McDermott not in Top 10 of NFL coaches per PFF.

[Mikie2times]

Just now, Buffalo716 said:

I never said Josh Allen would not have been pretty good.. I said Josh Allen  would not be the Josh Allen we know 

 

There's been plenty of physically gifted quarterbacks who don't pan out.. in fact Jay Cutler was a 6'3 230 lb monster with a cannon who was trucking linebackers in the SEC 

 

I think Josh is more likely that in Chicago.. good not transcendent 

 

A transcendent player always needs somebody to tango with.. there's never been a surefire Hall of Fame greatest ever quarterback who didn't have a tremendous coach lol they kind of go hand in hand

Because the QB gives them stability, not the other way around. Very few coaches raise the needle in a significant way. More can lower the needle in a signifigant way. I don't think McD lowers it by any stretch, but I also don't think he's one of the few that raise it.  Andy Reid, Sean McVay are two people. Maybe a couple more, but it's a very short list. 

[Buffalo716]

1 minute ago, Mikie2times said:

Because the QB gives them stability, not the other way around. Very few coaches raise the needle in a significant way. More can lower the needle in a signifigant way. I don't think McD lowers it by any stretch, but I also don't think he's one of the few that raise it.  Andy Reid, Sean McVay are two people. Maybe a couple more, but it's a very short list. 

Awesome will agree to disagree Sean McDermott to me is a tremendous coach 

 

If you had to say McDermott or Josh Allen I'm obviously taking Josh Allen cuz he's our general 

 

But I'm not throwing Sean McDermott under the bus 

Edited 8 hours ago by Buffalo716

[Mikie2times]

2 minutes ago, Buffalo716 said:

Bill belichick gets credit for developing tom Brady

To those that choose to do so. What was Bill without Tom again?

Just now, Buffalo716 said:

Awesome well it greet a disagree Sean McDermott to me is a tremendous coach 

 

If you had to say McDermott or Josh Allen I'm obviously taking Josh Allen cuz he's our general 

 

But I'm not throwing Sean McDermott under the loss

Good with that, its not a provable debate really. One of the all time questions of the sport. 

[Goin Breakdown]

1 minute ago, Buffalo716 said:

That's like saying Bill belichick gets no credit for developing Tom Brady because he's a defensive guy 

 

He absolutely gets partial credit for helping develop Tom Brady and I 100% do not think Tom Brady would be Tom Brady if he got drafted anywhere else besides with belichick 

 

Tom Brady left as a 40-year-old man a fully developed professional and won.. I don't think Tom Brady getting any other coach at 22 years old turns him into what he is

I understand what you're saying. I'll give you this. Yes McD has to have some credit for his development but that's it, some (I'm being difficult here I know). I think there's players out there that boom or bust regardless of coaching or draft status. Thats not all on the coaches. I have seen it many times where a fan or media will say something like "if Josh and Mahomes switched teams, Josh would have won a few rings by now". I think that's coaching AND great QB. Right now we only have a great QB. It's like Cam newton just said in his breakdown of Josh's play (ohh man I'm using Cam as an example lol). He said Buffalo wins because of Josh and his consistent elite play and without Josh buffalo wouldn't be anything. McD is supposed to be a defensive guru and our defense has let us down year in and out. He's not a QB guru.....thankfully. Right?

[Buffalo716]

5 minutes ago, Mikie2times said:

To those that choose to do so. What was Bill without Tom again?

The coach who took the Cleveland browns to the playoffs..  and after they fired him only went once in 22 years?

 

The coach who stopped the greatest offense in NFL history versus the bills no huddle offense...  

 

 probably the greatest defensive coordinator of all time with head coaching statistics that will make a grown man cry

 

The guy who took the Patriots to the playoffs with McCorkle Jones... Which is more impressive than most coaches have on their resume

Edited 7 hours ago by Buffalo716

[QCity]

7 minutes ago, Mikie2times said:

 What was Bill without Tom again?

 

 

84 - 103, a .449 win rate.

 

[Mikie2times]

1 minute ago, Buffalo716 said:

The last coach who took the Cleveland browns to the playoffs before Baker Mayfield? 

 

The coach who stopped the greatest offense in NFL history versus the bills no huddle offense...  

 

 probably the greatest defensive coordinator of all time with head coaching statistics that will make a grown man cry

He was 41-55 as a HC before Brady arrived. Andy Reid was 11-13 in the playoffs before Mahomes arrived, McD has a losing record in games Josh Allen doesn't start in. If a coach isn't capable of approaching a similar status as they did with said HOF QB, is it not a reasonable conclusion to say the QB is likely driving more of the outcome than the HC?

