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Virgil

A Few Thoughts about the Redskins Game, in no particular order

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1 minute ago, John from Riverside said:

I thought the OL was very bad today......so many stops on 4th down on short yardage......that should NOT happen.

 

Allen with his usuall 3 or more houdinini's to get away from a sack

 

STOP CALLING DESIGNED RUNNING PLAYS WITH ALLEN

 

Robert Foster is done......whatever magic he found in the 2nd half of last year.....its gone....dont make Duke inactive again

 

I'd like to more about him being inactive this game.  Was it for his special teams? 

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1 minute ago, John from Riverside said:

I thought the OL was very bad today......so many stops on 4th down on short yardage......that should NOT happen.

 

Allen with his usuall 3 or more houdinini's to get away from a sack

 

STOP CALLING DESIGNED RUNNING PLAYS WITH ALLEN

 

Robert Foster is done......whatever magic he found in the 2nd half of last year.....its gone....dont make Duke inactive again

i may not agree with the O line as Singletary got some . and Washington was playing the run more often than not

 

But yes and yes

 about Foster ( i think that was McD doing and acid test, he failed) he should be gone and put Duke back on the field for now.
and i get too stressed when Allen has the ball and running. part because of injury, but more because of what he did again. Letting the ball get away from him.  Those mistakes by him are game changers. and must be corrected fully.

not cool Josh

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23 minutes ago, Virgil said:

 

Read what I wrote.  I talked about why I thought they had issues when they did regarding stopping the run.  I didn't talk about the entire game.  I was only referring to those plays were we got gashed. 

 

I also commented that it was different when Oliver was on the field in the first half as well as the Skins changing things up to more outside runs in the second half. 

 

The point was about just the plays gashed up the middle and a point of concern in recent weeks.

 

it's to the point where anyone who points out what the Bills need to do to improve is labeled as "negative."   It really shows a lack of critical thinking.  Your OP post was fantastic. I don't agree with it all, but pointed out some shortcomings of the team and also what they did well (start Motor).   

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6 minutes ago, Virgil said:

 

I'd like to more about him being inactive this game.  Was it for his special teams? 

see above ^^

 I think they wanted to see if Foster had his sheets together yet.

 he did not

Edited by 3rdand12

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39 minutes ago, Virgil said:

 

I don't even know why I write the opening statement anymore...

there is a definitive loss of reading comprehension among the youth in our nation or the comment was meant to be sarcastic and the poster was just too darn clever for us to figure it out..I hope its the latter as I always like to get fooled (can you say masochist)

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3 minutes ago, 3rdand12 said:

see above ^^

 I think they wanted to see if Foster had his sheets together yet.

 he did not

To me that long ball that Allen threw that Robert Foster didnt track correctly was inexcusable.....he does that (and catches it) that is a huge play

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30 minutes ago, Nextmanup said:

Some folks like to actually discuss the team and other football related topics, not simply give each other high fives and say "Go Bills!".

 

That's not the point. There's a difference between not "giving high fives" and going to a fan site and making a point to say almost everything is terrible after a win and you know it.

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39 minutes ago, thurst44 said:

Admitting something is overly negative in the opening statement does not make an overly negative commentary less overly negative. 

The statement was not that the post was overly negative; the statement was that many of the takes would be perceived as negative by folks who want to believe everything is great.

 

The team still has some issues and discussing them honestly is not generally well received; that's fine. Everyone has their perspective and everyone is entitled to their opinion.

 

I'm going to need a whole lot more to believe this is a high quality team. They're winning the games they're supposed to win and that's important. W/L's are always the most important aspect of any particular game, metrics be danged.

 

BUT, there should be room for honest, intellectual discussion. 

 

I will say this; Singletary was pretty impressive. I still have some questions, but his performance was the most positive development from my perspective. This offense desperately needs him to consistently perform. He's not gonna put up the kind of numbers he put up weekly, but they need those pop plays.

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8 minutes ago, RyanC883 said:

 

it's to the point where anyone who points out what the Bills need to do to improve is labeled as "negative."   It really shows a lack of critical thinking.  Your OP post was fantastic. I don't agree with it all, but pointed out some shortcomings of the team and also what they did well (start Motor).   

It wasn't framed as a list of things "needed to improve" but thoughts about the game, that was a 24-9 win (against admittedly a terrible team).


I honestly did not react to the original post. Fine. I've seen it all before. I have my issues with the game. It definitely had an agenda against players he does not like, but whatever. It was the smug, sarcastic why-do-I-even-bother to write an intro (that whole what-me-negative? attitude) when he knew exactly what he was doing. It was obnoxious. 

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Best record we've had since 1993. That's 26 years.  While I would love to see a complete game in all facets, I'll take "win ugly" over and over again.  

 

The offense did enough. 24 points is just fine by me.  

The defense did enough--yes we got gashed by the run, but it was mostly between the 20's.  We shut Washington out of the endzone. 

 

Josh Allen did enough.  14 of 20 and some well placed balls.  People are griping about 3 missed passes.  Yeah, I'd like to see an 85% completion rate too, but come on.  No dumb passes.  No hero ball. Connected when he needed to. 

 

Singletary did more than enough on an off day for Gore.  I'll take it.  

 

Just to reiterate, best season so far in 26 years. 

 

1 loss to a dominant NE. 1 bad loss to Philly, a team that is starting to come to life and has a winning record.  I'll take it. 

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2 minutes ago, LSHMEAB said:

The statement was not that the post was overly negative; the statement was that many of the takes would be perceived as negative by folks who want to believe everything is great.

 

The team still has some issues and discussing them honestly is not generally well received; that's fine. Everyone has their perspective and everyone is entitled to their opinion.

 

I'm going to need a whole lot more to believe this is a high quality team. They're winning the games they're supposed to win and that's important. W/L's are always the most important aspect of any particular game, metrics be danged.

 

BUT, there should be room for honest, intellectual discussion. 

 

I will say this; Singletary was pretty impressive. I still have some questions, but his performance was the most positive development from my perspective. This offense desperately needs him to consistently perform. He's not gonna put up the kind of numbers he put up weekly, but they need those pop plays.

OK, this I mostly agree with, but we can at least enjoy the game for a few hours. There's a lot that is good about this team; the arrow is almost certainly pointed up on the team, so I'll forgive them a bit and hope it gets better (b/c I'm pretty sure no coaches are looking here to make decisions) and be happy they are racking up the wins and hopefully can go into Dallas 8-3 or 9-2 as they work out the kinks. However, there are things that concern me. Oliver is not one of them, fwiw. He's a rookie who most experts seem to be impressed by. However, there was some bizarre play calling on offense and the defense broke down containment more than a top defense should. 

 

Yes, it does seem silly to me to run to a comment board right after to dis a team after a win by 15 pts., but that's not what I was commenting about. It was the whole did-I-do-that comment that I found annoying. The OP was mostly negative, own it! It amazes me how much of this fanbase seems to get more excited about pointing out what's wrong than actually enjoying a win. I'm not saying don't point out the negative, but right after a win -- that's a choice. One he has a right to make, but if you're going to act like people are overreacting, that should warrant a response.

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- I think Singletary just became our lead back.  Offense should perk up going forward.

- My guess is that McDermott watched the 1st and goal from the 2 devolve into a 42 yard field goal and told Daboll 'cut the crap', which led to Gore, Gore, Gore, Gore, etc.

Somewhere in-between would be better.

 

I think the offense has finally started to come together.

Fewer mistakes, fewer penalties, 6 of 12 on 3rd downs + a handful of big plays. 

Trending up.

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1 hour ago, Virgil said:

 

I don't even know why I write the opening statement anymore...

Just ignore the inane comments. They will always exist. Your summary is accurate. You did an excellent job in giving a fair representation of the game. 

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Thanks for the post. I don't think you're being overly negative, just pointing out some pretty troubling trends we've seen the last three weeks in particular. Pointing them out hoping the team can improve on them for the tough games ahead. 

 

Keep posting. Whoever doesn't like it, doesn't have to read it. 

 

Some additional, related thoughts...

 

Oliver was great in college... but played in a very weak conference. I'm assuming teams (and Bills) factored that in when analyzing him, but maybe not enough. I'm still holding out hope for him but it might take a coach's decision to use him differently somehow. Might need to flex him around the line maybe even standing up at times.

 

OL and/scheme was not working today on the inside runs. Gore was running into walls. Our line is not imposing it's will at all. I'd like to see more off-tackle and outside runs, especially with Singletary (which they did some). Not sure that would make a difference, but to continue to get stuffed up the gut isn't that smart. Maybe more of a spread at times too, to open things up for a back. 

 

Knox was not down on that play. He was on top of the defender and rolled for the first down. Surprised they didn't challenge that. 

 

At first and goal from the 2, those next 3 plays were comical. Only thing worse would have been if Hauschka missed that kick. Thankfully he didn't. 

 

2 weeks in a row Foster struggles to track the ball and adjust to give him a chance to catch it. Allen looked a little frustrated for once.

 

Star doesn't do much for me. Twice on the same drive today he was facing the other way as the RB ran right past him. Odd.

 

Loved that pass play to mckenzie for 8 yards. Would like to see more "quick-strike" plays like that. What a bullet pass.

 

Go Bills! 

 

 

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Sold analysis, thank you for trying to stay objective. The extremes of homerism and pessimism on this board can make it tough to read.  Keep it up! 

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19 minutes ago, thurst44 said:

It wasn't framed as a list of things "needed to improve" but thoughts about the game, that was a 24-9 win (against admittedly a terrible team).


I honestly did not react to the original post. Fine. I've seen it all before. I have my issues with the game. It definitely had an agenda against players he does not like, but whatever. It was the smug, sarcastic why-do-I-even-bother to write an intro (that whole what-me-negative? attitude) when he knew exactly what he was doing. It was obnoxious. 

 

You're an idiot  (Sorry Tom).  Who was my agenda against?  Oliver?  He sucked this game and I made a mention about my previous thoughts on him so that my overall stance could be known to give context.  It was also one point.  Daboll?  Yeah, not a fan of him either.  But you also miss the entire post.  I was very critical of Allen earlier and adjust based on what they do.  I laid off Oliver almost the entire season up until this point.  So, if you want to say things to fit your narrative, go for it.

 

I made my follow-up comment about "why bother" because I wrote that intro specifically to address it.  Sometimes lines aren't sarcastic.  I put it there to warn those who were looking for a warm and fuzzy "we won" post to save themselves some time for half of it.  It was direct and straight forward.  But apparently that blatant warning sign wasn't enough to stop you from reading and still commenting on it. 

 

You're the guy who went to see Face Off in theaters and then complained that it wasn't realistic because science can't do that.  Yeah, so said the poster.

 

Either way, I'm done responding to you.  I've fed you enough

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40 minutes ago, Nextmanup said:

Some folks like to actually discuss the team and other football related topics, not simply give each other high fives and say "Go Bills!".

 

 

We can do both, but I have seen some posters that can ONLY point out the negative, the truth is usually somewhere in the middle.

 

Like I enjoyed the win, but would have liked to see Allen throw Gore open on that red zone series that stalled - let Gore make that catch and see if he could get in, but I think they have drilled Allen so much on not turning the ball over, he is reluctant to pull the trigger some times.

 

Then on the very next play with the sweep to McKenzie that was blown up, what the hell was Dion Dawkins doing? It was like he did not know what play they called because he turned inside and let the edge defender come clean on McKenzie and kind of jogged down the LOS to the opposite side to basically lean into a pile of bodies no where near the play.

 

I wonder if Gore got dinged at some point, he had zero burst and Daboll kept calling his number. I am also counting how many weeks in a row that Daboll will try to use Gore on a stretch play for no gain. I have seen some stubborn coaching, but sheesh.

 

Either way, a good win and some things this team can build upon.

 

 

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11 minutes ago, hemma said:

- I think Singletary just became our lead back.  Offense should perk up going forward.

- My guess is that McDermott watched the 1st and goal from the 2 devolve into a 42 yard field goal and told Daboll 'cut the crap', which led to Gore, Gore, Gore, Gore, etc.

Somewhere in-between would be better.

 

I think the offense has finally started to come together.

Fewer mistakes, fewer penalties, 6 of 12 on 3rd downs + a handful of big plays. 

Trending up.

 

I agree about Singletary.  I just wonder what changed this past week to to earn him the start.  It certainly wasn't last week's performance.  Not a knock against him, just how the game went

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I do not think that this was overly negative, the concerns are valid ones that will need to be addressed by the time that the tougher games come around.   Despite the 2-1 record, the team has not been the same over the three games after the bye week.   They are lucky that two of the games were against bottom five teams.   Today, I feel like the play calling and coaching was at fault instead of the actual players.    It was good enough today but may not be in later games if Buffalo is not careful.    A couple of other thoughts

 

-The run defense looks good swarming a run when stopping the back, but if the back get past first contact, no one is anywhere near them and that allows a 10-20 yard run.     Philly was the first team that exposed this and was able to do it for the entire game.   Today, AP wasalso doing this for awhile when showing flashes of his old self, but did not have the stamina anymore to do that 15-20 times.  I worry about what Chubb who will be the best back that we have faced this year might be able to do against this D next week.

 

-I was disappointed when a defensive lineman or linebacker was not added during the trade, but replacing Peko with Taylor from the practice squad was a definite upgrade.  Taylor was not getting pushed around like Peko was and made a few nice tackles at key times.   

 

I still see a 10 or 11 win team, but if they lose to Cleveland next week, I will start to worry a bit.

 

Edited by dgrochester55

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Just now, WideNine said:

 

We can do both, but I have seen some posters that can ONLY point out the negative, the truth is usually somewhere in the middle.

 

Like I enjoyed the win, but would have liked to see Allen throw Gore open on that red zone series that stalled - let Gore make that catch and see if he could get in, but I think they have drilled Allen so much on not turning the ball over, he is reluctant to pull the trigger some times.

 

Then on the very next play with the sweep to McKenzie that was blown up, what the hell was Dion Dawkins doing? It was like he did not know what play they called because he turned inside and let the edge defender come clean on McKenzie and kind of jogged down the LOS to the opposite side to basically lean into a pile of bodies no where near the play.

 

I wonder if Gore got dinged at some point, he had zero burst and Daboll kept calling his number. I am also counting how many weeks in a row that Daboll will try to use Gore on a stretch play for no gain. I have seen some stubborn coaching, but sheesh.

 

Either way, a good win and some things this team can build upon.

 

 

 

If it's the play I'm thinking of, I think a pass to Gore would have resulted in a pick 6.  He would've needed to toss it over a defender and there was a linebacker waiting at the goal line to greet him.  I think Allen made the right call to eat the ball as all the action was to that side of the field and he had nothing once he broke to the right

 

Again, if the play I'm thinking.

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I always enjoy reading your threads. Some fair and useful analysis. 

 

My thoughts

 

7) PI and the non-challenge - this was pretty clearly DPI, but it was the correct decision to not challenge it. For whatever reason it seems like refs are unwilling to change the call on the field in a PI challenge. Makes me wonder if there was a league wide memo stating that PI reversals should be saved for instances like the NFC Championship game (blatantly obvious AND huge impact to the outcome of the game). 

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Just now, Virgil said:

 

If it's the play I'm thinking of, I think a pass to Gore would have resulted in a pick 6.  He would've needed to toss it over a defender and there was a linebacker waiting at the goal line to greet him.  I think Allen made the right call to eat the ball as all the action was to that side of the field and he had nothing once he broke to the right

 

Again, if the play I'm thinking.

 

I think had he gotten it out quickly in front of Gore the linemen keeping Allen from running was not in position to make a play and the linebackers coming from center field would have been in time to take an angle on tackling Gore, but I don't think it was a pick six waiting to happen. I feel like Allen waited a second too long playing it safe and then yes by then - it would have been a pick and I am glad he ate the ball. Would have rather seen him throw it away, but glad he did not turn it over.

 

Conjecture at this point, and you could certainly be right. I just think that the coaching staff has preached turnover-free football so much to Allen that he is just a bit late getting the ball out as he still wants to visually confirm his guy is open rather then throw a pass where he has to trust his receiver to make a better play on the ball than the defender.

 

With the receivers he has had to work with, I am not sure I blame him for the caution-filled approach he has now. He needs to have play makers that bail him out enough that he trust them with 50/50 balls. Brown is the closet thing he has to that on the roster I think.

 

 

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18 minutes ago, WideNine said:

 

I think had he gotten it out quickly in front of Gore the linemen keeping Allen from running was not in position to make a play and the linebackers coming from center field would have been in time to take an angle on tackling Gore, but I don't think it was a pick six waiting to happen. I feel like Allen waited a second too long playing it safe and then yes by then - it would have been a pick and I am glad he ate the ball. Would have rather seen him throw it away, but glad he did not turn it over.

 

Conjecture at this point, and you could certainly be right. I just think that the coaching staff has preached turnover-free football so much to Allen that he is just a bit late getting the ball out as he still wants to visually confirm his guy is open rather then throw a pass where he has to trust his receiver to make a better play on the ball than the defender.

 

With the receivers he has had to work with, I am not sure I blame him for the caution-filled approach he has now. He needs to have play makers that bail him out enough that he trust them with 50/50 balls. Brown is the closet thing he has to that on the roster I think.

 

 


you’re not wrong.  He’s looking a little Trent-ish.  I don’t know if that’s him in his own head or the coaches 

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My only complaint in this game is the short yardage play calling. You can find other things to gripe about but they fixed some of the big errors from early on as the game progressed. The defense wasn't quite as shut down as I would have liked but you can't argue with 9 points.

 

But yes the short yardage play calling was really bad. The 3 runs to Gore on the goal line was egregious enough, but the 4th and 1 call to Gore was borderline criminal. We have a 6-5 QB. Use him in those situations. We weirdly will call QB sneaks when we have a yard and a half to go, but when we need a few inches we outsmart ourselves.

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1 hour ago, Virgil said:

 

I don't even know why I write the opening statement anymore...

You should relax on the thesis length posts.  It really isn't necessary🤪

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