JP51 Posted September 4 Posted September 4 The debate rages on the board and in my head LOL.... there are times that I am yelling at the TV fire him... he will never be good enough... then I remember the criticism of Polian and for 20 years longed for someone like him as we attempted to redefine mediocrity as a franchise... but I dont want to settle for another Marv type "well we were good and that was a fun ride"... so I wonder... does firing the coach help i dont care what we have to do to win it all.... who do you bring in... is this another 2 years of Allen's career before everyone is on the same page in hopes the next guy is better? But some of his game day decisions are horrible.. and back and forth I go... then I wonder when I look at this team is this guy really out coaching what most could do, is he the right guy for the right situation... Sometimes I wonder about the over all talent level here (there are no Reed, Thomas, Smith, Talley, Bennett, Conlan, Odomes, L Smith, Wolford, Ritcher, Hull, Lofton, Tasker talent amalgamations here to compliment Josh) .... especially on Defense... Benford is great... Bernard is B plus, Milano hasn't been available... the defensive line is a C something our overall 2ndry in the past few years has been a fire drill.... Offensive line is very good TE our average, WR are average... injuries have been exhausting,. outside of Allen and maybe Dawkins and for 1 year Cook and even going into the past with Diggs maybe a cup of coffee with a healthy Milano... who have the studs been on this team. Where are the game wreckers on defense... Is it possible that McDermott is taking this team as far as its talent will go... Is his flaw he finds weak D cords so he can run defense... Would we be the Bengals or the Cowboys or the Chargers without him? Or are we the 90's Bills with Marv and coaching is the only thing stopping us... Right now. I am putting down my pitchfork I wanna see this year... I reserve my right to pick it up at any time. Because I know this.. we are completely wasting Josh and they need to figure this out... 1 1 Quote
Walking Tall Posted September 4 Posted September 4 (edited) 2 hours ago, Gregg said: Saban and Levy had more success than McDermott. If winning counts (and it does) then Saban is #1. He coached B2B AFL championships in Bills history. The only coach to actually win something here. Winning 4 straight AFC Championships (14 teams) in the 90’s was way more difficult than 2 AFL Championships (8 teams) in the mid-1960’s. That’s why Marv Levy should always get the nod as the best coach in franchise history. Edited September 4 by Walking Tall 1 1 Quote
Gregg Posted September 4 Posted September 4 7 minutes ago, Walking Tall said: Winning 4 straight AFC Championships (14 teams) in the 90’s was way more difficult than 2 AFL Championships (8 teams) in the mid-1960’s. That’s why Marv Levy should always get the nod as the best coach in franchise history. That's a good point. Both would have to rank 1 and 2 on the Bills all-time coaching list. McDermott is probably 3 with Knox at 4. After that I have no idea. 1 1 Quote
BillsShredder83 Posted September 4 Posted September 4 18 hours ago, VW82 said: I don't think it's just about the young guys. Look who we drafted. Look who we brought in. If you follow the guys covering the team, they all say our approach on defense looks different this year. More pressure, more rushers, more guys in man covering one-on-one, more diversity in concepts. It could take us a bit to find the right combinations and find a new identify. McD is evolving and so is the defense. Serious question. Do you have any writers in particular you're referencing. I totally believe you but feel like I havent seen anything about it. Maybe I have and just skimmed over it thinking - thats the usual late summer coach speak. I'd like to see what you or anyone else has seen indicating this? Very possible I was distracted over summer and just missed it too Quote
Mikie2times Posted September 4 Posted September 4 54 minutes ago, T master said: I would rather be a part of a winning team every year than what transpired before McD got here . Prior to his arrival as you have apparently forgotten every 3 + years there was a HC ing change, scheme changes, player changes and NO PLAY OFFS AT ALL because there was no stability . Where does this stuff come from. Josh is ensuring that doesn't happen more than anybody. We might not hold hands as much as we do now, but this team isn't missing the playoffs with Allen at QB. Quote
JP51 Posted September 4 Posted September 4 (edited) 9 minutes ago, Gregg said: That's a good point. Both would have to rank 1 and 2 on the Bills all-time coaching list. McDermott is probably 3 with Knox at 4. After that I have no idea. This will not be a popular take... Give Saban, Knox, or even Mc D Marv's roster with all of those HOF'ers and Pro Bowlers like literally a roster that i have not seen the likes of almost ever I think those three win at least 1. Marchibroda was the mastermind of that team... and all three of those guys would have fired Walt Corey who took a defense comprised of Bruce Smith, Cornelius Bennett, Nate Odomes, Leonard Smith, Shane Conlan and Darryl Talley to dead last in the NFL... Edited September 4 by JP51 1 Quote
PoundingDog Posted September 4 Author Posted September 4 13 minutes ago, JP51 said: The debate rages on the board and in my head LOL.... there are times that I am yelling at the TV fire him... he will never be good enough... then I remember the criticism of Polian and for 20 years longed for someone like him as we attempted to redefine mediocrity as a franchise... but I dont want to settle for another Marv type "well we were good and that was a fun ride"... so I wonder... does firing the coach help i dont care what we have to do to win it all.... who do you bring in... is this another 2 years of Allen's career before everyone is on the same page in hopes the next guy is better? But some of his game day decisions are horrible.. and back and forth I go... then I wonder when I look at this team is this guy really out coaching what most could do, is he the right guy for the right situation... Sometimes I wonder about the over all talent level here (there are no Reed, Thomas, Smith, Talley, Bennett, Conlan, Odomes, L Smith, Wolford, Ritcher, Hull, Lofton, Tasker talent amalgamations here to compliment Josh) .... especially on Defense... Benford is great... Bernard is B plus, Milano hasn't been available... the defensive line is a C something our overall 2ndry in the past few years has been a fire drill.... Offensive line is very good TE our average, WR are average... injuries have been exhausting,. outside of Allen and maybe Dawkins and for 1 year Cook and even going into the past with Diggs maybe a cup of coffee with a healthy Milano... who have the studs been on this team. Where are the game wreckers on defense... Is it possible that McDermott is taking this team as far as its talent will go... Is his flaw he finds weak D cords so he can run defense... Would we be the Bengals or the Cowboys or the Chargers without him? Or are we the 90's Bills with Marv and coaching is the only thing stopping us... Right now. I am putting down my pitchfork I wanna see this year... I reserve my right to pick it up at any time. Because I know this.. we are completely wasting Josh and they need to figure this out... Oh Boy, you are going to get blasted by those who will shout in your ear "We have Allen, the greatest QB/player in NFL history". It reminds me of an old SNL episode on Ditka, as in Ditka beats everything and anyone by himself. In some Bills fans' mind, that's exactly what it is replacing Ditka's name with Allen. Now realistically, the combination of salary cap, rule changes and general improvement of scouting overall means the kind of talent stacking in one team in the early 90s era is not happening in today's NFL. But you still need to be on the same level of talent overall as the best teams in the league to win. The Bills have the most important position covered, but not other positions in prior years. We'll see what transpires in 2025. 1 Quote
Mark80 Posted September 4 Posted September 4 (edited) 3 hours ago, Gregg said: Saban and Levy had more success than McDermott. If winning counts (and it does) then Saban is #1. He coached B2B AFL championships in Bills history. The only coach to actually win something here. Levy had how many hall of famers and didn't win a Superbowl? Got just as outcoached in each of those Superbowls as McD has vs the Chiefs .615 win rate compared to McD's .656. How, exactly, is that better? Not to mention no salary cap to deal with. Saban won championships in a league that had a whopping 8 teams and was a second rate league compared to the NFL. Congrats, he beat 7 other minor league teams. Give me a break. Edited September 4 by Mark80 1 Quote
JP51 Posted September 4 Posted September 4 2 minutes ago, PoundingDog said: Oh Boy, you are going to get blasted by those who will shout in your ear "We have Allen, the greatest QB/player in NFL history". It reminds me of an old SNL episode on Ditka, as in Ditka beats everything and anyone by himself. In some Bills fans' mind, that's exactly what it is replacing Ditka's name with Allen. Now realistically, the combination of salary cap, rule changes and general improvement of scouting overall means the kind of talent stacking in one team in the early 90s era is not happening in today's NFL. But you still need to be on the same level of talent overall as the best teams in the league to win. The Bills have the most important position covered, but not other positions in prior years. We'll see what transpires in 2025. Yes I will and I will also get blasted by the other side that hates Beane's drafting except for Allen... and you know what, I won't disagree with either of them... because I myself just don't know if its the chicken or the egg... I don't see the massive overall talent on this team outside of Allen and a couple others... especially on the D Line... and wonder if he really isnt doing a good job with what he has... and then I see some in game decisions that are so bad its mind blowng... so, I got my fire ######ant suit on... they can flame away, its good discussion... and you are also right the salary cap era is different for sure. Quote