 

Plenty of examples exist of HOF QB's with multiple HC's. How many HOF coaches without HOF QB's? It is possible to look at performance separately and draw some conclusions. All of which really don't support what you're saying. 

[Buffalo716]

3 minutes ago, Mikie2times said:

He was 41-55 as a HC before Brady arrived. Andy Reid was 11-13 in the playoffs before Mahomes arrived, McD has a losing record in games Josh Allen doesn't start in. If a coach isn't capable of approaching a similar status as they did with said HOF QB, is it not a reasonable conclusion to say the QB is likely driving more of the outcome than the HC?

 

Plenty of examples exist of HOF QB's with multiple HC's. How many HOF coaches without HOF QB's? It is possible to look at performance separately and draw some conclusions. All of which really don't support what you're saying. 

Andy Reid also has a losing record against Bill belichick 

 

Bill belichick took a McCorkle Jones lead Patriots team to the playoffs 

 

I'm sorry I hated the Patriots dynasty.. Bill belichick is without a doubt the greatest football coach of all time defensive coordinator through head coach

 

 Bill belichick does not get out coached in the super bowl like Andy Reid did.. belichick always find a wrinkle 

 

Andy Reid got out coached and his ass whooped.. belichick would have had his team more prepared to keep it closer

Edited 7 hours ago by Buffalo716

[stevestojan]

58 minutes ago, Buffalo716 said:

That's not true.. people literally have created their own statistics 

 

Taking his last five losses.. and his points per game in those losses.. and then said his 33.2points per game allowed in his last five losses is the most in NFL history 

 

But guess what that was also a lie cuz I looked at Mike McCarthy's last five playoff losses and it's worse

 

Cherry picking his losses you can take the last five playoff losses from every coach and they're all 27+ to 32 points per game

 

You could cherry pick any coaches last five playoff losses and no coach is allowing 22 points per game in a loss lol 

it’s still really really really really bad for a “defensive minded” HC. So the stat is wrong and he’s only second or third worst in that category? Not anything to crow about. He’s the sole reason Josh doesn’t have at least two rings. 

[Buffalo716]

2 minutes ago, stevestojan said:

it’s still really really really really bad for a “defensive minded” HC. So the stat is wrong and he’s only second or third worst in that category? Not anything to crow about. He’s the sole reason Josh doesn’t have at least two rings. 

Andy Reid gives up 31.5 points per game in his last five playoff losses 

 

And his defense has been a lot healthier in the playoffs than Sean mcdermotts 

 

What's your excuse for him

 

The bills had 14 players on the injury report going into our conference championship game.. that's ridiculous 

 

There's zero proof that we would have two rings without Sean McDermott.. that is your opinion my friend

Edited 7 hours ago by Buffalo716

[SydneyBillsFan]

47 minutes ago, stevestojan said:

He lucked into Allen. 
 

There is nothing - in his scheme, his clock/game management, his decision making, or his “defensive mindset” that puts him in the top 20. 
 

Without Allen, he’s out of a job 4 years ago. 

 

These points need reinforcing, as I sometimes get the impression that the average Bills fan suffers from short-term memory loss and / or mild dementia.

 

His deer in the headlights moments have been too frequent and their impact has been too severe, and they heavily outweigh his game day tactical nous and ability to problem solve in quick time when encountered with a high pressure situation.

 

That said, he is a great Monday to Saturday coach who is surely one of the best in the NFL at building a great culture and instilling an uncompromising team ethos into his players. And he is a high character human being. If I had a kid who played football, I would love him to play under Sean.

 

But, sadly, the fact remains that he is something of a game day dud. There have been too many instances for this to be ignored.

 

As a Bills fan I obviously wish him well. But in the race to achieve the ultimate goal of bringing a Lombardi to WNY, he simply does not have all the necessary tools in the tool box.

Edited 7 hours ago by SydneyBillsFan

[stevestojan]

5 minutes ago, Buffalo716 said:

Andy Reid gives up 31.5 points per game in his last five playoff losses 

 

And his defense has been a lot healthier in the playoffs than Sean mcdermotts 

 

What's your excuse for him

 

The bills had 14 players on the injury report going into our conference championship game.. that's ridiculous 

 

There's zero proof that we would have two rings without Sean McDermott.. that is your opinion my friend

 

I’m fine with you having your opinion. It just seems absolutely no one agrees with you by reading the replies. Doesn’t mean you’re wrong, but it sure does point in that direction.
 

