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And we're on to.. Aiyuk?


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22 hours ago, mannc said:

Aiyuk is absolutely a No. 1 WR.  He’s a top ten WR in the league.

Really? I wouldn't say that. If you wanna get into top 15 or top 20, I will listen

8 minutes ago, Chicken Boo said:

In the immortal words of Marlo Stanfield, "Price of the brick going up."

 

DeVonta Smith just signed for approximately $25 mill per year. 

 

Me thinks Aiyuk is now off the table.  Contracts have seen an uptick.  From Cousins, to Jacksonville Josh, now Smith.

 

 

 

Me thinks so too

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4 minutes ago, Buffalo03 said:

Really? I wouldn't say that. If you wanna get into top 15 or top 20, I will listen

I think it’s probably fair to say he is projecting into the top 10 in the future.

 

Lamb

Hill 

St Brown

AJ Brown

DJ Moore

Puka

 

those were the guys with more yards than Aiyuk last year. And I don’t think Moore or Puka are better than him.

 

Combine that with the 3-4 guys who will likely age out of top 10 status in a year or two (Diggs, Adams, Evans, Hopkins?) Aiyuk is definitely in the conversation.

 

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5 minutes ago, FireChans said:

I think it’s probably fair to say he is projecting into the top 10 in the future.

 

Lamb

Hill 

St Brown

AJ Brown

DJ Moore

Puka

 

those were the guys with more yards than Aiyuk last year. And I don’t think Moore or Puka are better than him.

 

Combine that with the 3-4 guys who will likely age out of top 10 status in a year or two (Diggs, Adams, Evans, Hopkins?) Aiyuk is definitely in the conversation.

 

I'm not just going by yards. I'm going by the eye test. Jamaar Chase isn't on that list and I would take him over Ayuik every time. Aiyuk is more Tee Higgins to me right now than anywhere in the top 10 category 

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2 minutes ago, Buffalo03 said:

I'm not just going by yards. I'm going by the eye test. Jamaar Chase isn't on that list and I would take him over Ayuik every time

So would I.

 

I guess I’m just saying the production is there and the eye test is there.

 

What 10 WR’s do you have better than Aiyuk heading into 2024?

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Just now, FireChans said:

So would I.

 

I guess I’m just saying the production is there and the eye test is there.

 

What 10 WR’s do you have better than Aiyuk heading into 2024?

Where do you rank Tee Higgins and do you think Aiyuk is really that much better than him right now? To me, at this point, if you traded for either one, you would be getting the same player

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13 minutes ago, Buffalo03 said:

Really? I wouldn't say that. If you wanna get into top 15 or top 20, I will listen

Me thinks so too

I can only name three or four WRs in the league who are definitely better than Aiyuk...he's absolutely top 10...Go ahead and try to name 14 WRs who are better....

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9 minutes ago, FireChans said:

So would I.

 

I guess I’m just saying the production is there and the eye test is there.

 

What 10 WR’s do you have better than Aiyuk heading into 2024?

The only ones I can name who are definitely better than Aiyuk are Jefferson, Chase, Hill...maybe AJ Brown...maybe I'm forgetting a few, but that's about it. 

3 minutes ago, Buffalo03 said:

3 or 4? No way

I'm all ears...who are the WRs in the NFL who are definitely better than Aiyuk?

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10 minutes ago, Buffalo03 said:

Where do you rank Tee Higgins and do you think Aiyuk is really that much better than him right now? To me, at this point, if you traded for either one, you would be getting the same player

Higgins is probably right below Aiyuk to me. They have very different skill sets. Aiyuk is much better at YAC (part of that is the Shanny scheme) whereas Tee is more of a contested catch guy (and tbh is much more overrated a skill at the NFL level.) Tee to me is a 1B maximum. There’s a reason they chased Chase the next year. 

 

Aiyuk had his other WR miss time and posted a BLISTERING 17.9 YPC and a passer rating of 124 when targeted. That’s elite. 


I think as awesome as it would be to trade and pay him, it’s probably bad business. But I do think he’s going to be in the top 10 next year and will be paid like it.

 

Guys who I would take in 2024 over Aiyuk in no particular order.

 

JJ

Chase

Hill

Lamb

St Brown

AJ Brown

McLaurin

?Evans

?Adams

?Diggs

 

If just one of Diggs/Adams/Evans falls off a Cliff, he’s in my top 10.

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1 minute ago, FireChans said:

Higgins is probably right below Aiyuk to me. They have very different skill sets. Aiyuk is much better at YAC (part of that is the Shanny scheme) whereas Tee is more of a contested catch guy (and tbh is much more overrated a skill at the NFL level.) Tee to me is a 1B maximum. There’s a reason they chased Chase the next year. 

 

Aiyuk had his other WR miss time and posted a BLISTERING 17.9 YPC and a passer rating of 124 when targeted. That’s elite. 


I think as awesome as it would be to trade and pay him, it’s probably bad business. But I do think he’s going to be in the top 10 next year and will be paid like it.

 

Guys who I would take in 2024 over Aiyuk in particular order.

 

JJ

Chase

Hill

Lamb

St Brown

AJ Brown

McLaurin

?Evans

?Adams

?Diggs

 

If just one of Diggs/Adams/Evans falls off a Cliff, he’s in my top 10.

I think Garret Wilson needs to be on that list too.

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Just now, FireChans said:

Higgins is probably right below Aiyuk to me. They have very different skill sets. Aiyuk is much better at YAC (part of that is the Shanny scheme) whereas Tee is more of a contested catch guy (and tbh is much more overrated a skill at the NFL level.) Tee to me is a 1B maximum. There’s a reason they chased Chase the next year. 

 

Aiyuk had his other WR miss time and posted a BLISTERING 17.9 YPC and a passer rating of 124 when targeted. That’s elite. 


I think as awesome as it would be to trade and pay him, it’s probably bad business. But I do think he’s going to be in the top 10 next year and will be paid like it.

 

Guys who I would take in 2024 over Aiyuk in particular order.

 

JJ

Chase

Hill

Lamb

St Brown

AJ Brown

McLaurin

?Evans

?Adams

?Diggs

 

If just one of Diggs/Adams/Evans falls off a Cliff, he’s in my top 10.

I'll give you Lamb, but given their ages, no one would prefer Evans, Adams or Diggs to Aiyuk right now... I'd rather have Aiyuk than St Brown or McLaurin; he's much more explosive than those guys.  Aiyuk has gotten better every year and just had a monster season at age 25...

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2 minutes ago, Low Positive said:

I think Garret Wilson needs to be on that list too.

Wilson's definitely got potential, but he hasn't accomplished nearly as much as Aiyuk to this point in his career.

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Just now, mannc said:

I'll give you Lamb, but given their ages, no one would prefer Evans, Adams or Diggs to Aiyuk right now... I'd rather have Aiyuk than St Brown or McLaurin; he's much more explosive than those guys.  Aiyuk has gotten better every year and just had a monster season at age 25...

No, of course not.
 

I didn’t say who was more “valuable” because that’s a much easier conversation. then even guys like Higgins are more valuable than guys like Adams when they are not in the same convo in regards to talent.

 

I think Aiyuk will be a top 10 WR in regards to his talent and production around the league. He’s gonna get a top 5 contract because of his age.

Just now, Low Positive said:

I like Wilson more. I'm not sure that I want a guy that is demanding a trade form a team that was a play or two away from winning a Lombardi. 

Must be down on Tee Higgins too, right?

 

it’s all contract negotiation. Deebo did the same thing a few years back. I doubt he goes anywhere.

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20 minutes ago, mannc said:

The only ones I can name who are definitely better Aiyuk are Jefferson, Chase, Hill...maybe AJ Brown...maybe I'm forgetting a few, but that's about it. 

I'm all ears...who are the WRs in the NFL who are definitely better than Aiyuk?

Jefferson, Chase, Lamb, Hill, AJ Brown, St. Brown, Kupp, Davante Adams, Mike Evans, Chris Olave, Nakua, Keenan Allen, Garrett Wilson

 

I would put Aiyuk more on the Jaylen Waddle, Terry McLaurin, Amari Cooper, Michael Pittman, DK Metcalf level. But he is top 15

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7 minutes ago, FireChans said:

No, of course not.
 

