Sojourner

I might be in the minority but the talent on the defense is more of the issue than the schemes and designs/concepts they run themselves. If they can grab a quality guy on the interior as well as another CB I think they’ll take massive strides to what we saw a few years ago. An aggressive defense is nice as it’s not allowing an offense to, in theory, dictate the game. However, when you have the right line play in McD’s defenses, it’s just as troublesome as you’ve got 7 guys to disguise, roll, invert or trap coverage with. The bigg st complaint circles back to talent again, they’ve put a decent amount into it prior to the last few years but we still have pretty much the same issues. Trusting they finally get the right players is a concern. On top of that, we know Safety is a critical part of the coverage schemes Sean/Babich run. They should be grabbing one of the litter that’s available in FA as it does seem to have quality available pre-negotiations. That might be a tough pill to swallow but Bishop is still raw and Rapp, as much as he has good play here and there, can be a liability to himself and his team with injuries.

Great write up. One guy I think changes the 20-30 range is Revel and how he is viewed after his interviews. I can see the Bengals going after him if he checks out. I think Barron is a stud but could be a better Safety than he is CB. Then down further to Chargers. If not the Bengals he’s in play there too. They need some help in that position. Where are you gauging FSU’s Thomas right now? I think he’s going to move up into the early second after the CB drills @ Indy as he’s shown success in zone and man coverages at various positions for Florida State.

No but he is a difference maker. Definitely not ideal for the system we run but you could make it work as he has the talent however would it be ideal to play him where he wants: continue the LB role that he’s in? Talk is they may be switching to a 3-4 scheme in Dallas and I would expect they switch him exclusively to an OLB role. He’s best as a moveable chess piece with freedom to attack different gaps and areas of the line. Would he fit here? I think he fits anywhere if I’m honest. The question is if you play him exclusively on the edge does he rack up the sacks you’d expect him to be getting based on years prior? I don’t think you’d ever know until it was happening/possible. It would be close though, guy is a stud.

“Can’t believe Augie didn’t serve us hors d'oeuvres himself”

Didn’t say it was accurate but his weight has more value than others who cry about it. Why? Because you have the ability to be fined as an active player? Doesn’t take that much thought process as to why guys stay quiet or the ones who don’t do it in an indirect manner. I’m open to listen to someone who’s in the HOF and player 15 seasons. Doesn’t mean I agree with him or not.

WR was the strength of last class and while it was we didn’t do as great as we hoped for immediate impact. This year is quality for interior guys. Especially the type we needed. Hope we get it right as Dewayne Carter was solid against the run and flashed the pass rush game collegiately, didn’t meet the expectation even when the bar wasn’t very high.

Parsons is a player I could get behind if you can’t get Crosby/Garrett. Cowboys defense would be even worse without him, falling apart territory.

30. Benjamin Morrison CB | Notre Dame 56. Eric Ayomanor WR | Stanford 62. Alfred Collins DL | Texas 108. Cobee Bryant CB | Kansas 131. Kyren Lacy WR | LSU 171. Tyler Cooper IOL | Minnesota 175. Craig Woodson S | California 179. Barryn Sorrell EDGE | Texas 206. Rylie Mills DL | Notre Dame 208. Jackson Woodard LB | UNLV

And that trade worked out wonders. I just don’t think Cleveland ever become willing to trade him unless he forces himself out or has a serious injury. They have said on numerous occasions he isn’t for trade and their GM just reiterated that a few days ago by saying they’re trying to get an extension done that essentially will have him retire as a Brown. Piggy back off that, Myles said many times last year the team isn’t that far off from being a contender and that he felt the year was just unlucky in terms of injuries that took place to the QBs and Chubb. Id love him, he has stretches of absolute dominance. When he’s not dominating he’s still great. Maxx is just as good. The next best get.

With the fact he’s getting another DPOY I’d bet that asking price might even be more.

Still think he’s a decent player just not $20m+ which is probably what he’s projected to get when his deal is up and the salary cap adjusted again. 22.5 in 4 seasons for that price? 4m a sack of the numbers stay consistent. Rough.

He might be the “secretary of defense”. He was giving the LBs and secondary appointments with the ball carrier all game.

