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But the depth of the bowl will affect the flow and that’s what we are talking about; the deep 50 foot below grade field level. I assume your bowl is oval shaped like the stadium? Now, imagine if that funneled flow of water into that oval shaped bowl hits smack dab against the far wall of the bowl that’s directly perpendicular to it. What happens to that water after it hits that perpendicular side of the bowl?

With one end of the current stadium being perpendicular to the prevailing wind, more wind concentrates or “collects” and swirls when trapped within the bowl. A shallower bowl “collects” less wind. At least that’s how a couple engineers explained it to me.

I don’t have formal education or professional experience in the field. But I know people who do and I think what they say on the matter makes a lot of sense and they’ve said the issue with the field at Highmark being 50 feet below grade is that it causes the winds to swirl due to one end of the stadium being perpendicular to the prevailing wind. And if you’ve ever been on the sidelines during a very windy game, you can appreciate just how impactful that swirling wind can be. At times, the flags on top of the uprights which are only 28.5 feet above the field aren’t moving at all while those on the sideline are getting whipped by the swirling wind. A shallower bowl simply offers more room for the wind to exit. And as I mentioned previously, the more north/south orientation of the new stadium will eliminate one end of the field being perpendicular to the prevailing wind. The wind in Orchard Park will never have been so confused when the new stadium is built.

Good lord, did everyone not realize that “wind confusion” is an ongoing joke whenever a reference is made to any aspect of the new stadium construction? That said, the 50 feet below grade field level at Highmark has always been a contributor to the wind issues in the stadium and a shallower lower bowl should help a ton in that regard. As will the more north/south orientation of the structure itself.

Merchandise sales over the years would seem to contradict this assertion. The Packers have been a well loved team since Lombardi, Jerry Kramer, the Ice Bowl, Max McGee, etc.

Mac will be an All Pro? 😂 Nostradamus Garofalo is not.

No. We are talking past each other. Simple as that. That will help cause major confusion for the wind.

There’s no use in complaining, which is why I was merely pointing out yet another in a string of really poor economic and development mistakes made by Erie county and city of Buffalo leadership for decades. There’s a difference between complaining and lamenting. And I could give a rat’s ass about domes or what percentage of seats are covered.

Thanks for pointing out the obvious. Whatever cost benefit, no matter how little, would be better realized in a populated downtown urban environment than it is out in the sticks. Speaking of two different worlds, that’s what we have with Orchard Park and Buffalo. I have no desire to hash and rehash yet again the pros and cons of stadium location. It should have been downtown 50 years ago and it should be downtown today, economic impact notwithstanding. That is an immovable position for me. Yours and others’ mileage may vary.

Speaks well of the coaching staff and the type of players they have. Bye week hangovers are a very real phenomenon.

This is true, but stadiums are people magnets and even though they’re limited use, they still draw people to a certain geographic area where they tend to spend money. I know all those bar and restaurant owners are glad as hell to have Sabres fans coming back downtown since the pandemic. At the very least, it would only add to the downtown economy, however small that level of addition might be. I’m a big believer in dollar velocity.

That must have been tedious so thanks for the effort. I’m just figuring that the lowest rows comprise that 35% of uncovered seats. Far from horrible, but just as far from optimal as well, imo.

How many rows of the lowest bowl comprise the 21,700 uncovered seats? Another missed opportunity. Kind of like the waterfront plans in the 70s.

I do like the cobblestone facade and I hope they keep that. It’s a real tip of the hat to historic buffalo.

I agree there’s only so much that can be done when designing for specific dimensions and uses like a football stadium. It’s too bad that ours can’t be in an urban setting because I think there are more aesthetic possibilities vs building in a barren field. What would you, as an architect, do to differentiate football stadiums?

I get the building material similarities and I pointed out the roof overhang previously, but everything else you mentioned is generic to many stadiums already.

Fair enough. What in your beholding eyes make the two stadiums so similar in your view?

Other than the roof overhangs and rectangular field, I don’t see many similarities in the renderings of Hotspur and the Bills new stadium. Especially on the outside. Given their bowl shapes and seating, I think all stadiums are similar in those aspects anyway.

There is no debate here when we consider what winner benefits us the most. And as distasteful as it may be, this week it’s the Patriots***. So swallow the bile, gird your loins, and root for a NE*** win this week. A hot shower after the game is advisable.

It not only will block the wind, it will confuse the wind before doing so.

I’ll just say this, teams and their coaches evaluate game film completely differently than the 60 “graders” employed by PFF. And perhaps the biggest difference is that teams have multiple dedicated evaluators, per position group, on both sides of the ball evaluating every play with the full context of each play in each game situation, vs. that single person at PFF evaluating every player at every position and operating without much context, if any at all.

When I look at the pre-construction renderings of Hotspur stadium and compare them to the final product, I’m not convinced that our new stadium won’t also cover much more of the seating.

NJ Giants. 😂 And they will no longer claim NY as their home. 😂

As I said last week the sheer enormity of the task and the time constraints involved don’t lend itself to quality work. PFF has around 60 graders according to their own website. Given an average of 60 plays per team per game on each side of the ball, those 60 people have to analyze over 84,400 individual player snaps each week. As a result, I just can’t take their analyses with anything less than a huge boulder of salt.