Gary M Posted July 23, 2020 Posted July 23, 2020 2 hours ago, shoshin said: So what you're saying is that defeating the virus comes down to eating more kale and living the Robb Wolf diet? You seem a little unhinged brother. There is no defeating it, there is only reducing the negative impact (remember slow the spread,) the virus actually defeats itself by infecting people and either killing them or making them immune. The idea that cuomo or POTUS or any other politician can mandate this virus away is the real lie. 1
shoshin Posted July 23, 2020 Posted July 23, 2020 1 minute ago, Magox said: Uhhhh Cuomo had problems of his own making. His Nursing home policies killed thousands and god knows how many people were infected that brought it back into their homes through the MTA. That is a perfect place for transmission of the virus, people sit next to each other for extended periods of time. Hell, they weren't even sanitizing the transportation system nearly as much as they should have been. Everyone got a lot of lessons learned from what happened in NYS. Cuomo made bad decisions. Others learned from them (in some places...masks have been a loooooooong lesson to teach.). There was not much criticism here about Cumo's decisions in the moment he was making them. Just saying. Anyone can Monday morning QB. 1
Gary M Posted July 23, 2020 Posted July 23, 2020 6 minutes ago, shoshin said: Cuomo's challenge was threefold: (1) No place is like NYC in all of America, (2) We sucked at treatment, and (3) We sucked at prevention. Every other state should do better than NY. We could have all done much, much better, but we didn't take prevention seriously and now just are watching it spread. BS look at the numbers, cases surged after the shut down. The virus was already here and spreading. Because they thought if you got it you died they didn't test asymptomatic people we didn't know how far spread it was. 1
shoshin Posted July 23, 2020 Posted July 23, 2020 3 minutes ago, Gary M said: There is no defeating it, there is only reducing the negative impact (remember slow the spread,) the virus actually defeats itself by infecting people and either killing them or making them immune. The idea that cuomo or POTUS or any other politician can mandate this virus away is the real lie. Our behavior can beat it pretty well do. Imagine if we had someone who could unite us against a virus. Not even a political opponent!
Gary M Posted July 23, 2020 Posted July 23, 2020 Just now, shoshin said: Our behavior can beat it pretty well do. Imagine if we had someone who could unite us against a virus. Not even a political opponent! ahh the human superiority complex, man cannot beat nature. 1 1
shoshin Posted July 23, 2020 Posted July 23, 2020 Just now, Gary M said: BS look at the numbers, cases surged after the shut down. The virus was already here and spreading. Because they thought if you got it you died they didn't test asymptomatic people we didn't know how far spread it was. What point are you trying to make? Do you not recall how little capacity there was for testing at the beginning? How little we knew about outcomes? How little we knew about spread? How little we knew about fatality? Just now, Gary M said: ahh the human superiority complex, man cannot beat nature. Norway would like you to look at their Covid numbers.
