Who is your choice for Bills starting QB in 2018 and why?

[Hapless Bills Fan]

3 hours ago, White Linen said:

He might be the next great QB who the heck knows - but I'm not trading up and giving up multiple picks to draft a 5'11" QB with little bitty hands.  He might make it but I don't want to take the risk with him - it's a massive thing to overcome.  

 

So to the OP's question: who is your personal choice?

 

Mayfield at the combine measured 6' 3/8" and 9 1/2" hands.

Russ Wilson is 5'11", Drew Brees is 6'0".  Aaron Rodgers is 6'2".

[Augie]

2 hours ago, Logic said:

I'm fairly certain that doesn't make any sense. But I do like your avatar picture. Have a lovely day.

 

 

Wise choice. Play nice or he might sneak up behind you and snip your hamstring. You’ll never be the same....  

[Hapless Bills Fan]

8 minutes ago, KelsaysLunchbox said:

Fitzpatrick is more consistent than the Madden Curse. In the fact that every place he goes the starting QB misses long stretches of games lol.

 

I'd still want McCown as the #2 guy. From what I have read on him he has the making of an excellent QB coach in the opinion of many of his coaches. Iirc there was some interest in him becoming a coach if he couldn't latch on anywhere else last season.

 

I wouldn't be upset if Fitz came back. He's an E-P guy so he fits (ha..Fitz fits) but I think we could definitely do better.

 

Winston lucked out then, only missed 3 games.

 

I had the thought that Fitz might be a good mentor for someone like Rosen.  He's got the Harvard degree, the football acumen, and the Sudoku-playing chops to maybe get Rosen's attention that he knows something.  I found this quote when Fitz was interviewed after TB beat the Jets: " “Bryce’ll always be a dear friend for me, and I think he’s got so much potential,” he said. “When he came out of Baylor, he didn’t know a lot. And he didn’t know that, but he’s learned a ton, he’s stayed with it, he plays hard, he competes, and I’m looking forward to seeing what Bryce’s future holds.”

That kind of reminded me of what Dilfer said about Rosen coming out of high school.

[Victory Formation]

I want Nick Foles or Case Keenum. I want a veteran QB, not a fan of trading up at all.

[OldTimeAFLGuy]

8 minutes ago, NewDayBills said:

I want Nick Foles or Case Keenum. I want a veteran QB, not a fan of trading up at all.

 

 

 

...now with his personnel credentials back after Chocolate Chip, Roseman is smarter than to deal Foles with Wentz' uncertainty...............ACL/LCL surgery isn't wart removal.....and who is their backup?.....Keenum may be an option but Vikes have 3 as UFA's and he is the healthiest.....then again, couldn't blame the kid to shop for a 4+ year deal which is probably beyond the McBeane purview of a 2 year vet to develop the 1st round QB and Peterman.....a wild guess/opinion............

Edited February 21, 2018 by OldTimeAFLGuy

[Logic]

20 minutes ago, OldTimeAFLGuy said:

 

...strange how he's been in Buffalo recently for Eric's (possible) retirement and FredEx roast.......could this be guilt by (HIS hopeful) association?.........don't like McCown but it is personal versus football...was living at a hotel in Cleveland while my late wife was at the Cleveland Clinic......Browns used this hotel exclusively......met several of their invitees, rooks, vets, etc during minis and OTA's.....an A+ class bunch.....everything with the youngins' was "yes sir...no sir".....poolside with many and a great group.....killed me to sit at the curb with an invitee or rook that had been released, trying to pump them up for their next stop....met McCown....an arrogant POS.....hotel staff hated him as he treated them like dirt..."don't you know who I am?"....YAWN......have to see what happens with the Vikes triplets but no way on Sam as much as I like the kid.....although he never has shown much, MSU's Stanton was a 2nd to Detroit and is a 'Zona UFA coming off a two year, $6.5 mil deal.......my guess is McBeane & McD want a max 2 year vet guy to mentor their 1st round QB choice and Peterman...market is flooded with stupid and desperate money, so you may have to look "older" versus guys like McCarron or Keenum who will want 4+ year deals....stay tuned.......

I read that during the Wood (non) press conference, Daboll and Fitz talked for quite some time. IF the Bills move on from Tyrod and go with a rookie, it wouldn't surprise me one bit to see Fitz brought back to be a mentor/break-glass-in-case-of-emergency option.

