Josh Allen Played Most Undisciplined Game in Three years Against Falcons-- Jim Kubiak BN

[90sBills]

1 hour ago, HamSandwhich said:

I havent read through this thread, just the OP. Perhaps what I'm about to say is not new and others have been saying it. Given that this seems to be a yearly thing for the team, could it be that we get a good record out of the gate and then coaching says "lets do some experimenting since we have some leeway to see what works and what doesnt" and thus they get the mid season lull? It just seems so odd to me that this happens all the time. 

 

 

Experimenting things like letting blitzers go straight to our qb and see what happens?

[Peace Frog]

21 hours ago, Casey D said:

Wow, that's a lot of projection and speculation you got there.

Merely based off of what my eyes have seen.  At this moment in time, I have the Bills finishing 10-7 and losing the WC game.

[CincyBillsFan]

3 hours ago, Avisan said:

I mean... and lot of teams have players that can set pass protections and execute them and/or immediately get the ball to the hot routes.  We have good pressure rates as a defensive unit, it's not as though we're failing to disrupt the QB from a schematic standpoint, our secondary is just dogwater.

 

Despite that, we're currently the 17th ranked defense, so basically dead average, so SOMETHING has to be going right.

We played the J.E.T.S!

[major]

Our qb is on this list:

 

https://www.nytimes.com/athletic/6720664/2025/10/16/dak-prescott-cowboys-nfl-betrayed-quarterbacks/

[Dillenger4]

1 hour ago, Casey D said:

And I never said they will hold teams to 24 and 23 points a game.  It was not a prediction.  My point is that they did hold the other two teams to 23 and 24 the last two games and that should be good enough to win with a top flight offense.

Maybe, but I think it is more just being human beings-- we have off days.  That's why teams lose games they should not lose and even the very best baseball teams lose over 60 games a year.  And only the 1972 Dolphins went undefeated in the NFL.

Yes, Human beings that aren't very good at football compared to the other NFL players they are playing against. Maybe that's the issue?

Our D is not good. Full stop. I guess we will see vs Carolina. Hopefully they can win and move forward.

[CincyBillsFan]

2 hours ago, zow2 said:

I'm not panicking as we saw Allen really struggle last season @Baltimore and @Houston.  Then he came on after that to win the MVP.  Games vs. KC, SF, Rams and Detroit also blitzed him and he masterfully picked those teams apart or scrambled out of trouble for nice gains.

There's no question in my mind that the offensive line has failed in some big moments, and the WR's.  They all need to pick up the pace and urgency... and I think they will.

I was curious as to Allen's play this year versus last season and here's what I found:

 

2024 during the 3 - 2 start Allen averaged 221 total (pass + rush) yards per game;  2.0 total TD's per game & 0.4 TO's per game.

 

2025 during the 4 - 2 start Allen has averaged 275 total yards per game; 2.33 total TD's per game & 0.67 TO per game.

 

Pretty close.  So post the 4 - 2 start will 2024's MVP emerge or not? I think Allen will mimic last season.

 

 

[Casey D]

15 minutes ago, Dillenger4 said:

Yes, Human beings that aren't very good at football compared to the other NFL players they are playing against. Maybe that's the issue?

Our D is not good. Full stop. I guess we will see vs Carolina. Hopefully they can win and move forward.

You are correct, it isn't.  They need to improve, and the offense needs to get its Mojo back if this team is to do anything.

[Pete]

21 hours ago, TBBills Fan said:

If that is the case why is bailing on clean pockets?  Why does is he not taking the easy buckets?

 

Does he have superman PTSD? Cause he has been bailing early 

He was getting battered.  That messes with your head after awhile, even Josh.

[Livinginthepast]

Most competent OCs would find ways to punish blitzing teams like the Falcons, but not our little Joe, he looks at Josh getting hammered by blitzing defenders as a test of resilience! 

[zow2]

We will see in the coming weeks but maybe it was just one of those games??   The Atlanta's D-coordinator, Jeff Ulbrich, used the perfect defense to neutralize Allen and the Bills.  Couple that with not having Dalton Kincaid and Palmer being injured early in the 2nd Qtr, it was really a mess on offense.

[Sojourner]

13 hours ago, Einstein said:

 

Josh was not great. 

 

But the disconnect between the two posting groups is that some of us think that Allen played poorly in part due to the porous line and non-stop pressure he was under.

 

Even Tom Brady looked bad in games where he was under nonstop pressure. It gets to a QB.

There very may well be disconnect but it isn’t because of those circumstances. Some think Josh was not to blame at all. 
 

Those of us who are saying that some blame goes to Josh understand there was lapses in play from the offensive line but there was several plays he made the wrong decision on. Gobills808 asked for the proof and I provided him two drives to end and start the first and second quarters. 
 

All I’ve seen is people blame the defense. They actually did a reasonable job in the second half to limit the Falcons from scoring on their first 3 drives; even wiped points off the board via a blocked FG. 
 

All I’ve seen is people say the coaches can’t scheme anyone open, the talent can’t separate or get space for Josh to throw. Yet on those drive screenshots, the majority of them, Josh had ample time to throw thanks to the offensive line AND guys were open. 
 

There wasn’t a lot of great in that game. The defense was abysmal but actually managed to do something when it’s back was against the wall to give us a decent chunk of the game to get back in it and take the lead. The offensive game plan could have been better when you’re up against a team that runs a lot of blitzes. 
 

This team has blemishes on all sides but the QB. We know more often than not Josh is going to have to pull a rabbit out of a hat for a win. These last two games? Not really. Josh was forcing a lot of stuff to whom he had already decided. 
 

Wasnt a Keon fan but thought he’d turn it around after Baltimore. Looking unlikely. The problem is more that Josh forces the ball consistently to him. Several throws against Atlanta there was actually another option open for an uncontested catch by the time the ball gets there. That’s a problem that isn’t purely a coaching or play design issue. 
 

None of those saying he had a bad game is bashing Josh. Completely the opposite. The disconnect problem you highlight is when the majority point out A, B or C was bad it usually results in bashing and now most of the same people implying their own perspective as someone critiquing Josh through the same lens they do the defense, Keon, Sean, Brandon or whatever it is for that week. 
 

Most of those alluding to Josh having a bad game are ironically the ones who usually don’t tar and feather the team or its players for their blips, blunders or defects. 
 

 

[Einstein]

15 minutes ago, Sojourner said:

There very may well be disconnect but it isn’t because of those circumstances. 

 

As one on the other side, yes it is.
 

15 minutes ago, Sojourner said:

there was several plays he made the wrong decision on. Gobills808 asked for the proof and I provided him two drives to end and start the first and second quarters. 

No, you posted a few plays with poor analysis and attributed blame to the wrong person on most of them.

For example: On the 2nd & 10 you wanted Josh to throw the swing pass. I dont know what game you're watching but the play-call was for Josh to keep the ball. That was literally the play. You see Edwards pull and McGovern block down. This was a run all the way. The swing route was a distraction. If Allen throws that, its immediately illegal man downfield.

On another play you say Josh has plenty of options and should have thrown to one of them, completely ignoring that his first read has 1 on 1 on the outside with no safety help because there are 2 receivers on that side and the safety is playing middle.

In another play you say that Josh should have audibled to run on the other side of the field, because you saw more Bills players over there and thinks thats how that work (it doesnt).  I could keep going on, but what's the points?

So yes, you posted a bunch of images and wrote words, but they were grounded in a lack of football knowledge and understanding of what is happening. In general you really struggle with understanding progressions and that not every person on the field is a viable target.

[Sojourner]

Just now, Einstein said:

 

As one on the other side, yes it is.
 

No, you posted a few plays with poor analysis and attributed blame to the wrong person on most of them.