Again, without Josh, he’s nothing. And don’t even give me the Andy Dalton led team that got us to the playoffs as a sign of Clappy’s ability to lead a non-Josh team to the playoffs. Plus that year our strength of schedule was basically negative. 
 

You seem a bit over the top with your defense of a coach who is simply not good enough defensively to take the world’s best football player to the Super Bowl. It’s cool if your his brother or something but your passionate defense of him is a little odd. 

 

[Buffalo716]

3 minutes ago, stevestojan said:

 

I’m fine with you having your opinion. It just seems absolutely no one agrees with you by reading the replies. Doesn’t mean you’re wrong, but it sure does point in that direction.
 

Again, without Josh, he’s nothing. And don’t even give me the Andy Dalton led team that got us to the playoffs as a sign of Clappy’s ability to lead a non-Josh team to the playoffs. Plus that year our strength of schedule was basically negative. 
 

You seem a bit over the top with your defense of a coach who is simply not good enough defensively to take the world’s best football player to the Super Bowl. It’s cool if your his brother or something but your passionate defense of him is a little odd. 

 

Really no one agrees? Because just like in life it's usually those who protest the loudest but they're the smallest in numbers 

 

In fact my original post has six likes zero dislikes 

 

It's the people who don't agree with me who are making a scene .. but I respond to everybody as I always have 

 

We can agree to disagree but don't act like nobody agrees with me

 

And Bill belichick is seven and three versus Andy Reid an undefeated in the playoffs

 

And Andy Reid just got out coached and his ass whooped in the super bowl and Bill belichick never got out coached that bad in a super bowl in his life.. he always found a wrinkle to at least keep it close

Edited 7 hours ago by Buffalo716

[julian]

1 hour ago, Buffalo716 said:

That is the farthest thing from fact 

 

Remember going 17 years without playoffs? You remember the roster McDermott took us to the playoffs with?

 

Do you remember that Josh Allen was considered one of the rawest quarterback prospects ever who had a huge bust potential? We took a kid who had a massive chance of flopping and they groomed him 

 

Sean McDermott has been there every step of the way he deserves credit for helping mold Josh Allen into player he is.. he is the head coach and around Josh every single day and been a calming study influence 

 

He literally took a kid people thought shouldn't be drafted in the top 10 and helped coach him into a superstar

And some people(Kyper) thought Allen should be the 1st overall pick in a loaded QB class.

 

 McDermott is an excellent coach, if he were fired, he would have a job of his choosing before cleaning out his office, but let’s not pretend he’s some QB whisperer lol.

 

 Allen’s incredible self belief, evidenced by his collegiate origin story coupled with offseason determination to get better every year and his historic physical talents are the reason he’s turned himself into the leagues QB1.

[Mikie2times]

7 minutes ago, Buffalo716 said:

Really no one agrees? Because just like in life it's usually those who protest the loudest but they're the smallest in numbers 

 

In fact my original post has six likes zero dislikes 

 

It's the people who don't agree with me who are making a scene .. but I respond to everybody as I always have 

 

We can agree to disagree but don't act like nobody agrees with me

 

And Bill belichick is seven and three versus Andy Reid an undefeated in the playoffs

If it’s any consolation I would never count the number of people who agree as proof of anything. That’s said you’re horribly wrong on this one and should feel deep shame and remorse for your thoughts. But do so in an agreeable way please 😂

Edited 7 hours ago by Mikie2times

[TheWeatherMan]

1 hour ago, Fleezoid said:

 

I actually think the opposite. Having JA should cost you points because Josh Allen will Josh Allen regardless. Which is why I think Brian Billick was a stinking genius and best coach on the planet at the time he won a Super Bowl with Trent Dilfer (defense aside). 

You’re actually agreeing with me because I said statistically not in actuality hence why I agree with PFF. 

[Buffalo716]

6 minutes ago, julian said:

And some people(Kyper) thought Allen should be the 1st overall pick in a loaded QB class.

 

 McDermott is an excellent coach, if he were fired, he would have a job of his choosing before cleaning out his office, but let’s not pretend he’s some QB whisperer lol.

 

 Allen’s incredible self belief, evidenced by his collegiate origin story coupled with offseason determination to get better every year and his historic physical talents are the reason he’s turned himself into the leagues QB1.

