DCOrange Posted February 23, 2018 Share Posted February 23, 2018 I don't necessarily agree with all the takes in here, but it's always interesting to read this stuff IMO: http://bleacherreport.com/articles/2760902-matt-millers-scouting-notebook-scouts-latest-takes-comparisons-for-top-qbs?share=twitter 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pine Barrens Mafia Posted February 23, 2018 Share Posted February 23, 2018 Note the Lamar Jackson quotes. Yup. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Canadian Bills Fan Posted February 23, 2018 Share Posted February 23, 2018 I saw "Bleacher Report" in the link so I didn't even need to click on it 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
26CornerBlitz Posted February 23, 2018 Share Posted February 23, 2018 (edited) 1 minute ago, Canadian Bills Fan said: I saw "Bleacher Report" in the link so I didn't even need to click on it Matt Miller is a good analyst/writer and so is Tyler Dunne. Bleacher Report has come a long long way since its inception. Edited February 23, 2018 by 26CornerBlitz 9 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jr1 Posted February 23, 2018 Share Posted February 23, 2018 Rivers' completion percentage in college was 63.6, comparing Allen to him is embarrassing 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Canadian Bills Fan Posted February 23, 2018 Share Posted February 23, 2018 2 minutes ago, 26CornerBlitz said: Matt Miller is a good analyst/writer and so is Tyler Dunne. Bleacher Report has come a long long way since its inception. Good to know. May have to start reading their articles again. I remember them all being about how many clicks they could get and how all their articles were different slides you had to click on Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
section122 Posted February 23, 2018 Share Posted February 23, 2018 Not saying it is right or wrong but I loved the irony of this: Scout's Quote: "Why does the league like him more than Twitter? Because we know what we're doing. Allen had nothing around him and people expect him to complete passes? To who?" vs. Scout's Quote: "And, by the way, he completed like 57 percent of his passes. There are a lot of question marks about this dude." 2 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jimmy10 Posted February 23, 2018 Share Posted February 23, 2018 Blind quotes? My guess is Matt Miller shares an agency with whoever came out of this report looking best. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
section122 Posted February 23, 2018 Share Posted February 23, 2018 Just now, Canadian Bills Fan said: Good to know. May have to start reading their articles again. I remember them all being about how many clicks they could get and how all their articles were different slides you had to click on That's Billswire now. Their content is really good but it is slide show presentation which is a non-starter for me. Bleacher report is much improved yet there is still a lot of nonsense to wade through. They can't be as easily dismissed as they once were though imo. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
26CornerBlitz Posted February 23, 2018 Share Posted February 23, 2018 (edited) 4 minutes ago, section122 said: That's Billswire now. Their content is really good but it is slide show presentation which is a non-starter for me. Bleacher report is much improved yet there is still a lot of nonsense to wade through. They can't be as easily dismissed as they once were though imo. It all depends on who authors a particular piece with their name on it. They have several good writers on board. Edited February 23, 2018 by 26CornerBlitz 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dave mcbride Posted February 23, 2018 Share Posted February 23, 2018 16 minutes ago, DCOrange said: I don't necessarily agree with all the takes in here, but it's always interesting to read this stuff IMO: http://bleacherreport.com/articles/2760902-matt-millers-scouting-notebook-scouts-latest-takes-comparisons-for-top-qbs?share=twitter Good stuff; thanks. The first Josh Allen quote was awesome. 4 minutes ago, Canadian Bills Fan said: Good to know. May have to start reading their articles again. I remember them all being about how many clicks they could get and how all their articles were different slides you had to click on Nah, that was 10 years ago. They're good now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jimmy10 Posted February 23, 2018 Share Posted February 23, 2018 Just now, 26CornerBlitz said: It all depends on who authors a particular piece with their name on it. They have several good writers on on board. So it’s still basically Wikipedia? A few people who know what they’re doing among all the “I CAN TYPING!” morons? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dave mcbride Posted February 23, 2018 Share Posted February 23, 2018 5 minutes ago, section122 said: Not saying it is right or wrong but I loved the irony of this: Scout's Quote: "Why does the league like him more than Twitter? Because we know what we're doing. Allen had nothing around him and people expect him to complete passes? To who?" vs. Scout's Quote: "And, by the way, he completed like 57 percent of his passes. There are a lot of question marks about this dude." Well, the second quote referred to Jackson, who had a lot better talent than Allen around him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
