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NYG requested permission to interview Daboll for OC - DENIED

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7 minutes ago, Gugny said:

I agree a power run guy (perhaps one in his 20s) would be nice to complement Singletary.  But the lack of carries he had all year (let alone the playoff debacle) is pathetic.  It clearly shows how Daboll sees what's working, then abandons it.

 

I'm not sure what it shows.  They don't necessarily show what's going on on the sidelines.  Maybe Singletary has been suffering lingering effects from that hamstring injury all season.  Maybe they have him on a pitch count.  Maybe he needs to come off periodically and get stretched and massaged, I don't know.

 

Maybe Allen is supposed to run Singletary more but keeps checking to pass plays. 

 

Or maybe it is Daboll having his head up his butt.  I don't know. 

 

It's a mystery we fans can not solve.

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8 hours ago, reddogblitz said:

 

Fair enough. 

 

However the Bills were .500 over the 3 previous seasons before McDermott arrived.  Not great but not a "bad team" either.  And it was a pretty stacked roster at WR and OLine and DLine and RB and DB.  If Rex coulda coached D we would have been in the playoffs.

 

Rams, Broncos, Bears, and Eagles all hired new OCs.  They all have prolific offensive head coaches and they didn't talk to Daboll. 

 

I hope you're right that it all just needs  one more year to bake in.

 

The Broncos have a prolific offensive head coach? 

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I love how many people on here think Dabol sux but the players, coaches and other teams think he is great, which confirms what i already know is that he is great. The only thing i would like him to do is be more balanced, other than that glad he is back.

 

 

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8 hours ago, Mr. WEO said:

 

We all recognize that.  But it doesn't answer the question.  The O-line, revamped, is still not that good.  WR, a position McD has struggled with sicne he got here is still a major need, as is another RB (not one ending his career here).   I have no doubt that McD does EVERYTHING intensely.  But "more intensity" from him isn't going to change the Offense output.

 

Continuity is acceptable if you are starting with a coach with demonstrated success.  Daboll wasn't and isn't that guy.  He has succeeded nowhere as OC in this league.  He has succeeded in placing himself in proximity to great coaches and launching those associations into better jobs.  Given his best chance to shine in a playoff game, his late game playcalling was disastrous.

Thank you!

 

For objectively stating the obvious to those to can't see what some of us do see. 

 

@Shaw66You are really too nice a guy in thinking that things will change for the better by just adding a few new pieces and another year of development and experience.

 

Look at the 2016 Los Angles Rams with Jeff Fisher, John Fassel and Rob Boras as the OC. That year the Rams drafted QB Jared Goff #1 overall and he looked horrid after starting him, going 0-7 with a 54.6 completion percentage and 5 TD's, 7 INT's. There were big questions after this season as if the rams had made a tragic error in selecting Goff #1 overall. The Rams even had RB Todd Gurley and ran him 278 times that season.

 

The next season the Rams hire Sean McVay as HC and Matt Lefluer as OC and suddenly that QB who looked so bad as a rookie started looking like that #1 overall that they were hoping for with Goff going 11-4. It also helped the Rams successfully pounded the rock with Todd Gurley at RB to help out Goff. Gurley got about the same carries as the year previous but saw far more success with the new coaching staff. The #1 offense in points scored. The next year #2 overall offense and 13-3. 

 

It doesn't take a full season to develop "continuity" in any aspect of an offense as that is why they have OTAs, training camp and four full games of pre season. I heard this same excuse for Chan Gailey over and over, along with others who failed. Marrone with Hackett, etc.

 

How did "continuity" help Aaron Rodgers with Mike McCarthy as HC/play caller? The 2019 Packers 13-3 with a new HC who also calls the plays. The Packers are also running the ball more successfully this season and helping out Rodgers by taking pressure off of him to not have to carry the game with his arm. 

 

Look at the 49ers this season, 478 passing attempts vs 498 rushing attempts and this without a 1000 yard rusher on the team. They have three different backs all over 500 yards. The 2019 49ers 13-3 and a good bet to win the super bowl this season. 

 

Oh, but it's a passing league...the 14-2 Ravens, #1 in the league in rushing...were handily beaten by a team better at rushing the ball with the leagues leading rusher...

