Scraps Posted March 7, 2021 Posted March 7, 2021 4 minutes ago, SoCal Deek said: Hey Tibs The 2017 tax cut didn’t add to the deficit but the runaway out of control spending sure as heck did. Republicons controlled all the levers of power at the time. They own both the revenue and any excesses in spending. The country was racking up trillion dollar deficits every year, despite extremely low unemployment.
SoCal Deek Posted March 7, 2021 Posted March 7, 2021 Just now, Scraps said: Republicons controlled all the levers of power at the time. They own both the revenue and any excesses in spending. The country was racking up trillion dollar deficits every year, despite extremely low unemployment. I agree. You’ll notice my response didn’t mention either political party. A pox on both of their houses!
Scraps Posted March 7, 2021 Posted March 7, 2021 9 minutes ago, SoCal Deek said: I agree. You’ll notice my response didn’t mention either political party. A pox on both of their houses! Trump included?
SoCal Deek Posted March 7, 2021 Posted March 7, 2021 13 minutes ago, Scraps said: Trump included? And Biden for you?
Scraps Posted March 7, 2021 Posted March 7, 2021 (edited) 3 minutes ago, SoCal Deek said: And Biden for you? I asked my question first. I'll answer yours if you answer mine. Or are you going to continue to dodge, as I expect. Edited March 7, 2021 by Scraps
oldmanfan Posted March 7, 2021 Posted March 7, 2021 56 minutes ago, SoCal Deek said: Hey Tibs The 2017 tax cut didn’t add to the deficit but the runaway out of control spending sure as heck did. When we take over the White House (we still have to flip a coin for which of us takes which position), we can wipe out around 6 cabinet departments minimum, don’t you think? Then I get a good accountant to tell me what each Senator and Congressman gets in federal funding, and I give them a month to tell me what cuts they make to decrease their federal spending by 30%. If they don’t I arbitrarily decide, then send the bill to Congress.
SoCal Deek Posted March 7, 2021 Posted March 7, 2021 28 minutes ago, Scraps said: I asked my question first. I'll answer yours if you answer mine. Or are you going to continue to dodge, as I expect. I’ll answer. I’m for anyone who’ll cut taxes. Trump, Biden, whoever. Is that good enough for you? If we’re going to to run these federal deficits with or without tax increases or decreases I’m voting for less taxes every single time. 8 minutes ago, oldmanfan said: When we take over the White House (we still have to flip a coin for which of us takes which position), we can wipe out around 6 cabinet departments minimum, don’t you think? Then I get a good accountant to tell me what each Senator and Congressman gets in federal funding, and I give them a month to tell me what cuts they make to decrease their federal spending by 30%. If they don’t I arbitrarily decide, then send the bill to Congress. Bingo sir! Sign me up!
Scraps Posted March 7, 2021 Posted March 7, 2021 12 minutes ago, SoCal Deek said: I’ll answer. I’m for anyone who’ll cut taxes. Trump, Biden, whoever. Is that good enough for you? If we’re going to to run these federal deficits with or without tax increases or decreases I’m voting for less taxes every single time. I am dead set against people who will ring up the credit card our children, their children and grandchildren with no chance of ever balancing the budget. I think the mantra of just "cut taxes" is selfish and short sighted. For that reason, Trump , the self described "king of debt" was a disaster.
