Just remember this team finished very strong after getting humiliated in 3 straight games last yr

[row_33]

9 minutes ago, oldmanfan said:

I would hope the players have a sense of pride and will refuse to get beat down like that again.  If I were say Kyle and I see Benjamin give the kind of half hearted effort he did last week, I'd kick his ass in right on the sideline 

 

i'll be cheering you on as you get stomped and tased

 

[No_Matter_What]

I am a fan from Europe, long time lurker and this thread made me finally register.

 

I wanted to state the very same thing as OP. I know it happens on each forum all the time but the level of overreaction on TBD never stops to surprise me.

 

We lost 3 consecutive games last year in brutal fashion, and we still MADE PLAYOFFS with a team very similar to this one. And yet people seem to think that now Bills are almost lock for 1st overall draft pick after W1. That is just insane. You may argue that Davis is not Gaines, OL is considerably weaker, Allen is unknown and so on, but the fact remains that HC, DC and majority of team core (roughly 15/16 starters) is the same as last year, and there still many positions which may in fact turn out to be improved - Allen, Edmunds, Phillips, Lotulelei, T. Murphy and especially RB2 which was nonexistent last year.

 

I don't pretend having a crystal ball, and it is fairly possible (esp. if Allen will struggle) that Bills go something like 2-14 but at this point I do not see any reason to think that we will not be at least 7-9 team.

[Pine Barrens Mafia]

4 minutes ago, No_Matter_What said:

I am a fan from Europe, long time lurker and this thread made me finally register.

 

I wanted to state the very same thing as OP. I know it happens on each forum all the time but the level of overreaction on TBD never stops to surprise me.

 

We lost 3 consecutive games last year in brutal fashion, and we still MADE PLAYOFFS with a team very similar to this one. And yet people seem to think that now Bills are almost lock for 1st overall draft pick after W1. That is just insane. You may argue that Davis is not Gaines, OL is considerably weaker, Allen is unknown and so on, but the fact remains that HC, DC and majority of team core (roughly 15/16 starters) is the same as last year, and there still many positions which may in fact turn out to be improved - Allen, Edmunds, Phillips, Lotulelei, T. Murphy and especially RB2 which was nonexistent last year.

 

I don't pretend having a crystal ball, and it is fairly possible (esp. if Allen will struggle) that Bills go something like 2-14 but at this point I do not see any reason to think that we will not be at least 7-9 team.

 

Hey, welcome! Don't be a stranger!

 

[JerseyBills]

1 hour ago, Steptide said:

I've been good about not over reacting after Sundays loss. We've seen this many times before. If we win Sunday, half the posts here will be about how Allen is the next Brady and we're gonna win 10 games this year. It's just how it goes. We win, we're awesome, we lose and we're the worst in the NFL 

Exactly , this was my main point. I don't think I've seen it this bad on here. I watched week 1 , yes it was ugly, I personally attribute alot of that to Peterman , who seems to be a classic QB who looks good in practice but is absolutely atrocious in a real game. 

 

Just the energy Allen brought to the offense and sidelines was an improvement , you can see it in the offense and  even seems like it spreaded throughout the team. 

 

But ya , I guess it's just the social media era and the instant reactions and million of hot takes out there , the truth is we won't know who the real big dogs of the NFL are for another month or so . 

 

Shoot, Even if we lose and Allen looks good , the whole tone of the board will change and the 0-16, 1st pick in the draft posts will slip into oblivion

[Protocal69]

1 hour ago, thurst44 said:

Chargers also lost and had their own issues (admittedly not as profound), so maybe, maybe not.

While admittedly you could say the OP is cherry picking, you are cherry picking even more ridiculously. If you're taking out the Jacksonville game, then I'm taking out the Patriots games -- besides, in one of those games, the Pats actually scored fewer points than their 2018 average. And then, there you have it, the "illuminating claim" that the Bills played poorly in the 3-game stretch and last week, which is part of the original point. 

I listed the jags playoff game as you can read. No matter how how you slice it bro it's bad. Did you read those pts against totals. That my friend is a trend.

 

I'm usually the glass half full guy but even I have to admit it's looking bad

[billsfan1959]

22 minutes ago, driddles said:

I thought these were the last 6 games of 2017?  minus the playoff game...  did I forget my meds?

