The Packers' TD

[scribo]

I have not yet seen the game. I only heard/read that the Pack had its way with the Bills first string D in Favre's one and only drive.

 

Did the Pack find some vulnerability in the defense, or did they just execute really well, or did the Bills just execute poorly?

 

Anyone think the Bills would have made adjustments and shut Farve down if he had stayed out there?

[Thailog80]

We played a basic base defense. Relax.

[nobody]

I really think the Bills played a conservative 1st series to appease the Packers.

[marck]

The Packers ran the ball ok, got a first down after a 3rd down pass was incomplete and on the TD, Favre escaped from Sam Adams and threw to Ahman Green who beat Aaron Schobel on zone blitz coverage.

 

No big deal.

 

 

 

I have not yet seen the game. I only heard/read that the Pack had its way with the Bills first string D in Favre's one and only drive.

 

Did the Pack find some vulnerability in the defense, or did they just execute really well, or did the Bills just execute poorly?

 

Anyone think the Bills would have made adjustments and shut Farve down if he had stayed out there?

414332[/snapback]

[Kelly the Dog]

I have not yet seen the game. I only heard/read that the Pack had its way with the Bills first string D in Favre's one and only drive.

 

Did the Pack find some vulnerability in the defense, or did they just execute really well, or did the Bills just execute poorly?

 

Anyone think the Bills would have made adjustments and shut Farve down if he had stayed out there?

414332[/snapback]

For me it was all about Favre, and the Packers play-calling. Favre orchestrated that drive perfectly. The Bills were trying a few things defensivley and didn't blitz more than 1 or 2 plays. The one time we did, the Packers just happened to have a perfect call and Favre threw a nice swing pass to Davenport for 12+ yards, it wasn't like a 12 yard or more pass that was caught. They also ran some draws on third and medium that picked up the first downs. The Bills stopped them in time for a FG but Greer got caught for a very questionable interference call (that had nothing to do with the play), which gave the Pack a first down when they would have kicked a 40+ yard field goal. The TD itself was an awesome play by Favre that very few quaterbacks in the entire league (including Brady and Manning) would have been able to do. They just outsmarted us, out-called us, out-lucked us, and out nickle-and-dimed us down the field led by arguably the best player in the league. I wouldn't call it a cause for worry at all.

[Rubes]

If it was a real game, maybe. Probably not in a preseason game.

 

My main concerns on the TD drive were:

 

1. Failure to shut down the running game effectively

 

2. Failure to hold the Pack on 3rd down.

 

The D did a decent job getting them into 3rd down situations, but they couldn't get off the field. Favre was able to find the open guy fairly easily, at least on two of those occasions.

 

On one occasion, we actually did stop them, but Greer got a bad holding penalty to give them the first down. On the TD play, we actually had a pretty decent defensive call, but Posey proceeded to give his best impression of Eddie Robinson. He had Favre on the run, but Favre danced around and made him look pretty silly. Twice. But it's Favre, so what can you do.

 

Were it a real game, I think we would make some good adjustments to stop the run, and make Favre beat us. Which he might, but I still like our chances.

[Mile High]

If Posey could tackle he would've had Farve for a huge sack on that play.

[scribo]

For me it was all about Favre, and the Packers play-calling. Favre orchestrated that drive perfectly. The Bills were trying a few things defensivley and didn't blitz more than 1 or 2 plays. The one time we did, the Packers just happened to have a perfect call and Favre threw a nice swing pass to Davenport for 12+ yards, it wasn't like a 12 yard or more pass that was caught. They also ran some draws on third and medium that picked up the first downs. The Bills stopped them in time for a FG but Greer got caught for a very questionable interference call (that had nothing to do with the play), which gave the Pack a first down when they would have kicked a 40+ yard field goal. The TD itself was an awesome play by Favre that very few quaterbacks in the entire league (including Brady and Manning) would not have been able to do. The just outsmarted us, out-called us, out-lucked us, and out nickle-and-dimed us down the field led by arguably the best player in the league. I wouldn't call it a cause for worry at all.

414338[/snapback]

Thanks! That's just the info I was looking for.

[Simon]

If Posey could tackle he would've had Farve for a huge sack on that play.

It was embarrasing enough to come free and completely unblocked and then miss a 40yrold QB; but then he whiffed on him again.

It only got worse on the next series when ARodgers made him look like Eddie Robinson on a 15yrd run.

[smokinandjokin]

A. Green picked up a first down when he gained about 9 yards on a 3rd down draw. Excellent call. I think the whole stadium and the Bills D were thinking pass.

[Peter]

Two words: Brett Favre.

 

He abused us on the opening drive. Whether that would have continued if he had not left the game, who knows. The guy is a future hall of famer and there is a reason for that. He showed why on the first series -- especially during the play that resulted in the TD.

[LabattBlue]

threw to Ahman Green who beat Aaron Schobel on zone blitz coverage.

 

No big deal.

414336[/snapback]

I was puzzled by this when GB scored and then proceeded to forgot about it. I've never understood the part of the zone blitz scheme where you have a 280 pound DE trying to cover a 200 pound RB? It's a matchup that the defense will lose everytime.

 

...unless it was a blown coverage!

[stuckincincy]

I was puzzled by this when GB scored and then proceeded to forgot about it.  I've never understood the part of the zone blitz scheme where you have a 280 pound DE trying to cover a 200 pound RB?  It's a matchup that the defense will lose everytime. 

 

...unless it was a blown coverage!

414550[/snapback]

 

I think zone blitzing lends itself to a 3-4 set.

[jad1]

I think zone blitzing lends itself to a 3-4 set.

414632[/snapback]

 

The 3-4 gives a team more angles to blitz from, but a 4-3 has quicker and more agile DEs to drop into coverage than a 3-4.

 

Zone Blitzing from a 3-4 or 4-3 might not be the best idea against a veteren like Favre though.

[LabattBlue]

The 3-4 gives a team more angles to blitz from, but a 4-3 has quicker and more agile DEs to drop into coverage than a 3-4. 

 

Zone Blitzing from a 3-4 or 4-3 might not be the best idea against a veteren like Favre though.

414642[/snapback]

It doesn't matter how quick and agile your DE's are. They will not be able to cover a RB in any downfield pass coverage scenario.

[jad1]

It doesn't matter how quick and agile your DE's are.  They will not be able to cover a RB in any downfield pass coverage scenario.

414643[/snapback]

 

Well that's why they're in a zone, and not man-to-man. The Bills really don't use zone blitzing that much, but Denney did get an interception last preseason in a zone blitz.

 

Sam Adams' interception against the Pats a couple of seasons ago looked like it came from a zone blitz (or Sam was just reeeeaaal slow getting off the line). Fletcher blitzed, Sam stepped back, Brady made a bad throw, and that's goal of the zone blitz.

[LabattBlue]

Well that's why they're in a zone, and not man-to-man. 

414652[/snapback]

That's why I asked if it was a blown coverage. It was Schobel on Green with no one else in sight. Didn't appear to be zone coverage to me, but then again I wasn't at the stadium.

[Kelly the Dog]

That's why I asked if it was a blown coverage.  It was Schobel on Green with no one else in sight.  Didn't appear to be zone coverage to me, but then again I wasn't at the stadium.

414657[/snapback]

It was a zone blitz. Schobel's job was to cover the back out of the backfield (as it developed), which he did. When Favre started scrambling, however, it was virtually impossible for Schobel to stay with Ahman Green. But if a LB were on him for that long, I doubt the LB would have stayed with him either. The play broke down because Favre scrambled and reversed his field and then lobbed a perfect touch pass on the run, not because of a mismatch or mistake on defense.

[Mark Vader]

One very key play in this drive occured on a 3rd down play when the Packers had the ball at the Bills 20.

Favre threw an incomplete pass which would have brought on the FG unit, but there was a bogus defensive holding call on Jabari Greer, which kept the drive going.

If you watch the replay, Greer makes contact with the receiver, but does not even come close to holding him. Did anyone else see that?