 

 

This Bills OC is bad at the majority of the offense. Bad at O line blocking schemes, protections against the better teams and most of all the O line penalties against nearly everyone. Bad at finding ways to run the ball in any situation. Bad at properly developing a young QB (by ever asking him to throw more than 35 times a game as that's usually what losing QB's do). Bad at game situational awareness and making adjustments during games to counter what the opposing defense is doing. Bad at seeing the talent at hand and recognizing if a player can do his job or not. Bad at maximizing the talent on the roster for success. 

 

Its rather clear to me that when the Bills pounded the ball on the ground and ran more than they threw the ball, they usually won every game. Conversely, when they asked the QB to carry the game with his arm by throwing more than running, they usually lost. The larger the disparity in throwing over running, the worse it looked for Buffalo.

 

 Don't blame the QB,  how did the 2018 6-9-1 Green Bay Packers look with Aaron Rodgers at QB? How have the Atlanta Falcons looked the last two seasons 7-9 with Matt Ryan at QB?

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24 minutes ago, Nihilarian said:

Thank you!

 

For objectively stating the obvious to those to can't see what some of us do see. 

 

@Shaw66You are really too nice a guy in thinking that things will change for the better by just adding a few new pieces and another year of development and experience.

 

Look at the 2016 Los Angles Rams with Jeff Fisher, John Fassel and Rob Boras as the OC. That year the Rams drafted QB Jared Goff #1 overall and he looked horrid after starting him, going 0-7 with a 54.6 completion percentage and 5 TD's, 7 INT's. There were big questions after this season as if the rams had made a tragic error in selecting Goff #1 overall. The Rams even had RB Todd Gurley and ran him 278 times that season.

 

The next season the Rams hire Sean McVay as HC and Matt Lefluer as OC and suddenly that QB who looked so bad as a rookie started looking like that #1 overall that they were hoping for with Goff going 11-4. It also helped the Rams successfully pounded the rock with Todd Gurley at RB to help out Goff. Gurley got about the same carries as the year previous but saw far more success with the new coaching staff. The #1 offense in points scored. The next year #2 overall offense and 13-3. 

 

 

Do you want me to tell you what else the Rams did that offseason? They rebuilt their offensive line totally. They went from the worst starting left tackle in football in 2016 (Greg Robinson) to one of the very best of the last decade, multiple all-pro, and a future Hall of Famer (Andrew Whitworth). They went from a center who after starting all season for the Rams in 2016 has never taken another snap in the NFL and has been out of the league since spending one week on the 49ers roster in 2017 (Tim Barnes) to a first team all-pro center (John Sullivan).

 

They also massively upgraded at wide receiver. They went from a wide receiver corps of Tavon Austin (a 1st round bust who has never been a starter since), Kenny Britt (a 1st round bust who has only appeared in 4 NFL games since) and Brian Quick (11 NFL targets since the Rams dumped him after that season and now out of the NFL) to the traded for Sammy Watkins, the priority FA pickup Robert Woods and drafted Cooper Kupp.

 

It was a major, major talent upgrade. Todd Gurley, who you mentioned, went from 3.2 yards a carry to 4.7 yards a carry. Do I think the move to McVay's stretch zone played a part in that? Sure. But three new starters on the offensive line including two top end players and all pro level talents had a significant part to play too.

 

The easiest way to upgrade your offense? Get better talent.

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11 hours ago, Hapless Bills Fan said:

 

Actually, the Bills were a mediocre team when they hired McDermott.  9-7, 8-8, 7-9 last 3 years.

You mean 24-24 vs. 25-25 with McD, but yes Playoffs.....

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1 hour ago, Nihilarian said:

Thank you!

 

For objectively stating the obvious to those to can't see what some of us do see. 

 

@Shaw66You are really too nice a guy in thinking that things will change for the better by just adding a few new pieces and another year of development and experience.

 

Look at the 2016 Los Angles Rams with Jeff Fisher, John Fassel and Rob Boras as the OC. That year the Rams drafted QB Jared Goff #1 overall and he looked horrid after starting him, going 0-7 with a 54.6 completion percentage and 5 TD's, 7 INT's. There were big questions after this season as if the rams had made a tragic error in selecting Goff #1 overall. The Rams even had RB Todd Gurley and ran him 278 times that season.

 

The next season the Rams hire Sean McVay as HC and Matt Lefluer as OC and suddenly that QB who looked so bad as a rookie started looking like that #1 overall that they were hoping for with Goff going 11-4. It also helped the Rams successfully pounded the rock with Todd Gurley at RB to help out Goff. Gurley got about the same carries as the year previous but saw far more success with the new coaching staff. The #1 offense in points scored. The next year #2 overall offense and 13-3. 