It's kiper

 

And again nobody was downplaying Josh Allen's potential .. even the scouts and pundits who thought he would not make it 

 

All agreed he had tremendous talent just thought he had too many flaws to correct at the NFL level 

 

There's a difference between having tremendous talent versus being polished 

.. quarterbacks go in the top 10 every year with tremendous talent and 60% of them bust lol

 

People's couldn't stop raving about Zack Wilson's talent and he went top three.. and didn't last two seasons in New York ... Jay Cutler was 6'3 235 with a cannon and was trucking SEC linebackers.. he had all the talent in the world

 

That could have been Josh Allen's fate if it wasn't for his work ethic and for our coaching staff... But guess what  most quarterbacks have good work ethics especially if they're going in the top 10 and plenty of them still bust 

 

 Josh Allen deserves credit but so does our coaching staff including Sean McDermott

4 minutes ago, Mikie2times said:

If it’s any consolation I would never count the number of people who agree as proof of anything. That’s said you’re horrible wrong on this one and should feel deep shame and remorse for your thoughts. 

Feel deep shame because I think Sean McDermott is a good coach who would get snatched up in a second if we fired him? 

 

Deep shame because I don't think it would be really easy to upgrade if we got rid of Sean McDermott? 

 

Deep shame because Josh Allen's my favorite player in the world but I do think Sean McDermott has helped develop him? Even though Josh also has to help himself 

 

Yeah I don't really have much deep shame in any of that because anybody with common sense would know it could get a lot worse with a different coach

 

Grass is not always greener

Edited 7 hours ago by Buffalo716

[Mikie2times]

4 minutes ago, Buffalo716 said:

It's kiper

 

And again nobody was downplaying Josh Allen's potential .. even the scouts and pundits who thought he would not make it 

 

All agreed he had tremendous talent just thought he had too many flaws to correct at the NFL level 

 

There's a difference between having tremendous talent versus being polished 

.. quarterbacks go in the top 10 every year with tremendous talent and 70% of them bust lol

 

People's couldn't stop raving about Zack Wilson's talent and he went top three.. and didn't last two seasons in New York 

 

That could have been Josh Allen's fate if it wasn't for his work ethic and for our coaching staff... But guess what  most quarterbacks have good work ethics especially if they're going in the top 10 and plenty of them still bust 

 

 Josh Allen deserves credit but so does our coaching staff including Sean McDermott

Feel deep shame because I think Sean McDermott is a good coach who would get snatched up in a second if we fired him? 

 

Deep shame because I don't think it would be really easy to upgrade if we got rid of Sean McDermott? 

 

Deep shame because Josh Allen's my favorite player in the world but I do think Sean McDermott has helped develop him? Even though Josh also has to help himself 

 

Yeah I don't really have much deep shame in any of that because anybody with common sense would know it could get a lot worse with a different coach

 

Grass is not always greener

I was laying the sarcasm on pretty thick on that 

Edited 7 hours ago by Mikie2times

[julian]

2 minutes ago, Buffalo716 said:

It's kiper

 

And again nobody was downplaying Josh Allen's potential .. even the scouts and pundits who thought he would not make it 

 

All agreed he had tremendous talent just thought he had too many flaws to correct at the NFL level 

 

There's a difference between having tremendous talent versus being polished 

.. quarterbacks go in the top 10 every year with tremendous talent and 70% of them bust lol

 

People's couldn't stop raving about Zack Wilson's talent and he went top three.. and didn't last two seasons in New York 

 

That could have been Josh Allen's fate if it wasn't for his work ethic and for our coaching staff... But guess what  most quarterbacks have good work ethics especially if they're going in the top 10 and plenty of them still bust 

 

 Josh Allen deserves credit but so does our coaching staff including Sean McDermott

You’re correct, most QBs do have good work ethic, it’s just none of them have ever had the otherworldly physical talents that 17 has to work with.

 

 Like I said, McDermott is an excellent coach but Allen was riding a rocket ship that he was piloting and that was gonna be with or without McDermott going along for the ride.

 

 Coach got very lucky on draft day and he’d be the 1st to admit it lol.

[uticaclub]

1 hour ago, Buffalo716 said:

That is the farthest thing from fact 

 

Remember going 17 years without playoffs? You remember the roster McDermott took us to the playoffs with?

 

Do you remember that Josh Allen was considered one of the rawest quarterback prospects ever who had a huge bust potential? We took a kid who had a massive chance of flopping and they groomed him 

 

Sean McDermott has been there every step of the way he deserves credit for helping mold Josh Allen into player he is.. he is the head coach and around Josh every single day and been a calming study influence 

 

He literally took a kid people thought shouldn't be drafted in the top 10 and helped coach him into a superstar

The roster he made the playoffs with were 9-7, 8-8 & 7-9 the three prior years, he didn't take over a bottom feeder