I didn’t say who was more “valuable” because that’s a much easier conversation. then even guys like Higgins are more valuable than guys like Adams when they are not in the same convo in regards to talent.

 

I think Aiyuk will be a top 10 WR in regards to his talent and production around the league. He’s gonna get a top 5 contract because of his age.

Must be down on Tee Higgins too, right?

 

it’s all contract negotiation. Deebo did the same thing a few years back. I doubt he goes anywhere.

Higgins is handling this a lot better: https://bleacherreport.com/articles/10116829-tee-higgins-anticipates-staying-with-bengals-in-2024-amid-nfl-trade-contract-rumors

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1 minute ago, Buffalo03 said:

Jefferson, Chase, Lamb, Hill, AJ Brown, St. Brown, Kupp, Davante Adams, Mike Evans, Chris Olave, Nakua, Keenan Allen

 

I would put Aiyuk more on the Jaylen Waddle, Terry McLaurin, Amari Cooper, Michael Pittman, DK Metcalf level. But he is top 15

Give me a break...Nakua's played one year in the league and Kupp has had two down years in row.  Keenan Allen wouldn't even sniff the top 20 at this point in his career and Diggs, Evans, and Adams are all over 30 and noticeably in decline, although all can still play...Olave is a good player, but there's absolutely no reason to think he's better than Aiyuk at this point in his career. 

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16 minutes ago, Buffalo03 said:

Jefferson, Chase, Lamb, Hill, AJ Brown, St. Brown, Kupp, Davante Adams, Mike Evans, Chris Olave, Nakua, Keenan Allen, Garrett Wilson

 

I would put Aiyuk more on the Jaylen Waddle, Terry McLaurin, Amari Cooper, Michael Pittman, DK Metcalf level. But he is top 15

Hard disagree on Kupp, Nakua and Olave. Extremely hard disagree. 
 

 

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7 minutes ago, mannc said:

Give me a break...Nakua's played one year in the league and Kupp has had two down years in row.  Keenan Allen wouldn't even sniff the top 20 at this point in his career and Diggs, Evans, and Adams are all over 30 and noticeably in decline, although all can still play...Olave is a good player, but there's absolutely no reason to think he's better than Aiyuk at this point in his career. 

Ok. You need to stop caring about age right now. If you wanted to give me Keenan Allen at Aiyuk's age. I'm taking Allen all day. And Adams had Garoppolo and Aiden O'Connell throwing to him last year and you're gonna say he is in decline? Lol. Give me Mike Evans right now at Aiyuk's age and I am taking Evans. I actually forgot about DJ Moore and maybe Garrett Wilson. Kupp had a catastrophic knee injury 2 years ago and just bounced back last year and got more into form as the year went on. Healthy, I'm taking Kupp. They are just better than Aiyuk, sorry

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5 minutes ago, Buffalo03 said:

Olave, I will give you. How about DJ Moore? And Kupp healthy isn't better than Aiyuk?

He’s not better than DJ Moore. 
 

Kupp hasn’t been healthy in 2 seasons. I have very high concerns that he will be the 2021 version of himself in 2024 at 31 years old.

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6 minutes ago, Buffalo03 said:

Ok. You need to stop caring about age right now. If you wanted to give me Keenan Allen at Aiyuk's age. I'm taking Allen all day. And Adams had Garoppolo and Aiden O'Connell throwing to him last year and you're gonna say he is in decline? Lol. Give me Mike Evans right now at Aiyuk's age and I am taking Evans. I actually forgot about DJ Moore and maybe Garrett Wilson. Kupp had a catastrophic knee injury 2 years ago and just bounced back last year and got more into form as the year went on. Healthy, I'm taking Kupp. They are just better than Aiyuk, sorry

Why wouldn't I care about age?  The issue is "which receiver would you rather have right now" because that's the decision any team wanting to sign Aiyuk has to ask, not "Who has had the more impressive career accomplishments?".  No GM would take K Allen, Evans, Diggs, Adams or Kupp over Aiyuk right now and that's probably also true regarding Nakua, Olave and Wilson, even though they are really good young players.  Tee Higgins is a pretty good comp, but Aiyuk is more explosive and just had a much better year than Higgins, who has been somewhat injury-prone.  Aiyuk is about to sign a top four or five WR contract, that's for sure.       

