**Breaking News** Pete Carroll out in Seattle

[Buffalo716]

5 minutes ago, Gugny said:

I am a Beane fan and he has made some solid moves. 
 

But if we’re talking historically, Belichick has out GM’d him by a very long shot. 
 

And re: Welker, before Belichick acquired him, he was JAG for 3 seasons. Two seasons with Miami in which he had about 1100 receiving. 
 

He came to NE and had multiple 1000+ yard seasons. 
 

It was a great acquisition and one of many for Belichick. 
 

Last year, Beane snagged John Brown and Cole Beasley to shore up the playoff roster. 
 

It’s really not close. 
 

The only thing they have in common is having elite QBs. 
 

One of them knew how to leverage that so far. 
 

Not trying to pile on Beane, but it makes me laugh when Bills fans (not you) try to sell the “Belichick wasn’t a great coach and was a horrible GM,” story. 
 

The Lombardis say otherwise. 
 

Well bill is the best ever... I have no problem saying that

 

He's Nick Saban on steroids... And I've met Nick multiple times at coaching seminars and he's my idol...

 

But the pro ranks to the collegiate ranks is a different animal... Bill is the best

 

But it's not like the dolphins fought welker was a scrub... They literally wouldn't budge off a second round pick... That's a lot of value in the NFL

 

As I said Bill belichick is a master evaluator of pro personnel... And he knows the best players in the league, and how to acquire them

 

He knew Wes welker was going to become the modern slot receiver... Why he gave up a second... If nobody thought the talent was there it would have been a sixth

 

Bills negotiating should be praised because he landed the best modern slot receiver... For a good deal

 

And nobody talks about the X's and O's that bill created....

 

He's literally the innovator of zone match schemes with Cleveland...  Mixing cover 3 and cover one... A genius move that has had insurmountable effects on football

 

 

[Big Blitz]

As for BB - We’re talking 40 years of having great to dominant defenses that had QBs seeing ghosts.  Absolutely insane.  

Most famously was probably his game plan to shut down the 1990 Bills.  And then almost 30 years later the McVay Rams in the SB.  

 

Those 2 performances bookend his career as a SB winning coach.  
 

He is absolutely one of the greatest defensive minds in NFL history.  

Edited January 11 by Big Blitz

[joemac1114]

I still remember Pete when he was with the Jets, running down the sideline at the Ralph giving Thurman the choke sign. Haven't been a fan since that day. 

[davefan66]

Pete said “I competed hard to be the head coach”.

 

Looks like he was forced out, yet amicable.
 

1 hour ago, joemac1114 said:

I still remember Pete when he was with the Jets, running down the sideline at the Ralph giving Thurman the choke sign. Haven't been a fan since that day. 

 

Disliked him after that for years. Changed for me after some time, seemed like a decent dude, a players coach for sure.

[x-BillzeBubba]

Bellichik out

[BRH]

14 hours ago, billsfan_34 said:

Kay Stephenson and Hank Bullough years are ones we all would love to forget. Ugly times indeed

 

Stephenson was in an unenviable position.  All of Knox's veterans got old at the same time and then the USFL came along and took Cribbs and kept us from getting Kelly until 1986.

 

Bullough though, that's the guy that took the sails out of our wind for awhile.

[ChevyVanMiller]

15 minutes ago, BRH said:

 

Stephenson was in an unenviable position.  All of Knox's veterans got old at the same time and then the USFL came along and took Cribbs and kept us from getting Kelly until 1986.

 

Bullough though, that's the guy that took the sails out of our wind for awhile.

I see what you did there.

[Mr. WEO]

Whos' the real GOAT?

 

BB: 6 SB wins as HC, 2 more as DC.  No college.

 

Saban:  7 college national titles.  crashed and burned in NFL, ran back to college game.

 

Carroll:  2 college national titles, SB win  (and SB loss).

[BRH]

13 minutes ago, Mr. WEO said:

Whos' the real GOAT?

 

BB: 6 SB wins as HC, 2 more as DC.  No college.

 

Saban:  7 college national titles.  crashed and burned in NFL, ran back to college game.

