Purdy and 49’ers extension. 5 years 265 million

[GunnerBill]

6 hours ago, Richard Noggin said:

 

I don't think Goff's documented production or his tape supports such a dismissive assessment of his ability. "A less talented Kirk Cousins" is a crazy claim. #1 overall pick with a better athletic profile and college pedigree who's had SO MUCH more NFL success...it's just not close. I get that they're both pocket guys who throw a nice intermediate in-breaker, but come on!

 

Goff has been consistently underrated by a lot of NFL fans. And the reason why I am convinced is his rookie year. Where he did look horrible. You only get one chance to make a first impression and his was awful. It doesn't matter that he has then been very good and season by season consistent since then.... people will always find a way to say that is someone else's doing. Remember the "Sean McVay is reading defenses for him" nonsense. 

 

He is less Kirk Cousins and more Matt Ryan 2.0. A really good QB who isn't the most mobile and lacks a bit of clutch gene. 

[Warriorspikes51]

Don't think he's worth nearly this much per season.

 

It's not the case, but there should be a huge gap with QB $

Mahomes
Allen

Jackson

 

Burrow

Hurts 
 

Everyone Else 

Edited 6 hours ago by Warriorspikes51

[BillsFan130]

9 hours ago, RoscoeParrish said:

You needed advice because you said you weren’t sure if Purdy is better than Fields which is why you got jumped on. 
 

Everyone is sure that Purdy is better than Fields.

So here’s the thing.

 

I’m mot saying Goff is terrible. If I was defining him by a 5 pick game, he wouldn’t be a pretty good QB. He would be another Peterman.

 

what I am saying is it exemplified the kind of QB Goff is. A QB that can be very good in a good situation with a good team. A QB who can unfortunately meltdown not uncommonly. And a QB who looks better than he is because he has a very good team around him, good enough to beat a playoff team despite their QB actively trying to lose it.

I'm still not sure why you're drilled towards that one game where Goff played horrible and they won. Last season there were 4-5 examples where Goff needed to play great to get the win, and they did win, or his defence let him down in a shoot out.

 

Josh Allens stats against Atlanta in January 2022:

 

11 for 26 for 120 yards, 0 tds and 3 INTS.

 

But the Bills won by 2 touchdowns- So are we going to define one game as "the bills carry Josh Allen?"

[BullBuchanan]

5 hours ago, GunnerBill said:

 

Goff has been consistently underrated by a lot of NFL fans. And the reason why I am convinced is his rookie year. Where he did look horrible. You only get one chance to make a first impression and his was awful. It doesn't matter that he has then been very good and season by season consistent since then.... people will always find a way to say that is someone else's doing. Remember the "Sean McVay is reading defenses for him" nonsense. 

 

He is less Kirk Cousins and more Matt Ryan 2.0. A really good QB who isn't the most mobile and lacks a bit of clutch gene. 

What he shares with both of those guys is that he's a chronic choker who you could put on the most elite team in the league and he'd still find a way to lose. He regresses in the playoffs compared to his regular season in just about every category. That's not a guy I want to try to win a SB with.

[GunnerBill]

5 minutes ago, BullBuchanan said:

What he shares with both of those guys is that he's a chronic choker who you could put on the most elite team in the league and he'd still find a way to lose. He regresses in the playoffs compared to his regular season in just about every category. That's not a guy I want to try to win a SB with.

 

But there are not 32 guys who you do. At any one time there might be 4 or 5. What do you do if you don't have one? You put a team around a darn good QB like Goff and hope you can find a way. And about once every 10 years or so that works out.

[RoscoeParrish]

2 hours ago, BillsFan130 said:

I'm still not sure why you're drilled towards that one game where Goff played horrible and they won. Last season there were 4-5 examples where Goff needed to play great to get the win, and they did win, or his defence let him down in a shoot out.

 

Josh Allens stats against Atlanta in January 2022:

 

11 for 26 for 120 yards, 0 tds and 3 INTS.

 

But the Bills won by 2 touchdowns- So are we going to define one game as "the bills carry Josh Allen?"

The Bills don’t carry Josh Allen.

 

The teams Jared Goff have been on is a different story. 

 

He was traded away from a SB losing team who immediately won a Super Bowl. 
 

He has been very good in Detroit, even better than LA, but still ugly Jared comes out to play and greatly contributed to their playoff losses.

Edited 53 minutes ago by RoscoeParrish

[Bleeding Bills Blue]

8 minutes ago, BullBuchanan said:

What he shares with both of those guys is that he's a chronic choker who you could put on the most elite team in the league and he'd still find a way to lose. He regresses in the playoffs compared to his regular season in just about every category. That's not a guy I want to try to win a SB with.