 

It doesn't take a full season to develop "continuity" in any aspect of an offense as that is why they have OTAs, training camp and four full games of pre season. I heard this same excuse for Chan Gailey over and over, along with others who failed. Marrone with Hackett, etc.

 

How did "continuity" help Aaron Rodgers with Mike McCarthy as HC/play caller? The 2019 Packers 13-3 with a new HC who also calls the plays. The Packers are also running the ball more successfully this season and helping out Rodgers by taking pressure off of him to not have to carry the game with his arm. 

 

Look at the 49ers this season, 478 passing attempts vs 498 rushing attempts and this without a 1000 yard rusher on the team. They have three different backs all over 500 yards. The 2019 49ers 13-3 and a good bet to win the super bowl this season. 

 

Oh, but it's a passing league...the 14-2 Ravens, #1 in the league in rushing...were handily beaten by a team better at rushing the ball with the leagues leading rusher...

 

 

This Bills OC is bad at the majority of the offense. Bad at O line blocking schemes, protections against the better teams and most of all the O line penalties against nearly everyone. Bad at finding ways to run the ball in any situation. Bad at properly developing a young QB (by ever asking him to throw more than 35 times a game as that's usually what losing QB's do). Bad at game situational awareness and making adjustments during games to counter what the opposing defense is doing. Bad at seeing the talent at hand and recognizing if a player can do his job or not. Bad at maximizing the talent on the roster for success. 

 

Its rather clear to me that when the Bills pounded the ball on the ground and ran more than they threw the ball, they usually won every game. Conversely, when they asked the QB to carry the game with his arm by throwing more than running, they usually lost. The larger the disparity in throwing over running, the worse it looked for Buffalo.

 

 Don't blame the QB,  how did the 2018 6-9-1 Green Bay Packers look with Aaron Rodgers at QB? How have the Atlanta Falcons looked the last two seasons 7-9 with Matt Ryan at QB?

And how do KC & NO look.....  Still need to pass the ball and be able to come back in games when necessary.  As great as Baltimore was, as soon as they were punched in the mouth they went down.

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6 hours ago, Gugny said:

 

I agree a power run guy (perhaps one in his 20s) would be nice to complement Singletary.  But the lack of carries he had all year (let alone the playoff debacle) is pathetic.  It clearly shows how Daboll sees what's working, then abandons it.

 

100% correct. He's too interested in being clever vs being right

 

But that falls on your HC. Just like when the defense was faltering Frasier lost his playcall duties and the fact he gives all that power to someone who abandons the run way too often is beyond amazing.

 

I'm going to prophesy the future: if we have a bad season next year people will call for McDermott's head to be fired. They will call this year a fluke and as much as I want the Bills to succeed I don't see it happening without us paying premium money for an OC/assistant HC who can keep Daboll in check and learn how to GULP run the ball and throw screen passes and swing passes to the RB.

 

The mystery is how can the same guy who had such great playcalling in the 1st series in the Texans game not even try doing it again in the game? All the motion, all of the great designs... GONE after the 1st sequence.

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4 minutes ago, Billsfan1972 said:

And how do KC & NO look.....  Still need to pass the ball and be able to come back in games when necessary.  As great as Baltimore was, as soon as they were punched in the mouth they went down.

Think about this. 

 

Your team goes 13-3, gets home field in the first WC game. Has one of the greatest QB's of all time behind center. Yet, still gets beat at home by a team that ran at them 40 times. Vikings RB Dalvin Cook gained 130 yards from scrimmage and scored two TDs.

 

Saints HC after the game, "They made more plays than we did," Payton said. "They ran the ball better than we did."

 

https://www.espn.com/nfl/recap?gameId=401131038

 

As bad as I feel being a Bills fan. Its gotta be even worse for Saints fans in knowing that this might have been the last hurrah with Brees at QB. The second straight season the Saints ended their year with an overtime loss. 

 

Anyway, my entire point was that NFL teams can still win by running the ball and with Buffalo having a young, inexperienced QB under center that perhaps that is exactly what they should have been doing every week. That even star QB's like Aaron Rodgers and Matt Ryan can have bad seasons without a great run game to help support them!