[Augie]

In order I would prefer Rosen, Darnold, then roll the dice on Mayfield, but who I want would in reality depends upon who falls far enough to be available without pulling a Ditka. 

 

Having said that, I’ve never met one of those guys so how the heck could I really know what’s true about all the stuff you hear? 

[John from Riverside]

1 hour ago, xRUSHx said:

Rosen,Darnold, Mayfield, Rudolph or Cousins.

 

Why? Because IMO they are very  talented. Also they are not a backup QB from another team.

It is interesting to me that you like Rudolph

 

Just because there is a realistic chance he would be there without trading up.

[OldTimeAFLGuy]

1 minute ago, Logic said:

I read that during the Wood (non) press conference, Daboll and Fitz talked for quite some time. IF the Bills move on from Tyrod and go with a rookie, it wouldn't surprise me one bit to see Fitz brought back to be a mentor/break-glass-in-case-of-emergency option.

 

...after the Fitz mega deal debacle (hmmm....similar to the TT mega extension??), Brandon offered Fitz back up money and he said, "I'll get starter money somewhere"...he wasn't too far off in his travels earnings wise......so who the hell knows?.....popcorn time.............

[Augie]

1 minute ago, John from Hemet said:

It is interesting to me that you like Rudolph

 

Just because there is a realistic chance he would be there without trading up.

 

I really liked Rudolph early in the year. Then I started hearing all the one-read-wonder stuff, and didn’t see much more of him after that. I don’t know what to make of him. Allen has the highest ceiling, but also maybe the lowest floor?  I’ve seen him look GREAT, and also doing an EJ impersonation.

 

I admit I wonder mostly, and do not have the deep convictions that others seem to have. And some people actually know what they are talking about! 

[Hapless Bills Fan]

33 minutes ago, OldTimeAFLGuy said:

...strange how he's been in Buffalo recently for Eric's (possible) retirement and FredEx roast.......could this be guilt by (HIS hopeful) association?........

 

I think Fitz laid it out about as clearly as possible in Buffalo media that he'd welcome the chance to come  back.  I'm sure he made his pitch to Daboll as they were standing around waiting for Eric Woods....there are a lot of vet QB, there are less vet QB with a lot of experience in an E-P system and the cred to be both a capable backup and a good mentor.

 

Interesting story on McCown.

3 hours ago, Logic said:

For what it's worth (not much), I DID want Watson last year. Couldn't fathom why a QB needy teem in year 1 of a rebuild with a new coach would pass on a QB.
And now, here we are, once again needing a QB. Oy vey.

 

I couldn't either, at the time.  My "aha!" moment came after the Beane hire, when they slung the entire scouting staff out the door lock stock and Bills paraphernalia.

 

I think McDermott didn't trust the evaluation of Whaley and the existing scouting staff.

Edited February 21, 2018 by Hapless Bills Fan

[Logic]

9 minutes ago, Hapless Bills Fan said:

 

I think Fitz laid it out about as clearly as possible in Buffalo media that he'd welcome the chance to come  back.  I'm sure he made his pitch to Daboll as they were standing around waiting for Eric Woods....there are a lot of vet QB, there are less vet QB with a lot of experience in an E-P system and the cred to be both a capable backup and a good mentor.

 

Interesting story on McCown.

 

I couldn't either, at the time.  My "aha!" moment came after the Beane hire, when they slung the entire scouting staff out the door lock stock and Bills paraphernalia.

 

I think McDermott didn't trust the evaluation of Whaley and the existing scouting staff.

I totally agree. I think McDermott wanted to stake his coaching tenure with the Bills (because lets be honest: If they took a 1st round QB and missed, he'd likely ultimately be fired) on the decision making of someone he trusted more. I think they also knew that THIS year's draft crop at the QB position would be all-world, hence the trade-down to get an extra 1st this year.

All that being said, I have most recently read that it was TRUBISKY that the Bills loved, to the point that they were willing to trade UP if he dropped past a certain point. So even IF McDermott had trusted Whaley's evaluations and gone for a QB, Watson still was likely not going to be a Bill. 

I now understand WHY the move was made (or, in this case, NOT made), but I'm still hugely disappointed. Watson is dynamic.

[xRUSHx]

13 minutes ago, John from Hemet said:

It is interesting to me that you like Rudolph

 

Just because there is a realistic chance he would be there without trading up.