Gregg Posted September 4 Posted September 4 1 minute ago, Mark80 said: Levy had how many hall of famers and didn't win a Superbowl? Got just as outcoached in each of those Superbowls as McD has vs the Chiefs .615 win rate compared to McD's .656. How, exactly, is that better? Saban won championships in a league that had a whopping 8 teams and was a second rate league compared to the NFL. Congrats, he beat 7 other minor league teams. Give me a break. He got outcoached vs the Giants. Why they didn't give the ball to Thurman more in that game I will never understand. If they had the Bills probably win that game. Against the Redskins and Cowboys, the Bills just got their asses kicked. Washington physically dominated them and the Cowboys at that time were just as skilled if not more so than the Bills. As for Saban yes it was the AFL, but he still goes in the Bills record books as the only coach to win a championship for Buffalo. Winning goes a long way that is why he is up there as one the great Bills coaches of all-time. McDermott needs to at least get to a Super Bowl. If he wins one, then he goes to the top of the Bills all-time coaching list. 2 Quote
BigDingus Posted September 4 Posted September 4 18 hours ago, VW82 said: I don't think it's just about the young guys. Look who we drafted. Look who we brought in. If you follow the guys covering the team, they all say our approach on defense looks different this year. More pressure, more rushers, more guys in man covering one-on-one, more diversity in concepts. It could take us a bit to find the right combinations and find a new identify. McD is evolving and so is the defense. Well that should be good, because the Bills had way more success in Man coverage than they did Zone against Lamar. Pretty sure Lamar was 12 of 12 against us in Zone & 6 of 13 against Man. Might not be great against everyone, but it's certainly important in certain matches. 1 Quote
BillsShredder83 Posted September 4 Posted September 4 9 hours ago, justjoshingaround said: I think mcdermott is a nice guy. I do think he coaches not to lose. I fear he will never go for the kill shot in the playoffs. I think that's been pretty obvious. What will never sit well me was vs mia. Sending bass out there for a 61 yarder. Knowing damn well if he missed it bass was going to be the scapegoat. I think this should be mcdermotts last year if he doesn't make it to the superbowl. If we keep him, no one outside of buffalo will realize the amazing, 1 of a kind talent allen was. I dont even necessarily disagree with the sentiment of this post, but the first bolded is just factually wrong. Dude is aggressive , unfortunately results havent matched philosophy. Second bolded I couldn't disagree more on. I think it was brilliant, regardless of how it had turned out. Sometimes you need a polarizing moment: A. He absolutely flops on his face attempting it... 1a. Dude crumbles to pieces going forward, we know what we have to do in offseason 2a. Dude takes the faith given in him, and uses it as a crutch to overcome the yips for good. Fixed! B. He makes it. Remembers why he got that contract from us, proceeds to ball out. He went route B... but even if he'd want 1a/1b, we could make a fair assessment. Also, McD would've absolutely dived into the dung pile after that game to protect the player, had it worked that way. I think that's one of the stronger traits of his tenure here, and it reflects in how we hear player leadership talk/act after games too. Quote
T master Posted September 4 Posted September 4 40 minutes ago, HomeskillitMoorman said: How could I possibly guarantee that with anyone I would name? Just like you can't guarantee that McD will win a SB here. And I wouldn't ask that because it's silly. And I didn't say a defensive coach can't win it, I said McD is a defensive coach whose defense has let us down for 6 straight years in the postseason. His side of the ball has been our big weakness and liability in the most important games every year. That didn't happen with Belichick's defenses on the Giants or Patriots. I'm starting to think you don't even read what people are writing here. No I can't but I unlike most of you haters I will ride with the guy that gives me the best chance year after year instead of gambling on a different HC that will put us in the drink again like Jacksonville has done . As far as McD being a D coach yes but he allows those he has put in those positions to coach those players the freedom to do their job and he himself will take the blunt of it for their failures . I just get sick and tired of all the whining and crying a lot of Bills fans are like the wife that you can never please no matter what you buy her she always wants more . It's like for christ sake enjoy what we got quit your complaining, every year it's the same thing every body else in the NFL notices that McD is one of the best HC's in the league but our fans alls they want to do is criticize no matter how good the team does . Maybe it will sink in a bit more next year when some of ya'll walk into the Brand New Stadium that Mcd& Company helped the Bills get ... But I doubt it . Quote