Gary M Posted July 23, 2020 Posted July 23, 2020 Just now, shoshin said: What point are you trying to make? Do you not recall how little capacity there was for testing at the beginning? How little we knew about outcomes? How little we knew about spread? How little we knew about fatality? Exactly Decisions (mostly bad) were made with bad/little/no information. 1
bilzfancy Posted July 23, 2020 Posted July 23, 2020 2 minutes ago, shoshin said: What point are you trying to make? Do you not recall how little capacity there was for testing at the beginning? How little we knew about outcomes? How little we knew about spread? How little we knew about fatality? Norway would like you to look at their Covid numbers. I could be mistaken but didn't the Scandinavian countries keep their schools open? 1
shoshin Posted July 23, 2020 Posted July 23, 2020 (edited) 6 minutes ago, bilzfancy said: I could be mistaken but didn't the Scandinavian countries keep their schools open? Yup. As we should too, even while we're F-ing up our response. But look what you can do when you work smart and united instead of dumb and divided. 8 minutes ago, Gary M said: Exactly Decisions (mostly bad) were made with bad/little/no information. It was a tough time really. I have been against almost all the extended shutdowns (except for NYC or anyplace the hospitals get bombed out) but the first one for 2-3 weeks while we assessed made the most sense. NYC was reeling. Edited July 23, 2020 by shoshin
WEATHER DOT COM Posted July 23, 2020 Posted July 23, 2020 (edited) From what I recall many businesses shut down in NYS and across the country before the county-wide shutdowns even began. Edited July 23, 2020 by wAcKy ZeBrA
Cinga Posted July 23, 2020 Posted July 23, 2020 4 minutes ago, shoshin said: 9 minutes ago, bilzfancy said: I could be mistaken but didn't the Scandinavian countries keep their schools open? Yup. As we should too, even while we're F-ing up our response. Look what you can do when you work smart and united instead of dumb and divided. Nor did they require a mask, leaving it up to the individual instead. What an ironic twist of freedom from a socialist nation huh? 4
GG Posted July 23, 2020 Posted July 23, 2020 13 minutes ago, shoshin said: What point are you trying to make? Do you not recall how little capacity there was for testing at the beginning? How little we knew about outcomes? How little we knew about spread? How little we knew about fatality? Norway would like you to look at their Covid numbers. You're back to testing? What was increased testing going to do with a virus that was fully established in NYC for about a month? 1
\GoBillsInDallas/ Posted July 23, 2020 Posted July 23, 2020 On 5/20/2020 at 2:04 PM, Chef Jim said: The unidentified staffer told her managers at Tula Regional Clinical Hospital that she was “too hot” No such thing. On 5/20/2020 at 2:35 PM, Joe Miner said: You won't get that kind of treatment with Obamacare. Thanks a lot Obama. On 5/20/2020 at 2:40 PM, Jon in Pasadena said: Where's the pics of her getting disciplined? (Asking for a friend.) On 5/20/2020 at 2:41 PM, keepthefaith said: She probably saved a few old dudes. No way you'd go ahead and die if you knew she'd be back to take your temperature. On 5/21/2020 at 7:01 AM, Gary M said: yep https://nypost.com/2020/07/23/too-hot-covid-19-nurse-lands-tv-spot-as-weather-forecaster/ 1 1
Buffalo_Gal Posted July 23, 2020 Posted July 23, 2020 Because lawmakers, judges, and federal employees are immune from COVID-19? 2
Magox Posted July 23, 2020 Posted July 23, 2020 33 minutes ago, shoshin said: Everyone got a lot of lessons learned from what happened in NYS. Cuomo made bad decisions. Others learned from them (in some places...masks have been a loooooooong lesson to teach.). There was not much criticism here about Cumo's decisions in the moment he was making them. Just saying. Anyone can Monday morning QB. It's not Monday Morning QB'ing when his peers in Florida, Georgia, Texas and other states didn't have that policy that resulted in a much better end result. The MTA was obvious from the very beginning and had lots of criticism, I criticized it myself while it was happening on this board countless times. Let's just be real here, Cuomo mishandled the virus worse than any other governor in the country, the numbers bear that out. I know you aren't a believer in data and tend to follow mainstream news analysis, but you're off once again. 2
3rdnlng Posted July 23, 2020 Posted July 23, 2020 One thing that I haven't seen taken into consideration is the cultural propensity for travel within a country or region. Is it possible that in countries in which their citizens are not prone to travel much that the spreading of the virus is substantially curtailed? I wonder if there have been any travel studies done in certain countries and how that would coincide with the amount of infections. Just a thought.