Yes I like him and feel he could be a very good starting QB in the NFL. To have a chance for him without moving up is great but that is a huge risk to hope for him to be there, IMO yes he could be there but also a team could jump us in a move up to take him right before us.  It is a big risky move but if it is all said and done with no move up to keep all our picks I am very ok with Rudolph.

 

I am not in support of Allen or Jackson for the Bills at all. Allen has bust written all over him IMO and Jackson will get crushed running around in the NFL and will be lucky to survive his first contract IMO.

 

I really want a move up for Rosen,Darnold or Mayfield, that is my top choice for this team regardless of what it costs. Mayfield is a very interesting prospect that could cost a little less then Rosen/Darnold but who knows some team could value him higher then the other two. I really want a QB to be proud of and any of these 4 has me really excited for the Bills future.

[Hapless Bills Fan]

20 minutes ago, Augie said:

I really liked Rudolph early in the year. Then I started hearing all the one-read-wonder stuff, and didn’t see much more of him after that. I don’t know what to make of him. Allen has the highest ceiling, but also maybe the lowest floor?  I’ve seen him look GREAT, and also doing an EJ impersonation.

 

I admit I wonder mostly, and do not have the deep convictions that others seem to have. And some people actually know what they are talking about! 

 

I'll put it out there, unless it's in the context of "smoke and mirrors" I don't understand at all the QB stories flying around.  Perhaps it's complicated by my (lack of) knowledge of college football and if I put it out there someone will set me straight.

 

Darnold, Falk, Jackson, Mayfield, and Rudolph all (I think) come from "air raid" or "spread" offenses.  Rudolph does play under center at times.  There is concern that Rudolph is a one-read wonder but not about Darnold or Mayfield?  (Falk dropped out of the QB discussion, Jackson has other concerns).  I don't get it.

 

Mayfield is 6' 3/8" tall.  Jackson is 6'3" tall.  There is concern that Jackson is too short to play QB, but not concern that Mayfield is too short to play QB.

 

Josh Allen has a completion percentage of 56% and has passed for 1812 yds.  Jackson has a completion percentage of 59% and has passed for 3660 yds.  There is concern that Jackson is "not enough of a passer" and "not accurate enough" but not similar concern about Allen not being enough of a passer?  It's almost as though Jackson is getting penalized for being a better athlete and racking up all those run yards besides, even though as a runner he has the elusiveness of a greased eel in a log flume and is probably not more likely than an RB to get killed.

 

It's all very challenging for me to understand. 

 

5 minutes ago, Logic said:

I now understand WHY the move was made (or, in this case, NOT made), but I'm still hugely disappointed. Watson is dynamic.

 

On IR, no one is dynamic.

Edited February 21, 2018 by Hapless Bills Fan

[xRUSHx]

24 minutes ago, Hapless Bills Fan said:

 

I think Fitz laid it out about as clearly as possible in Buffalo media that he'd welcome the chance to come  back.  I'm sure he made his pitch to Daboll as they were standing around waiting for Eric Woods....there are a lot of vet QB, there are less vet QB with a lot of experience in an E-P system and the cred to be both a capable backup and a good mentor.

 

Interesting story on McCown.

 

I couldn't either, at the time.  My "aha!" moment came after the Beane hire, when they slung the entire scouting staff out the door lock stock and Bills paraphernalia.

 

I think McDermott didn't trust the evaluation of Whaley and the existing scouting staff.

I would be ok with Fitz on a cheap mentor contract to help the 1st round rookie along but not as the overpaid journeyman starter.

8 minutes ago, Hapless Bills Fan said:

 

I'll put it out there, unless it's in the context of "smoke and mirrors" I don't understand at all the QB stories flying around.  Perhaps it's complicated by my (lack of) knowledge of college football and if I put it out there someone will set me straight.

 

Darnold, Falk, Jackson, Mayfield, and Rudolph all (I think) come from "air raid" or "spread" offenses.  Rudolph does play under center at times.  There is concern that Rudolph is a one-read wonder but not about Darnold or Mayfield?  (Falk dropped out of the QB discussion, Jackson has other concerns).  I don't get it.

 

Mayfield is 6' 3/8" tall.  Jackson is 6'3" tall.  There is concern that Jackson is too short to play QB, but not concern that Mayfield is too short to play QB.