 

Goff, Darnold, Herbert all played pretty lousy in the playoffs last year.  Pretty sure all seem to struggle on the road and outdoors.  The lions just played... terrible.  I know Goffs largely to blame but that defense was terrible (albeit banged up).  

Edited 52 minutes ago by Bleeding Bills Blue

[BillsFan130]

10 minutes ago, RoscoeParrish said:

The Bills don’t carry Josh Allen.

 

The teams Jared Goff have been on is a different story. 

 

He was traded away from a SB losing team who immediately won a Super Bowl. 
 

He has been very good in Detroit, even better than LA, but still ugly Jared comes out to play and greatly contributed to their playoff loss.

if you don't think goff is good, that's fair and I respect your opinion even though I respecfully disagree with it.

 

I just don't understand why you are trying to prove that Goff gets carried by his team because of one game detroit won in which he was horrible.  (That is cherry picking to try to prove something, as there are far more examples in which Goff has had to play great for Detroit to win)

 

Every single good to great QB has had awful games where their team has still won. (Yes even Josh Allen as I showed)

Edited 47 minutes ago by BillsFan130

[BullBuchanan]

5 minutes ago, GunnerBill said:

 

But there are not 32 guys who you do. At any one time there might be 4 or 5. What do you do if you don't have one? You put a team around a darn good QB like Goff and hope you can find a way. And about once every 10 years or so that works out.

I don't think this takes away from my point that he's in the same camp as a guy like Cousins or Purdy that are ultimately the weak link on their team. Comparing their stats during the regular season is great as long as anybody cares about that. The playoffs is a different animal entirely and each of these guys seems to struggle under the added pressure.

As for what I do if I have a player like this, I guess it depends on what your goals are. Are you really trying to win a Super Bowl at all costs, or are you more interested in having a team that people believe is capable of winning a Super Bowl? As an owner, the latter might be better than the former. If that's the case, you keep Goff and you tow the company line about "getting better"/"finishing the job", etc and you rake in the profits from stacking up division championships (something the Bills are currently doing).

If you care about winning the Super Bowl, you do what the Rams did when they traded for Stafford. At worst, you should be trying to find a guy behind him that can push for the job. Do the Lions believe a 27 year old Hendon Hooker is that, or is he just a cheap backup?

17 minutes ago, Bleeding Bills Blue said:

 

Goff, Darnold, Herbert all played pretty lousy in the playoffs last year.  Pretty sure all seem to struggle on the road and outdoors.  The lions just played... terrible.  I know Goffs largely to blame but that defense was terrible (albeit banged up).  

For sure, but 3 picks doesn't help. Even going back the previous year against SF, Goff lead the offense to a 24-7 start, but then he was only able to generate 7 more points (in garbage time) across the second half of the game in an loss. He had two drives of 4th and 3 and 4th and 2 where he threw incomplete passes. You just can't do that.

[GunnerBill]

9 minutes ago, BullBuchanan said:

I don't think this takes away from my point that he's in the same camp as a guy like Cousins or Purdy that are ultimately the weak link on their team. Comparing their stats during the regular season is great as long as anybody cares about that. The playoffs is a different animal entirely and each of these guys seems to struggle under the added pressure.

As for what I do if I have a player like this, I guess it depends on what your goals are. Are you really trying to win a Super Bowl at all costs, or are you more interested in having a team that people believe is capable of winning a Super Bowl? As an owner, the latter might be better than the former. If that's the case, you keep Goff and you tow the company line about "getting better"/"finishing the job", etc and you rake in the profits from stacking up division championships (something the Bills are currently doing).

If you care about winning the Super Bowl, you do what the Rams did when they traded for Stafford. At worst, you should be trying to find a guy behind him that can push for the job. Do the Lions believe a 27 year old Hendon Hooker is that, or is he just a cheap backup?

For sure, but 3 picks doesn't help. Even going back the previous year against SF, Goff lead the offense to a 24-7 start, but then he was only able to generate 7 more points (in garbage time) across the second half of the game in an loss. He had two drives of 4th and 3 and 4th and 2 where he threw incomplete passes. You just can't do that.

 

He is better than Cousins and better than Purdy.

[BullBuchanan]

2 minutes ago, GunnerBill said:

 

He is better than Cousins and better than Purdy.

We disagree on that, but it's not that important to belabor it, because I think we do agree they're all the same class of player that's going to give you the same end result come January. Or do we not?