oldmanfan Posted March 7, 2021 Posted March 7, 2021 33 minutes ago, Scraps said: I am dead set against people who will ring up the credit card our children, their children and grandchildren with no chance of ever balancing the budget. I think the mantra of just "cut taxes" is selfish and short sighted. For that reason, Trump , the self described "king of debt" was a disaster. The federal government needs to get back to doing what is proscribed by the Constitution. Those things that only a federal government can do. That would cut spending tremendously. 1
leh-nerd skin-erd Posted March 7, 2021 Posted March 7, 2021 11 hours ago, Scraps said: You don't come across as a fan of the Fauc and sarcasm in your posts are humorous. I want to trust Fauci, I really do. The biggest factor for me is the disconnect between his words and actions on putting normality on hold for a year v his response to mass gatherings over the last year. I think he was weak and tepid when he could have displayed the leadership I would expect from a guy in his position. It’s easy to suggest he’s the science guy, not the political guy, but therein lies the problem for me. He had a platform and unprecedented access to the American people. He opined on all sorts of things from family gatherings to multiple household events and the like. I’m just a guy trying to figure it all out during what he says is a pandemic and the danger to our way of life extreme. Yet, on mass gatherings of people he treaded lightly and brought the political into it. As this mandate has dragged on...I’ve gotten to the point where I simply don’t trust him and question his motives. 7 hours ago, oldmanfan said: Go do it. The trials showed no real risks for any of the 3. As I said, I’m not on the fence about it. I don’t want any flu bug (or worse) ever. I’m a terrible patient and if it causes mass sterilization my seeds have already been sown. 👨🏻🦳
SoCal Deek Posted March 7, 2021 Posted March 7, 2021 3 hours ago, Scraps said: I am dead set against people who will ring up the credit card our children, their children and grandchildren with no chance of ever balancing the budget. I think the mantra of just "cut taxes" is selfish and short sighted. For that reason, Trump , the self described "king of debt" was a disaster. Well there we do differ. Now I’m not saying this to be boastful but as someone who’s well into the highest earnings bracket I’m beyond fed up with what I’m being asked to fund. I gladly pitched in during the Great Recession when the Obama Administration asked that my taxes be raised to help a nation in need. I just as gladly accepted the exact same tax percentage cut when Trump recommended putting my rate back where it was when Obama took office. Seemed more than fair to me...and it was. Not sure why we can’t do the same with the SPENDING side of the equation. Instead, it keeps spiraling ever upward.
B-Man Posted March 7, 2021 Posted March 7, 2021 COVID Relief Bill Passes Senate; Now Back to House For Another Round of Stupidity By Jennifer Van Laar https://redstate.com/jenvanlaar/2021/03/06/covid-relief-bill-passes-senate-now-back-to-house-for-another-round-of-stupidity-n338525 “The Senate has never spent $2 trillion in a more haphazard way. [Democrats’] top priority wasn’t pandemic relief. It was their Washington wish list.” The purpose of this bill was to bail out the years of fiscally criminal behavior of blues state governments. They have trying to do this for 6 years. This subsidizes the oppressive taxation that accompanies oppressive laws where instead of those who live in those states dealing with the consequences, they have now socialized them to the whole country and future generations to suffer. Stolen elections have consequences.
BillStime Posted March 7, 2021 Posted March 7, 2021 5 minutes ago, B-Man said: COVID Relief Bill Passes Senate; Now Back to House For Another Round of Stupidity By Jennifer Van Laar https://redstate.com/jenvanlaar/2021/03/06/covid-relief-bill-passes-senate-now-back-to-house-for-another-round-of-stupidity-n338525 “The Senate has never spent $2 trillion in a more haphazard way. [Democrats’] top priority wasn’t pandemic relief. It was their Washington wish list.” The purpose of this bill was to bail out the years of fiscally criminal behavior of blues state governments. They have trying to do this for 6 years. This subsidizes the oppressive taxation that accompanies oppressive laws where instead of those who live in those states dealing with the consequences, they have now socialized them to the whole country and future generations to suffer. Stolen elections have consequences. REDSTATE!!!!! Wait - "Stolen elections have consequences." Weren't you just biching about Blue ANON conspiracies? SMH lmao
B-Man Posted March 7, 2021 Posted March 7, 2021 (edited) COVID DERANGEMENT SYNDROME: Coronavirus has the Karens and Biden voters cowering. Covid Derangement Syndrome — it’s real, and there was a massive outbreak of it this week. Three states announced they were ending the absurd yearlong “mask mandates,” and the left’s collective head exploded in outrage. The reason is because this isn’t about public health anymore, or even politics, if it ever was. COVID is now the state religion, and the decisions by these GOP governors aren’t seen as a policy dispute, they’re considered heresy. Only an infidel or an apostate denies that there is a … mild seasonal virus out there. Half the population cowers in abject terror — afflicted with CDS. In New England, the leading prophet of the new faith is Gov. Charlie Baker. On Wednesday, in his daily sermon to the faithful, Tall Deval outlined the significance of the Mask in his strange cult: “I think the mask mandate has been an important element in both encouraging behavior but also in sending a message