 

Josh Allen has a completion percentage of 56% and has passed for 1812 yds.  Jackson has a completion percentage of 59% and has passed for 3660 yds.  There is concern that Jackson is "not enough of a passer" and "not accurate enough" but not similar concern about Allen not being enough of a passer?  It's almost as though Jackson is getting penalized for being a better athlete and racking up all those run yards besides, even though as a runner he has the elusiveness of a greased eel in a log flume and is probably not more likely than an RB to get killed.

 

It's all very challenging for me to understand. 

 

 

On IR, no one is dynamic.

Jackson gets penalized IMO because he is too scrawny, no lower half of his body while Mayfield has good size down low to take the hits. Jackson's game is about running, I can see his legs getting broken many times in his NFL career.

Edited February 21, 2018 by xRUSHx

[LABILLBACKER]

Rent Bradford for 2 yrs

Draft Rudolph @ 21

Keep Peterman to compete 

[BuffaloFan68]

My answer is ABT  Anyone But Tyrod. I'll be happy with Rosen, Rudolph, Mayfield, Darnold, Allen, White, etc..... ABT!

Let's Go Buffalo!!!!!

[Alphadawg7]

2 hours ago, White Linen said:

 

I'm not trying to get you to buy anything but you're just not going to convince me I'm wrong.  If Mayfield was 6'4" he'd be the #1 QB on the board and the first QB taken and you know it.  I mean I get that you think it's BS but not everyone has to or does.  

 

It's a different Era?  Wilson was drafted in the 3rd round in this era. 

 

This makes absolutely no sense to me.  "No one is going to deny that size can create advantages or disadvantages for a QB.  HOWEVER, its a complete fallacy and myth to put size as a determining criteria on why a player succeeded or failed when their height falls into the range of successful QB's."  No one is going to deny it but it's a complete fallacy and myth?  I don't even know what that means.  

 

You again dismiss the large portion of my argument so I assume you have no answer.  If Mayfield doesn't succeed and the Bills traded 3 first round picks or 2 firsts and a 2nd and/or 3rd - You don't think it'll deserve criticism?  How the heck do you know it won't be because he got balls batted down, couldn't see so ran out of the pocket or because his small hands won't allow him to throw an NFL football well enough?

 

Let's sum it up so we don't have to go back and forth.  He could end up being great and there's physical challenges that can't be ignored, IMO.   You believe he has no physical challenges and either will succeed or not succeed based on factors exclusively outside of physical.  

 

I agree to disagree.

 

 

 

There is a SUBSTANTIAL difference to say there are and advantages and disadvantages then saying something is the direct root of the success or failure.  Advantages and disadvantages come with wide degrees of impact.  

 

You on the other hand are making a case that Bakers predicted failure by you is predicated on him being too short to succeed and directly tied to his height.  It is complete non sense to state that Baker cant succeed or is most likely not to succeed due to his height when he is taller than or barely shorter than 3 of the top 4 NFL QB's playing right now, 2 of which are already 2 of the all time greatest in history.

 

As far as the different era comment, it absolutely is a different era in this regard.  With guys like Brees and Wilson having massively successful careers in the NFL, its impacting how teams look at shorter prospects that are outside that prototypical size stereotype.  You seem to get hung up on the word "era" as if it needs to mean some massive time gap that needs to predate guys playing now.  Players come along that change the how teams value or evaluate positions, and it doesn't take decades for the to happen.  So, its absolutely a different era right now because if not for the successes of guys like Brees, Wilson, and Rogers who are all undersized in comparison to the ideal prototype then guys like Baker wouldn't have first round consideration no matter how good his college tape was.  

 

And again, there is not a single person in the world who would say Rogers would suck if he was 1 inch shorter like Baker...not one.  Just like no one is going to say that if Baker was 1 or two inches taller he would have been good if he eventually busts.  Baker will either be a guy who can read defenses, avoid the pressure and deliver the ball accurately or not.  That one inch is NOT in any way going to be the determining factor on his ability to do that.  