 

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42 minutes ago, Nihilarian said:

Think about this. 

 

Your team goes 13-3, gets home field in the first WC game. Has one of the greatest QB's of all time behind center. Yet, still gets beat at home by a team that ran at them 40 times. Vikings RB Dalvin Cook gained 130 yards from scrimmage and scored two TDs.

 

Saints HC after the game, "They made more plays than we did," Payton said. "They ran the ball better than we did."

 

https://www.espn.com/nfl/recap?gameId=401131038

 

As bad as I feel being a Bills fan. Its gotta be even worse for Saints fans in knowing that this might have been the last hurrah with Brees at QB. The second straight season the Saints ended their year with an overtime loss. 

 

Anyway, my entire point was that NFL teams can still win by running the ball and with Buffalo having a young, inexperienced QB under center that perhaps that is exactly what they should have been doing every week. That even star QB's like Aaron Rodgers and Matt Ryan can have bad seasons without a great run game to help support them!

 

I will not argue that running the ball is important, but also must be able to score points when needed.

 

Another team was down 24-0 & then scored 51 points.

 

Payton coached a terrible game and yep still lost thanks to a coin toss in OT.

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1 hour ago, delirious said:

All the Daboll hate is getting really insufferable. 

 

Freedom of choice is yours: to see, and to avoid.

 

As for Daboll, he's in the same boat as Allen with some of the fans.  When Allen plays more consistently and stops pulling bonehead crap like leaving the ball in position to be stripped while he ponders "should I throw or should I go now?" or taking dumb sacks, he'll get less criticism.  When fans stop having questions like "Singletary was running so well, why did he only have 13 carries?  Why did we stop feeding the rock to him 4Q and OT?" Daboll will field less criticism too.

 

2 hours ago, Billsfan1972 said:

You mean 24-24 vs. 25-25 with McD, but yes Playoffs.....

 

?

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8 hours ago, Hapless Bills Fan said:

 

I'm not sure what it shows.  They don't necessarily show what's going on on the sidelines.  Maybe Singletary has been suffering lingering effects from that hamstring injury all season.  Maybe they have him on a pitch count.  Maybe he needs to come off periodically and get stretched and massaged, I don't know.

 

Maybe Allen is supposed to run Singletary more but keeps checking to pass plays. 

 

Or maybe it is Daboll having his head up his butt.  I don't know. 

 

It's a mystery we fans can not solve.

 

True … we'll never know the real reasons.  But let's say there was a pitch count and/or a lingering injury … then, at best, it's horrible roster management.  If they knew Singletary had to be limited AND chose to only suit up Singletary and Gore - while leaving Yeldon inactive every week - then it's still a very, very big problem.

 

The fact that they had Duke Williams inactive for the majority of the regular season only to activate him and make him THE focal point of the passing game in the playoffs worries me.  This, coupled with the mismanagement of the running game (I think it's clear that it was mismanaged, regardless of whichever reason is the real one), should be a major concern.

 

I think about the mismanagement of the roster throughout this season, which then reminds me of when we went INTO the season with Nathan Peterman and rookie Josh Allen.

 

These are huge blunders.

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On 1/15/2020 at 11:24 PM, Happy Gilmore said:

Why couldn't Daboll have been allowed to interview for the position?  Good way to get rid of his bearded bowling ball head without having to fire him.

because some actually value him OR he wouldnt be getting looked at for HC or other OC jobs.....and think on this.....who would you trust more to know a decent coach from a poor one...other guys IN NFL football OR some fan that just has a axe to grind because he didnt like this or that??

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9 hours ago, Hapless Bills Fan said:

 

I'm having trouble decoding if your beef is with the talent on offense, or with Daboll?

 

When they decided to overhaul the offense last off season, they brought in a high-priced center in Mitch Morse and selected a guy in the 2nd round (Ford) but other than that, Beane basically shopped at Kohls.  He signed Spain (UDFA), whom the Titans moved on from to upgrade to Saffold.  He pulled capable backups from the Redskins (Nsekhe, UDFA) and Oakland (Feliciano, a 2015 4th round pick).  These guys can play, and Beane got good value for the cost, and they looked like a miraculous upgrade to last year's line, but there's probably a reason that they don't measure up well against the best defenses.    The best OLs usually feature a couple former first round picks.....