 

12	November 26	at Kansas City Chiefs	W 16–10	6–5	Arrowhead Stadium	Recap
13	December 3	New England Patriots	L 3–23	6–6	New Era Field	Recap
14	December 10	Indianapolis Colts	W 13–7 (OT)	7–6	New Era Field	Recap
15	December 17	Miami Dolphins	W 24–16	8–6	New Era Field	Recap
16	December 24	at New England Patriots	L 16–37	8–7	Gillette Stadium	Recap
17	December 31	at Miami Dolphins	W 22–16	9–7	Hard Rock Stadium	Recap

Shhhhhh.… We try to never let facts get in the way of a good rant around here

[JerseyBills]

11 minutes ago, No_Matter_What said:

I am a fan from Europe, long time lurker and this thread made me finally register.

 

I wanted to state the very same thing as OP. I know it happens on each forum all the time but the level of overreaction on TBD never stops to surprise me.

 

We lost 3 consecutive games last year in brutal fashion, and we still MADE PLAYOFFS with a team very similar to this one. And yet people seem to think that now Bills are almost lock for 1st overall draft pick after W1. That is just insane. You may argue that Davis is not Gaines, OL is considerably weaker, Allen is unknown and so on, but the fact remains that HC, DC and majority of team core (roughly 15/16 starters) is the same as last year, and there still many positions which may in fact turn out to be improved - Allen, Edmunds, Phillips, Lotulelei, T. Murphy and especially RB2 which was nonexistent last year.

 

I don't pretend having a crystal ball, and it is fairly possible (esp. if Allen will struggle) that Bills go something like 2-14 but at this point I do not see any reason to think that we will not be at least 7-9 team.

Welcome. I like your way of thinking! Glad you finally signed up!! I agree with your points to the tee. The overreacting is reaching outrageous levels , this team deserves better from the fans.

[thurst44]

4 minutes ago, SouthNYfan said:

 

I don't think it's manipulative at all

I really think it just shows that we were an average at best defense, and a circus at worst.

I myself thought we would be better this year on defense, but it really doesn't look like it.

I was worried about depth at cb after Tre, at linebacker, and on dline, and it looks to be well warranted.

Wasn't trying to be a jerk either.

I think we are all a little testy after that beating Sunday 

The OP's point was to after the three game dive, a stretch during which we were 4-2 with the two losses being to the Patriots in which our defense gave up the same amount of points every team does to the Patriots. 

 

Let's look game-by-game of this 7-game stretch after the last Peterman debacle when most everyone said the team was done for:

KC: 2017 Offensive Avg Pts: 25.6, Our D allowed 10

NE: 2017 Avg: 28.9, Our Def: 23

Ind: 2017 Avg: 16.4. Our Def: 7 (admittedly, snow game)

Mia: 2017 Avg: 17.6, Our Def: 16

NE: 2017 Avg: 28.9, Our Def: 37

Mia: 2017 Avg: 17.6, Our Def: 16

Jac: 2017 Avg: 25.9, Our Def: 10 (scored 45 pts the following week and their exalted defense gave up more than we did week 13 to NE in championship game)

 

I'd say in that seven-game stretch, the defense rebounded pretty well, and while not the dominant D they were at the beginning of the season, and trading the largest guy on said defense probably did not help (and, no, Star has not done anything to prove he's improved the team), but they were a little above average while being on the field a lot. That was the point of the OP. 

 

And, yes, testy, Sunday sucked and does not bode well for this Sunday, but Allen starts and things can change. We'll see.

[JerseyBills]

2 minutes ago, Protocal69 said:

I listed the jags playoff game as you can read. No matter how how you slice it bro it's bad. Did you read those pts against totals. That my friend is a trend.

 

I'm usually the glass half full guy but even I have to admit it's looking bad

You didn't list week 12,14,15,17 .. Including Jax, So the final 7 games ,the Bills gave up 23 (to the Pats)and 30+.. The 5 other games were under 20! I guess it's a positive trend...

[thurst44]

26 minutes ago, 26CornerBlitz said:

 

None of this has anything to do with the 2018 Buffalo Bills. 