about the importance of recognizing and understanding that COVID is still very much with us.” He sounds like earlier generations of clergymen railing against the devil’s unending temptations, doesn’t he? But his real “message” is — we’re in charge, and you will do what you’re told. It used to be said, if you want to send a message, call Western Union. Now you just tell people they’re going to be afflicted with prolonged suffering and a gooey death if they don’t obey your orders, no matter how preposterous. And half the population — the feeble-minded, the Biden voters, the Karens — will instantly comply. QED, someone who bills herself as a “Syndicated op-ed columnist @washingtonpost, commentator @cnn, special correspondent @newshour” admitting that she’s incapable of doing her job as a fact and opinion gathering journalist: She better get used to mask burning parties eventually going nationwide in the coming year as more and more people are vaccinated. Edited March 7, 2021 by B-Man
Buffarukus Posted March 7, 2021 Posted March 7, 2021 (edited) 20 hours ago, Scraps said: How a party runs their nominating process is up to them. Certainly in 2016, with the super delegates, the Dems had a system that was tilted against Bernie Sanders. The logic for this was to put a brake on the polar extreme of the party and prevent them from choosing someone who was unelectable in the general election. I'm not a Democrat so I don't have a dog in that fight. I can see both points of view. Both parties have had processes that some would consider unfair historically. how a nominating process of a party is up to them? what exactly is the point of having primaries if the will of the american voter becomes subverted by what a party feels is best for them. Bernie was winning many delegates up until Iowa! why even have Bernie or any of the others "not approved" waste money, time and resources, only to do everything within their power to not get them the nomination regardless. if that isn't concidered blatant corruption on the highest level then your pretty much agreeing with me that democrats don't care about election integrity. they are perfectly fine with the establishment making the choice for them as long as they produce the facade they had any say in the process. perfectly happy to tow the anyone but trump line after the decision was made on their behalf...TWICE! you say both do it, which is true on a level but i can promise you if the RNC were as corrupt, donald trump would have never become the presidential nominee. established republicans were not in support of a outsider stepping in. the people voted and that's where the chips fell. its how democracy is supposed to work, like it or not. so this was the basis of my argument. the democrats are not calling for in depth transparent investigations into their own elections and think the other half of the country should share their low standards, shut up and sit down. i gave plenty of reasons why, true or not, rational people would believe their were problems with this general election as the same issues happened in the democratic primary. you seem to suggest well if there were problems then they would be presented on a right wing platforms. im pretty sure they have been, continuously. i gave two examples of problems. one that led to a arrest. the other that was immediately censored instead of what should be the standard debated. then you say that they are not presenting it and is not censored? i tryed my best not to include right wing sites as my links, it is not easy but does it make it less true? i wish there was less biased media but it simply one or the other for MOST well known publications..period. i haven't conducted full research of the general election but you go rather in depth on voting machine software basically saying it is proven there were no issues. a quick search reveals. https://www.rt.com/usa/509674-michigan-dominion-audit-errors-fraud/ "We conclude that the Dominion Voting System is intentionally and purposefully designed with inherent errors to create systemic fraud and influence election results." you talk about recounts and everyone laughed as alot of them revealed biden actually gained more votes in areas. noone really stopped to think how most recounts FOUND hundreds and in some cases thousands of uncounted votes. all voices that would never have been counted. but every vote counts and if its not enough to change the outcome..no issues here? there seems to be a overarching theme of "widespread" and "changed results". there are alot of issues found that dont fall under that very exclusive umbrella and can be dismissed as untrue! [ fact check : FALSE! ] this issue def would NOT have changed the election! no one asked that question in the first place. 🙄 you talk about the court hearings thrown out. i agree for the most part. but when laws are changed by those in power the last minute its pretty easy to not break it. not saying that is the case, mostly cause i dont want to research it all, but the last minute state changes are just another reason that draws suspicion regardless. broken pipes that stopped voting that evidence showed never existed. ballot watchers being told as long as they were in the same building then that constitutes the process was "overseen" regardless if they were near the actual ballot processing, due to covid of coarse. being able to actually observe at a reasonable distance had to be fought in court! the list goes on and on. we can go back and forth but i think it boils down to this. 20 hours ago, Scraps said: Why is it so difficult to accept the most simplest, straight forward answer. Enough voters were either dissatisfied with or sick and tired of him, or both, and Trump lost. when you have a huge population that has lost confidence