. Garrett Wilson is an insane talent sitting at 25. Plus that kind of draft slide would piss off a guy with his expectations and pedigree. Probably be good for everyone involved. (I don't usually stump so hard for a specific take on this board, but this scenario is just so unrealistic and awesome.)

Isn't Wilson broadly viewed as a better prospect than Justin Jefferson, for example? I wonder what it is that has fewer posters thinking this fall to 25 is completely mock-draft-generator-level crazy.

But Garrett Wilson is like top half of the first round talent. A complete prospect. He's athletic as eff.