Yes it does in that applies to all teams. They may look bad last week. They may improve next week. People said many similar hopeless things. To imply that these 2018 Buffalo Bills are immune and clearly irredeemable (not that you are doing that, but many are) is to ignore history for the sake of basking in negativity or to play a game of negative oneupmanship.

 

I'm pretty sure we are saying essentially the same thing (and i'm pretty sure the op is too): we don't truly know what will happen next week.  

[oldmanfan]

25 minutes ago, row_33 said:

 

i'll be cheering you on as you get stomped and tased

 

I said if I were Kyle.  There's not a policeman in WNY that would taze Kyle!

[SouthNYfan]

4 minutes ago, thurst44 said:

The OP's point was to after the three game dive, a stretch during which we were 4-2 with the two losses being to the Patriots in which our defense gave up the same amount of points every team does to the Patriots. 

 

Let's look game-by-game of this 7-game stretch after the last Peterman debacle when most everyone said the team was done for:

KC: 2017 Offensive Avg Pts: 25.6, Our D allowed 10

NE: 2017 Avg: 28.9, Our Def: 23

Ind: 2017 Avg: 16.4. Our Def: 7 (admittedly, snow game)

Mia: 2017 Avg: 17.6, Our Def: 16

NE: 2017 Avg: 28.9, Our Def: 37

Mia: 2017 Avg: 17.6, Our Def: 16

Jac: 2017 Avg: 25.9, Our Def: 10 (scored 45 pts the following week and their exalted defense gave up more than we did week 13 to NE in championship game)

 

I'd say in that seven-game stretch, the defense rebounded pretty well, and while not the dominant D they were at the beginning of the season, and trading the largest guy on said defense probably did not help (and, no, Star has not done anything to prove he's improved the team), but they were a little above average while being on the field a lot. That was the point of the OP. 

 

And, yes, testy, Sunday sucked and does not bode well for this Sunday, but Allen starts and things can change. We'll see.

 

I'm happy about Allen.

I'll say for the Jax game that they were really streaky all year too.

They also dominated Pittsburgh every game I believe so that's just a team that they rocked.

The kc game they were in a nose dive when we played them so that is kind of an anomaly too.

 

Again I think we were average overall on defense last year, but very up and down game to game, no consistency.

If that holds true maybe we will be better this week since we had our pants around our ankles last week.

[thurst44]

10 minutes ago, Protocal69 said:

I listed the jags playoff game as you can read. No matter how how you slice it bro it's bad. Did you read those pts against totals. That my friend is a trend.

 

I'm usually the glass half full guy but even I have to admit it's looking bad

I went through the seven-game stretch that the OP was referring to with points and it doesn't look quite as bad, even the Patriots games. Yes, we did terribly on Sunday and in that 3-game stretch. Our defense held the opponents to fewer than each team's average in 6 out of the 7 games in between (and, yes, 26, this is not the "same team," but in that case there is no trend and we'll see how they react to an embarrassing loss with the new and exciting, but inexperienced QB at the helm).

[Protocal69]

5 minutes ago, JerseyBills said:

You didn't list week 12,14,15,17 .. Including Jax, So the final 7 games ,the Bills gave up 23 (to the Pats)and 30+.. The 5 other games were under 20! I guess it's a positive trend...

My point was to make when we lose , we lose bad. It was to also point out that we have a losing record over that time 

 

We made the playoffs because we lucked up and played the dolphins 2 twice caught KC when they was on the skid and beat the colts in  the snow where the game winning td had to be overturned. 

 

I'm happy we made the playoffs but for us to have a defensive minded head coach we cant be giving NBA half time scores to ANYTEAM anytime

[26CornerBlitz]

15 minutes ago, thurst44 said:

Yes it does in that applies to all teams. They may look bad last week. They may improve next week. People said many similar hopeless things. To imply that these 2018 Buffalo Bills are immune and clearly irredeemable (not that you are doing that, but many are) is to ignore history for the sake of basking in negativity or to play a game of negative oneupmanship.

 

I'm pretty sure we are saying essentially the same thing (and i'm pretty sure the op is too): we don't truly know what will happen next week.  

 

We certainly don't know and this year's Buffalo team will determine their own results to the best of their collective abilities independent of any other year or team in the past.

