mrags Posted April 2 Share Posted April 2 1 minute ago, PBF81 said: Yeah, and it seems to be getting more interesting now. As to people downgrading, there have been a ton of comments about people saying that they're not downgrading for more money. Again, simply sharing what we're reading, who knows, could all be smoke, but I'm not as convinced as you are that they'll sell out so easily. Good thing they're doing this now while Allen's at the top of his game. LOL Well. “Downgrading” is a bit off at this point. Because right now those seats are considered clubs. With better amenities. Vs regular 100 level seats. Maybe they don’t get as good of a view, but that doesn’t mean they are “downgrading” right now they would be majorly upgrading with club options. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Einstein Posted April 2 Share Posted April 2 3 minutes ago, PBF81 said: Yeah, and it seems to be getting more interesting now. As to people downgrading, there have been a ton of comments about people saying that they're not downgrading for more money. Again, simply sharing what we're reading, who knows, could all be smoke, but I'm not as convinced as you are that they'll sell out so easily. Keep in mind, according to the Bills, 1 in 4 aren't renewing. That's pretty bad for most businesses to lose a quarter of your customers. And if I had to guess, those numbers are a bit fudged. They likely include those who say they will renew, but at a lower package. Meaning, they have to be called back in in a few months. Will they *actually* renew at that lower package? hmm, maybe not. The real number, with non-fudged numbers, could be 1 in 3 fans not renewing for all we know. Even using the Bills numbers, they are down over 20 basis points from last year in renewals. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mrags Posted April 2 Share Posted April 2 7 minutes ago, Einstein said: Keep in mind, according to the Bills, 1 in 4 aren't renewing. That's pretty bad for most businesses to lose a quarter of your customers. And if I had to guess, those numbers are a bit fudged. They likely include those who say they will renew, but at a lower package. Meaning, they have to be called back in in a few months. Will they *actually* renew at that lower package? hmm, maybe not. The real number, with non-fudged numbers, could be 1 in 3 fans not renewing for all we know. Even using the Bills numbers, they are down over 20 basis points from last year in renewals. Yup. And add in the fact that the new stadium has 10k less seats and there’s a 7k person waiting list. Got ya Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PBF81 Posted April 2 Share Posted April 2 Just now, mrags said: Well. “Downgrading” is a bit off at this point. Because right now those seats are considered clubs. With better amenities. Vs regular 100 level seats. Maybe they don’t get as good of a view, but that doesn’t mean they are “downgrading” right now they would be majorly upgrading with club options. I was more referring to people in the clubs or lower level that would pay the same but have to move to the uppers for example. In short, what does what someone is paying now, get them in the new arena. Of the relatively small number of people that I know, most are average Bills fans, none live elsewhere and fly in regularly for games for example. LOL They live in the region, have moderate incomes, etc. From what they're told me, and what a bunch of people have said here over the past year or two, is that they're at the limits of what they're willing to pay. They swallow the annual price increases with some "kicking of the dog," but they've said that if the prices go up much more they're out. Those are the ones that I'm talking about. What are face value for lower level sideline tix right now what, $200/game? IDK, seriously asking. So say $1,600 per seat. That amount may get them mezzanine level corners or lower level end-zones, but according to them they're not willing to pay that much for those seats. On top of that there's the approx. $3-5k PSL which is more than they've told me they're willing to pay. Maybe the percentage of people that I know with STs aren't a good cross section, who knows. As stated, it is definitely going to get interesting. I see some consternation and resentment down the road. I'm so glad that I only do secondary market tix anymore. LOL Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kirby Jackson Posted April 2 Share Posted April 2 (edited) 14 minutes ago, Einstein said: Keep in mind, according to the Bills, 1 in 4 aren't renewing. That's pretty bad for most businesses to lose a quarter of your customers. And if I had to guess, those numbers are a bit fudged. They likely include those who say they will renew, but at a lower package. Meaning, they have to be called back in in a few months. Will they *actually* renew at that lower package? hmm, maybe not. The real number, with non-fudged numbers, could be 1 in 3 fans not renewing for all we know. Even using the Bills numbers, they are down over 20 basis points from last year in renewals. 90% is always the renewal rate goal in sports. You get an award in the NBA at 90%. The Bills retention, especially recently, has been well north of that. The NFL is generally closer to 100%. That is going to be the case here as well. We “know” at this point that 3 out of 4 have said yes but that is a small, small, small, small percentage of the total universe. It is also, FAR AND AWAY the most expensive options. So far, they are through maybe 5% of the seats. I just got called last Thursday and am a club seat holder with 20-30 years of seniority. It’s probably closer to 2%. The PSLs that are <$5k will be sold at 95% plus. That will be at least 70% of the stadium. This isn’t going to be the issue that some are predicting. Legends knows EXACTLY what they are doing. They’re the best at this. The PSLs selling will not be a problem here. The vocal minority does not represent what is actually happening / what will happen. Edited April 2 by Kirby Jackson 1 1 1 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Virgil Posted April 2 Share Posted April 2 I think they will have far less than 90% for what they consider to be the new club seats (lower level between the 40's), but will make up for it with endzone and upper deck renewals. My biggest fear for this new stadium was that good seats were going to all become premium, and I think that's going to be the case. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PBF81 Posted April 2 Share Posted April 2 3 minutes ago, mrags said: Yup. And add in the fact that the new stadium has 10k less seats and there’s a 7k person waiting list. Got ya I think we'll have a clearer picture by the end of summer. It's interesting to watch unfold I must say. One thing's for sure, I'm always skeptical of "official numbers" for just about anything where something is being sold. LOL Reminds me of this ... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WotAGuy Posted April 2 Share Posted April 2 1 minute ago, Virgil said: I think they will have far less than 90% for what they consider to be the new club seats (lower level between the 40's), but will make up for it with endzone and upper deck renewals. My biggest fear for this new stadium was that good seats were going to all become premium, and I think that's going to be the case. From what little information I can gather, the least expensive seats in the upper levels are going to be covered. The uncovered seats are the fairly expensive lower bowl seats in the bottom half of those sections. The people claiming they aren’t going to go from a present 100-level seat to a club seat in the new stadium may find the view and overhead coverage is pretty attractive for a cheaper seat up top. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Virgil Posted April 2 Share Posted April 2 4 minutes ago, WotAGuy said: From what little information I can gather, the least expensive seats in the upper levels are going to be covered. The uncovered seats are the fairly expensive lower bowl seats in the bottom half of those sections. The people claiming they aren’t going to go from a present 100-level seat to a club seat in the new stadium may find the view and overhead coverage is pretty attractive for a cheaper seat up top. I get that, I do. And I know I'm coming off very GOML, but it's just frustrating to see this trend finally hit the Bills. I appreciated that you the fancy rich could have their club and box seats between the 40's, but there were also regular lower level seats for everyone else. Everyone got a chance to sit with a premium view. Now, you have to go somewhere else, even though I know the upper deck isn't terrible. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
34-78-83 Posted April 2 Share Posted April 2 5 minutes ago, WotAGuy said: From what little information I can gather, the least expensive seats in the upper levels are going to be covered. The uncovered seats are the fairly expensive lower bowl seats in the bottom half of those sections. The people claiming they aren’t going to go from a present 100-level seat to a club seat in the new stadium may find the view and overhead coverage is pretty attractive for a cheaper seat up top. There's not going to be a bad view in the house... Even in the current stadium, there really aren't too many. It's all a matter of perspective. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PBF81 Posted April 2 Share Posted April 2 18 minutes ago, Einstein said: Keep in mind, according to the Bills, 1 in 4 aren't renewing. That's pretty bad for most businesses to lose a quarter of your customers. And if I had to guess, those numbers are a bit fudged. They likely include those who say they will renew, but at a lower package. Meaning, they have to be called back in in a few months. Will they *actually* renew at that lower package? hmm, maybe not. The real number, with non-fudged numbers, could be 1 in 3 fans not renewing for all we know. Even using the Bills numbers, they are down over 20 basis points from last year in renewals. Well, if 3 in 4 renew, that'd be 75% of 70k or so, or 53k. Figure then that 3 in 4 on the waiting list are still interested, they'll have nearly sold out based on that. As Kirby Jackson says, may simply be a vocal minority. My view stems from just a handful, maybe 6-8 people that I know that currently have STs. Only one says he'll pay more to attend games, didn't even mention the section. The others have expressed that they've been turned off by the rising prices as it's been, but they're at their limits cost wise. Who knows, maybe they'll change their tune. One interesting tidbit however in discussing with them, is them realizing that Allen's not going to be here forever, and that's a big part of it because none of them would think about paying the current asking prices if Allen weren't here now. I guess I'm simply associated with that vocal minority, even though I don't think that they've been vocal. LOL 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kirby Jackson Posted April 2 Share Posted April 2 (edited) 15 minutes ago, Virgil said: I think they will have far less than 90% for what they consider to be the new club seats (lower level between the 40's), but will make up for it with endzone and upper deck renewals. My biggest fear for this new stadium was that good seats were going to all become premium, and I think that's going to be the case. That was the reason that a refurb was never an option. The lower level seats, between the 20’s were the most underpriced seats in all of sports. The Bills knew that. In order to “right size” the stadium they needed to get way more money for the best locations. They needed the clean slate of the new stadium to provide that cover. While they will give the people with 1965 seniority the opportunity to retain their location, it will be at a significantly higher price that more accurately reflects the market for those seats around the league. Those are the people that’ll be most impacted here. Many say that they won’t downgrade but we will see. I’ve seen that story before when we did a reconfiguration. 