 

We are currently 23rd overall in our spending on offensive line.  There's kind of a theme there: 25th in spending on RB, 15th in spending on WR, 11th in spending on TE (but the big $$ guy didn't work out). 

 

Money isn't everything, but since the OL is the engine that powers both pass and rush game, some might say that our #23 ranked offense is a case of "get what you pay for".

 

If Beane and McDermott really want to be able to evaluate Allen and help him succeed, they better shore up the OL some more and (imo) acquire a better TE and an RB.  And draft a WR.

 

 

 

Well, Daboll for sure.

 

But the other poster was going on about how McD will be intensely improving the Offense (again) this off-season.  Many here have legitimately questioned McD's ablility to build an offense.  3 years in and they are still looking more quality at RB/TE/WR...and O-line.   He's done a nice job on the Defensive roster, but 3 years and his Offense still struggles to score points.

 

I don't think most teams blow their budget on O-line FAs anyway, so I don't think cost matters.  It shouldn't anyway--this team is sitting on tons of cash.

 

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NICE. I went to a SUNY school so I have a bunch of goony friends from downstate. I love giving them ***** about the Giants. 

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2 hours ago, delirious said:

All the Daboll hate is getting really insufferable. 

Don't you know that every year there has to be a whupping boy here for some? It's a tradition.

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Just now, Gugny said:

 

True … we'll never know the real reasons.  But let's say there was a pitch count and/or a lingering injury … then, at best, it's horrible roster management.  If they knew Singletary had to be limited AND chose to only suit up Singletary and Gore - while leaving Yeldon inactive every week - then it's still a very, very big problem.

 

The fact that they had Duke Williams inactive for the majority of the regular season only to activate him and make him THE focal point of the passing game in the playoffs worries me.  This, coupled with the mismanagement of the running game (I think it's clear that it was mismanaged, regardless of whichever reason is the real one), should be a major concern.

 

I think about the mismanagement of the roster throughout this season, which then reminds me of when we went INTO the season with Nathan Peterman and rookie Josh Allen.

 

These are huge blunders.

 

It's a fair point.  If they don't like Yeldon (and I don't see what's to love in the 6 yds on 6 carries he managed outside his 12 yd scamper vs Jets), then they should have been scouring the practice squads of other teams or even trying to work a trade to improve the RB room.  It's either player misuse, or roster mismanagement.  When they didn't like the DL and Horrible Harry IR'd, they brought in Liuget.  If Singletary was still limited by the hamstring and they don't like Yeldon, bring in someone else.

 

Even Beane admits he blundered in not doing enough for the OL in 2018 and that it hurt Josh's development.  The same can be said for WR, and now RB (

 

I give them a pass (hurr, hurr, see what I did there?) on Duke - they played him for 3 games in October and apparently didn't like what they saw.  He saw declining targets and receptions in those 3 games.  Perhaps he was struggling with the playbook or in practice - I don't know.  He did seem to injure his shoulder if I recall.

 

It also seems as though perhaps Daboll may have a bit of the "Red Headed Stepchild" role.  He stepped into Dennison's staff instead of dismissing them and bringing in his own his first year.  QB coach, OL coach, WR coach were all McDermott picks, I believe - wasn't the OL coach hired before Dennison was?  Perhaps he felt he couldn't lobby hard for what he needed on offense.  I hope that's changed.

 

Or perhaps Daboll just has bad judgement about what he needs on offense, and doesn't prioritize the run game high enough.

 

 

This is my major caveat with the current FO and coaching.  It just seems as though when it comes to offense, they have a "Low Interest Rate" and/or insufficient talent evaluation.

 

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15 minutes ago, Hapless Bills Fan said:

 

It's a fair point.  If they don't like Yeldon (and I don't see what's to love in the 6 yds on 6 carries he managed outside his 12 yd scamper vs Jets), then they should have been scouring the practice squads of other teams or even trying to work a trade to improve the RB room.  It's either player misuse, or roster mismanagement.  When they didn't like the DL and Horrible Harry IR'd, they brought in Liuget.  If Singletary was still limited by the hamstring and they don't like Yeldon, bring in someone else.

 

Even Beane admits he blundered in not doing enough for the OL in 2018 and that it hurt Josh's development.  The same can be said for WR, and now RB (

 

I give them a pass (hurr, hurr, see what I did there?) on Duke - they played him for 3 games in October and apparently didn't like what they saw.  He saw declining targets and receptions in those 3 games.  Perhaps he was struggling with the playbook or in practice - I don't know.  He did seem to injure his shoulder if I recall.