Edited September 13, 2018 by 26CornerBlitz

[row_33]

14 minutes ago, oldmanfan said:

I said if I were Kyle.  There's not a policeman in WNY that would taze Kyle!

 

 

has a spectator ever attacked a player on the bench?

 

i remember Red Sox fans went into the Yankees bullpen and got stomped real bad awhile back

 

and a Flyers fan fell into the penalty box with Tie Domi, an unwise move after taunting him

 

 

 

9 minutes ago, Protocal69 said:

My point was to make when we lose , we lose bad. It was to also point out that we have a losing record over that time 

 

We made the playoffs because we lucked up and played the dolphins 2 twice caught KC when they was on the skid and beat the colts in  the snow where the game winning td had to be overturned. 

 

I'm happy we made the playoffs but for us to have a defensive minded head coach we cant be giving NBA half time scores to ANYTEAM anytime

 

it was good to make the playoffs, but it didn't mean the square root of sweet eff all going forward

 

 

[oldmanfan]

2 minutes ago, row_33 said:

 

 

has a spectator ever attacked a player on the bench?

 

i remember Red Sox fans went into the Yankees bullpen and got stomped real bad awhile back

 

and a Flyers fan fell into the penalty box with Tie Domi, an unwise move after taunting him

 

 

 

 

it was good to make the playoffs, but it didn't mean the square root of sweet eff all going forward

 

 

Let's try again.  If I were Kyle Williams, DT of the Buffalo Bills, and my teammate was dogging it again I would kick his ass right on the sideline.

[billsfan1959]

1 hour ago, joesixpack said:

 

Because they're doing an actual rebuild.

 

Right. Last year was about getting rid of players that didn't fit their vision and salaries that they believed were not warranted or were detrimental in building the team they want. This year was about finding their franchise QB, eating the dead cap money, and filling positional needs the best that they could. Next year is about adding more talent through the draft and free agency, building the foundation of a competitive team, and continue to build/remain competitive each year thereafter, primarily through the draft.  The team was very fortunate to make the playoffs last year and, anyone paying attention, should have been prepared for a team that will struggle this year.

 

Hopefully, they are successful. If not, we will be starting over once again in 2020/2021. I do think they will be more competitive this year than they showed in their opener; however, I am under no illusions about how good this team will be. Personally, I will be happy if Allen demonstrates growth and and franchise QB potential to begin building around next year.

 

[Hapless Bills Fan]

2 hours ago, Kirby Jackson said:

I happen to think that the Bills will be competitive this week. They won’t roll over after that embarrassment. With that being said they aren’t going to win a lot.

 

It really depends upon the coaches and how flexible and educable they are.

 

After watching all-22 myself, focusing on offense, I believe our OL struggles had a lot to do with scheme.  The OL struggles badly when they are asked to perform blocking schemes with motion, especially with crossing motion - left guard moving right as to pull, center and right guard moving left.  These guys simply aren't quick and nimble enough to get where they're going and get into a leverage stance, especially with Groy doing a head-bob tell like a freakin' metronome that let the DL get a half-step jump on the snap.

 

Daboll started the game employing these blocking schemes as part of his pass plays, presumably to "sell" the play fakes.  The result was usually that a DLman  was in Peterman's lap before he had a chance to look up from the fake handoff.

 

It also seemed like at times, the OL were totally confused about their blocking responsibilities with one or two guys standing around blocking no one, and other guys overwhelmed.  If football is a chess match, Daboll got whupped.

 

If Daboll ditches that fancy-pants crap (that I agree a pro OL should ideally be able to do, but ours can't) and focuses on a simplified scheme which lets everyone figure out who they're supposed to man-handle, maybe simplifies the playbook and makes sure each play gets learned well - I believe we will have a better chance and they will keep Allen cleaner.

 

The problem is that coaches usually get tied up in their ego, and blame the players in their mind (whatever they say in pressers) instead of just looking objectively at the film and saying "OK, we are doing that well, we are doing this poorly, let's focus on that and not this"

[row_33]

17 minutes ago, oldmanfan said:

Let's try again.  If I were Kyle Williams, DT of the Buffalo Bills, and my teammate was dogging it again I would kick his ass right on the sideline.

 

you should know how i don't really care about YOUR original content if it doesn't fit my narrative

 

BY NOW.....