The Big Gamble: Hydroxychloroquine

[Doc]

1 hour ago, Magox said:

Again, I don't know if it works or not. My suspicions are that with some sort of combination that it works early on and/or for prophylactic purposes. 

 

This was an interesting finding from the UAE.  They have a paper that they published to review.  You can read that here https://www.dha.gov.ae/en/HealthRegulation/Documents/COVID National Guidelines FINAL 18 March.pdf

 

 

It's all about viral load.  Early-on, the load is low.  Later-on it's high and overwhelms the body's defenses. 

 

26 minutes ago, Magox said:

It appears that Didier Raoult suggests data manipulation behind the recent study published in the Lancet on hydroxycholorquine.

 

 

 

Shocker!

[Gene Frenkle]

Wow, you fellas sure are clinging to this one. All. In.

[Doc]

14 minutes ago, Gene Frenkle said:

Wow, you fellas sure are clinging to this one. All. In.

 

Your puppet masters are taking it.  They're mostly (Klobuchar slipped-up) just not telling you.

Edited May 27, 2020 by Doc

[keepthefaith]

5 hours ago, Doc said:

 

It's all about viral load.  Early-on, the load is low.  Later-on it's high and overwhelms the body's defenses. 

 

 

 

 

This mirrors what nurse friend told us over the weekend.  Very senior nurse at our local hospital.   She said they used HCQ on many patients.  Those that were given the drug before they were in very serious condition seem to get good results.  Very serious cases didn't seem to respond to the drug.  Interestingly, the hospital was told by our State government to stop using the drug about 2 weeks ago.  She said it's all political and that doctors at hospital are under gag order not to discuss it.  She's never been an outwardly political person. 

[4merper4mer]

4 minutes ago, Gene Frenkle said:

Wow, you fellas sure are clinging to this one. All. In.

The good news is that a double blind study proved it cures baldness.  The bad news is that the study was only double blind because two docs lost their vision from looking at too many shiny chrome domes.  It was like looking into the sun.  So who really knows if you'll grow hair.

[meazza]

8 minutes ago, Gene Frenkle said:

Wow, you fellas sure are clinging to this one. All. In.

 

Well this isn't just a Trump thing.  I have a lot of colleagues who are from France who are debating the very same issue.

[Doc]

5 minutes ago, keepthefaith said:

This mirrors what nurse friend told us over the weekend.  Very senior nurse at our local hospital.   She said they used HCQ on many patients.  Those that were given the drug before they were in very serious condition seem to get good results.  Very serious cases didn't seem to respond to the drug.  Interestingly, the hospital was told by our State government to stop using the drug about 2 weeks ago.  She said it's all political and that doctors at hospital are under gag order not to discuss it.  She's never been an outwardly political person. 

 

Are they also giving the patients zinc?

[Gene Frenkle]

2 hours ago, Doc said:

 

Are they also giving the patients zinc?

 

This is so played. Yes, you're the one who has it all figured out, doc. The rest are either shills or fools!

[Chef Jim]

3 minutes ago, Gene Frenkle said:

 

This is so played. Yes, you're the one who has it all figured out, doc. The rest are either shills or fools!

Huh. I took his question as curiosity in wanting to seriously know if the reason they were having success was because it was being taken with zinc. 

Edited May 27, 2020 by Chef Jim

[Gene Frenkle]

2 minutes ago, Chef Jim said:

Huh. I took his question as curiosity in wanting to seriously know if the reason they were having success was because it was being taken with zinc. 

 

He's been harping on how "they're doing it wrong" by not including zinc in the treatment, especially after HCQ didn't work on it's own. He's the one who knows. If only the idiots would listen!

At this point, it seems not to be the wonder drug we hoped for. Time to move on and hopefully learn something about politicians playing doctor.

[Gene Frenkle]

BTW, what exactly is HCQ with or without zinc supposed to do? Is it preventative? Does it cure the disease? Does it lessen the symptoms? Does it "just work"? All of the above? I'm hyper confused about all of your theories here, which seem to be less than concrete, to say the least.

 

I mean, keepthefaith's nurse sees results in patients who already have it, but not the severe cases. The president says he's taking it prevntatively. Doc slams all the studies because they're missing the obvious (zinc). DR sees a coverup by those who "don't want you to know".

 

Trumpian homework: Let's get a unified theory on the table that avoids the whole moving goalposts thing. I'll wait while you internet clinicians figure out what your consensus should be. If you keep it vague enough, we can keep this conspiracy going for another month or so.

[Nanker]

3 hours ago, meazza said:

 

Well this isn't just a Trump thing.  I have a lot of colleagues who are from France who are debating the very same issue.

Oh, it certainly is in this country.  
 

1 hour ago, Gene Frenkle said:

BTW, what exactly is HCQ with or without zinc supposed to do? Is it preventative? Does it cure the disease? Does it lessen the symptoms? Does it "just work"? All of the above? I'm hyper confused about all of your theories here, which seem to be less than concrete, to say the least.

 

I mean, keepthefaith's nurse sees results in patients who already have it, but not the severe cases. The president says he's taking it prevntatively. Doc slams all the studies because they're missing the obvious (zinc). DR sees a coverup by those who "don't want you to know".

 

Trumpian homework: Let's get a unified theory on the table that avoids the whole moving goalposts thing. I'll wait while you internet clinicians figure out what your consensus should be. If you keep it vague enough, we can keep this conspiracy going for another month or so.

 

Think of it as a condom. It might prevent something from starting, but won’t prevent the ultimate Result after that something has already started. 

[Chef Jim]

8 hours ago, Gene Frenkle said:

 

He's been harping on how "they're doing it wrong" by not including zinc in the treatment, especially after HCQ didn't work on it's own. He's the one who knows. If only the idiots would listen!

At this point, it seems not to be the wonder drug we hoped for. Time to move on and hopefully learn something about politicians playing doctor.

So what you’re saying be just because it’s not the “wonder drug” that we just move on?  Most drugs are not miracle cures. Many just lessens the symptoms which allow for treatment.  

[Doc]

9 hours ago, Gene Frenkle said:

This is so played. Yes, you're the one who has it all figured out, doc. The rest are either shills or fools!

 

Again re-read what I told you above about your puppet masters using HCQ (probably with zinc).  Klobuchar let the cat out of the bag. 

 

8 hours ago, Gene Frenkle said:

BTW, what exactly is HCQ with or without zinc supposed to do? Is it preventative? Does it cure the disease? Does it lessen the symptoms? Does it "just work"? All of the above? I'm hyper confused about all of your theories here, which seem to be less than concrete, to say the least.

 

I mean, keepthefaith's nurse sees results in patients who already have it, but not the severe cases. The president says he's taking it prevntatively. Doc slams all the studies because they're missing the obvious (zinc). DR sees a coverup by those who "don't want you to know".

 

Trumpian homework: Let's get a unified theory on the table that avoids the whole moving goalposts thing. I'll wait while you internet clinicians figure out what your consensus should be. If you keep it vague enough, we can keep this conspiracy going for another month or so.

 

Do your own homework, Sue.  There have been several posts and videos talking about the mechanism of action. 

[shoshin]

19 hours ago, Magox said:

It appears that Didier Raoult suggests data manipulation behind the recent study published in the Lancet on hydroxycholorquine.

 

 

 

He would know something about data manipulation. 

 

(He's a crazy genius, but don't discount the crazy. I have no idea about his conclusions here and don't have the energy to dive into their actual data.)

[BuffaloHokie13]

8 hours ago, Gene Frenkle said:

Trumpian homework: Let's get a unified theory on the table that avoids the whole moving goalposts thing. I'll wait while you internet clinicians figure out what your consensus should be. If you keep it vague enough, we can keep this conspiracy going for another month or so.

First, I'm not a Trumpian. I didn't vote for him and if morons would stop making incredibly stupid claims about him I wouldn't have to defend him as often as I do. 

 

If you actually read Doc's statement then you would understand that it fits well with keepthefaith's account. The combination of HCQ and Zinc slows, if not stops, the virus' ability to replicate. So if you start it early it is significantly more effective than it would be after the virus has already replicated. This also fits with the idea that the combo may be useful for prevention. HCQ has been used for other purposes for decades and the side effects are well known and documented. It is worth discussing with your doctor to see if the pros outweigh the cons in your individual situation. Whatever you do, I suggest listening to your doctor. Not Doc, not me, not DR, not Trump, not the talking heads on CNN. Your doctor. 

[Gene Frenkle]

25 minutes ago, BuffaloHokie13 said:

First, I'm not a Trumpian. I didn't vote for him and if morons would stop making incredibly stupid claims about him I wouldn't have to defend him as often as I do. 

 

If you actually read Doc's statement then you would understand that it fits well with keepthefaith's account. The combination of HCQ and Zinc slows, if not stops, the virus' ability to replicate. So if you start it early it is significantly more effective than it would be after the virus has already replicated. This also fits with the idea that the combo may be useful for prevention. HCQ has been used for other purposes for decades and the side effects are well known and documented. It is worth discussing with your doctor to see if the pros outweigh the cons in your individual situation. Whatever you do, I suggest listening to your doctor. Not Doc, not me, not DR, not Trump, not the talking heads on CNN. Your doctor. 

 

Link?

[keepthefaith]

15 hours ago, Doc said:

 

Are they also giving the patients zinc?

 

I will find out. 

[Deranged Rhino]

 

[Warren Zevon]