For example: On the 2nd & 10 you wanted Josh to throw the swing pass. I dont know what game you're watching but the play-call was for Josh to keep the ball. That was literally the play. You see Edwards pull and McGovern block down. This was a run all the way. The swing route was a distraction. If Allen throws that, its immediately illegal man downfield.

On another play you say Josh has plenty of options and should have thrown to one of them, completely ignoring that his first read has 1 on 1 on the outside with no safety help because there are 2 receivers on that side and the safety is playing middle.

In another play you say that Josh should have audibled to run on the other side of the field, because you saw more Bills players over there and thinks thats how that work (it doesnt).  I could keep going on, but what's the points?

So yes, you posted a bunch of images and wrote words, but they were grounded in a lack of football knowledge and understanding of what is happening. In general you really struggle with understanding progressions and that not every person on the field is a viable target.

Einstein. Always has to chastise or inflate his own ego in the manner of belittling people.
 

Run checks are exclusively that. It does work like that. They are built in for you to CHECK the side that better suits defensive alignment. High school football… HIGH SCHOOL. Has 3 and sometimes 4 checks. Every run play has a mirror call, but you knew that already. 
Every play has a fail safe run pass or RPO to check to. But you knew that already. 
 

Everyone is a viable target. Hence the rule of progressions, checks and route combinations. 
 

But you know everything. 

Just like your one post…

 

”watch the all 22. There’s zero separation”

 

SMH. 

[GoBills808]

6 minutes ago, Sojourner said:

Einstein. Always has to chastise or inflate his own ego in the manner of belittling people.
 

Run checks are exclusively that. It does work like that. They are built in for you to CHECK the side that better suits defensive alignment. High school football… HIGH SCHOOL. Has 3 and sometimes 4 checks. Every run play has a mirror call, but you knew that already. 
Every play has a fail safe run pass or RPO to check to. But you knew that already. 
 

Everyone is a viable target. Hence the rule of progressions, checks and route combinations. 
 

But you know everything. 

Just like your one post…

 

”watch the all 22. There’s zero separation”

 

SMH. 

but not at the same time

 

the reason i always post stills from the top of Allen's drop is because that's when the ball is supposed to come out to his first read, it gives you an understanding of what the play should look like from the OC and QB perspective...the design plus Allen's pre- and post snap diagnosis 

 

and there are half field reads that really do mean the other routes aren't viable targets in the sense that the ball is just not going there unless the play breaks down 

 

 

[Sojourner]

2 minutes ago, GoBills808 said:

but not at the same time

 

the reason i always post stills from the top of Allen's drop is because that's when the ball is supposed to come out to his first read, it gives you an understanding of what the play should look like from the OC and QB perspective...the design plus Allen's pre- and post snap diagnosis 

 

and there are half field reads that really do mean the other routes aren't viable targets in the sense that the ball is just not going there unless the play breaks down 

 

 

Oh I know. I was being zealous to being wrong. 
 

 

[LABILLBACKER]

46 minutes ago, zow2 said:

We will see in the coming weeks but maybe it was just one of those games??   The Atlanta's D-coordinator, Jeff Ulbrich, used the perfect defense to neutralize Allen and the Bills.  Couple that with not having Dalton Kincaid and Palmer being injured early in the 2nd Qtr, it was really a mess on offense.

That still doesn't excuse Brady for having no answer to the constant blitz or pulling Cook out on 3rd down.  We're finding out that both Brady & Babich are not great making in game adjustments on the fly. We don't have hot reads embedded in this offense.  If I'm a DC, I'm blitzing Josh the rest of the season.

[Low Positive]

59 minutes ago, Casey D said:

You are correct, it isn't.  They need to improve, and the offense needs to get its Mojo back if this team is to do anything.

This might be a bit of rant. It probably should be it's own thread, but I don't start threads. Got knows we have enough negative ones around here this week. 

 

The entire Bills roster lacks swagger. My biggest complaint about our coaching staff and front office is that they are afraid of big personalities. I miss Diggs screaming "I AM HIM" after TDs. Ja'Marr Chase, who everyone here watched for the first time this year last night in awe, has swagger in everything he does. He walks into the stadium with his junk in a wheelbarrow. He demands a minimum of ~12 targets a game. If he doesn't get them, he'll complain to the beat reporters after the game. He does this after wins. He claims he's "always open," and should get the ball even if he's double covered. He is not about the team. He is about HIM. Higgins is quieter, but he still demands targets. Burrow does a fantastic job not only getting them the ball, but also managing the egos. The Bills actively avoid this type of personality, instead looking for "humble and hungry." I'm tired of process guys. I want players who impose their will on other people. I want players that, when they get embarrased like the Bills did in the first half on Monday, don't hang their heads in shame but want to tear the other guys heads off. To paraphrase the great Larry Bird, we need dawgs, not a bunch of milk drinkers. 

 

This was after a loss, but this is what I want. I want great players that KNOW they are great and are not afraid to tell everyone that they are great.

 

[GoBills808]

1 minute ago, Low Positive said:

This might be a bit of rant. It probably should be it's own thread, but I don't start threads. Got knows we have enough negative ones around here this week. 

 

The entire Bills roster lacks swagger. My biggest complaint about our coaching staff and front office is that they are afraid of big personalities. I miss Diggs screaming "I AM HIM" after TDs. Ja'Marr Chase, who everyone here watched for the first time this year last night in awe, has swagger in everything he does. He walks into the stadium with his junk in a wheelbarrow. He demands a minimum of ~12 targets a game. If he doesn't get them, he'll complain to the beat reporters after the game. He does this after wins. He claims he's "always open," and should get the ball even if he's double covered. He is not about the team. He is about HIM. Higgins is quieter, but he still demands targets. Burrow does a fantastic job not only getting them the ball, but also managing the egos. The Bills actively avoid this type of personality, instead looking for "humble and hungry." I'm tired of process guys. I want players who impose their will on other people. I want players that, when they get embarrased like the Bills did in the first half on Monday, don't hang their heads in shame but want to tear the other guys heads off. To paraphrase the great Larry Bird, we need dawgs, not a bunch of milk drinkers. 

 

This was after a loss, but this is what I want. I want great players that KNOW they are great and are not afraid to tell everyone that they are great.

 

never going to happen under McDermott

 

 

[Low Positive]

10 minutes ago, GoBills808 said:

never going to happen under McDermott

 

 

Well then, he's gotta go. You can't win in this violent sport with a bunch of milk drinkers. That's probably my biggest complaint about McDermott. It's his job as an NFL head coach to manage those personalities. So when things went out of control with Diggs, that's on him. Now he wants to avoid those types of personalities, even to the point of making it a major point in draft decisions? You can't build a team like that. 

[DCofNC]

On 10/16/2025 at 12:56 PM, 26TrapDraw said:

beg to differ. I was at the pats game and he forced throws missed open receivers all night. Granted he played better against the Pats. But i saw some very uncharacteristic stuff from 17 these last 2 games. The picks were his fault but the rest of the offense as a whole didn't help him much. Kincaid had a great game against the pats but as a whole the offense is sputtering. In my humble opinion Josh seems off .

Not for nothing, outside of the 4th quarter of the Ravens game and the 1st quarter of the Pats game, this might be the worst we have seen Josh in years.   He has had a few drives here and there where it looked good, but for the most part, he has not been himself this year.   I think he came in with the “everyone eats” thing being ok in his mind and he has lost faith in it.  He’s pressing bc the WRs aren’t worth a damn and teams have started to key on Cook.   That’s my armchair evaluation anyway.   JA is an intelligent guy, he sees the garbage around him and there’s no way he wants to run these dumbass sweeps on crucial plays.  The defense is a joke and he obviously knows that.  I don’t see how he wouldn’t be questioning everything and pressing to try to win it himself.