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1 minute ago, FireChans said:

He’s not better than DJ Moore. 
 

Kupp hasn’t been healthy in 2 seasons. I have very high concerns that he will be the 2021 version of himself in 2024 at 31 years old.

He was very good in 2022 before his catastrophic injury. He started coming back to form a bit last season. We will have to see what happens. But a healthy in form Kupp, I'm taking over Aiyuk

2 minutes ago, mannc said:

Why wouldn't I care about age?  The issue is "which receiver would you rather have right now" because that's the decision any team wanting to sign Aiyuk has to ask, not "Who has had the more impressive career accomplishments?".  No GM would take K Allen, Evans, Diggs, Adams or Kupp over Aiyuk right now and that's probably also true regarding Nakua, Olave and Wilson, even though they are really good young players.  Tee Higgins is a pretty good comp, but Aiyuk is more explosive and just had a much better year than Higgins, who has been somewhat injury-prone.  Aiyuk is about to sign a top four or five WR contract, that's for sure.       

It's about which WRs are top 10 guys right now. Of course I would take age and potential over a 33 year old guy but if a 33 year old guy is better than the 25 year old guy right now, I am going to acknowledge that. 

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2 minutes ago, Buffalo03 said:

He was very good in 2022 before his catastrophic injury. He started coming back to form a bit last season. We will have to see what happens. But a healthy in form Kupp, I'm taking over Aiyuk

Meh he was very good but he was still much less productive than 2021. And he had that lingering hammy last year.

 

I like Kupp a lot. I don’t have him top 10 heading into 2024. Feel like that’s fair evaluation of a 31 year old WR who hasn’t eclipsed 1k in 2 seasons, has been oft injured and best days are probably behind him.

 

 

8 minutes ago, mannc said:

Why wouldn't I care about age?  The issue is "which receiver would you rather have right now" because that's the decision any team wanting to sign Aiyuk has to ask, not "Who has had the more impressive career accomplishments?".  No GM would take K Allen, Evans, Diggs, Adams or Kupp over Aiyuk right now and that's probably also true regarding Nakua, Olave and Wilson, even though they are really good young players.  Tee Higgins is a pretty good comp, but Aiyuk is more explosive and just had a much better year than Higgins, who has been somewhat injury-prone.  Aiyuk is about to sign a top four or five WR contract, that's for sure.       

This is obvious. Keenan Allen was traded for a 4th. Diggs was traded for a 2nd. 
 

Will Higgins/Aiyuk be traded for that price, even despite them about to need a contract as well? Of course not.

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10 minutes ago, FireChans said:

Meh he was very good but he was still much less productive than 2021. And he had that lingering hammy last year.

 

I like Kupp a lot. I don’t have him top 10 heading into 2024. Feel like that’s fair evaluation of a 31 year old WR who hasn’t eclipsed 1k in 2 seasons, has been oft injured and best days are probably behind him.

 

 

This is obvious. Keenan Allen was traded for a 4th. Diggs was traded for a 2nd. 
 

Will Higgins/Aiyuk be traded for that price, even despite them about to need a contract as well? Of course not.

Keenan Allen is barely a WR 2 right now.  I guarantee the Bears draft a receiver on day 1 or day 2 who will supplant him this year or next.

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5 minutes ago, mannc said:

Keenan Allen is barely a WR 2 right now.  I guarantee the Bears draft a receiver on day 1 or day 2 who will supplant him this year or next.

They would if they were smart. I’m not sure they are smart.

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Bears should take which of the big 3 WR are left at 9 to pair with Caleb and they can grow together . 
 

Would be the best thing they could do for their franchise QB development 

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1 hour ago, mannc said:

Keenan Allen is barely a WR 2 right now.  I guarantee the Bears draft a receiver on day 1 or day 2 who will supplant him this year or next.

Do you ever actually look at things before you make arguments? He has had 100 catches or more 5 of the last 7 seasons, and over 1000 yards in all but one of those including last year and the only season he didn't was because he missed some time. How do you figure he is barely a WR 2 now? 

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2 hours ago, Buffalo03 said:

Olave, I will give you. How about DJ Moore? And Kupp healthy isn't better than Aiyuk?