 

It also seems as though perhaps Daboll may have a bit of the "Red Headed Stepchild" role.  He stepped into Dennison's staff instead of dismissing them and bringing in his own his first year.  QB coach, OL coach, WR coach were all McDermott picks, I believe - wasn't the OL coach hired before Dennison was?  Perhaps he felt he couldn't lobby hard for what he needed on offense.  I hope that's changed.

 

Or perhaps Daboll just has bad judgement about what he needs on offense, and doesn't prioritize the run game high enough.

 

 

This is my major caveat with the current FO and coaching.  It just seems as though when it comes to offense, they have a "Low Interest Rate" and/or insufficient talent evaluation.

 

Which doesn't bode well for them going forward.

 

Any FO/coaching staff isn't going to last very long in this league with bad offensive talent evaluation and execution.

For McDermott, it's 3 years as Bills head coach and 3 years of bad offensive football. 

 

Look at their Carolina teams. Outside of that terrific 2015 campaign from Cam Newton, they had absolutely no one to help him out.... Their WRs were mostly trash. Really hope they learned their lesson and have learned to value the skills position. I'm skeptical they have until I see it.

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8 minutes ago, Hapless Bills Fan said:

 

It's a fair point.  If they don't like Yeldon (and I don't see what's to love in the 6 yds on 6 carries he managed outside his 12 yd scamper vs Jets), then they should have been scouring the practice squads of other teams or even trying to work a trade to improve the RB room.  It's either player misuse, or roster mismanagement.  When they didn't like the DL and Horrible Harry IR'd, they brought in Liuget.  If Singletary was still limited by the hamstring and they don't like Yeldon, bring in someone else.

 

Even Beane admits he blundered in not doing enough for the OL in 2018 and that it hurt Josh's development.  The same can be said for WR, and now RB (

 

I give them a pass (hurr, hurr, see what I did there?) on Duke - they played him for 3 games in October and apparently didn't like what they saw.  He saw declining targets and receptions in those 3 games.  Perhaps he was struggling with the playbook or in practice - I don't know.  He did seem to injure his shoulder if I recall.

 

It also seems as though perhaps Daboll may have a bit of the "Red Headed Stepchild" role.  He stepped into Dennison's staff instead of dismissing them and bringing in his own his first year.  QB coach, OL coach, WR coach were all McDermott picks, I believe - wasn't the OL coach hired before Dennison was?  Perhaps he felt he couldn't lobby hard for what he needed on offense.  I hope that's changed.

 

Or perhaps Daboll just has bad judgement about what he needs on offense, and doesn't prioritize the run game high enough.

 

 

This is my major caveat with the current FO and coaching.  It just seems as though when it comes to offense, they have a "Low Interest Rate" and/or insufficient talent evaluation.

 

 

I agree with all of this and as much as I want to love Beane and McDermott, I have my concerns.  To be clear (in general/to anyone reading) … I am NOT calling for anyone's head.  However, we are three years into this regime and they have yet to handle/prepare the offense properly.  That is no Bueno.

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2 hours ago, Nihilarian said:

Think about this. 

 

Your team goes 13-3, gets home field in the first WC game. Has one of the greatest QB's of all time behind center. Yet, still gets beat at home by a team that ran at them 40 times. Vikings RB Dalvin Cook gained 130 yards from scrimmage and scored two TDs.

 

Saints HC after the game, "They made more plays than we did," Payton said. "They ran the ball better than we did."

 

https://www.espn.com/nfl/recap?gameId=401131038

 

As bad as I feel being a Bills fan. Its gotta be even worse for Saints fans in knowing that this might have been the last hurrah with Brees at QB. The second straight season the Saints ended their year with an overtime loss. 

 

Anyway, my entire point was that NFL teams can still win by running the ball and with Buffalo having a young, inexperienced QB under center that perhaps that is exactly what they should have been doing every week. That even star QB's like Aaron Rodgers and Matt Ryan can have bad seasons without a great run game to help support them!

 

 

I think what they should be doing is focussing on developing their inexperienced QB into a star QB. And they don't do that running it 40 times a game.