plenzmd1 Posted July 23, 2020 Posted July 23, 2020 1 hour ago, shoshin said: Once we have a vaccine, it will not be widely available so that is just talk. HCWS, at risk, older folks, then probably open for all. It'll take a couple years before it's out there for anyone would be my guess. And it doesn't matter because tons of people--most posters here at PPP--won't bother taking it. I thought the deal is they are pre-producing 4 of the most likely vaccines now..the Pfizer deal the other day was part of this...i may be wrong, but that is what i thought 1 hour ago, shoshin said: Cuomo's challenge was threefold: (1) No place is like NYC in all of America, (2) We sucked at treatment, and (3) We sucked at prevention. Every other state should do better than NY. We could have all done much, much better, but we didn't take prevention seriously and now just are watching it spread. No doubt he had a different challenge.But by early April it was apparent this thing was attacking nursing homes with a vengeance, and he did not rescind the order till May 10. And plenty of experts, HCW, and people on this board were killing him for it on here. He made a mistake, its okay..everyone was still learning at that point. And i will say again, the biggest problem we had in this country, and i do not believe it is any fault..is we semi-locked down the entire country when only the NE should have been on a full lockdown. When people started seeing such low numbers everywhere else, naturally the reaction was WTF? NYC has an issue, not my city...and we went back to full normal to quick. It was understandable reaction. Again, no one to blame. The one thing I have always stated, from the start..if we want to lockdown then lets lockdown. Should have been 21 days "lockdown"...and i mean no one leaves their freaking house. Grocery, essentials, beer, and weed delivered...only people out are grocery delivery people and people on the way to the hospital( as much as possible) . No Amazon delivery, no Walmart , Target and Kroger being open, no carryout..nothing! That would have worked. Might be something to consider in these hotspots states now. ( NFL players exempted of course) 1
Taro T Posted July 23, 2020 Posted July 23, 2020 10 minutes ago, plenzmd1 said: I thought the deal is they are pre-producing 4 of the most likely vaccines now..the Pfizer deal the other day was part of this...i may be wrong, but that is what i thought No doubt he had a different challenge.But by early April it was apparent this thing was attacking nursing homes with a vengeance, and he did not rescind the order till May 10. And plenty of experts, HCW, and people on this board were killing him for it on here. He made a mistake, its okay..everyone was still learning at that point. And i will say again, the biggest problem we had in this country, and i do not believe it is any fault..is we semi-locked down the entire country when only the NE should have been on a full lockdown. When people started seeing such low numbers everywhere else, naturally the reaction was WTF? NYC has an issue, not my city...and we went back to full normal to quick. It was understandable reaction. Again, no one to blame. The one thing I have always stated, from the start..if we want to lockdown then lets lockdown. Should have been 21 days "lockdown"...and i mean no one leaves their freaking house. Grocery, essentials, beer, and weed delivered...only people out are grocery delivery people and people on the way to the hospital( as much as possible) . No Amazon delivery, no Walmart , Target and Kroger being open, no carryout..nothing! That would have worked. Might be something to consider in these hotspots states now. ( NFL players exempted of course) Agree with a lot of this. But, unless the plan is to drag out the virus spreading until after there is a vaccine (which could be available anytime between Friday and never) eventually a complete lockdown will end and the virus will spread through the population when the lockdown ends. We delay the inevitable, but don't prevent it. And if the idea is to get to "herd immunity" then lockdown the vulnerable tightly & don't lockdown the rest until the heavy transmission starts & then lockdown just enough to keep from overwhelming the healthcare system in that particular area. Try to keep the transmission rate manageable. If the goal is something else other than 1 of the 2 extremes, state it explicitly and let people know what the plan is to reach THAT goal. And getting back to Cuomo, won't criticize him for decisions made in March; but by mid-April at the latest he needed to rescind that Nursing Home directive. He still had the Navy Medical Ship & the converted Javits Center available both sitting nearly empty to use as temporary housing for the nursing home residents to stay after they were well enough to leave the hospital but were still contagious. How many lives would've been saved changing that order 3-4 weeks earlier than it was? And the subways were handled about as poorly as possible- they cut down on the # of trains running, crowding the remaining riders into tighter spaces but didn't stop train service at any hours to allow for ACTUAL disinfection rather than simply wiping them down for a few minutes at night. The disinfection via UV should've been happening by April 15 as well. Really expecting we'll find in hindsight that what finally slowed the spread in NYC was they'd already reached / approached herd immunity after having it rage through for close to 2 months. Would explain why LA & other major cities are getting hit hard now, but with similar behavior by its residents that NYC isn't seeing a 2nd wave commensurate to these other places initial waves. 1
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