 

Kupp has 2 seasons with over 1000 yards.  Two.

 

My wife is a die hard Niners fan, and so I watch every Niners game.  You are grossly undervaluing and underestimating Aiyuk.  I would take him in a heartbeat over Olave and Kupp...and he is at least as good as DJ Moore.  I would say they are pretty close to each other.  

 

I don't think we should trade for him, but that doesn't mean you are accurately portraying him either.  He is an excellent WR and would go off with a QB like Allen more than he already has.  I mean look at what he is doing on a run heavy team with a 2nd year QB that doesn't have a big arm.

30 minutes ago, Buffalo03 said:

Do you ever actually look at things before you make arguments? He has had 100 catches or more 5 of the last 7 seasons, and over 1000 yards in all but one of those including last year and the only season he didn't was because he missed some time. How do you figure he is barely a WR 2 now? 

 

As much as you are underrating Aiyuk, you are now overrating Keenan for this next season.  Is he still a quality player, yes, but he isn't the player he once was and if the over/under on yards was 1000 yards this year I would take the under all day.  

 

No disrespect, but you seem to be hung up on names more than being in tune to where some of these guys are right now.  Kupp?  Allen?  No GM in the NFL would choose them over Aiyuk right now. 

Edited by Alphadawg7
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12 minutes ago, Alphadawg7 said:

 

Kupp has 2 seasons with over 1000 yards.  Two.

 

My wife is a die hard Niners fan, and so I watch every Niners game.  You are grossly undervaluing and underestimating Aiyuk.  I would take him in a heartbeat over Olave and Kupp...and he is at least as good as DJ Moore.  I would say they are pretty close to each other.  

 

I don't think we should trade for him, but that doesn't mean you are accurately portraying him either.  He is an excellent WR and would go off with a QB like Allen more than he already has.  I mean look at what he is doing on a run heavy team with a 2nd year QB that doesn't have a big arm.

 

As much as you are underrating Aiyuk, you are now overrating Keenan for this next season.  Is he still a quality player, yes, but he isn't the player he once was and if the over/under on yards was 1000.  

 

No disrespect, but you seem to be hung up on names more than being in tune to where some of these guys are right now.  Kupp?  Allen?  No GM in the NFL would choose them over Aiyuk right now. 

Come on bro. 
 

Aiyuk over Julio Jones? Julio was filthy in 2015

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4 minutes ago, FireChans said:

Come on bro. 
 

Aiyuk over Julio Jones? Julio was filthy in 2015

 

Ha I am assuming this is either sarcasm directed at the other poster who keeps naming old fogey WR's as better than Aiyuk...or you just replied to me by mistake since I didn't mention Julio lol  

Edited by Alphadawg7
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36 minutes ago, Buffalo03 said:

Do you ever actually look at things before you make arguments? He has had 100 catches or more 5 of the last 7 seasons, and over 1000 yards in all but one of those including last year and the only season he didn't was because he missed some time. How do you figure he is barely a WR 2 now? 

Because he's old and no longer very good.  He was the Chargers' WR 1 last year and they suffered because of it.  They had a dink and dunk offense that scared absolutely no one and the fact that Keneen Allen was their best receiver was a big part of that.  The fact that the Chargers dealt him for a fourth round pick should tell you something... 

45 minutes ago, FireChans said:

Keeping their lame duck HC to get fired in the middle of Caleb’s rookie deal is not smart lol

I agree, but they've made some good moves recently, like picking up Carolina's first round pick and the trade for Montez Sweat... 

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23 minutes ago, mannc said:

Because he's old and no longer very good.  He was the Chargers' WR 1 last year and they suffered because of it.  They had a dink and dunk offense that scared absolutely no one and the fact that Keneen Allen was their best receiver was a big part of that.  The fact that the Chargers dealt him for a fourth round pick should tell you something... 

I agree, but they've made some good moves recently, like picking up Carolina's first round pick and the trade for Montez Sweat... 

None of it matters until they figure out the QB. We know this.

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1 minute ago, FireChans said:

None of it matters until they figure out the QB. We know this.

Well, they've certainly put themselves in a very good position to get a QB...now they just have to pick the right one...

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