Mikie2times Posted September 4 Posted September 4 10 minutes ago, JP51 said: Yes I will and I will also get blasted by the other side that hates Beane's drafting except for Allen... and you know what, I won't disagree with either of them... because I myself just don't know if its the chicken or the egg... I don't see the massive overall talent on this team outside of Allen and a couple others... especially on the D Line... and wonder if he really isnt doing a good job with what he has... and then I see some in game decisions that are so bad its mind blowng... so, I got my fire ######ant suit on... they can flame away, its good discussion... and you are also right the salary cap era is different for sure. I have said this a million times, but both Beane and McD can't be elite, with Josh, and not have done more. The perception by many here are all three are elite. I just don't see that as possibility. I have blamed McD for a lot, but have leaned more into Beane and the roster construction the last year or so. I don't particularly think rebuild #2 has gone very well. 3 Quote
uticaclub Posted September 4 Posted September 4 1 hour ago, T master said: Can't tell what group you come from I suggest you go root for the Browns for a while then come back and see exactly how good we have it . Yah it sucks that we haven't been to the SB as of yet but the HC can only do so much and the biggest share is on the players . I suppose you are also a Knorwood hater blaming the SB against the giants on his miss instead of seeing the entire picture of how the D let the team down time and time again . I would rather be a part of a winning team every year than what transpired before McD got here . Prior to his arrival as you have apparently forgotten every 3 + years there was a HC ing change, scheme changes, player changes and NO PLAY OFFS AT ALL because there was no stability . I guess as they say you can't make every body happy and as I said you will probably still complain about something if and when they do make it to the big game . Oh and how many teams recently that change coaching staffs go from the bottom to the top and sustain it ? We have Josh Allen and play in the AFC East, making the playoffs nearly a guarantee. Any coordinator would have achieved similar results with a team led by Josh Allen. The year after Josh leaves, this will be a three-win team, with or without McDermott. 1 Quote
Gregg Posted September 4 Posted September 4 (edited) 14 minutes ago, T master said: No I can't but I unlike most of you haters I will ride with the guy that gives me the best chance year after year instead of gambling on a different HC that will put us in the drink again like Jacksonville has done . As far as McD being a D coach yes but he allows those he has put in those positions to coach those players the freedom to do their job and he himself will take the blunt of it for their failures . I just get sick and tired of all the whining and crying a lot of Bills fans are like the wife that you can never please no matter what you buy her she always wants more . It's like for christ sake enjoy what we got quit your complaining, every year it's the same thing every body else in the NFL notices that McD is one of the best HC's in the league but our fans alls they want to do is criticize no matter how good the team does . Maybe it will sink in a bit more next year when some of ya'll walk into the Brand New Stadium that Mcd& Company helped the Bills get ... But I doubt it . Most Bills fans give McDermott and Beane a lot of credit for turning the Bills around. But it is fair to question if McDermott is the coach who can win a championship given all the playoff failures. The same applies to Beane in building a roster good enough to win it all as well. Are you going to be happy if they "Marino/Ewing" Allen's career. Edited September 4 by Gregg 1 1 1 Quote
Buffalo Boy Posted September 4 Posted September 4 1 hour ago, T master said: Then WHO ???????? Name me one, And I want a guarantee that the next guys record would be better and that we would go to a SB !! Do you. remember who else was a defensive coach that whipped our ass every year for 20 yrs ? Can you say Bellicek ?? Oh and the coach that beat us in the first Bills SB against the Giants was a defensive coach so that doesn't hold any water sorry ... Uh, BB coached a D to stop the hottest offense in the league allowing the Giants to beat us with a backup. Mc???? Not so much🤔🫢😉 2 Quote
VW82 Posted September 4 Posted September 4 57 minutes ago, BillsShredder83 said: Serious question. Do you have any writers in particular you're referencing. I totally believe you but feel like I havent seen anything about it. Maybe I have and just skimmed over it thinking - thats the usual late summer coach speak. I'd like to see what you or anyone else has seen indicating this? Very possible I was distracted over summer and just missed it too Both Joe B from the Athletic and Joe Marino from locked on Bills have talked about it. 1 Quote
Max Fischer Posted September 4 Posted September 4 1 hour ago, QB Bills said: And you attribute this to McDermott? Your pet hamster could coach this team to the playoffs with Josh Allen as QB. My God, even a hamster would know that Josh Allen didn't do all of this on his own. It's depressing how obtuse these "fans" can be. Quote
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