duey Posted March 26, 2009 Share Posted March 26, 2009 A few more thoughts (sleeping on an episode always helps)... I can’t get past the idea that everything is circular. Ben uses Sayid as a killer after they get off the island because he knows that that’s all he is and always will be. Ben somehow does survive being shot…he has to the way thinks work. The permanence of the Oceanic folk in the history of the Dharma project is proven by that picture that Christian showed Sun last week. As such, what Sayid did to Ben must be as permanent, thus Ben must survive. Around and around we go. And in regards to Richard...I think he and Ben are caught in the same circular cycle…hence his knowing what was going to happen to John, etc. I think he and Ben aged to a point and then got caught in this circular routine where they’re both trying to get to something or make something happen. Remember how “clueless” Richard was when John first came to him and then when he sat down with Sawyer? Both he and Ben got on the island train at some time and have been riding ever since. The best line of the night was this… Sawyer says to Sayid, “How you doing?” To which Sayid replies, “I was just brought a chicken salad sandwich by a 12-year old Ben Linus…how do you think I’m doing?” I'm still LMAO over that one. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sherman Posted March 26, 2009 Share Posted March 26, 2009 I'm guessing that Ben lives because Jack is there to do surgery. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SonOfWade Posted March 26, 2009 Share Posted March 26, 2009 I'm guessing that Ben lives because Jack is there to do surgery. Either that or young Ben needs blood, and the only viable donor is either Kate, Hurley, or Jack. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
UConn James Posted March 27, 2009 Share Posted March 27, 2009 Either that or young Ben needs blood, and the only viable donor is either Kate, Hurley, or Jack. Ooooh. You know, duey, you may not know the half of it about things being circular. For some time now, people have noticed that the plotlines are working like a parabola. OK, divide the number of planned episodes in half and the midway point (which we'll call M here) should be about late-S3. Work out from there and compare the M+1 and M-1, M+2 and M-2, etc., etc. and you will find similar plotlines. May involve different places or different places, but some of the same conditions are there. E.g. With Sayid in the Others' jail, the timeline to compare to will be mid-season 2... which is when Ben was in the Swan lock-up. You'll find much more of this stuff if you compare. The show is kind of looping back on itself. I believe Young Ben being shot approximately coincides with flip-side of when Boone was injured and Jack went to heroic attempts to save him, giving him his own blood until he was ashen-faced and piqued. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
extrahammer Posted March 27, 2009 Author Share Posted March 27, 2009 Sawyer is in control and screwing things up. Jack is about to take over. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ramius Posted March 27, 2009 Share Posted March 27, 2009 Nice reports by all of you guys as usual. I'm in the camp that little ben isn't dead and that the island will save him or that he knew what was going to happen if he is in a time loop. I also think there are lots of parallels in the show as Uconn pointed out. The show progression has almost reversed on itself. An interesting side note that might have meaning, or might just be a little Easter egg put in by the producers. The guy who gave sayid the truth serum was named Oldham. In the flashforward, when Sayid killed the last guy in Russia, one of the signs on one of buildings read, "Oldham's Pharmaceuticals" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EDinRTP Posted March 27, 2009 Share Posted March 27, 2009 Regarding "Oldham"...trying to place him from earlier episodes. Any possibility he's the dude in the institution with Hurley who gave him the numbers? Could Sayid's brother/buddy from the first scene last week be the new character this season who also crashed on the plane? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
a player to be named later Posted March 27, 2009 Share Posted March 27, 2009 Ben shot Locke and he just healed... Maybe that will be the same case. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DrDawkinstein Posted March 27, 2009 Share Posted March 27, 2009 Regarding "Oldham"...trying to place him from earlier episodes. Any possibility he's the dude in the institution with Hurley who gave him the numbers? Could Sayid's brother/buddy from the first scene last week be the new character this season who also crashed on the plane? i think if you were on a plane with only 20 other people and had a lot of chances to see everyone, you MIGHT notice your brother in handcuffs... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DrDawkinstein Posted March 27, 2009 Share Posted March 27, 2009 Ben shot Locke and he just healed... Maybe that will be the same case. agreed, or Jack or someone saves him, either way he definitely isnt dead Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DrDawkinstein Posted March 27, 2009 Share Posted March 27, 2009 interesting theory that was posted on thetailsection.com (the lost site i frequent). props to the author, screen name "erikau". This was posted in response to someone basically asking "Why name the Swan 'The Swan'?" I'm going to focus on the Hindu tradition, since the clues the show is giving us points squarely in that direction. There are lots of gods and goddesses in this faith, but the Big 3 and their female consorts or counterparts are: Brahma (god of creation) and Sarasvati (goddess of music, knowledge, and art) Vishnu (the essence of all being, and also the master of Time: past, present, and future, the preserver of all existence...he's basically pretty freakin important..interestingly he has four hands, one of which holds the Wheel that symbolizes time in Hinduism) and Lakshmi (goddess of wealth, prosperity, and generosity, and also the embodiment of beauty, grace and charm...she's also the goddess of the means to achieving objectives...basically she's the goddess of helping people get **** done, prosperity haha) Shiva (the god of destruction and rejuvenation) and Durga or Parvati, she goes by both (the Divine Mother and goddess of fertility, motherhood, and generally creation...she is considered the gentle side of Shakti (shakti is the general term for all the primordial cosmic energies, dynamic forces that move throughout the Universe), and the Divine Shakti, meaning she is the embodiment of total energy in the universe...sounds like the Island to me haha) So Brahma creates the world, Vishnu preserves