 

Carroll:  2 college national titles, SB win  (and SB loss).

 

Judging from the rump-licking Belichick has been getting on NFLN and ESPN all morning, you'd think Saban and Carroll didn't even exist.

 

Also, Scott Pioli on NFLN just now talking about how the Pats* are going to follow the Rooney rule and all other protocols "because that's who they are, they respect the rules and do things the right way."

 

🤣

 

Edited January 11 by BRH

[TheFunPolice]

23 minutes ago, Mr. WEO said:

Whos' the real GOAT?

 

BB: 6 SB wins as HC, 2 more as DC.  No college.

 

Saban:  7 college national titles.  crashed and burned in NFL, ran back to college game.

 

Carroll:  2 college national titles, SB win  (and SB loss).

 

Andy Reid, especially once another 4-5 years have gone by. IMO he isn't retiring until he's at least 70, so that's another 5 seasons after this one. If Bruce Arians could keep going standing there beet red with his goofy cap and power packs strapped to his chest in his early 70's then Reid can too. 

 

Reid has 258 wins now. If Reid averages 11 wins a season he will tie Shula in 6.3 years, when he is 71. So by the end of his 71 year old season he will be the winningest coach of all time, or an extremely close #2 to Belichick.

 

Yes, Belichick is ahead of Reid in wins as of now, but Belichick is also quite a bit older (71 vs 65). Assuming Reid coaches until he is the age Belichick is now he will have not only surpassed the number of wins Belichick has today, he will quite likely have also surpassed Shula. 

 

He will likely have at least 1 more SB win than he does now. 

 

He is already the only coach in NFL history to be the winningest head coach for 2 different franchises. 

He's already appeared in 4 Super Bowls, winning 2. 

He has a huge and successful coaching tree. 

He was in the top 10 all time in HC wins before he ever met Mahomes. 

 

Assuming Reid continues to coach into his 70's the ONLY thing Belichick will have over him is # of rings 6 vs ___?

 

If it's 6 rings vs 3 but Reid is ahead of him in all time wins and his assistants are successful HC all over the league at the end then it's a real debate. 

 

Without Brady, Belichick has been meh. Without Mahomes, Reid was already a top 10 winningest HC of all time and had been to a Super Bowl with McNabb and the Eagles. 

 

 

 

 

 

Edited January 11 by TheFunPolice

[Ethan in Cleveland]

18 hours ago, Maynard said:

Wow, I did have a feeling he may retire. Still shocked a bit. 

He got fired. Not retiring 

[Maynard]

1 hour ago, Ethan in Cleveland said:

He got fired. Not retiring 

I know, that was before his official press conference. He was definitely forced out. 

[Mr. WEO]

1 hour ago, TheFunPolice said:

 

Andy Reid, especially once another 4-5 years have gone by. IMO he isn't retiring until he's at least 70, so that's another 5 seasons after this one. If Bruce Arians could keep going standing there beet red with his goofy cap and power packs strapped to his chest in his early 70's then Reid can too. 

 

Reid has 258 wins now. If Reid averages 11 wins a season he will tie Shula in 6.3 years, when he is 71. So by the end of his 71 year old season he will be the winningest coach of all time, or an extremely close #2 to Belichick.

 

Yes, Belichick is ahead of Reid in wins as of now, but Belichick is also quite a bit older (71 vs 65). Assuming Reid coaches until he is the age Belichick is now he will have not only surpassed the number of wins Belichick has today, he will quite likely have also surpassed Shula. 

 

He will likely have at least 1 more SB win than he does now. 

 

He is already the only coach in NFL history to be the winningest head coach for 2 different franchises. 

He's already appeared in 4 Super Bowls, winning 2. 

He has a huge and successful coaching tree. 

He was in the top 10 all time in HC wins before he ever met Mahomes. 

 

Assuming Reid continues to coach into his 70's the ONLY thing Belichick will have over him is # of rings 6 vs ___?

 

If it's 6 rings vs 3 but Reid is ahead of him in all time wins and his assistants are successful HC all over the league at the end then it's a real debate. 