I’m not disagreeing with you or anyone. At all. It’s just we seem to be absolving the offense of failings that actually lost us the game and deciding to lump the whole outcome as a defensive failure. It was a team failure. Pre-AFCC hypotheticals: Strength for strength. Their defense vs. our offense. Who would you take? Go weakness for weakness. Their offense vs. our defense. Who would you take? Again, us losing games more often than not is indicative of our defense. They are out biggest let down. Will never argue against that but you’re talking about a seasoned team that just got fully healthy the final weeks of the season. They can put up points, just hadn’t done 30. If you saw that unit they fielded for the whole year, I’d bank on it happening at least one or two out of the 17. Put it in baseball terms if we won games on the basis of pinch hitters and closing pitchers all year but they lay a dud in the championship series, it’s acceptable? Basketball, down 1 need a bucket. Our best player that can penetrate or hit a quick jump shot is also a 95%+ FT shooter on the year. We draw up a play that has him drive low elbow for a quick pop. Lane is open and the better opportunity arises. Fouled from behind with no conversion on the attempt. He goes to the line. 0-2. Is it acceptable? It’s a team sport. Our strength in the bigger picture blinked. See the bolded:

And that’s fair. Not saying anyone is wrong and it’s something there’s validity to people who agree offense or agree defense. This is the question I say to a lot of people though who are so abhorrently against it being the offense. Not saying you’re not btw. If this falls on the defense then how many games did they win or lose in the regular season? Conversely, how many games did the offense win or lose? It’s a team sport. You know our weakness. The defense should be better. I will never deny that. But it absolutely comes down to expectations. I went through the game week thread for the AFCC. The vast majority of fans were essentially saying “we just need them to get a couple of stops or turnovers”. That was many expectations. By that standard request/hope, they did that in the second half. But then the yard stick is moved even further cause they want to blame it entirely on one unit. Our offense wasn’t great to start the first half but gets a pass. The offense left lots of points on the field by repeatedly forcing a scenario that KC had essentially already dictated wasn’t going to work. The play calling in the final drive involves leaving our best skill position on the sideline when there was plenty of time for him to be a focal point, couple that with two poor throws by Josh and a dropped pass on a blown protection change into a miracle heave. We need better players on defense or at least the ones we have to show up when it matters. We also needed better offensive play calling and execution and we win that game. Blame falls on both for the loss imo but offense is the better unit.

Fair points, age can definitley play a part in terms of how you can pan out but if you’re old and raw that’s as much on a player and their willingness to be the best coupled with a great positional coach. I’m not sure who his was in college but they are a necessity for installing the basic and unconscious fundamentals you have when playing the game. A pro coach is where they master fine tuning what they do best. Bro, I’m a huge fan of Dorian and think he could be a decent starter in this league if he was more disciplined but Roquan Smith he definitely is not.

Seems like everyone is in divided camps as to who to blame. Some guys at work think offense, the others think defense. Im in the offense camp. This may be a repeated but simplified post, the defense doesn’t get it done for this team. It’s usually 8/9 out of 10 the offense and Josh who’s winning us a game. The expectation of a low standard was met and exceeded in some way by what fans believed/wanted going into that game. The offense didn’t. They let a lot of their usually quality execution missed and on the field. Is it unfair to rely on the offense/josh to do so much? Yes. Is it unfair to not make the buck stop at the defense in the bigger picture? Yes. There’s no game changer on defense. That’s not an excuse but the talent is somewhat lacking, even with Benford in that unit. That’s a front office problem. There’s definitely one, at least 2 if you count his (Cook) performance in the AFCC and a top end OLine on the offense. Defense is a huge problem but, by season standards, coaching and execution on the offense lost us the game. The offense are the butter for our bread, the hand that feeds, the life-raft on a sinking ship.

Dorian Williams>Roquan Smith?! Shakir=AB84?! Kincaid=Tony G?! F me bro. That’s some wild takes lmao

The sad thing is, his off the field antics, ego and persona are going to lead people to deem him just being “T.O.” and “going off on a random nonsense rant”. There’s weight to it. Especially with a guy who played at a high level for 15 years and was around first hand for a lot of the rule changes we see that team benefit from. Sad, cause like others have said in this thread, things aren’t changing. Especially not anytime soon.

I think he might even get an extension and some new money to appease him if he’s even thinking about wanting to leave the team. Not that it happens this year but rather at the end of this upcoming season into the next off.

Hes really doubling down on his innocence…

About to spend that kind of $ on Groot. We weren’t able to though realistically due to the Von handcuff. Might be the worst thing of this whole regime. Can’t hold injuries against them.

lol yeah, a guard playing LT. Shut him down too whenever he was lined up there. 😔 (sarc)

You aren’t kidding. Some of those guys were so good that we hoped they’d resurrect their play; Star/Butler/Mario Addison. On top of that he had decent ends in Charles Johnson, Greg Hardy and Koby Ealy that SB run. Pair all those guys with Luke Kuechly, Thomas Davis, Shaq Thompson and a rotational AJ Klein… Pretty solid box defense. Secondary had some quality too. That defensive scheme isn’t that far different. Why is that a SB caliber one and here not? Player talent on the field is what I find myself going back to. A lot of decent players only.

JFC. The internet never fails to win…

Both of you made fair points for either side of the argument and it all depends on personal perspective. It can be both good and bad. Will say though, if you’re relying on lucking out with your early draft picks, that’s not a tangible way to operate roster building. Once in a while you can luck out, once in a while you can have a bust. Collectively it needs to have moderate success if you’re wanting to have longevity as a winner.