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4 hours ago, GunnerBill said:

 

Do you want me to tell you what else the Rams did that offseason? They rebuilt their offensive line totally. They went from the worst starting left tackle in football in 2016 (Greg Robinson) to one of the very best of the last decade, multiple all-pro, and a future Hall of Famer (Andrew Whitworth). They went from a center who after starting all season for the Rams in 2016 has never taken another snap in the NFL and has been out of the league since spending one week on the 49ers roster in 2017 (Tim Barnes) to a first team all-pro center (John Sullivan).

 

They also massively upgraded at wide receiver. They went from a wide receiver corps of Tavon Austin (a 1st round bust who has never been a starter since), Kenny Britt (a 1st round bust who has only appeared in 4 NFL games since) and Brian Quick (11 NFL targets since the Rams dumped him after that season and now out of the NFL) to the traded for Sammy Watkins, the priority FA pickup Robert Woods and drafted Cooper Kupp.

 

It was a major, major talent upgrade. Todd Gurley, who you mentioned, went from 3.2 yards a carry to 4.7 yards a carry. Do I think the move to McVay's stretch zone played a part in that? Sure. But three new starters on the offensive line including two top end players and all pro level talents had a significant part to play too.

 

The easiest way to upgrade your offense? Get better talent.

 

All these are great points, but it has to be noted that Frank Cignetti (2015 OC) and Rob Boras (2015 TE coach promoted to OC after Cignetti fired) would seem to be a Special kind of Bad as OC.  They managed to make the following QB look like a hot mess:

-Nick Foles (probowl year in Philly then good partial season in Philly with Shurmur as OC; decent play as backup in KC with Reid 2016; Championship and Superbowl win with Reich and DeFilippo in Philly 2017 2018)

-Case Keenum (11-3, championship game with Shurmur 2017)

-Jared Goff (playoffs 2017, championship 2018 with McVay)

Now these are all guys with limitations, but they're also all guys who showed they can have success with the right coaching and support.

 

I think it can be argued that it takes a special kind of coach/system to make not one, not two, but THREE QB who had success before and after look like crap.

 

Rob Boras, BTW, is now our TE coach and I lived in fear of what I'd hear if Daboll left.

 

20 minutes ago, GunnerBill said:

I think what they should be doing is focussing on developing their inexperienced QB into a star QB. And they don't do that running it 40 times a game.

 

I think they should be focusing on developing their inexperienced QB too, and it is justly said that an inexperienced QB's best friend is a strong run game.

 

A QB who knows he can move the chains by handing it off and taking the check-down under pressure is a QB who just might be less inclined to do boneheaded things or to force throws

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5 minutes ago, Hapless Bills Fan said:

 

All these are great points, but it has to be noted that Frank Cignetti (2015 OC) and Rob Boras (2015 TE coach promoted to OC after Cignetti fired) would seem to be a Special kind of Bad as OC.  They managed to make the following QB look like a hot mess:

-Nick Foles (probowl year in Philly then good partial season in Philly with Shurmur as OC; decent play as backup in KC with Reid 2016; Championship and Superbowl win with Reich and DeFilippo in Philly 2017 2018)

-Case Keenum (11-3, championship game with Shurmur 2017)

-Jared Goff (playoffs 2017, championship 2018 with McVay)

Now these are all guys with limitations, but they're also all guys who showed they can have success with the right coaching and support.

 

I think it can be argued that it takes a special kind of coach/system to make not one, not two, but THREE QB who had success before and after look like crap.

 

Rob Boras, BTW, is now our TE coach and I lived in fear of what I'd hear if Daboll left.

 

Yea I agree the offensive coordinator position was not at all good in St Louis / LA - but what is also true is that wide receiver corps is a special kind of bad too. I mean that might rival the 2018 Bills for ineptitude.

 

 

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My problem with Daboll is that he seems to lose creativity as the game goes on. He can do it, but he gets in a rut. There were flashes of excellent play calling during many games this season, in which it was clear he was using motion or play action to make a play that was purposely designed to set up the next play. Then....nothing. A textbook example was the middle range ‘deep’ ball to Brown against the Texans. Play action at the line, froze the defense and Brown was wide open! But....we never saw that play again....ugh.

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Fantasy offseason: Sign Conklin, Scherff, and Hooper in free agency.

Spend draft capital and move up for Jeudy or maybe a slightly smaller trade up and get Ruggs, draft a back like Najee Harris, and another good wr in a draft with depth at the position. This is an offseason where the priority has to be offense.

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