75% of the people said that there was no way that they would go to a lesser location, especially at the same price that they were already paying. 90% of those people did end up downgrading when all was said and done. It was a small handful that “stuck to their guns.” I suspect that will be the case here as well. Edited April 2 by Kirby Jackson Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PBF81 Posted April 2 Share Posted April 2 3 minutes ago, 34-78-83 said: There's not going to be a bad view in the house... Even in the current stadium, there really aren't too many. It's all a matter of perspective. It is a matter of perspective, but keep in mind the TV option. I personally enjoy the view from the uppers, it offers a better whole-field-of-view view, but not everyone values that. There have been a lot of comments about watching on TV instead. Again, who knows, but watching it unfold is incredibly interesting for Buffalo. 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cdl 716 Posted April 2 Share Posted April 2 1 hour ago, Kirby Jackson said: I’m in 237. 237 I’m in 235 and have my stadium experience appointment at 1245 pm today. Should be interesting. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
papazoid Posted April 2 Share Posted April 2 13 hours ago, papazoid said: friend of mine who sits in LOWER BOWL goes for his experience tomorrow (tues) 1965 seniority, 50 yard line should have some good info in 24 hours P.S. of the 25% who didn't agree to new club level seats immediately on first offer....i bet more than half of them get seats in a less expensive area on their second chance meeting. so that initial 75% will likely go to 85-90% FALSE ALARM.....APOLOGIES.....my friend is confused....his "experience" today is just the normal STH RELOCATION process from current stadium. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kirby Jackson Posted April 2 Share Posted April 2 2 minutes ago, cdl 716 said: I’m in 235 and have my stadium experience appointment at 1245 pm today. Should be interesting. Good luck!!! Let us know how it goes 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WotAGuy Posted April 2 Share Posted April 2 1 minute ago, papazoid said: FALSE ALARM.....APOLOGIES.....my friend is confused....his "experience" today is just the normal STH RELOCATION process from current stadium. Tell him to relocate to the 300s so he can afford his new stadium seat location. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
plenzmd1 Posted April 2 Share Posted April 2 16 hours ago, Dr.Mantis_Toboggan said: If I was looking for a bunch of passive aggressive nonsense, I’d talk to my wife. N I’m sorry, MOST billionaires are proper shite, better? If i was looking for just pure nonsense, I would talk directly to you 12 hours ago, Einstein said: Impressive seniority. His Bills fan career will now span 3 home stadiums.. While we did not have seasons, my first games were at the Rockpile. Sure several of us on here have memories of that joint. 21 minutes ago, Kirby Jackson said: That was the reason that a refurb was never an option. The lower level seats, between the 20’s were the most underpriced seats in all of sports. The Bills knew that. In order to “right size” the stadium they needed to get way more money for the best locations. They needed the clean slate of the new stadium to provide that cover. While they will give the people with 1965 seniority the opportunity to retain their location, it will be at a significantly higher price that more accurately reflects the market for those seats around the league. Those are the people that’ll be most impacted here. Many say that they won’t downgrade but we will see. I’ve seen that story before when we did a reconfiguration. 75% of the people said that there was no way that they would go to a lesser location, especially at the same price that they were already paying. 90% of those people did end up downgrading when all was said and done. It was a small handful that “stuck to their guns.” I suspect that will be the case here as well. I always felt the lower bowl being below grade was the number one reason refurbishing just could not work. Prolly goes hand in hand that without making those lower bowl concourses any wider and thus more accommodating, tough to charge market rates for a subpar experience. Looking forward to when the first lower bowl folks go.. had enough of hearing from you stinky club seat holders, you are all rich and snobs and according to so many here vile people and deserve our disdain!! 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Virgil Posted April 2 Share Posted April 2 34 minutes ago, Kirby Jackson said: Many say that they won’t downgrade but we will see. I’ve seen that story before when we did a reconfiguration. 75% of the people said that there was no way that they would go to a lesser location, especially at the same price that they were already paying. 90% of those people did end up downgrading when all was said and done. It was a small handful that “stuck to their guns.” I suspect that will be the case here as well. I can only speak for my family, and we are most likely going to get rid of the season tickets due to all of this. A major reason to have seasons is to have those seats locked in. If they weren't where they were, we wouldn't have kept them. For us, it'll make more sense just to buy single game tickets, pick where we sit, and let the ticket owner eat the PSL. Gameday tickets prices drop like crazy on the day of. Outside of the season opener in the new stadium, I'm sure we won't have issues getting tickets 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mrags Posted April 2 Share Posted April 2 17 minutes ago, papazoid said: FALSE ALARM.....APOLOGIES.....my friend is confused....his "experience" today is just the normal STH RELOCATION process from current stadium. Based on what has been presented as far as club members getting first crack this makes more sense. I just relocated last week Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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