26CornerBlitz Posted February 23, 2018 Share Posted February 23, 2018 1 minute ago, jimmy10 said: So it’s still basically Wikipedia? A few people who know what they’re doing among all the “I CAN TYPING!” morons? No. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hapless Bills Fan Posted February 23, 2018 Share Posted February 23, 2018 (edited) 24 minutes ago, joesixpack said: Note the Lamar Jackson quotes. Yup. Jackson: "Is he smart enough to make pro reads? Has he ever gotten to his progressions from the pocket? Can he stay healthy with that frame and his style of play? And, by the way, he completed like 57 percent of his passes. There are a lot of question marks about this dude." Jackson may not succeed as a pro QB. What bothers me about these "hot takes: are: 1) as I understand it (and I take correction, as I am NOT a college football afficionado), it's a big question whether Darnold, Mayfield, and Rudolph can make pro reads or get to their progressions from the pocket because they are spread offense QB playing in a simplified system, while Louisville under Petrino runs, as I understand it, a pro offense and you can clearly see Jackson making progressions on film. So why don't those questions show up under Darnold, Mayfield, and Rudolph (and Falk)? 2) Allen: "Why does the league like him more than Twitter? Because we know what we're doing. Allen had nothing around him and people expect him to complete passes? To who?" Wouldn't the same caveat apply to Jackson? As far as I can tell, he had porridge for OLmen and WR whose play he elevated - the highest drop percent at 12%. So if Jackson's rising completions and passing yardage leave a lot of questions, wouldn't the same concern be true of Allen, whose completion percentage flatlined at 56% last 2 years? 3) Jackson has, in fact, stayed healthy in college with that frame and style of play, while Mr Poise in the Pocket Rosen has gotten injured multiple times. Do NFL teams want him to learn to slide? You Betcha. Do they want Allen to learn to be accurate? You Betcha. Which is easier? You tell me. I think there's truth that these quotes reflect the way teams see these kids, the same way that there's yeast in bread - it's there, but not very much of it. I think Miller chose the most polarizing, controversial quotes he could find to generate clicks. And I think jimmy10 has a point about agent influence - if not agent sharing, agents he wants to stay in good with because they dole him gouge. 14 minutes ago, 26CornerBlitz said: It all depends on who authors a particular piece with their name on it. They have several good writers on board. Dunne 11 minutes ago, dave mcbride said: Well, the second quote referred to Jackson, who had a lot better talent than Allen around him. Did he? Then why did his WR have the most drops (12%) vs Allen's (7 or 8% as I recall)? Did you watch his OL? Edited February 23, 2018 by Hapless Bills Fan 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dave mcbride Posted February 23, 2018 Share Posted February 23, 2018 4 minutes ago, Hapless Bills Fan said: Did he? Yes, flat out. Wyoming gets no one. http://gocards.com/news/2015/9/24/BB_0924154924.aspx Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DCOrange Posted February 23, 2018 Author Share Posted February 23, 2018 (edited) 34 minutes ago, dave mcbride said: Well, the second quote referred to Jackson, who had a lot better talent than Allen around him. Better, but I think the disparity between Lamar's supporting cast and his opponents versus Allen's actually makes Lamar's supporting cast relatively worse. Louisville was a god awful team offensively being propped up by Lamar while facing ACC competition. Wyoming was also a god awful team offensively (worse than Louisville) but the MWC competition isn't a lot better. I like both Lamar and Allen personally, but the excuses that scouts make for Allen while not affording the same excuses to Lamar is really stupid IMO. For example, Louisville WRs were roughly 2-3 times more likely to drop catchable passes than Wyoming WRs were this year. I think the NFL Comps for those two were way off too while the comparisons for the other 4 guys were all pretty good. Edited February 23, 2018 by DCOrange 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
C.Biscuit97 Posted February 23, 2018 Share Posted February 23, 2018 19 minutes ago, dave mcbride said: Yes, flat out. Wyoming gets no one. http://gocards.com/news/2015/9/24/BB_0924154924.aspx They also play against no one. And whenever they did, he was terrible. This happens every year. They completely over hype some prospect. McShay said Jevan Snead was a 2st rounder. He went undrafted and didn't last a season in the NFL. Allen would be interesting as a 2nd or 3rd rounder. But now, there is going to be insane pressure on him. Scouting qbs is the toughest job in sports. It's laughable how people try to be experts. But completion % is a huge tell. If you are inaccurate in college, it likely won't get better in the NFL. 57% is bad. In the Moutain West for a guy being guy talked up as #1 overall, it's awful. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hapless Bills Fan Posted February 23, 2018 Share Posted February 23, 2018 18 minutes ago, section122 said: Not saying it is right or wrong but I loved the irony of this: Scout's Quote: "Why does the league like him more than Twitter? Because we know what we're doing. Allen had nothing around him and people expect him to complete passes? To who?" vs. Scout's Quote: "And, by the way, he completed like 57 percent of his passes. There are a lot of question marks about this dude." I know, Right? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hapless Bills Fan Posted February 23, 2018 Share Posted February 23, 2018 19 minutes ago, C.Biscuit97 said: They also play against no one. And whenever they did, he was terrible. This happens every year. They completely over hype some prospect. McShay said Jevan Snead was a 2st rounder. He went undrafted and didn't last a season in the NFL. Allen would be interesting as a 2nd or 3rd rounder. But now, there is going to be insane pressure on him. Scouting qbs is the toughest job in sports. It's laughable how people try to be experts. But completion % is a huge tell. If you are inaccurate in college, it likely won't get better in the NFL. 57% is bad. In the Moutain West for a guy being guy talked up as #1 overall, it's awful. IMO, many NFL scouts (because, GMs they scout for) over-hype size and arm strength. Now I get it, other things being equal, a big guy is better than a small guy, and a strong arm is better than a meh arm - you can't coach size. But you probably can't (or can't easily) coach field vision and pocket awareness, either. They're just harder to evaluate objectively than size and arm strength. Accuracy is harder to assess, because so many things affect completion percentage (ball placement, receiver quality, pressure) but it's probably also not easy to coach, unless it stems from mechanics which can be adjusted 1 hour ago, dave mcbride said: Yes, flat out. Wyoming gets no one. http://gocards.com/news/2015/9/24/BB_0924154924.aspx The link above took me to info about their college baseball recruiting 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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