Reed83HOF Posted November 21, 2019 Share Posted November 21, 2019 1 minute ago, whatdrought said: How much does that happen in the NFL these days? I would be fine with Allen having some autonomy and I think we’ve seen he does good things when changing stuff at the lines, but how much of the “playcalling” is done by QB’s? Not flaming, just curious myself. Not many and I'm not sure how much Rodgers is doing it this year as opposed to the past. Obviously the 2 big names were JK and Peyton. The way I look at it is, the QB has to basically know where every player is going to be, how WR routes are going to be adjusted based on the D coverage, he adjusts the blocking scheme, can audible to a run from a pass etc. - he might as well have the autonomy to call his own plays honestly at that point. It feels to me that the players in the game have a better feel for the flow of the game and that makes it easier. The OC should have his time spent looking for the tells and what to take advantage of (the higher level perspective). 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
whatdrought Posted November 21, 2019 Share Posted November 21, 2019 5 minutes ago, Reed83HOF said: Not many and I'm not sure how much Rodgers is doing it this year as opposed to the past. Obviously the 2 big names were JK and Peyton. The way I look at it is, the QB has to basically know where every player is going to be, how WR routes are going to be adjusted based on the D coverage, he adjusts the blocking scheme, can audible to a run from a pass etc. - he might as well have the autonomy to call his own plays honestly at that point. It feels to me that the players in the game have a better feel for the flow of the game and that makes it easier. The OC should have his time spent looking for the tells and what to take advantage of (the higher level perspective). I think in a controlled way this makes sense... I.e, he’s got 3 or 5 plays set up and then situationally can call what looks right. I think this is what they do some of during the tempo, as we see Allen make more adjustments. Short of a manning brain, it’s hard to have an entire play sheet in your head at any given time. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Reed83HOF Posted November 21, 2019 Share Posted November 21, 2019 8 minutes ago, whatdrought said: I think in a controlled way this makes sense... I.e, he’s got 3 or 5 plays set up and then situationally can call what looks right. I think this is what they do some of during the tempo, as we see Allen make more adjustments. Short of a manning brain, it’s hard to have an entire play sheet in your head at any given time. The game is a bit different now from back then, but being able to run multiple plays out of 1 formation puts a tremendous amount of pressure on the D and keeps them off balance. Reich does a great job at this in Indy & I believe Shanny jr does the same. Not to turn this into this conversation, but yeah I wanted Frank here (but didn't want to have all of the nostalgia crap and pop and circumstance that went with it - especially if it didn't work out); he is a great offensive brain and his help with JK in their playing days was huge. Thought he would be a great person to groom a young QB. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Plano Posted November 21, 2019 Share Posted November 21, 2019 is Daboll in the box permanently or was it just in Miami? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
billsherd Posted November 21, 2019 Share Posted November 21, 2019 Josh has learned to read the defense like if they are 11 or 12 of them on the field. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mrbojanglezs Posted November 21, 2019 Share Posted November 21, 2019 4 minutes ago, Plano said: is Daboll in the box permanently or was it just in Miami? We'll see this week but it sounded as if it would be that way for the foreseeable future. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
whatdrought Posted November 21, 2019 Share Posted November 21, 2019 1 hour ago, Reed83HOF said: The game is a bit different now from back then, but being able to run multiple plays out of 1 formation puts a tremendous amount of pressure on the D and keeps them off balance. Reich does a great job at this in Indy & I believe Shanny jr does the same. Not to turn this into this conversation, but yeah I wanted Frank here (but didn't want to have all of the nostalgia crap and pop and circumstance that went with it - especially if it didn't work out); he is a great offensive brain and his help with JK in their playing days was huge. Thought he would be a great person to groom a young QB. I agree regarding running multiple plays and play types out of the same look. That’s a major concern for me for our offense right now- we seem to be transparent. Less so this week, or so it seemed, but we need to be more duplicative with what we do out of what formation. I do like Reich. Wouldn’t have minded having him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cripple Creek Posted November 21, 2019 Share Posted November 21, 2019 5 hours ago, ganesh said: Where is the QB coach in all these ? By the QB. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ctk232 Posted November 22, 2019 Share Posted November 22, 2019 Can't recall this being posted elsewhere, but Cover1's take on the development here provides interesting context to this conversation: https://www.cover1.net/buffalo-bills-week-11-offensive-staff-gave-josh-allen-the-answers-to-the-test/ It's worth the read in full, but it seems it still relates to what McVay has been doing, but not necessarily via the headset chatter. To quote the article's concluding summary: Quote While this game was not against a premier defense, I think the staff has found a recipe for success: limited personnel groupings, but specifically, heavy use of 11 personnel with Brown, Beasley, McKenzie, Knox, and Singletary. This grouping puts speed on the field to stress man or zone defenses, while still having McKenzie on the field to run jet sweeps and swing screens. Using that grouping in the trips set I outlined earlier also makes it easier to detect how the defense is going to defend the plays called, which of course makes in-game adjustments that much easier for the staff and for Allen, as described by Brown on the 40-yard touchdown. Using one primary group can also allow the offense to use tempo at any given moment, which forces the defense to have checks and audibles in place. If they don’t, and the opponent plays vanilla coverage like the Dolphins did, Allen can then slice and dice the defense. The other key ingredient was RPOs. These quick-read types of plays were easy completions for Allen, and the answers he needed to get the Bills their seventh win. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Beast Posted November 22, 2019 Share Posted November 22, 2019 12 hours ago, r00tabaga said: I wish Jim Kelly was my dad. How old are you? He may be. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
3rdand12 Posted November 22, 2019 Share Posted November 22, 2019 13 hours ago, Hapless Bills Fan said: I interpreted Daboll's comments as indicating it might happen if the Bills were coming to the line and he saw something Josh seemed to be missing, but that it wasn't something he wanted to do on a routine basis: "HE's got to play" exactamundo Hap 2 hours ago, Cripple Creek said: By the QB. Flag thrown 12 men on the field ! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Locomark Posted November 22, 2019 Share Posted November 22, 2019 (edited) 8 hours ago, Reed83HOF said: Maybe it's just me and growing up with JK as my QB, but I would rather have the QB call the plays than an OC. The OC is a good coach to go to in between series to talk about what they are both seeing and thinking about how to attack the D etc. Edit: It is just a terrible crutch for QBs IMO. With the Rams, McVay is basically playing Madden with Goff as his QB While I enjoyed the KGun, they only used like 15 base plays. Defenses are much more athletic now and I think that package can work for short durations but not for full seasons. What made it work is they had 4 hall of fame skill players on the field at one time and then throw in lighting fast Beebe and a great change of pace backup RB in Kenny D. Josh has zero potential hall of famers in his lineup ! Edited November 22, 2019 by Locomark Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StHustle Posted November 22, 2019 Share Posted November 22, 2019 16 hours ago, njbuff said: Being an NFL QB is about the hardest thing to do in professional sports. I don't watch the sport much but I would imagine being a good hockey goalie is harder. At least at the same level. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts