Buffalo Sabres & NHL 2018-19: Sabres picking 7th overall (6/21/19). Ralph Krueger hire as new head coach!

[K-9]

2 hours ago, BillsFan4 said:

 

They play a completely different system than what Trotz ran. 

 

 

Housley was actually hired by Trotz in Nashville (and then kept on by Laviolette, where he was given free reign to run the defense while Lavy focused on the offense). 

 

He was there for Trotz’s last year (2013/14) and then worked 3 years with Laviolette. 

 

Trotz ran a much different, defense first system where the defenseman hardly ever joined the rush. He was actually considered too safe and too defensive in Nashville, which is part of the reason he brought housley in. He let housley start to implement parts of his system in 2013, and the change was noticeable on a Nashville team that had always played conservatively. 

 

Housley was then allowed to fully implement his 5 man attack when Lavy took over, where the defenseman began to consistently join the rush. 

 

Even the Nashville players talked about how different the new system housley put in place was, and how it was such a big change from a system that was very much the opposite of Laviolette and housley’s. 

 

 

And Nashville’s defense took a huge step forward under Housley.

 

Ryan Ellis didn’t start to come into his own until that first season under Housley (and only played 1 full season under Trotz).

Mattias Ekholm (a 4th round pick) only played 1 season under Trotz and didn’t blossom into the defenseman he is now until after Trotz left. 

Roman Josi (2nd round pick) made a huge leap in Housley’s first season. Went from 18pts to 40pts. 

All 3 really didn’t blossom into the defenseman they are today until after Trotz left. 

 

Ellis, Josi, even Subban have all had their best years, points wise, under Housley (and after Trotz left) 

 

Peter Laviolette and pretty much every Nashville defenseman all raved about the job housley did. 

 

He may be in over his head as a head coach, but you can’t knock what he did in Nashville. 

You’re missing a pretty good game so far! I didn’t see the 1st period (for some reason I thought the game wasn’t on tonight, even though I updated the thread title yesterday to show the game time....lol). But the 2nd has been pretty exciting, and mostly all buffalo. 

 

Lets hope it continues... 

I give Housley little credit for the success of Nashville’s defense. They have three potential HOF players back there.

 

And Trotz likes his defensemen to drive play as well. 

 

But it all depends on the defensemen available, anyway. 

[JohnC]

58 minutes ago, BillsFan4 said:

Big win. Buffalo desperately needed those 2 points. 

 

I didnt see the 1st, but I thought buffalo played a heck of a 2nd and (most of the) 3rd. 

That was a good team win. 

The recipe for a win is having Plezmd play ping pong instead of watching the game. That dour guy is a freaking jinx!  Don't tell him that the Sabres play tomorrow against a good but struggling Winnipeg because I want to increase the team's chances for success. 

 

This team is still a work in progress but when it gets secondary scoring their chances for success go exponentially up. Sheary is playing well and Mitts is steadily getting better. My MVP is Reinhart because he elevated a deflated second line. And that was desperately needed. 

[K-9]

On another note, I hope nobody is under the delusion that we played a great game today. We won one period of hockey, which is great and sometimes all it takes, but a win for a struggling team can be seductive so I’m under no illusions that this was some grand display of hockey today. 

 

They beat a team they should have beaten but other than that one period, they weren’t the better team for most of the game (metrics bear this out) except for special teams which was the difference. That is not a sustainable winning formula. 

 

We needed to play .632 hockey the rest of the way going into today for a decent shot at the playoffs. Today was a start. Nothing more. Sweep the last three games of this home stand and we have a chance to make waves if other teams start to struggle. 

 

But we need to play much better. 

[JohnC]

57 minutes ago, K-9 said:

On another note, I hope nobody is under the delusion that we played a great game today. We won one period of hockey, which is great and sometimes all it takes, but a win for a struggling team can be seductive so I’m under no illusions that this was some grand display of hockey today. 

 

They beat a team they should have beaten but other than that one period, they weren’t the better team for most of the game (metrics bear this out) except for special teams which was the difference. That is not a sustainable winning formula. 

 

We needed to play .632 hockey the rest of the way going into today for a decent shot at the playoffs. Today was a start. Nothing more. Sweep the last three games of this home stand and we have a chance to make waves if other teams start to struggle. 

 

But we need to play much better. 

As you noted we beat a team that we were supposed to beat. I'll take it. I didn't see the first period so I can't comment about it. For the other two periods I thought we outplayed them. What is encouraging is that we are getting secondary scoring at a greater frequency. That's a positive sign. I give much of the credit to Reinhart. He has continued to play well even when not playing with the top line. 

 

As you well know I'm not hung up on the playoff chase. However, I do believe that we will be playing meaningful playoff implication games until the end of the season. Is that a big deal? For me it is. What I'm keenly watching is the play of the young players and their development. I see Mitts steadily getting better. Dahlin is a gem. Tage flashes talent but his game is untamed. 

 

As the season grinds on to the end stage few people have delusions about how good this team is. As you well know at this time of the season the style of play becomes more grinding  than an artistic for all teams. You don't earn points based on style.. A win is a win and I will gladly take it.  

 

This team is far from being a finished product. This roster is full of a lot of young players who are steadily getting better. I'm encouraged with what I have seen. As I stated in other posts I foresee the Sabres earning between 20-25 (closer to 25) points more than they did last year. That's very good progress. 

[BillsFan4]

44 minutes ago, K-9 said:

I give Housley little credit for the success of Nashville’s defense. They have three potential HOF players back there.

 

And Trotz likes his defensemen to drive play as well. 

 

But it all depends on the defensemen available, anyway. 

 

I disagree. 

 

Almost every one of their defenseman had better seasons under Housley than any other coach. A few (Ellis, Josi, Ekholm) had career years under Housley after Trotz left.

Shea Weber, a well established 8 year vet, had his highest scoring season in Housley’s 1st year. 

 

Ekholm and Ellis were both struggling in their development before Housley came on board. Neither were considered top defenseman before housley’s time there. 

He has been pretty widely credited with their development -

 

Quote

When the Predators hired Housley after the 2012-13 season, the team did so to add a different voice to the coaching staff. The group missed the playoffs and finished with the fourth-worst record in the NHL and the organization felt a change was needed.

 

But Nashville also wanted him to help unlock the potential in both Ellis and fellow young blue liner Mattias Ekholm. At the time, the Preds saw both players in their long-term plans, but the two were struggling to take the next step. Ellis, a 2009 first-round pick, had six points in 32 games in 2012-13 and averaged 16:23 of ice-time per-game.

Ekholm, who was one of the top Swedish defensive prospects, had played three NHL games. He previously made headlines after former coach Barry Trotz called him outfollowing a disastrous debut in his first two games in 2011-12. He went back to Sweden shortly after for the rest of that year.

 

It has taken some time and patience, but under Housley’s tutelage, both Ekholm and Ellis have turned into legit top defensemen. This past season, Ekholm was a two-way force for Nashville and averaged 23:28 of ice-time with 23 points in 82 games. Ellis notched career-highs with 16 goals and 38 points in 71 games while averaging 23:57 in 2016-17.

 

https://sports.yahoo.com/news/phil-housley-coaches-offense-predators-defense-152520840.html

 

Quote

Housley’s ability to get through to his players has to do with his beliefs as an offensive-minded coach along with his playing résumé. Nashville’s blue liners like how Housley preaches an attacking style and they admire the fact that he’s one of the game’s all-time greats.

 

Ekholm and Ellis aren’t the only players who have taken off under Housley. Josi has finished fifth in Norris Trophy voting each of the last two years and had a career-high 61 points in 2015-16.

 

“....... Nashville radio analyst Chris Mason said. “I just think defensemen want to play that style of play. If you have skill and you can skate, that’s the kind of hockey you really enjoy playing. It’s fun and he encourages that style of play so I think hand-in-hand with the way his experiences have gone and him having that credibility of being that type of player, I think it’s just a really relatable type of player with the defensemen.”

 

2 of those defenseman were not 1st round picks. One was a 2nd rounder. The other was a 4th rounder. They were by no means sure things when drafted, and Housley worked with them longer than any other coach has. Trotz wasn’t with some of those defenseman for more than 1 full season. Ekholm played 3 games for Trotz before Housley got there. Ellis played about 60 games. Even Josi had only played 2 50 game seasons before Housley got there. 

 

Housley was with them for 4 full seasons and was there in the early stages of some of their development. 

 

Plus, Every Nashville defenseman raves about housley and many credited him for their development as players. Even Shea Weber and PK Subban, both experienced vets when housley worked with them, raved about Housley and called him one of the best and/or most knowledgeable coaches they had. 

 

Heres a quote from PK Subban -

 

Quote

The new addition to the group was Subban.....

 

.....Subban was lacing up some new skates when he was asked about Housley on Thursday. He looked up from what he was doing and his eyes immediately lit up.

 

“He brings such a different element to coaching because of the player he was; he sees the game unlike probably anyone else who's ever played the game," Subban said. "When he talks, all that matters to me is what is coming out of his mouth."  

 

https://www.nhl.com/news/coach-phil-housley-shaped-nashville-predators-defense/c-289275342

 

and Ellis -

 

 

Quote

Ellis left little doubt as to Housley's impact on his ascension to these heights.

"He understands the game and how we see it and how we want to play it," he said. "He thinks a step ahead of a lot of plays. What he's brought to all of us, you can't really get that from anyone else.

 

"Someone who's played, I don't know, 1,500 games or close to it and almost a point-a-game player as a defenseman, whatever he says you pretty much do."

 

And this -

 

Quote

Incorporating Subban and adjusting from the loss of Weber was a job that was in large part handled by Housley, who coach Peter Laviolette says he gives a ton of latitude to run the defense as he sees fit because of how much he trusts his judgment.

 

Quote

Housley has no problem trusting those players because they are so good, and a big reason why they are so good is because they look up to their coach.

 

 

There are plenty more articles out there with high praise for the job Housley did in Nashville, and plenty more player quotes raving about him.

 

His development of the nashville blue line was a huge reason he became such a hot coaching candidate, and why he was considered the hottest coaching candidate on the market the year buffalo hired him. 

 

 

[JohnC]

1 minute ago, BillsFan4 said:

 

I disagree. 

 

Almost every one of their defenseman had better seasons under Housley than any other coach. A few (Ellis, Josi, Ekholm) had career years under Housley after Trotz left.

Shea Weber, a well established 8 year vet, had his highest scoring season in Housley’s 1st year. 

 

Ekholm and Ellis were both struggling in their development before Housley came on board. Neither were considered top defenseman before housley’s time there. 

He has been pretty widely credited with their development -

 

 

https://sports.yahoo.com/news/phil-housley-coaches-offense-predators-defense-152520840.html

 

 

2 of those defenseman were not 1st round picks. One was a 2nd rounder. The other was a 4th rounder. They were by no means sure things when drafted, and Housley worked with them longer than any other coach has. Trotz wasn’t with some of those defenseman for more than 1 full season. Ekholm played 3 games for Trotz before Housley got there. Ellis played about 60 games. Even Josi had only played 2 50 game seasons before Housley got there. 

 

Housley was with them for 4 full seasons and was there in the early stages of some of their development. 

 

Plus, Every Nashville defenseman raves about housley and many credited him for their development as players. Even Shea Weber and PK Subban, both experienced vets when housley worked with them, raved about Housley and called him one of the best and/or most knowledgeable coaches they had. 

 

Heres a quote from PK Subban -

 

 

https://www.nhl.com/news/coach-phil-housley-shaped-nashville-predators-defense/c-289275342

 

and Ellis -

 

 

 

And this -

 

 

 

 

There are plenty more articles out there with high praise for the job Housley did in Nashville, and plenty more player quotes raving about him.

 

His development of the nashville blue line was a huge reason he became such a hot coaching candidate, and why he was considered the hottest coaching candidate on the market the year buffalo hired him. 

 

 

Housley has done a good job handling Dahlin. He started the season by easing him in and steadily increased his load and responsibility. It is tricky task to coach a great young player because there is a delicate balance between over and under coaching a prodigy. I've noticed with some young players he has them on a tighter leash than he does with Dahlin.

 

I'm in a very distinct minority on the topic of Housley. In general, I think he is doing a reasonably solid job coaching a roster full of very young players. He has to balance developing players and trying to win. So I'm satisfied with him as our coach. And to further antagonize the majority of the lynching crowd here I believe that Scandella has played reasonably well in his role as a third pairing defenseman.     

[K-9]

1 hour ago, BillsFan4 said:

 

I disagree. 

 

Almost every one of their defenseman had better seasons under Housley than any other coach. A few (Ellis, Josi, Ekholm) had career years under Housley after Trotz left.

Shea Weber, a well established 8 year vet, had his highest scoring season in Housley’s 1st year. 

 

Ekholm and Ellis were both struggling in their development before Housley came on board. Neither were considered top defenseman before housley’s time there. 

He has been pretty widely credited with their development -

 

 

https://sports.yahoo.com/news/phil-housley-coaches-offense-predators-defense-152520840.html

 

 

2 of those defenseman were not 1st round picks. One was a 2nd rounder. The other was a 4th rounder. They were by no means sure things when drafted, and Housley worked with them longer than any other coach has. Trotz wasn’t with some of those defenseman for more than 1 full season. Ekholm played 3 games for Trotz before Housley got there. Ellis played about 60 games. Even Josi had only played 2 50 game seasons before Housley got there. 

 

Housley was with them for 4 full seasons and was there in the early stages of some of their development. 

 

Plus, Every Nashville defenseman raves about housley and many credited him for their development as players. Even Shea Weber and PK Subban, both experienced vets when housley worked with them, raved about Housley and called him one of the best and/or most knowledgeable coaches they had. 

 

Heres a quote from PK Subban -

 

 

https://www.nhl.com/news/coach-phil-housley-shaped-nashville-predators-defense/c-289275342

 

and Ellis -

 

 

 

And this -

 

 

 

 

There are plenty more articles out there with high praise for the job Housley did in Nashville, and plenty more player quotes raving about him.

 

His development of the nashville blue line was a huge reason he became such a hot coaching candidate, and why he was considered the hottest coaching candidate on the market the year buffalo hired him. 

 

 

Then my question is, what the hell happened to Housley between Nashville and Buffalo? Because his defensive genius isn’t manifesting very much here. 

 

It’s great that the Preds defenders praise him. But I think it’s nothing much more than players hyping their coach. They were already a talented group. Jossi and Subban, especially. 

 

Housley gets no credit from me until he proves himself here. None. 

[bbb]

17 hours ago, BillsFan4 said:

 

I disagree. 

 

Almost every one of their defenseman had better seasons under Housley than any other coach. A few (Ellis, Josi, Ekholm) had career years under Housley after Trotz left.

Shea Weber, a well established 8 year vet, had his highest scoring season in Housley’s 1st year. 

 

Ekholm and Ellis were both struggling in their development before Housley came on board. Neither were considered top defenseman before housley’s time there. 

He has been pretty widely credited with their development -

 

 

https://sports.yahoo.com/news/phil-housley-coaches-offense-predators-defense-152520840.html

 

 

2 of those defenseman were not 1st round picks. One was a 2nd rounder. The other was a 4th rounder. They were by no means sure things when drafted, and Housley worked with them longer than any other coach has. Trotz wasn’t with some of those defenseman for more than 1 full season. Ekholm played 3 games for Trotz before Housley got there. Ellis played about 60 games. Even Josi had only played 2 50 game seasons before Housley got there. 

 

Housley was with them for 4 full seasons and was there in the early stages of some of their development. 

 

Plus, Every Nashville defenseman raves about housley and many credited him for their development as players. Even Shea Weber and PK Subban, both experienced vets when housley worked with them, raved about Housley and called him one of the best and/or most knowledgeable coaches they had. 

 

Heres a quote from PK Subban -

 

 

https://www.nhl.com/news/coach-phil-housley-shaped-nashville-predators-defense/c-289275342

 

and Ellis -

 

 

 

And this -

 

 

 

 

There are plenty more articles out there with high praise for the job Housley did in Nashville, and plenty more player quotes raving about him.

 

His development of the nashville blue line was a huge reason he became such a hot coaching candidate, and why he was considered the hottest coaching candidate on the market the year buffalo hired him. 

 

 

 

This guy sounds great.  Let's get him!  Get er done, Jason!

[BillsFan4]

 

17 hours ago, K-9 said:

Then my question is, what the hell happened to Housley between Nashville and Buffalo? Because his defensive genius isn’t manifesting very much here. 

 

It’s great that the Preds defenders praise him. But I think it’s nothing much more than players hyping their coach. They were already a talented group. Jossi and Subban, especially. 

 

Housley gets no credit from me until he proves himself here. None. 

 

Subban was obviously well established by the time he was traded to Nashville (yet still credits housley for helping him with his game).

 

But as I mentioned before, Josi had only played two 1/2 seasons before housley got there (50 games in 2011/12 and 48 games in 2012/13) and had yet to establish himself as an elite talent. 

 

Housley then spent the next 4 years (over 300 games) with Josi, where in that time he got better every single year, and in every single statistical category (fancy stats included), and developed into a Norris level defender.

He spent more time with Josi than any other coach. If Housley doesn’t get credit, who does? 

 

Same with Ellis and Ekholm - 3/4ths of Nashville’s top 4. 

 

And Seth Jones was coming along very nicely under Housley, too. 

 

I’ve also heard Peter Laviolette, David Poile and Roman Josi himself (among others) credit Housley with his (Josi’s) development. 

 

 

 

 

And the praise he got for his work in Nashville came from a lot more than just the players themselves.

Poile, Laviolette, every beat reporter that covered the team, hockey people from around the NHL, national media, analysts etc etc.  I mean, Basically everyone credits him for the development of Nashville’s defense corps. 

 

 

 

His time in Nashville as an assistant coach is completely separate from his time here in Buffalo as a head coach. You can judge the two separately. 

He could have done (and in reality, Did do) an excellent job there and still do a bad job here. 

 

We see it all the time, where a guy is among the best assistant coaches yet fails as a head coach. That doesn’t mean that they were suddenly no longer a good assistant coach before becoming a head coach..... 

You can’t go back and erase his time and work in Nashville because of his time in Buffalo. 

 

 

Anyway, I realize that you are not going to change your mind on anything related to housley so I will just let this conversation end here. 

 

[plenzmd1]

22 hours ago, JohnC said:

The recipe for a win is having Plezmd play ping pong instead of watching the game. That dour guy is a freaking jinx!  Don't tell him that the Sabres play tomorrow against a good but struggling Winnipeg because I want to increase the team's chances for success. 

 

This team is still a work in progress but when it gets secondary scoring their chances for success go exponentially up. Sheary is playing well and Mitts is steadily getting better. My MVP is Reinhart because he elevated a deflated second line. And that was desperately needed. 

Just finished up my nap, went to grab a beer for the game, and whadya know, they have dogs running obstacles courses on Fox. Way more entertaining than the Sabres. 

 

Get to game later, if At all!

[JohnC]

8 minutes ago, BillsFan4 said:

 

 

 

 

Anyway, I realize that you are not going to change your mind on anything related to housley so I will just let this conversation end here. 

 

If you think the Housley critics are in a state of frothy anger now wait until next year when he is still behind the bench. Housley is presiding over a fringe playoff team with a lot of young players when the season started. He has that caliber of team competing on the fringe of the wild-card spot. That is to say that he has them performing up to their talent level. So essentially he has them playing to their talent level and for that the majority of voices are condemning him as an abject failure. I simply don't get it. 

[JohnC]

Just now, plenzmd1 said:

Just finished up my nap, went to grab a beer for the game, and whadya know, they have dogs running obstacles courses on Fox. Way more entertaining than the Sabres. 

 

Get to game later, if At all!

I'm rooting for you to not witness the game. There is nothing personal. But it has become abundantly clear that you are a jinx. When you watch the games your contaminating mojo spills onto the team. If playing ping pong and having your snickering brother-in-law hustle the chump out of his wallet is what it takes for Sabre success then I encourage you to keep whacking at that little white ball. 

[BillsFan4]

 

 

about time! Can’t believe it took this long... 

 

Somewhat Surprising that the GM is naming himself interim coach though. He must want and up close look at what the problems are. Obviously they have more issues than just coaching...

[Misterbluesky]

Jack has to tie that guy up...lazy.

[K-9]

Something, something played hard. 

 

Something, something, we competed. 

 

Something, something gotta learn how to hold leads. 

 

But the effort is there! 

 

We can insert any sorry cliche of an excuse about to be offered up in defense of this team. 

 

Too many fans confuse effort with results. And the results were that we still couldn't win two games in a row since October, the fluky streak excluded. 

 

Fringe playoff team my ass. 

43 minutes ago, Misterbluesky said:

Jack has to tie that guy up...lazy.

^This. He's not right and hasn't been for a while now. But still, that was a lazy play. Granted it was at the end of a long shift of being totally dominated in their own zone, but the captain has to sell out there. 

[K-9]

3 hours ago, BillsFan4 said:

 

 

Subban was obviously well established by the time he was traded to Nashville (yet still credits housley for helping him with his game).

 

But as I mentioned before, Josi had only played two 1/2 seasons before housley got there (50 games in 2011/12 and 48 games in 2012/13) and had yet to establish himself as an elite talent. 

 

Housley then spent the next 4 years (over 300 games) with Josi, where in that time he got better every single year, and in every single statistical category (fancy stats included), and developed into a Norris level defender.

He spent more time with Josi than any other coach. If Housley doesn’t get credit, who does? 

 

Same with Ellis and Ekholm - 3/4ths of Nashville’s top 4. 

 

And Seth Jones was coming along very nicely under Housley, too. 

 

I’ve also heard Peter Laviolette, David Poile and Roman Josi himself (among others) credit Housley with his (Josi’s) development. 

 

 

 

 

And the praise he got for his work in Nashville came from a lot more than just the players themselves.

Poile, Laviolette, every beat reporter that covered the team, hockey people from around the NHL, national media, analysts etc etc.  I mean, Basically everyone credits him for the development of Nashville’s defense corps. 

 

 

 

His time in Nashville as an assistant coach is completely separate from his time here in Buffalo as a head coach. You can judge the two separately. 

He could have done (and in reality, Did do) an excellent job there and still do a bad job here. 

 

We see it all the time, where a guy is among the best assistant coaches yet fails as a head coach. That doesn’t mean that they were suddenly no longer a good assistant coach before becoming a head coach..... 

You can’t go back and erase his time and work in Nashville because of his time in Buffalo. 

 

 

Anyway, I realize that you are not going to change your mind on anything related to housley so I will just let this conversation end here. 

 

Don't misunderstand me here. I fully respect your position and appreciate the effort put forth in supporting it.

 

But nothing Housley did in Nashville as an assistant, nothing he did as a coach in the US system or in high school, nor anything he did is a player has shown him to be a quality NHL head coach. Nothing will show him to be a quality NHL head coach until he, as an NHL head coach, proves it. 

 

I'm still waiting for someone, anyone, to tell me why he's a good head coach. I need more than he's got them playing hard and competing with teams. MOST teams in the NHL play hard on a night to night basis. Playing hard is the bear minimum so he gets no credit for that from me. They played hard for Nolan and Bylsma, too. 

 

It's about results, period. So far, he's led us to the first 31st place finish in league history by coaching the same team to 16 points less than his predecessor and to being the fourth worst team this year outside of a glorious 10 game win streak. A good coach should be able to win two consecutive games since October by accident for crissakes (again, 10 game win streak excepted). 

 

Personnel decisions, in game adjustments, goalie rotation ( he may have finally gotten a clue there, hopefully), line combinations , etc., all point to nothing special. And worst of all, he seems to have a very selective process for holding players accountable for their performances. It's ludicrous that Scandella, Okposo, and Sobotka, for example haven't had to sit out a game for their poor play while others have. There is NO excuse for CJ Smith to be shown the press box the last couple games when he's played well and provided speed and tenacity on the ice. 

 

So, if anyone wishes to convince why Housley is the answer at head coach, I'm all ears. But I need more than anecdotal evidence to sway me. 

[plenzmd1]

^^^^^ @K-9 , don't you know silly they are coming from last place, ( lets not discuss the fact he coached em to last place)...and it's Buffalo so first, lower your expectations!..the plan and the process is sacred, wins and points are for neophytes who don't understand the modern game...the long game of making the playoffs when Jack is about to come off his 8 year deal is where the smart, patient fan lands. 

 

People who want them to make the playoffs ...uneducated.

 

Next year we will compete for a playoff spot as we bring the kids from Rochester up..(cant expect them to really make the playoffs in their first year), the year after we should expect an 8th place finish as the kids grow into their role...year after , well we lost some core players who just got too old, but the plan is in place..rinse , wash, repeat

[K-9]

6 minutes ago, plenzmd1 said:

^^^^^ @K-9 , don't you know silly they are coming from last place, ( lets not discuss the fact he coached em to last place)...and it's Buffalo so first, lower your expectations!..the plan and the process is sacred, wins and points are for neophytes who don't understand the modern game...the long game of making the playoffs when Jack is about to come off his 8 year deal is where the smart, patient fan lands. 

 

People who want them to make the playoffs ...uneducated.

 

Next year we will compete for a playoff spot as we bring the kids from Rochester up..(cant expect them to really make the playoffs in their first year), the year after we should expect an 8th place finish as the kids grow into their role...year after , well we lost some core players who just got too old, but the plan is in place..rinse , wash, repeat

I want so much to laugh at this, but the sad thing is, I think you're probably closer to the reality than not. 

 

Interesting theory about not wanting to make the playoffs. I wonder if Housley and Co. have assured the players that it's really not an essential goal this year because, you know, first we have to play meaningful games in February. Nothing prepares a young player better than being off the hook to compete for a playoff spot. Wouldn't want them to have that added pressure as they stay the course and develop. Never mind that this psychological "pass" has infected many of the players on this team for years now. "Don't worry boys. Just go out there and compete, play hard, show the fans you're in games and don't worry about the playoffs this year. You're young and need to develop good, fundamental habits like how to lose while competing hard." 

 

I say that in jest, but when look at the Girgensens, Ristos, Larssons, et al whose entire careers have been part of teams where nothing his expected because of the "stay the course until we're better" lowered expectations that were placed on them. I think we may need to purge a huge chunk of this team the more I think of that aspect of their "development" since they got here. 

[SinceThe70s]

I know it's not Sabres, but anyone catch the video of James Neal's teeth? 

 

https://nypost.com/2019/02/10/the-gross-moment-nhlers-teeth-come-flying-out/

 

 

 

 

[snafu]

3 hours ago, plenzmd1 said:

^^^^^ @K-9 , don't you know silly they are coming from last place, ( lets not discuss the fact he coached em to last place)...and it's Buffalo so first, lower your expectations!..the plan and the process is sacred, wins and points are for neophytes who don't understand the modern game...the long game of making the playoffs when Jack is about to come off his 8 year deal is where the smart, patient fan lands. 

 

People who want them to make the playoffs ...uneducated.

 

Next year we will compete for a playoff spot as we bring the kids from Rochester up..(cant expect them to really make the playoffs in their first year), the year after we should expect an 8th place finish as the kids grow into their role...year after , well we lost some core players who just got too old, but the plan is in place..rinse , wash, repeat

 

 

Woah woah woah, don’t get your hopes up with your three year projections.

 

[JohnC]

13 hours ago, plenzmd1 said:

^^^^^ @K-9 , don't you know silly they are coming from last place, ( lets not discuss the fact he coached em to last place)...and it's Buffalo so first, lower your expectations!..the plan and the process is sacred, wins and points are for neophytes who don't understand the modern game...the long game of making the playoffs when Jack is about to come off his 8 year deal is where the smart, patient fan lands. 

 

People who want them to make the playoffs ...uneducated.

 

Next year we will compete for a playoff spot as we bring the kids from Rochester up..(cant expect them to really make the playoffs in their first year), the year after we should expect an 8th place finish as the kids grow into their role...year after , well we lost some core players who just got too old, but the plan is in place..rinse , wash, repeat

The attached link by Harrington of the Buffalo News very well captures my thoughts.

 

https://buffalonews.com/2019/02/10/buffalo-sabres-nhl-jack-eichel-winnipeg-jets-blake-wheeler/

 

I only watched the first period. So I can't talk about what I observed after that period other than what was gathered from reports.  In that period I thought the Sabres played a Cup Contending team evenly or maybe slightly outplayed them. In the end they lost a closely contested game. That's certainly disappointing but it's not something that should stoke a depression or a spasmodic fit of rage. 

 

Hockey reporters like  Mike Harrington and Paul Hamilton have posed the hypothetical question that if before the season started and you were told that the Sabres would be contending for a wildcard playoff up to the end of the season would you consider that acceptable? Many of us would say yes and gladly accept this team getting better and moving up the ranks. Obviously, not everyone would accept that proposition, certainly not you and K-9. 

 

You and the angry others want this team to fire its coach and make deals to catapult this team upwards. Putting aside the coaching issue what deals would you propose that could alter our status this year? You don't think our GM, like every GM, isn't willing to make a deal if it would improve the team as long as it didn't hurt its future prospects? 

 

It seems that after every tormenting loss you become a raging bull that wants to cut loose and horn someone into a bloody battering. You desperately want this team to be better than the talent level of its current roster. It's not going to happen because this is the real world and not your fantasy world. 

 

I implore you to let the season play out before you go full bat shiiit crazy because of your unrealized grandiose expectations. As I see this season unfolding it is well within what I expected. So I'm reasonably satisfied. Your expectations have been demolished because they went beyond what they should have. That's the problem: It's you!

[Pete]

I think we all have some PTSD from the Bills and Sabre’s the last 50 years.  I understand why some are so frustrated.  And every year I have hope for Buffalo, and then another year of mediocrity.  The attrition takes it toll.  That being said- call me a sucker- I am still optimistic for both the sabres and Bills.  Both are young, exciting, and up and coming.  The Bills have been playing decent, with not much talent.  Well last year beane added over a half dozen talented players with the draft and FA.  10 picks and $80 in cap.  

 

The Sabres have 3 potential superstars with Skinner, Jack, and Dahlin.  Sam is pretty solid too.  Mittelstadt, Erod, Pilut, CJ -  that is a great young core.  3 first rounders, Rochester playing great hockey, the future is bright for Bills and Sabres!

[JohnC]

2 minutes ago, Pete said:

I think we all have some PTSD from the Bills and Sabre’s the last 50 years.  I understand why some are so frustrated.  And every year I have hope for Buffalo, and then another year of mediocrity.  The attrition takes it toll.  That being said- call me a sucker- I am still optimistic for both the sabres and Bills.  Both are young, exciting, and up and coming.  The Bills have been playing decent, with not much talent.  Well last year beane added over a half dozen talented players with the draft and FA.  10 picks and $80 in cap.  

 

The Sabres have 3 potential superstars with Skinner, Jack, and Dahlin.  Sam is pretty solid too.  Mittelstadt, Erod, Pilut, CJ -  that is a great young core.  3 first rounders, Rochester playing great hockey, the future is bright for Bills and Sabres!

Plezmd hates you! Watch your back. If he gets the chance he will shank you. Your positive attitude based on a longer perspective will not be tolerated in a room full of despair. 

[plenzmd1]

1 hour ago, JohnC said:

Plezmd hates you! Watch your back. If he gets the chance he will shank you. Your positive attitude based on a longer perspective will not be tolerated in a room full of despair. 

I don't hate anybody, I  hate the acceptance that Buffalo teams have to suck. It's something that seems to have crept into the collective psyche of the Buffalo fan base. Maybe I, and others like me that advocated hard for the tank, have to bear some of the responsibility. 

 

Sabres did play okay yesterday..but we base it off how awful they played the preceding 2 months. And i think just the opposite fo being negative on t he team and players, I thnk the players are capable of competing, its the coach who is not!

 

And BTW, 26 might need to catch his breath here..his mistakes really seem to be growing...not quite sure what the right course of action is..reduced minutes???

 

Did anybody see how Nelson did this week? Strange as it sounds, I think we get better when he gets back

[K-9]

2 minutes ago, plenzmd1 said:

I don't hate anybody, I  hate the acceptance that Buffalo teams have to suck. It's something that seems to have crept into the collective psyche of the Buffalo fan base. Maybe I, and others like me that advocated hard for the tank, have to bear some of the responsibility. 

 

Sabres did play okay yesterday..but we base it off how awful they played the preceding 2 months. And i think just the opposite fo being negative on t he team and players, I thnk the players are capable of competing, its the coach who is not!

 

And BTW, 26 might need to catch his breath here..his mistakes really seem to be growing...not quite sure what the right course of action is..reduced minutes???

 

Did anybody see how Nelson did this week? Strange as it sounds, I think we get better when he gets back

Agree. We really need that RHD back there. There were several times in the game yesterday when having a LHD on the right was a disadvantage in the offensive zone. It just takes too long for him to get the puck on his forehand to make a better play or to shoot the puck towards the net. 

 

The rest of the debate is futile. When Housley has a team of all stars people will finally be able to tell me why he’s a good coach. In the mean time, I’m not confusing effort with results. 

 

And Harrington and Hamilton are full of crap, imo. The Sabres have SQUANDERED a prime playoff position and I’m supposed to take solace in how far they’ve fallen because they aren’t mathematically eliminated yet? I’m supposed to be encouraged after this historic fall? Why, because they’ve been pathetic for so long that even though we gave it all back, we are STILL better than last year at this time?

 

Pardon me if I can’t accept that particular brand of loser mentality. 

[K-9]

5 hours ago, plenzmd1 said:

I don't hate anybody, I  hate the acceptance that Buffalo teams have to suck. It's something that seems to have crept into the collective psyche of the Buffalo fan base. Maybe I, and others like me that advocated hard for the tank, have to bear some of the responsibility. 

 

Sabres did play okay yesterday..but we base it off how awful they played the preceding 2 months. And i think just the opposite fo being negative on t he team and players, I thnk the players are capable of competing, its the coach who is not!

 

And BTW, 26 might need to catch his breath here..his mistakes really seem to be growing...not quite sure what the right course of action is..reduced minutes???

 

Did anybody see how Nelson did this week? Strange as it sounds, I think we get better when he gets back

Somehow missed this earlier. I would not be opposed to Dahlin spending a game or two in the box. Two big mistakes yesterday directly led to the Jets' first two goals. 

 

My only concern with sitting him is he wouldn't be on the ice to make the handful of sublime little plays he makes every game. He drives play and we just don't have enough of those guys to spare. Maybe we are just going to have to live with his mistakes. I'd feel the same way about Scandella if he was worth a damn to our offensive output. 

[bbb]

Shouldn't he also have stopped the puck from getting out of the zone on the third open net goal?  (Or maybe I have my plays and games confused)

[snafu]

1 hour ago, bbb said:

Shouldn't he also have stopped the puck from getting out of the zone on the third open net goal?  (Or maybe I have my plays and games confused)

 

It’s not a great season when you’re getting empty net goals against mixed up. 

[JohnC]

10 hours ago, plenzmd1 said:

I don't hate anybody, I  hate the acceptance that Buffalo teams have to suck. It's something that seems to have crept into the collective psyche of the Buffalo fan base. Maybe I, and others like me that advocated hard for the tank, have to bear some of the responsibility. 

 

Sabres did play okay yesterday..but we base it off how awful they played the preceding 2 months. And i think just the opposite fo being negative on t he team and players, I thnk the players are capable of competing, its the coach who is not!

 

And BTW, 26 might need to catch his breath here..his mistakes really seem to be growing...not quite sure what the right course of action is..reduced minutes???

 

Did anybody see how Nelson did this week? Strange as it sounds, I think we get better when he gets back

Unless the talented Swede is hurt or fatigued he should continue to play. Rookies are going to make their share of mistakes. That's part of the learning process. Sometimes when he is struggling in a game some minutes can be distributed to other blueliners. But I wouldn't sit him.

 

Your belief that there is  an acceptance that the Buffalo teams have to suck is ridiculous. Where the heck is that foolishness coming from? Against Winnipeg the Sabres played a cup contending team evenly. The hard fought game had a playoff feel to it. We lost. As a measuring stick game it demonstrated that this team is not far from being a very competitive team. We are not there yet but this team is progressing. You might not be able to see it because you are too invested in your negative position. But from what I have seen this team with a roster full of young players is coming along.

 

What I can comfortably say is that the Sabres are substantially ahead of the Bills in assembling a contending roster.  You are starting to act like a broken old man sitting at the end of the bar by yourself speaking to no one in particular lamenting how downtrodden you are because your team ain't what you want it to be. Please stop this maudlin act. Before you throw in the towel let the season play out. 

[K-9]

Hmmm.

[EmotionallyUnstable]

No surprises here. Same issues since the break. We need more talented players and can no longer recover from the careless errors in our own defensive zone. 

 

I kind of find it similar to last years bills’ defense. They kept falling into turnovers and an unsustainable rate. 

 

Heres to hoping JB makes a move to improve this roster NOW. I for one, am tired of hearing about the future that seems to never come. 

[plenzmd1]

@K-9, the o my question is will @JohnC ever be able to recognize coaching blunders like the Sobitka article by Yost. 

 

When di do we start the trade Skinner debate. I think I am am almost there. Negoatiate a deal now, say 8 for $9 with a handshake deal that we gunna trade you, get a haul , and be better when you sign July 1 for 8 and $9.5. 

 

He gets an  extra $4m ( paid in signing bonus BTW), Sabres prolly get a decent 2C prospect and a # 1,,. Both sides win. 

[JohnC]

28 minutes ago, plenzmd1 said:

@K-9, the o my question is will @JohnC ever be able to recognize coaching blunders like the Sobitka article by Yost. 

 

When di do we start the trade Skinner debate. I think I am am almost there. Negoatiate a deal now, say 8 for $9 with a handshake deal that we gunna trade you, get a haul , and be better when you sign July 1 for 8 and $9.5. 

 

He gets an  extra $4m ( paid in signing bonus BTW), Sabres prolly get a decent 2C prospect and a # 1,,. Both sides win. 

Wow! Your exotic mind is spinning out of control. If you really believe that a wink and a nod deal with Skinner is going to work bringing us an extra haul then my recommendation to you is to lower your LSD dosages. Think about how crazy and fanciful your surreptitious deal is. Do you honestly believe that a team would trade for Skinner without contractual assurances that he would remain with the team?

 

With respect to the highlighted segment I can assure you that you are not there but rather you are far out there! You are in plain view precipitously declining. Seek help. Don't run to K-9 for help because he is your enabler. 

 

 

[plenzmd1]

3 minutes ago, JohnC said:

Wow! Your exotic mind is spinning out of control. If you really believe that a wink and a nod deal with Skinner is going to work bringing us an extra haul then my recommendation to you is to lower your LSD dosages. Think about how crazy and fanciful your surreptitious deal is. Do you honestly believe that a team would trade for Skinner without contractual assurances that he would remain with the team?

 

With respect to the highlighted segment I can assure you that you are not there but rather you are far out there! You are in plain view precipitously declining. Seek help. Don't run to K-9 for help because he is your enabler. 

 

 

#1) Defend your boy Housley on his utilization of a forward who has not scored in 35 games..most minutes on team outside top 3.

 

2) If Skinner ain't signing before the trade deadline, damn well better get something for him. 

[shrader]

This Sam and Diane thing you guys have going on right now is getting to be a bit strange.  I'll let you two figure out which one you are.

[JohnC]

29 minutes ago, plenzmd1 said:

#1) Defend your boy Housley on his utilization of a forward who has not scored in 35 games..most minutes on team outside top 3.

 

2) If Skinner ain't signing before the trade deadline, damn well better get something for him. 

Every thing I have heard is that contract discussions are underway and progressing. 

[K-9]

24 minutes ago, JohnC said:

Wow! Your exotic mind is spinning out of control. If you really believe that a wink and a nod deal with Skinner is going to work bringing us an extra haul then my recommendation to you is to lower your LSD dosages. Think about how crazy and fanciful your surreptitious deal is. Do you honestly believe that a team would trade for Skinner without contractual assurances that he would remain with the team?

 

With respect to the highlighted segment I can assure you that you are not there but rather you are far out there! You are in plain view precipitously declining. Seek help. Don't run to K-9 for help because he is your enabler. 

 

 

Why do you think the term “rental” is tossed around so much in discussions involved in hockey trades? Teams trade for pending free agent players all the time without assurances from those players that they’ll remain with their new teams. 

 

To answer your question as to what team would be willing to trade for Skinner, that would be any team that thinks obtaining a left wing who is also the second leading goal scorer in the league might be the difference in making a serious cup run in the playoffs. I submit that list of teams is not a short one.

 

 

[JohnC]

1 minute ago, K-9 said:

Why do you think the term “rental” is tossed around so much in discussions involved in hockey trades? Teams trade for pending free agent players all the time without assurances from those players that they’ll remain with their new teams. 

 

To answer your question as to what team would be willing to trade for Skinner, that would be any team that thinks obtaining a left wing who is also the second leading goal scorer in the league might be the difference in making a serious cup run in the playoffs. I submit that list of teams is not a short one.

 

 

See my response to Plezmd. 

[K-9]

38 minutes ago, plenzmd1 said:

#1) Defend your boy Housley on his utilization of a forward who has not scored in 35 games..most minutes on team outside top 3.

 

2) If Skinner ain't signing before the trade deadline, damn well better get something for him. 

Does Skinner still have a no movement clause? I think that may complicate potential trades if he does. I was glad he had a no trade clause with Carolina because they would have traded him to the Kings last summer instead of us. 

6 minutes ago, JohnC said:

See my response to Plezmd. 

I did, which is why I asked the question.

 

EDIT: I think you mean your last response to Plenz? I’m glad they are negotiating with Skinner, but that doesn’t preclude a potential trade of him. 

13 minutes ago, shrader said:

This Sam and Diane thing you guys have going on right now is getting to be a bit strange.  I'll let you two figure out which one you are.

More like a Cliff and Norm thing. I’ll leave it up to you to figure out who is wearing the milk bone underwear.

Edited February 12, 2019 by K-9

[plenzmd1]

10 minutes ago, shrader said:

This Sam and Diane thing you guys have going on right now is getting to be a bit strange.  I'll let you two figure out which one you are.

agreed and heard..

 

BTW, maybe Malkin gets 5? Has it been announced if in person or not? My quick search just found "hearing"