 

All good, we don't have to see eye to eye on this, but I couldn't disagree with your stance more, which is fine.  Time will tell how his career plays out...but his career arc will not be a function of him being between 6' and 6'-1" IMO

Edited February 21, 2018 by Alphadawg7

[Reed83HOF]

45 minutes ago, Hapless Bills Fan said:

 

No, I think you're raising a valid point that concerns me also - not about wanting to "move up", but a more general one.   That said, I don't think moving on Tyrod by 16 March necessarily telegraphs a "move up".  It depends upon what else we do - trade for a QB, sign a FA QB and who.  If we sign someone like McCarron, it might plausibly be considered we want to give him a shot to start and we're off the 1st round QB carousel.

 

I personally don't think we should cut ties with Tyrod until we have someone we see as equal or better under contract.  I think that is more important, frankly, than saving $6M.  That was the lesson of 2013 IMO.

 

 

 

Exactly what I was getting at; I couldn't recall if I saw it anywhere on here. I'm trying to collect my thoughts and rationales so please bear with me while I work through it. Feel free to call me an idiot and point out my terrible thoughts along the way

 

TT is certainly gone, with the benching that was the end of his tenure here. There is no way he can stay on this roster and not be a starter, even with an open competition. Players like Hughes, Shady etc. will revolt (Vets who want to win) and could cause McD to lose the team to a degree and I suspect the player leadership council made that clear with TTs benching last year. I also think that the new offensive coaches have seen his limitations in a very winnable playoff game against Jax; final nail in his coffin IMO.

 

That leads us to; I don't see us holding on to TT after the draft; since his trade value be diminished and most willing takers have resolved their situation at that point. What then, you cut him anyways and cost yourself an extra $6mil hit against the cap?  If they are indeed moving on, they would want his cap space quickly enough to be able to sign others in FA, especially if we are targeting Star and hope to get OL help and a #2 & #3 CB. Tyrod almost has to be moved once the free agent QBs contract demands are common knowledge (they probably are already known and teams most likely know what we are looking for in return) since that will be his peak ROI for a trade. TT's contract is very favorable and you should be able to get a decent pick in return when compared between the FA QBs demands. If you can't get a good offer, and the decision to move on has already been made, you almost have cut him before his bonus is due.

 

Once TT is gone (however that plays out), this will certainly be the telegraph to move up. The 2 options I see are: we either sit pat or if we go after Fitz, McCown etc.; an older vet who only has a year or 2 left in the tank or is clearly back up material or we go after a Cousins, McCarron, etc.. I honestly do not see us making a run at McCarron, Bridgewater, Bradford or even Keenum and pull a Glennon with the Bears. One thing I get from Beane is that he is concerned about getting the cap in order, which makes me wonder how he views another $6 million of dead cap on an aging and talent-limited roster like ours. 

 

If you go with the trade Glenn scenario (NYG badly need OL help) and the medicals and such, it just seems like this should be all buttoned up rather quickly to slide into #2, if that is indeed the move. A delay, just seems like it would give another team more time to work out trades to be able to move up. #2 guarantees you 1 of Rosen, Darnold, Allen or Mayfield. I would expect that Rosen & Darnold and near their top with Mayfeild and Allen further down. The second pick gives you one of your 2 top choices...

 

I'm very curious to see how this all unfolds.

[BuffaloHokie13]

19 minutes ago, Hapless Bills Fan said:

I'll put it out there, unless it's in the context of "smoke and mirrors" I don't understand at all the QB stories flying around.  Perhaps it's complicated by my (lack of) knowledge of college football and if I put it out there someone will set me straight.

 

Darnold, Falk, Jackson, Mayfield, and Rudolph all (I think) come from "air raid" or "spread" offenses.  Rudolph does play under center at times.  There is concern that Rudolph is a one-read wonder but not about Darnold or Mayfield?  (Falk dropped out of the QB discussion, Jackson has other concerns).  I don't get it.

 

Mayfield is 6' 3/8" tall.  Jackson is 6'3" tall.  There is concern that Jackson is too short to play QB, but not concern that Mayfield is too short to play QB.

 

Josh Allen has a completion percentage of 56% and has passed for 1812 yds.  Jackson has a completion percentage of 59% and has passed for 3660 yds.  There is concern that Jackson is "not enough of a passer" and "not accurate enough" but not similar concern about Allen not being enough of a passer?  It's almost as though Jackson is getting penalized for being a better athlete and racking up all those run yards besides, even though as a runner he has the elusiveness of a greased eel in a log flume and is probably not more likely than an RB to get killed.

 

It's all very challenging for me to understand. 

You're just reading into things. I've read right here on this site that every QB is judged exactly the same.