the world, and then Shiva destroys the world so that it can be recreated anew....but all of this happens in a CYCLICAL time, as represented by the wheel...time has no beginning or end, the beginning is the end, the end is the beginning. Each cycle is a mahayuga, a single existence, and it is made up of 4 stages. For more on the 4 stages of Hindu time, and how they parallel Lost, read my theory of the Frozen Donkey Wheel and the Hindu Wheel of Time: link Anyway, Sarsvati, the consort of the creator God and the Goddess of knowledge...she is represented by the Swan, specificaly the Hamsa (Hanso?) bird, or the Mute Swan. The Hamsa Swan is the possessor of the sacred knowledge of the Brahman (not to be confused with the god Brahma). Brahman represents the idea of perfect balance and union in life...a perfect balance of black and white, if you will, the masculine and feminine Shakti or energies (think of the yin yang)...and the bird is considered a container for the Supreme Spirit...much like the Swan station covers, protects, and harnesses the Supreme Spirit, or energy, of the Island. The flight of the hamsa swan is also the symbol for escaping samsara, which in Hinduism is the endless cycle of life death, and rebirth, which is considered mainly a negative thing because one only remains stuck in samsara if they fail to become enlightened...thus the bird is a symbol for achieving enlightenment. In certain sections of Hindu philosophy, one strives to be like the hamsa swan...as it is able to live in the water without getting its feathers wet, so too should a person be able to live in the material world without succumbing to its Maya, or illusion. Hamsa are super important...they symbolize divine knowledge, purity, detachment from the material world, prana (cosmic breath), and the highest level of spiritual achievement. If the Dharma (Hindu for sacred duty) Initiative, with all their Namastes, is not at least interested in the Hindu tradition, I'll eat my hat, They named it the Swan Station...they knew that place would do great things, unlock great mystery, allow them to achieve the impossible...so they gave it a name that had symbolized the highest achievements in the philosophy they admired. if you like this post, i suggest you follow the link to the post about the Frozen Donkey Wheel = Hindu Wheel of Time. (i post this because one of my favorite parts of the show are the discussions it generates. if you guys dont want me posting other people's crap, let me know, i wont be offended. currently, i find it fascinating) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
YOOOOOO Posted March 28, 2009 Share Posted March 28, 2009 I think its pretty obvious that the island will not let Ben die.... and I really think its obvious that Ben needed Sayid to comeback....thats why he was so concerned when Sayid walked away at the docks.... This may also explain why Tom shot into the sand instead of killing Sayid, Jin & Benard at the beach.... Why JUliet was brought to the island, cuz according to that one chick "she looks exactly like her".... I think Ben knew the whole time, who he had to keep alive.....he just didnt know how everything would unfold.... The only thing that kills this theory is that they did try to shoot/kill Sawyer&Jin when they were on the raft..... Plus remeber Bens story about the resurrection....i thought he was talkin about Locke/Jacob...but maybe he was talkin about himself.... Lil Ben was losing faith/patience....he just wanted to join the hostiles, even though it wasnt yet his time....his death/resurrection restored his faith to be patient and wait like Richard told him too.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Jokeman Posted March 28, 2009 Share Posted March 28, 2009 I believe Young Ben being shot approximately coincides with flip-side of when Boone was injured and Jack went to heroic attempts to save him, giving him his own blood until he was ashen-faced and piqued. Or perhaps links to the time Shannon was shot in the stomach and killed? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
UConn James Posted March 30, 2009 Share Posted March 30, 2009 Or perhaps links to the time Shannon was shot in the stomach and killed? Touche. Yes, that coincides nearer in the timeline ---mid-S2, whose flip would be Mid-S5... whereas Boone was late-S1. But even so, I don't see how Ben dies here. I am 100 percent certain he doesn't. The preview for this week's ep: "Whatever Happened, Happened" - Kate tries to save [Young] Ben. Kate starts to tell the truth about the lie in order to keep Aaron from harm. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cugalabanza Posted March 30, 2009 Share Posted March 30, 2009 if you like this post, i suggest you follow the link to the post about the Frozen Donkey Wheel = Hindu Wheel of Time. (i post this because one of my favorite parts of the show are the discussions it generates. if you guys dont want me posting other people's crap, let me know, i wont be offended. currently, i find it fascinating) That's some really interesting stuff. Thanks. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mark Vader Posted March 31, 2009 Share Posted March 31, 2009 Sayid should have known better. He takes one shot at Ben and assumes he's dead. Cosidering how dangerous Ben is, Sayid should have shot him in the back of the head for insurance. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
K-Gun10 Posted March 31, 2009 Share Posted March 31, 2009 Some clips from this weeks episode. http://www.movieweb.com/news/NEraOrrA33ynut Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RayFinkle Posted March 31, 2009 Share Posted March 31, 2009 Sayid should have known better. He takes one shot at Ben and assumes he's dead. Cosidering how dangerous Ben is, Sayid should have shot him in the back of the head for insurance. If there is one thing that TV/Movies have taught us all over the years, always put a couple extra bullets into the body, just to be sure. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cugalabanza Posted March 31, 2009 Share Posted March 31, 2009 If there is one thing that TV/Movies have taught us all over the years, always put a couple extra bullets into the body, just to be sure. Especially if you go back in time to kill somebody you know damn well is supposed to still be alive in the future. Duh! That's basic stuff. Time Travel 101. Along with don't fall in love with your grandmother and bring an almanac. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DrDawkinstein Posted April 1, 2009 Share Posted April 1, 2009 i will be doing the unthinkable and actually miss tonight's episode. got the dvr set though. cant pass up box seats for the Sabres!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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