[LabattBlue]

It was a zone blitz. Schobel's job was to cover the back out of the backfield (as it developed), which he did. When Favre started scrambling, however, it was virtually impossible for Schobel to stay with Ahman Green. But if a LB were on him for that long, I doubt the LB would have stayed with him either. The play broke down because Favre scrambled and reversed his field and then lobbed a perfect touch pass on the run, not because of a mismatch or mistake on defense.

414662[/snapback]

I hear what you are saying, but I just don't agree with a scheme that takes your best pass rushing DE and drops him into coverage against a RB. That being said, it's hard to argue with Gray's success the last couple of years.

[Kelly the Dog]

I hear what you are saying, but I just don't agree with a scheme that takes your best pass rushing DE and drops him into coverage against a RB.  That being said, it's hard to argue with Gray's success the last couple of years.

414676[/snapback]

That's what the zone blitz means by definition. That is what built Dick LeBeau''s reputation. That is the entire idea behind it, that the linemen won't know who to block if the DE moves back and the LB blitzes in another hole in his place.

[Rubes]

That being said, it's hard to argue with Gray's success the last couple of years.

414676[/snapback]

 

 

Unless you're Jerry Sullivan, then it's easy to argue it!

[Wiz]

One very key play in this drive occured on a 3rd down play when the Packers had the ball at the Bills 20.

Favre threw an incomplete pass which would have brought on the FG unit, but there was a bogus defensive holding call on Jabari Greer, which kept the drive going.

If you watch the replay, Greer makes contact with the receiver, but does not even come close to holding him. Did anyone else see that?

414671[/snapback]

Bad call. The receiver came into the body of Greer and Greer's arms got on the outside of his shoulderpads. That is what caused the ref to throw the flag.

[Simon]

The Bills really don't use zone blitzing that much,

I think they're uisng it a lot more than you think. Last night we saw Schobel, Kelsay, Denney, Ritzman, Gause, Edwards and Bannan all dropping at one point or another. The only guys I didn't see dropping into a zone were The Keg and TimAnderson. Keep an eye out fo rit and you'll see it almost every series at some point.

 

As for the GB TD, I'm not entirely convinced that even was a zoneblitz. Schobel didn't drop out immediately at the snap, instead sort of drifting out and up as if he were keeping contain (a must in that part of the field) while eyeballing Green in the flat. When Posey blew his job twice it seemed like Schobel realized the play had gone on too long and that there was nobody behind him on the short side so he took it upon himself to chase Green when he headed upfield. If it was a zone blitz, Schobel would have dropped into his zone right at the snap, or at the latest after he took a jabstep to hold the LT. He did not, instead moving up and to the outside.

Probably need to check with a coach on that one.

[34-78-83]

Well that's why they're in a zone, and not man-to-man.  The Bills really don't use zone blitzing that much, but Denney did get an interception last preseason in a zone blitz.

 

Sam Adams' interception against the Pats a couple of seasons ago looked like it came from a zone blitz (or Sam was just reeeeaaal slow getting off the line). Fletcher blitzed, Sam stepped back, Brady made a bad throw, and that's goal of the zone blitz.

414652[/snapback]

 

dude, the Bills use a TON of zone blitz in their scheme (probably second only to Pitt) and it has increased each year since Gray's arrival.

[ExWNYer]

It was embarrasing enough to come free and completely unblocked and then miss a 40yrold QB; but then he whiffed on him again.

It only got worse on the next series when ARodgers made him look like Eddie Robinson on a 15yrd run. 

414352[/snapback]

 

Uh, he's 35...but why let facts get in the way of a good story.

 

BTW, Posey did do a horrible job on that play. It looked like the old banana peel routine out there.

[Bflojohn]

I agree that the defensive hold on Greer was totally bogus! If anything Chapman initiated the contact and Greer only gave him a "chuck" that Chapman got around in a second! If they (officials) were going to call a foul, then illegal use of hands (beyond the 5 yard zone) was the only plausable call, but like I said, even that would have been highly questionable!!!