 

Without Brady, Belichick has been meh. Without Mahomes, Reid was already a top 10 winningest HC of all time and had been to a Super Bowl with McNabb and the Eagles.   

 

 

 

 

 

McNabb was a #2 1st round pick, not some 6th rounder...Alex Smith was an overall #1 pick. Mahomes was a #10 1st round pick.  2 rings with all of that for 

 

Reid, without more championships, isn't in this conversation yet.  The Chiefs aren't exactly on the come up at this point...

 

He's been a HC 25 years.  5 more and he's done.  If he wins 2 or 3 more SBs in that time then, sure, he is in the conversation.  His NFL competition is obviously BB, who did more with less (12 AFCC games, 9 SBs, 6 rings--all with one QB, good Defense and a bunch of journeymen at Offensive skill positions). 

[TheFunPolice]

4 hours ago, Mr. WEO said:

 

McNabb was a #2 1st round pick, not some 6th rounder...Alex Smith was an overall #1 pick. Mahomes was a #10 1st round pick.  2 rings with all of that for 

 

Reid, without more championships, isn't in this conversation yet.  The Chiefs aren't exactly on the come up at this point...

 

He's been a HC 25 years.  5 more and he's done.  If he wins 2 or 3 more SBs in that time then, sure, he is in the conversation.  His NFL competition is obviously BB, who did more with less (12 AFCC games, 9 SBs, 6 rings--all with one QB, good Defense and a bunch of journeymen at Offensive skill positions). 

 

Draft position means nothing once the games start. Brady was 10x the QB either of those guys were, and that might be low. By the time Alex Smith got to KC he was a reclamation project, and it was Reid who helped him reach his ceiling. 

 

I would take Brady and 3 mediocre WR over either of those guys and 3 great WR. And that's coming from a guy who couldn't stand Brady. 

 

Brady went to Tampa in his mid 40's and played better with a totally new coaching staff than he ever had for a couple seasons before the wheels finally came off. I was surprised and saddened to see it, but it shows what an advantage having him was. 

 

You're right though that we haven't seen the whole story of either guy's career. We don't know for sure how long either will coach. If Reid retires in the next few years he won't have enough hardware and wins to make it a real discussion, but #2 of all time might be a conversation depending on circumstances. 

 

Still, I think if current trends hold and Reid sticks with coaching until he's the age Belichick is now, this is going to be a popular debate in 5-6 years when you look at the entire picture. 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[Mr. WEO]

15 hours ago, TheFunPolice said:

 

Draft position means nothing once the games start. Brady was 10x the QB either of those guys were, and that might be low. By the time Alex Smith got to KC he was a reclamation project, and it was Reid who helped him reach his ceiling. 

 

I would take Brady and 3 mediocre WR over either of those guys and 3 great WR. And that's coming from a guy who couldn't stand Brady. 

 

Brady went to Tampa in his mid 40's and played better with a totally new coaching staff than he ever had for a couple seasons before the wheels finally came off. I was surprised and saddened to see it, but it shows what an advantage having him was. 

 

You're right though that we haven't seen the whole story of either guy's career. We don't know for sure how long either will coach. If Reid retires in the next few years he won't have enough hardware and wins to make it a real discussion, but #2 of all time might be a conversation depending on circumstances. 

 

Still, I think if current trends hold and Reid sticks with coaching until he's the age Belichick is now, this is going to be a popular debate in 5-6 years when you look at the entire picture. 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Was Brady a HOFer in those first 3 SB seasons? Few would say so. Most called him a game manager. 

 

Alex Smith was traded to the Chiefs for a second round pick.  That's a lot for a reclamation project. The facts are that Smith was on his was to his best season when he was replaced in game by Kaepernick.  Despite being cleared for the following game, Harbaugh decided to continue with Kaepernick....and, well, the rest is history. Smith was a reclamation in Washington--maybe that's what you meant to say?

 

Reid only gets in the conversation with several more rings.  GOAT isn't for just the regular season (he would need 71 more wins to pass Shula anyway)