in the electoral process you cannot just say..get over it. you cannot just say corruption did or did not happen as a absolute. I've provided alot of aligations that produces suspicion and im not sure why anyone would disagree regardless if true, its suspicious. in many cases these are not some off the wall way out there conspiracy theory type accusations. the things i shown are just the tip of other accusations. crazy idea but how about a full and transparent investigation of the election by a completely independant body? when it comes to postal, or insurrection our gov loves to deep dive into issues, somtimes repeatedly. not so much here. how about the democrats address why voter ID is so difficult to obtain for democratic voters, even though its not, and address THAT, instead of eliminating it from elections..which invites SUSPICION. people are fighting AGAINST HAVING A ID!!? i think we know the real reason why! address signature verification issues conservatives have. why are they trying to pass unsolicited voter enrollment...which is SUSPICIOUS. why are they trying to allow people to collect ballots on others behalf regardless of reason...which will make the system open to more voter harvesting! instead of eliminating things that provide more election integrity they seem intent on endorsing the things that produce fraud allegations. like i said the democrats have a very low bar and the supporters will not like the outcome of one party rule if they don't demand better. historically one party rule is where things become very scary. Edited March 7, 2021 by Buffarukus
oldmanfan Posted March 7, 2021 Posted March 7, 2021 (edited) 1 hour ago, Buffarukus said: how a nominating process of a party is up to them? what exactly is the point of having primaries if the will of the american voter becomes subverted by what a party feels is best for them. Bernie was winning many delegates up until Iowa! why even have Bernie or any of the others "not approved" waste money, time and resources, only to do everything within their power to not get them the nomination regardless. if that isn't concidered blatant corruption on the highest level then your pretty much agreeing with me that democrats don't care about election integrity. they are perfectly fine with the establishment making the choice for them as long as they produce the facade they had any say in the process. perfectly happy to tow the anyone but trump line after the decision was made on their behalf...TWICE! you say both do it, which is true on a level but i can promise you if the RNC were as corrupt, donald trump would have never become the presidential nominee. established republicans were not in support of a outsider stepping in. the people voted and that's where the chips fell. its how democracy is supposed to work, like it or not. so this was the basis of my argument. the democrats are not calling for in depth transparent investigations into their own elections and think the other half of the country should share their low standards, shut up and sit down. i gave plenty of reasons why, true or not, rational people would believe their were problems with this general election as the same issues happened in the democratic primary. you seem to suggest well if there were problems then they would be presented on a right wing platforms. im pretty sure they have been, continuously. i gave two examples of problems. one that led to a arrest. the other that was immediately censored instead of what should be the standard debated. then you say that they are not presenting it and is not censored? i tryed my best not to include right wing sites as my links, it is not easy but does it make it less true? i wish there was less biased media but it simply one or the other for MOST well known publications..period. i haven't conducted full research of the general election but you go rather in depth on voting machine software basically saying it is proven there were no issues. a quick search reveals. https://www.rt.com/usa/509674-michigan-dominion-audit-errors-fraud/ "We conclude that the Dominion Voting System is intentionally and purposefully designed with inherent errors to create systemic fraud and influence election results." you talk about recounts and everyone laughed as alot of them revealed biden actually gained more votes in areas. noone really stopped to think how most recounts FOUND hundreds and in some cases thousands of uncounted votes. all voices that would never have been counted. but every vote counts and if its not enough to change the outcome..no issues here? you talk about the court hearings thrown out. i agree for the most part. but when laws are changed by those in power the last minute its pretty easy to not break it. not saying that is the case, mostly cause i dont want to research it all, but the last minute state changes are just another reason that draws suspicion regardless. broken pipes that stopped voting that evidence showed never existed. ballot watchers being told as long as they were in the same building then that constitutes the process was "overseen" regardless if they were near the actual ballot processing, due to covid of coarse. being able to actually observe at a reasonable distance had to be fought in court! the list goes on and on. we can go back and forth but i think it boils down to this. when you have a huge population that has lost confidence in the electoral process you cannot just say..get over it. you cannot just say corruption did or did not happen as a absolute. I've provided alot of aligations that produces suspicion and im not sure why anyone would disagree regardless if true, its suspicious. in many cases these are not not some off the wall way out there conspiracy theory stuff. the things i shown are just the tip of other accusations. crazy idea but how about a full and transparent investigation of the election by a completely independant body? when it comes to postal, or insurrection our gov loves to deep dive into issues, somtimes repeatedly. not so much here. how about the democrats address why voter ID is so difficult to obtain for democratic voters, even though its not, and address THAT, instead of eliminating it from elections..which invites SUSPICION. people are fighting AGAINST HAVING A ID!!? i think we know the real reason why! address signature verification issues conservatives have. why are they trying to pass unsolicited voter enrollment...which is SUSPICIOUS. why are they trying to allow people to collect ballots on others behalf regardless of reason...which will make the system open to more voter harvesting! instead of eliminating things that provide more election integrity they seem intent on endorsing the things that produce fraud allegations. like i said the democrats have a very low bar and the supporters will not like the outcome of one party rule if they don't demand better. historically one party rule is where things become very scary. Ok, first if all do you really think quoting a Russian media site on the voting machines buttresses your argument? Seriously? The audits I am aware of all confirmed there were no abnormalities with the Dominion voting machines. And now that they’re suing those who slandered them discovery will show what occurred. Assuming the idiots claiming that are also too stupid to settle out of court. Now, as far as how the parties choose their nominees, the parties have their mechanisms and I don’t really care about that as I don’t have a constitutional right to vote in primaries. It used to be the bosses picked them in a smoke filled room. Now both parties lie, cheat and steal. Remember how Bush lied about McCain having an illegitimate child who was actually his adopted daughter? How about Trump lying about Cruz’s father? And yes Sanders probably got screwed. And Clyborne got Biden going in SC and we don’t know what pressure was put on nominees after that. But that is a means to an end where we all get to participate, and there simply is no evidence to support widespread election fraud. None. Remember the special investigation Trump demanded into the 2016 election to root out supposed fraud? You may not because the investigation was quietly terminated because it yielded nothing. In 2020 the DOJ said there was no evidence of widespread fraud. States that audited and reaffirmed their votes concluded there was no fraud. When Giuliani tried to get the Pennsylvania courts to intervene he told them specifically they were not claiming fraud. You claim states changed their laws; they did so to ensure that voters during the epidemic were not going to be deprived of their right to vote, and despite 60 some court cases no court said any legislature did anything illegal. And what they did helped make sure the Constitutional right to vote was protected for all. What you should be pissed about is the efforts to disenfranchise voters, like people in line to vote getting a bottle of water from a volunteer. If you care so much about supposed problems with primaries and voting as such, I hope you’ll join me in Georgia next election if this idiotic law is held up, and hand out water. You say a huge population has lost confidence in elections. Do you know why? Because they wanted Trump and that dishonest carnival barker started telling them weeks before the election that if he lost it was because it was rigged. It wasn’t rigged. He lost and his ego refused to accept it. Republicans now unworthy of the label Republicans participated in this charade because they were afraid of losing around 25% of voters, the hard core Trump supporters, who are incapable of separating themselves from their fantasy, and somehow believe a guy who lost the presidency and both the Senate and House is the answer to their political salvation. You ask for an independent investigation. The Trump campaign challenged results in states they wanted to challenge, and they lost. There you go. That is how elections work. There is no reason to add another layer to this just because Trump can’t accept defeat. And who would run a so-called investigation? The DOJ as I already pointed out found no evidence and that was run by Barr. So you want to put together some outside team? Led by who? With what investigatory powers? And when they reach the same conclusion the states and DOJ reached, will Trump and his supporters accept that? Are you so naive to think they will? What should have been done is for leaders of both parties to stand side by side and confirm in no uncertain terms that the election was fair and that Biden was elected. But that would involve integrity, which is in very short supply these days. As you say, we can go back and forth but it boils down to this: when you know that 2+2=4 and some if the population swear 2+2=5, or when you know the sky is blue but some of the population say it’s purple, and they say it because a guy like Trump tells them so, that is your problem. The political system in our country is far from perfect. But to fix it your have to focus on facts, and you have to fight against deliberate lies. Joe Biden is President because he was duly elected in a free and fair election. Rather than indulge those who want to live in conspiracy we would all benefit from focusing on the truth. Reviewing this I sound harsh, and apologize for the tone as I believe you are sincere in wanting to establish good dialog. But my general approach and opinion stand regardless of my harshness-I am just tired of what this continues to do to our country. Edited March 7, 2021 by oldmanfan 1 1
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